Indeed, always dangerous. Such a great player.
Toaster Toes Timo Werner | Tottenham Player
- Thread starter Damien
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Just needs to find a bit of confidence in front of goal. Has been really good at everything else. Makes great runs, works tirelessly. All he needs is confidence.
Fair play to him cause he looked like he was blowing out of his arse about 50 mins in yet he still ran till the end.
I know right, if only he could finish, well yeah but that's a massive if
Ive never seen a player so woeful in front of goal like Werner has been this season suddenly turn it all around the next season
Yeah he looked exahausted but never stopped, that kind of attitude goes a long way with a manager like Tuchel, Pep or Klopp. Credit to him after some of the stick he's taken.
Raheem Sterling? Couldn't hit a barn door with a banjo, gets his mojo back, turned into a wc goalscorer for 2.5 seasons, loses his confidence and back to the player we see currently. No reason why Werner can't do the same.
He has a shit touch though. Can only get past a player if he kicks it around the defender and runs. Reminds me of the way Rashford always finds a way to get 1v1 the keeper (when hes fit) but Werner just doesnt score or its mistimed. Rashford misses his share but Werner is even past that.
Not the same at all, Sterling was a young player developing his game when his finishing was erratic. Werner ain't.
Anyway Sterling's finishing is still erratic anyway, City's football though has just given him a shit load of tap ins which isn't a criticism at all as it's those goals that win you leagues
Its weird but Raheem who I tend to compare him too can look the same. Rashford is technically a better player than both particularly his first touch. I think new players to the prem get written off too soon. Sterling looks like a conference level player atm, keeps over hitting the ball, miscontroling etc.. theres a touch of that about Werner. I think when the goals come, he relaxes and the touoch gets better etc.. He'll never have the touch of Mahrez or Ziyech or Pogba but it just has to be a little better. Another example would be I don't know if you saw the game today but Aguero's touch since he got back in the City team is shocking, mentally he's just not at the races for Werner he's trying a little too hard I think.
he's not gonna suddenly bang in Harry Kane or Mo Salah numbers but I would expect 15-20 league goals next season.
The other difference is that people mostly know Werner from this season. Werner was never THIS bad in front of the goal, he wasn't clinical either but he was still a very consistent finisher and the stats also back that up, he had a normal chance conversion for a striker. So far the current season is the outlier and just going back to his "normal" finishing would be a huge improvement.
well he's got 12 goals this season, if we're talking about outliers then we should ignore last season as well meaning he usually hits around 20 a season
I think his problem is he is at his best playing from the left but isnt good enough to work space inside when he has a defender facing him up. When i close my eyes im not seeing him shimmy inside and smacking it. Its always trying to go outside to the space which puts control on his weak left foot.
I expect him to get better too since theres no way a striker can have 2 seasons worth of these misses or hilariously avoidable offsides.
The outlier isn't the number of goals scored, it's his conversion rate. It's roughly less than half of his usual. Which means he should be around 25/26 this season.
I don't think anyone will argue against that. He was never an excellent finisher to begin with, but last season he had an exceptional season in terms of goals, and this season a poor one. If he finds his confidence, and Chelsea doesn't replace him, he should be good for 15-20 goals in the league I'd say.
It will be interesting to see if Chelsea try to bring in another striker, or keep going with Werner or Havertz up top.
Would bet my house that that's down to the Christensen injury.
Reminds me when Andy Cole used to get a lot of stick from people who never seemed to acknowledge his general contribution (especially his hold up play).
The question is who. I'd be extremely surprised if Chelsea get Kane or Haaland this summer. Are there any credible rumours about other elite strikers, and who would it be?
Recently it seems he’s better at putting in nice passes from the right side of the box than scoring when he’s in clear.
Werner reminds you of Andy Cole?
He gets the chances which is most important. Obviously is more dangerous if he has some space to use his speed but he is a strong player anyway.
Look up his goas from last season on youtube (mostly normal goals). And you shouldn't forget that he is adding a lot of defensive power to the team with his high workrate.
