Television Tho Prop Grops Throps

Sylar said:
A discussion needs to be had regarding MJF and his material, right? He delivers it well and is a strong talker, but the material is getting repetitive and ... meh?
It feels kinda weak? I dunno, its just not great especially the amount of time hes given.
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Yeah exactly this. I get that he's straddling a fine line between heel and tweener and maybe this is part of his play to veer back towards the former with the crowd but my God it's getting boring.

I don't think he's doing anything for the belt either. Hopefully it's not a long reign.
 
MJF is supposed to be annoying. Thats why he will always go for the low hanging fruit. Because thats what historically works in wrestling. He's not there to be a cool heel who doesnt do anything for the good guy. He's there to annoy you and make you want someone to shut him up and then deliver on the payoff at the right moments with someone looking like a star for doing it. The face is the one who is supposed to come out being talked about
 
He's also not meant to be boring either. I don't want him to get 'his'. I just want it to go to the next segment
 
Sylar said:
He's also not meant to be boring either. I don't want him to get 'his'. I just want it to go to the next segment
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If you think MJF is boring, then you think all the real heels are boring. His talking and segments are far more entertaining than most traditional heels doing the same role.

For example WWE had Jinder doing it in his title run. Corbin does it. The current Austin Theory is trying to do it

If you find them less boring than MJF I dont know what to tell you
 
CassiusClaymore said:
Totally disagree about Mox and Hangman. There was plenty of backstory there stemming from the concussion (even before that tbh) and I had no idea that Mox would put Hangman over. He rarely loses.
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Sylar said:
I think its only the second time Mox has been pinned clean (first since Punk) maybe ever in AEW?
I think Page/Mox had story
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The story between them was basically that Hangman was annoyed that Mox knocked him out. The only thing that made sense in the build to me was Mox saying "what did you expect", considering that's basically the aim of the matches. On top of it being obvious Hangman would win (was way too soon after their last match, Page couldn't afford the loss, and Mox needs his holiday), I even expected the concussion angle at the end so they were even. Everything about it felt so obvious, at least to me.

As for Danielson Takeshita, it's basically the same match Takeshita has on AEW TV every time now - he's plucky and puts up a good fight, but loses. He could have won, or been squashed, anything to mix it up a little.

However, I get why some people would enjoy them, and would never be so arrogant as to "question what you enjoy about wrestling" if you did.
 
Ekeke said:
MJF is supposed to be annoying. Thats why he will always go for the low hanging fruit. Because thats what historically works in wrestling. He's not there to be a cool heel who doesnt do anything for the good guy. He's there to annoy you and make you want someone to shut him up and then deliver on the payoff at the right moments with someone looking like a star for doing it. The face is the one who is supposed to come out being talked about
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Disagree with this. Your main promo man can’t be sent out to have one dimensional, shit, repetitive promos. The audience is too smart for that
 
Ekeke said:
If you think MJF is boring, then you think all the real heels are boring. His talking and segments are far more entertaining than most traditional heels doing the same role.

For example WWE had Jinder doing it in his title run. Corbin does it. The current Austin Theory is trying to do it

If you find them less boring than MJF I dont know what to tell you
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You've just made some random weird argument to defend aew / mjf with your usual whataboutism :lol:

Let's focus on mjf
You used to post ratings a lot.
How about posting some ratings of dynamite and mjf segments especially since he's been champ?
 
The Hilton said:
The story between them was basically that Hangman was annoyed that Mox knocked him out. The only thing that made sense in the build to me was Mox saying "what did you expect", considering that's basically the aim of the matches. On top of it being obvious Hangman would win (was way too soon after their last match, Page couldn't afford the loss, and Mox needs his holiday), I even expected the concussion angle at the end so they were even. Everything about it felt so obvious, at least to me.

As for Danielson Takeshita, it's basically the same match Takeshita has on AEW TV every time now - he's plucky and puts up a good fight, but loses. He could have won, or been squashed, anything to mix it up a little.

However, I get why some people would enjoy them, and would never be so arrogant as to "question what you enjoy about wrestling" if you did.
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Nah I wouldn't try dismiss what you like and don't like

I do like that you explained why you didn't like it even if I don't agree or see it that way.
 
Sylar said:
You've just made some random weird argument to defend aew / mjf with your usual whataboutism :lol:

Let's focus on mjf
You used to post ratings a lot.
How about posting some ratings of dynamite and mjf segments especially since he's been champ?
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Firstly I dont believe you even understand what a traditional or what people might refer to "proper" heel is. Thats someone who is doing the job of heel first, not trying to get themselves over because that isnt what they are there for. There are lots of people who do that these days even though they are supposed to be setting up the face for being a star. So I can see why a fan wouldnt understand as well when there are bad examples in front of them.

There's the traditional heel who is there to annoy and have the crowd engage with them negatively, then make the face look good in the end of the story.

Then theres the special type heels like Flair who did some things differently. He was absolutely trying to get himself over, but the Flair match he bumped like crazy for the babyface to put them over and it would work.

