Shows how much ability he has that with a bit of luck he could have still had a hat trick in a match where he was double & triple marked, was targeted with some filthy tackles & got no service.
U18s Youth Cup - Manchester United vs Brighton
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Suppose he was a threat but apart from a few back passes straight at keeper I couldn't see any shots that you could call testing. Perhaps I've listened to the hype calling for him to be in the first team squad. Against a pretty poor Brighton side who had won one in ten was expecting more across the board.
Steerpike
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Greenwood wasn't as effective as he has been, and Brighton set out to do a job on him, often quite cynically. The first two fouls on Greenwood both merited cards, but unfortunately the referee was too lenient (as they often are at this level).Bit harsh imo. He was our only threat really and showed good touch and calmness in our build up play at times. Very strange to see him not catch so many shots tonight though. He usually strikes the ball really cleanly
I like Greenwood as a player, and I think he has a very good chance of making it all the way to becoming a first team regular. This game may provide a bit of a reality check for those pushing for him to get an immediate chance though. He doesn't look like he's ready yet to cope with the physicality of first team football - if Brighton U18s can basically bully him out of a game, then he will have a tough time against most Premier League sides. Having said that, he would benefit from the better refereeing at first team level.
Thiagoal
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Greenwood wasn't as effective as he has been, and Brighton set out to do a job on him, often quite cynically. The first two fouls on Greenwood both merited cards, but unfortunately the referee was too lenient (as they often are at this level).
I like Greenwood as a player, and I think he has a very good chance of making it all the way to becoming a first team regular. This game may provide a bit of a reality check for those pushing for him to get an immediate chance though. He doesn't look like he's ready yet to cope with the physicality of first team football - if Brighton U18s can basically bully him out of a game, then he will have a tough time against most Premier League sides. Having said that, he would benefit from the better refereeing at first team level.
I disagree. In my opinion, the only thing he did wrong last night was rush his finishes where normally he is very composed. The hype must get through to him and he probably felt his teams chances were all on his shoulders.
His general performance though I thought was exceptional. The way he linked play; his first touch and general game awareness was top quality. It wasn't the legal physicality he had any problem with (I didn't see him once get shoulder barged off the ball) it was the dirty, illegal fouls that would disrupt any player and that's down to poor refereeing to allow it.
Steerpike
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I obviously agree with you regarding the poor refereeing.
I do still think he was bullied out of the game to the extent that he wasn't doing the things he has been doing. He wasn't really taking players on, or getting into dangerous areas, and he didn't present that much of a goal threat. Yes, he had several shots, but most were speculative efforts from distance that rarely looked like troubling the keeper. The rushed finishes that you mention indicate that he felt under pressure, perhaps as you suggest because of the weight of expectations, but also I think because he felt that a heavy challenge would come in if he took any time on the ball.
If the opposition think that a player can be marginalised by a bit of rough treatment, then you can be fairly sure that it will be meted out. Mason Greenwood still has some work to do in developing strategies for dealing with this kind of pressure. As an aside, his team mates also need to step up: if a player in the first team had suffered the same foul early on that Greenwood did, the whole team would have reacted to it and made it very difficult for the referee not to issue a card. It may be described as gamesmanship, but players do need to look after themselves and each other on the pitch, and making sure referees take action against bad fouls is all a part of that.
I do still think he was bullied out of the game to the extent that he wasn't doing the things he has been doing. He wasn't really taking players on, or getting into dangerous areas, and he didn't present that much of a goal threat. Yes, he had several shots, but most were speculative efforts from distance that rarely looked like troubling the keeper. The rushed finishes that you mention indicate that he felt under pressure, perhaps as you suggest because of the weight of expectations, but also I think because he felt that a heavy challenge would come in if he took any time on the ball.
If the opposition think that a player can be marginalised by a bit of rough treatment, then you can be fairly sure that it will be meted out. Mason Greenwood still has some work to do in developing strategies for dealing with this kind of pressure. As an aside, his team mates also need to step up: if a player in the first team had suffered the same foul early on that Greenwood did, the whole team would have reacted to it and made it very difficult for the referee not to issue a card. It may be described as gamesmanship, but players do need to look after themselves and each other on the pitch, and making sure referees take action against bad fouls is all a part of that.
Thiagoal
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I obviously agree with you regarding the poor refereeing.
I do still think he was bullied out of the game to the extent that he wasn't doing the things he has been doing. He wasn't really taking players on, or getting into dangerous areas, and he didn't present that much of a goal threat. Yes, he had several shots, but most were speculative efforts from distance that rarely looked like troubling the keeper. The rushed finishes that you mention indicate that he felt under pressure, perhaps as you suggest because of the weight of expectations, but also I think because he felt that a heavy challenge would come in if he took any time on the ball.
If the opposition think that a player can be marginalised by a bit of rough treatment, then you can be fairly sure that it will be meted out. Mason Greenwood still has some work to do in developing strategies for dealing with this kind of pressure. As an aside, his team mates also need to step up: if a player in the first team had suffered the same foul early on that Greenwood did, the whole team would have reacted to it and made it very difficult for the referee not to issue a card. It may be described as gamesmanship, but players do need to look after themselves and each other on the pitch, and making sure referees take action against bad fouls is all a part of that.