I think he fits very well in this Chelsea squad. They shoukd keep him.
Look up his goas from last season on youtube (mostly normal goals). And you shouldn't forget that he is adding a lot of defensive power to the team with his high workrate.
I think he fits very well in this Chelsea squad. They shoukd keep him.
It's more the reaction people have given this season when he's fluffed his chances. People used to give Cole a really hard time for the spells where he struggled but as with Werner, he never hid and was always contributing.
Many have linked us to Lukaku at ~€75m give or take. Would rather go for Sancho personally and give Havertz a run as the number 9; he's been excellent recently. Haaland is obviously brilliant and would be a dream signing, but between transfer fee, wages, agent fees, etc, would probably cost around €60m per year. Havertz is currently our most expensive player on a per annum basis and costs about half that.
Werner doesn’t really contribute. He blunts attacks, runs down blind alleys, gets himself offside 5 times a match and his second touch is a tackle.
Ah yes, I read that too. But I don't think he'd fit Tuchel's idea of building the attack on pace, workrate, and technical precision.
My preferred scenario as well. Plus a good, experienced CF as backup/fallback option.
Most of all, I don't think Dortmund will sell Haaland this summer, especially if they make top 4.
Yep agreed on all counts. Think Sancho could very well leave though - question becomes who we get rid of; think we'd have to bin one or two of our current inside forwards to make room for Sancho + a backup striker (although perhaps irrationally I'd not mind seeing what Batshuayi could do in that role potentially).
He’s been very good after their first semi agains RM - when he looked slow and not on pair with the level.
In the last couple of games I’ve seen much more what’s in him. Looks like he has found himself or finally managed to adapt. Assume the arrival of Tuchel has given him a boost, especially because their both are German.
In the last couple of games I’ve seen much more what’s in him. Looks like he has found himself or finally managed to adapt. Assume the arrival of Tuchel has given him a boost, especially because their both are German.
Yeah I don't think Kane or Haaland are possible, and Lukaku seems happy at Inter so who knows. There are other less expensive options available like Andre Silva etc.
Just generally speaking, even if a great striker is available, should Chelsea go for him? It seems Havertz and Werner are settling in, and the team as a whole is finding their rhythm. It would certainly put the squad planning in a difficult spot, because did they buy Werner as a main striker only to find out that's not really his strong point? And likewise Havertz as an attacking midfielder when they have a lot of options there, and he might grow into that striker role now..
I think there's a lot of potential with Havertz as a false nine, and Werner playing off him from the left, but it's not a certainty it'll work consistently. But putting a big name in front could stunt the progress they've made.
He will score the winning goal in the CL Final, nailed on.
Awful striker though.
Awful striker though.
I think it should also be factored in that Tuchel is very much a disciple of the Guardiola school of positional play - as Pep has eschewed a proper 9 by design for much of the year, I think Tuchel increasingly might be inclined in the same way. I'd also argue that Havertz's unique skillset could add another dimension to this type of approach - whilst KdB is obviously different class in terms of his movement and delivery, Havertz is talented enough to be a reasonable facsimile as he continues to develop while also possessing a completely different level of aerial ability and mentality in front of goal.
Personally the prospect of developing that type of player is more appealing to me than buying the likes of Lukaku who I think we'd struggle to integrate - again though I'm extremely biased and very much trend towards the optimistic side of the spectrum!
Under Tuchel our performances and results have been substantially better when Werner starts compared to when he doesn't which ultimately is all that really matters.
He may almost never score, but he seems involved a lot when goals happen for Chelsea.
I think players can definitely improve at age 25, and there can be big variance between seasons where a player is low on confidence vs high on confidence. Diego Forlan might not be the best example as he had to leave us to kick on, but he became an elite striker after being a bit of a laughing stock with us at times.
Drogba in his worst season scored 5 goals in 24 league games, and the following season he scored 29 in 32. So there can be massive momentum swings season to season.