These days we have a lot of guys who consider themselves the heel and they might cheat once in the match, but for the rest of the match they're going move for move with the babyface in a moves match. Thats not working as a traditional heel, which is what MJF and the names I mentioned are/were doing. Thats cheating once in a match where 100 things happened and if your moves looked just as cool as your opponents the crowd might even get behind you instead of the face.

In this case we were talking about MJF on the mic. MJF wants to be a heel. Just a few months ago he started to get a big babyface reaction. He didnt want to be a babyface. What got him that reaction? Being too entertaining. If you're too entertaining as a heel you risk becoming a face because the fans start to respect and look forward to your moments over the faces

So MJF does what he does because he's better at his job than you think you are never having done it.

As for ratings :



They went up despite an ad break?
 
Ekeke said:
So MJF does what he does because he's better at his job than you think you are never having done it.
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All that nonsense just to end it with this line :lol:

I knew you were dying to somehow get it in to an argument one day

You've always been so condescending but this tops it even for you

And that ratings tweet isn't exactly the defending point that you think it is.
 
Sylar said:
And that ratings tweet isn't exactly the defending point that you think it is.
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From my limited knowledge (seeing those graphics pop up all the time on various subreddits) aren't the 9pm segments always up because that's when people flick around from other channels and land there?

So it's always up no matter who is in that segment?

What would concern me is that after his time on screen it looks like they lose 10% of the audience (rather than retaining go them into the next segment?) which can't be a good sign?

I don't know much about MJF as I don't watch much wrestling anymore but from everything I read people are getting bored of him ( the consensus seems to be that they feel he's got one note and it's played out) and he is beginning to generate "go away" heat rather than traditional heel heat.
 
Sylar said:
All that nonsense just to end it with this line :lol:

I knew you were dying to somehow get it in to an argument one day

You've always been so condescending but this tops it even for you

And that ratings tweet isn't exactly the defending point that you think it is.
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It is you just dont understand ratings like you dont understand how to work just by being a fan. If you did you wouldnt need training and experience to be a wrestler or promoter, any fan like yourself could just do it when they have a few mins like your posts.
 
MJF is the only proper heel in wrestling as far as I can think...well other than Jericho when he wants to be.

Most of the supposed bad guys these days don't do anything different to what the good guys do, which makes it very hard to invest in anything or care what is happening. Probably why WWE in particular struggle to introduce anyone new and get them over with the crowd...because there's no one to put them up against where the audience has a reason to care who wins.

Wouldn't say MJF is boring either. It gets a little tiring buy everything in wrestling does once it isn't new anymore. Even Austin/Rock got boring and they were probably given a much longer lifespan by WWE constantly having them up against authority figures/large factions to maintain the underdog angle.

A face turn would probably have been good for MJF in terms of popularity and keeping it fresh, but then there isn't really anyone in AEW other than MJF to put a face who would have been that over up against. So it would have become stale very quickly.
 
noodlehair said:
MJF is the only proper heel in wrestling as far as I can think...well other than Jericho when he wants to be.

Most of the supposed bad guys these days don't do anything different to what the good guys do, which makes it very hard to invest in anything or care what is happening. Probably why WWE in particular struggle to introduce anyone new and get them over with the crowd...because there's no one to put them up against where the audience has a reason to care who wins.

Wouldn't say MJF is boring either. It gets a little tiring buy everything in wrestling does once it isn't new anymore. Even Austin/Rock got boring and they were probably given a much longer lifespan by WWE constantly having them up against authority figures/large factions to maintain the underdog angle.

A face turn would probably have been good for MJF in terms of popularity and keeping it fresh, but then there isn't really anyone in AEW other than MJF to put a face who would have been that over up against. So it would have become stale very quickly.
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That's honestly bollocks.
 
Sylar said:
Nah I wouldn't try dismiss what you like and don't like

I do like that you explained why you didn't like it even if I don't agree or see it that way.
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Yeah that last little bit wasn't aimed at you, but it was a comment that was made.

I generally love AEW, even the thrown together matches usually have a small sense of doubt about who will win, they just lost sight of that a bit last dynamite.

As for the MJF stuff, I thought he was entertaining, some of his repetitive stuff but some targeted stuff, and the way he ran away from Danielson is old school heel work that'll always make me laugh, makes me wonder if he's been watching Jarrett who's been fantastic with that heel body language since coming back.
 
The Hilton said:
Yeah that last little bit wasn't aimed at you, but it was a comment that was made.

I generally love AEW, even the thrown together matches usually have a small sense of doubt about who will win, they just lost sight of that a bit last dynamite.

As for the MJF stuff, I thought he was entertaining, some of his repetitive stuff but some targeted stuff, and the way he ran away from Danielson is old school heel work that'll always make me laugh, makes me wonder if he's been watching Jarrett who's been fantastic with that heel body language since coming back.
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Mjf facials and reactions are great. His words need freshening up.

RacingClub said:
From my limited knowledge (seeing those graphics pop up all the time on various subreddits) aren't the 9pm segments always up because that's when people flick around from other channels and land there?

So it's always up no matter who is in that segment?

What would concern me is that after his time on screen it looks like they lose 10% of the audience (rather than retaining go them into the next segment?) which can't be a good sign?