I get where you're coming from. I think a big difference last night also was that Brighton played so deep. Lots of Mason's goals come from him running into open spaces. Therefore a good time to gently introduce him into first team football would be when teams are chasing the game against us and leaving gaps for him to expose. I also agree about the other players not stepping up- it was obvious from the first 30 seconds that there game plan was to injure Mason and stop him as soon as he received the ball. All good experience though and the U23's will certainly get him used to more physical football if nothing else!
SteveW
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Greenwood wasn't as effective as he has been, and Brighton set out to do a job on him, often quite cynically. The first two fouls on Greenwood both merited cards, but unfortunately the referee was too lenient (as they often are at this level).
I like Greenwood as a player, and I think he has a very good chance of making it all the way to becoming a first team regular. This game may provide a bit of a reality check for those pushing for him to get an immediate chance though. He doesn't look like he's ready yet to cope with the physicality of first team football - if Brighton U18s can basically bully him out of a game, then he will have a tough time against most Premier League sides. Having said that, he would benefit from the better refereeing at first team level.
The rush to put him into the first team is just daft. He's barely turned 17.
Completely disagree with the suggestion that he was bullied out of the game though. Desperately hacking someone down and giving away free kicks is not bullying someone, it's fouling because you can't bully them. Players who get bullied out of games don't end up having around 8 shots at goal either. Any other day 2 or 3 of them fly in and he's the hero. He just had a bit of an off day with his shooting.
limerickcitykid
There once was a kid from Toronto...
And additionally on another day in a senior game those Brighton players would be sent off for their "bullying." Not dealing with thugs trying to break your legs has no relevance to being physically capable for senior football. It's the same for Angel, the only times he is bullied these days is when he is being blatantly fouled and the refs are so shit they allow it.The rush to put him into the first team is just daft. He's barely turned 17.
Completely disagree with the suggestion that he was bullied out of the game though. Desperately hacking someone down and giving away free kicks is not bullying someone, it's fouling because you can't bully them. Players who get bullied out of games don't end up having around 8 shots at goal either. Any other day 2 or 3 of them fly in and he's the hero. He just had a bit of an off day with his shooting.
Not to mention playing against 9 players camped on the edge of a box is ridiculously hard and he was still creating chances for himself. On another day he'll have connected with those shots properly and scored or his teammates will have actually moved and followed up the rebounds the keeper was constantly giving.
Hope to see him the u23s now. I think he struggled to get involved on his debut despite the goal so get him in there now and give him a new challenge.
SteveW
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And additionally on another day in a senior game those Brighton players would be sent off for their "bullying." Not dealing with thugs trying to break your legs has no relevance to being physically capable for senior football. It's the same for Angel, the only times he is bullied these days is when he is being blatantly fouled and the refs are so shit they allow it.
Not to mention playing against 9 players camped on the edge of a box is ridiculously hard and he was still creating chances for himself. On another day he'll have connected with those shots properly and scored or his teammates will have actually moved and followed up the rebounds the keeper was constantly giving.
Hope to see him the u23s now. I think he struggled to get involved on his debut despite the goal so get him in there now and give him a new challenge.
Agreed. Yeah, it's the next step for him. It's too easy for him to get on the ball with the amount of space players get at U18 level. Currently he can just drift into space, pick up the ball easily and do what he wants.
Usually the u23s is similar but in a Ricky Sbragia team it can be quite challenging to get on the ball much as an attacker. So it may do him a fair bit of good
Mr. MUJAC
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I thought it was an interesting performance from him.
Clearly he got frustrated and started coming way too deep to get the ball. That just left less forwards in the box. In addition, he seemed to be trying to hard to make the difference on his own (a hard one as most of the others didn't exactly help him out).
There seemed to be a lack of leadership on the pitch and the tactics weren't changed quick enough given Brighton were playing so deep.
The best outcome was that he learns a lot from it. He will get kicked, outnumbered and marginalised against better players than the Brighton youth team so he will need to learn how to deal with it.
As many have said in the Greenwood thread...he still has some maturing to do and it will come with time.
Clearly he got frustrated and started coming way too deep to get the ball. That just left less forwards in the box. In addition, he seemed to be trying to hard to make the difference on his own (a hard one as most of the others didn't exactly help him out).
There seemed to be a lack of leadership on the pitch and the tactics weren't changed quick enough given Brighton were playing so deep.
The best outcome was that he learns a lot from it. He will get kicked, outnumbered and marginalised against better players than the Brighton youth team so he will need to learn how to deal with it.
As many have said in the Greenwood thread...he still has some maturing to do and it will come with time.
In Rainbows
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Citing Brighton's record isn't a really good reason to dismiss him when in the last FA youth cup he got a hattrick against the best English academy in recent times in Chelsea. Brighton defended deep and there was little space for him to operate in. His touch, dribbling, link up play, etc... were still consistently great. He just didn't cleanly strike the ball in that match.Suppose he was a threat but apart from a few back passes straight at keeper I couldn't see any shots that you could call testing. Perhaps I've listened to the hype calling for him to be in the first team squad. Against a pretty poor Brighton side who had won one in ten was expecting more across the board.
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No dismissing my end. He looks an excellent prospect to me. Just need to be realistic when it comes to moving into first team squad. His performance against Chelsea was impressive no doubt. Though the Chelsea team is as weak as they have produced in the last few years it was a great win for the club. Just a pity we couldn't back it up against a poor side on Monday. For a team defending for their lives they didn't half create some chances!
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