It does seem unlikely he'll ever be truely clinical though, but I don't think it's too late to polish his game and turn the 12-15 goals he'll score this season into 25+ next season.
Thats fair but Sterling is right now back to that form. Thats kinda my point. The Sterling of Pellegrini era is the Sterling we've seen since christmas. Some players like Sterling and Werner are the type who live and die on confidence, others will be less streaky and more consistent (someone like Gabriel Jesus comes to mind) and will never score 10 in 10 but will never have a shocking season either.
This. Cos, football.
Yeah I agree with that. As a neutral it's far more interesting to see how Chelsea do with Havertz up front, and how he develops as a player, than if they were to buy Haaland or whoever. With a bit more confidence I think Werner, or Abraham if he stays, can do a good job as the lone striker when needed, but Havertz seems such a unique player in terms of attributes. It's hard to judge what his ceiling is, but I'm curious to see how good he can become in that role.
Whilst his stamina has been ridiculous, with Mason mount fully rested I'd take him out if the squad for the arsenal game and give him a week to get ready for the cup final.
For people asking/wondering why he's kept playing for weeks, this is our record under Tuchel when he's started him compared to when we haven't.
WITH
W 2-0 Burnley
W 1-0 Spurs
W 2-1 Sheffield United
W 2-0 Newcastle
D 1-1 Saints
W 1-0 Atletico
W 1-0 Liverpool
W 2-0 Everton
W 2-0 Atletico
L 2-5 West Brom
W 2-0 Porto
W 1-0 Man City
W 1-0 West Ham
D 1-1 Real Madrid
W 2-0 Fulham
W 2-0 Real Madrid
W 2-1 Man City
P17 W14 D2 L1 scored in every game and bar West Brom, Saints and too an extent Porto all of them were good performances.
WITHOUT
D 0-0 Wolves
D 0-0 Man United (you could quite obviously tell United felt more comfortable pushing their line up without his presence)
D 0-0 Leeds
W 4-1 Crystal Palace (the outlier performance without him)
D 0-0 Brighton
W 1-0 Barnsley
W 2-0 Sheffield United
L 0-1 Porto
P8 W3 D4 L1
So without him starting under TT we failed to score in five of eight games (something we've not done in 17 with him on the team sheet) and of those 8 four of them were absolutely awful (the bottom four) compared to only two stinkers in the games he started. Only one top performance without him starting which was Palace away.
Despite the goal drought and the bad misses we're much better with him than without.
WITH
W 2-0 Burnley
W 1-0 Spurs
W 2-1 Sheffield United
W 2-0 Newcastle
D 1-1 Saints
W 1-0 Atletico
W 1-0 Liverpool
W 2-0 Everton
W 2-0 Atletico
L 2-5 West Brom
W 2-0 Porto
W 1-0 Man City
W 1-0 West Ham
D 1-1 Real Madrid
W 2-0 Fulham
W 2-0 Real Madrid
W 2-1 Man City
P17 W14 D2 L1 scored in every game and bar West Brom, Saints and too an extent Porto all of them were good performances.
WITHOUT
D 0-0 Wolves
D 0-0 Man United (you could quite obviously tell United felt more comfortable pushing their line up without his presence)
D 0-0 Leeds
W 4-1 Crystal Palace (the outlier performance without him)
D 0-0 Brighton
W 1-0 Barnsley
W 2-0 Sheffield United
L 0-1 Porto
P8 W3 D4 L1
So without him starting under TT we failed to score in five of eight games (something we've not done in 17 with him on the team sheet) and of those 8 four of them were absolutely awful (the bottom four) compared to only two stinkers in the games he started. Only one top performance without him starting which was Palace away.
Despite the goal drought and the bad misses we're much better with him than without.
Still think he's a very good player and will be much better next season, no doubt.
Yeah, his admittedly atrocious conversion makes loads of people overlook his influence in creating chances and danger in attack. Having a player with his work rate, speed and mobility does a lot for tearing holes in defenses, even if he does not play the final pass or put in a shot.