I don't know much about MJF as I don't watch much wrestling anymore but from everything I read people are getting bored of him ( the consensus seems to be that they feel he's got one note and it's played out) and he is beginning to generate "go away" heat rather than traditional heel heat.
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Yep. Funnily enough I'm going this route, ive worked analytics and now TV advertising for a combined almost fifteen years
Some forum troll telling me that I don't understand ratings actually made me literally l o l

Anybody who understands trends, analytics and such knows using a one off to make a point is being rash or ridiculous. That's not how you measure these. Everything has context
 
noodlehair said:
Cool. I'll leave you lot to acting like a bunch of 5 year olds over disagreeing about wrestling opinions (honestly).
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:lol:

I only discovered this thread recently. This last page has been like some comedy version of r/squaredcircle
 
Seems he died in a car crash. There were 4 people in the car, 2 adults and 2 children. Both adults were dead on arrival and the children have been hospitalised.

Don't want to speculate, but this looks like it could be really tragic.
 
SalfordRed18 said:
Seems he died in a car crash. There were 4 people in the car, 2 adults and 2 children. Both adults were dead on arrival and the children have been hospitalised.

Don't want to speculate, but this looks like it could be really tragic.
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That's horrible.

I know very little about the Briscoe Brothers apart from hearing Cornette talking them and (being an idiot) I assumed they were the sons of "Attitude Era Stooge" Gerald Briscoe.

I later found out that the weren't related but were in fact successful Chicken Farmers ,who apparently earned more money on the farm than in the ring.

It always kind of bothered me why someone that Cornette regularly called (along with FTR) one of the best tag teams in wrestling were relatively "unsuccessful" in their wrestling career and I kind of thought it must be due to their farm.. Then I read about the homophobic tweets* and it all kind of made sense.

I'll probably go and watch a match or two over the weekend (I've never seen either team wrestle at all) as I used to love tag team wrestling in my youth (Including The Hart Foundation, The Road Warriors and my personal favourites The Steiners) and it's sad that wrestling has been robbed of one of its top tag practitioners.

*I'm not extremely clued in to whether his/their later apologies are genuine or an attempt to save/ advance their careers.
 
Their trilogy with FTR were amazing. Fantastic tag team
Such a shame :(
 
ROH is my personal favorite wrestling promotion, and The Briscoes are hands down one of my all-time favorite acts. They put on some of the most incredible matches and promos I've ever seen.

I express my sincere condolences and well wishes to him, his daughters, his family, Mark, the other individual who sadly passed away, and everyone associated with him during this difficult time.

Dem Boys Forever. Jay Briscoe Forever.
 
SalfordRed18 said:
Seems he died in a car crash. There were 4 people in the car, 2 adults and 2 children. Both adults were dead on arrival and the children have been hospitalised.

Don't want to speculate, but this looks like it could be really tragic.
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His wife is alive. Their daughter is in surgery for her back.
 
Horrible news about Jay Briscoe, the police report makes it sound like another car swerved into his lane and hit them head on. Seems like a really nasty accident.

Enjoyed Dynamite this week, Danielson vs Bandido was so much more entertaining to me than his match against Takeshita last week (although the latter made me laugh out loud with his promo, if his English keeps improving and he can flesh out more of a character he could be a real asset).

The Saraya/Storm/Shida stuff is pretty interesting too, cool that they've leaned into the AEW original vs outsiders angle.
 
The Hilton said:
Horrible news about Jay Briscoe, the police report makes it sound like another car swerved into his lane and hit them head on. Seems like a really nasty accident.
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Yup both drivers were killed while the kids in the back of his car survived with some bad injuries (I think they are doing surgery to one daughter who is currently paralysed in the hopes of reversing the paralysis).

The police report states that he wasn't wearing a seat belt at the time of impact which gives a sense of "What if" but I'll be interested to hear the toxicology report from the other driver (or cell phone records) which may help explain the error.
 
If the top of this page argues mjf brought in ratings for 4th Jan,then he lost it on 11th Jan :smirk:



And look junglehook = ratings, despite an ad break.
 
The Hilton said:
Enjoyed Dynamite this week, Danielson vs Bandido was so much more entertaining to me than his match against Takeshita last week (although the latter made me laugh out loud with his promo, if his English keeps improving and he can flesh out more of a character he could be a real asset).

The Saraya/Storm/Shida stuff is pretty interesting too, cool that they've leaned into the AEW original vs outsiders angle.
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Yeah another week of good dynamite stuff.

Agreed about the womens stuff. Nice they are kinda course correcting with the heel / face dynamics. The originals clearly more loved so don't force things. Saraya/storm need one more.
Strangely enough shida turning would actually now be a face turn :lol:

Also the Danielson stuff is different. He's being set up as the number one contender against the top heel, but to do that he played heel in the last two matches. Cage match will be something different and intriguing. Goes the normal route to make Danielson a traditional goodguy
 
The stuff from SD leading to this was nicely done, but that trial was such a fantastic segment. Everyone played their role. Awesome and compelling storyline
 
Raw xxx was like raw 25 with taker and Austin nobody spoke

why was the theme song feeling good a remix of blue when blue is the colour of smackdown
 
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