The club have scrapped the club's annual Player of the Year ceremony in the wake of their worst-ever Premier League season.

Quality control
Imagine actually thinking this season has been successful for the club because women's team had a successful season. :lol:

If the women's team got canceled tomorrow, no one will give a shit about the whole thing.

The gap in popularity and investment between men's and women's football is huge and it's not even a contest.
 
MUW4Eva said:
Out of interest, what would make for a good season for the club overall?
Why shouldn't the successes that have been achieved this season be celebrated?
The FA Youth Cup winning side for example is worth being happy about is it not??
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The youth team is there to provide players in the future to the senior team. Yes it's important to celebrate their success, nobody is saying otherwise. But the goal is to win in the seniors.

And whether the fact is inconvenient or not, it's the men's senior team that have created the history, profile and revenue that has allowed the women's team to be successful. If the men's team fails, the whole club fails unfortunately.

Doesn't stop there being an awards ceremony for the women and juniors. Like I said I would make the men attend but not have any awards for them personally.
 
MUW4Eva said:
The women's developmental side did, just as the men's youth side won the FA Youth Cup.

Why should there be a separate awards night?
This awards night is supposed to be a celebration of what the club overall has achieved.
Why split things up?
Why not look to bring everyone together for one night to celebrate everyone's successes??
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This season has been an absolute disaster for the club, and we - the fans, players and club hierarchy - should acknowledge this. Holding an awards ceremony would be in direct contradiction to that.

That's not to say the women's team does not deserve recognition for its achievements - the youth team too. But leave the men's side out of it.

From what I understand, it was the players themselves who are against holding an awards ceremony ths year.
 
Random Task said:
This season has been an absolute disaster for the club, and we - the fans, players and club hierarchy - should acknowledge this. Holding an awards ceremony would be in direct contradiction to that.

That's not to say the women's team does not deserve recognition for its achievements - the youth team too. But leave the men's side out of it.

From what I understand, it was the players themselves who are against holding an awards ceremony ths year.
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I don't agree that you should leave the men out of it. They should go and support the women's and youth sides, why not?

If you need to save face you can just call it the Women's Title Celebration Dinner or something.
 
TwoSheds said:
I don't agree that you should leave the men out of it. They should go and support the women's and youth sides, why not?
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I suppose they tag along, you could even give them jobs for the night like car park valets, bathroom attendants or shoe shiners.
 
el3mel said:
Imagine actually thinking this season has been successful for the club because women's team had a successful season. :lol:

If the women's team got canceled tomorrow, no one will give a shit about the whole thing.

The gap in popularity and investment between men's and women's football is huge and it's not even a contest.
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I can assure you that a fair few people would care if the women's team got cancelled, just because by the looks of things, you personally might not care, you shouldn't be extrapolating that to mean more than that.
You are free to think however you personally feel, no issues or worries there, however of you start to say you are speaking for a large number of people, that is somewhat crossing a line.
 
Random Task said:
This season has been an absolute disaster for the club, and we - the fans, players and club hierarchy - should acknowledge this. Holding an awards ceremony would be in direct contradiction to that.

That's not to say the women's team does not deserve recognition for its achievements - the youth team too. But leave the men's side out of it.

From what I understand, it was the players themselves who are against holding an awards ceremony ths year.
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Why is it that club = men's first team??

That really isn't the case at all.
Men's first team = men's first team, and
Club= ALL the teams that represent it.

It really shouldn't be that hard a concept to grasp surely.

Yes the men's first team has been very poor, underwhelming, diabolical, use whichever negative term you wish, they all apply sadly, however to suggest that means ALL of the teams have been likewise, which is what seems to be happening by the use of the term "club", is just wrong and inaccurate.
 
el3mel said:
Imagine actually thinking this season has been successful for the club because women's team had a successful season. :lol:

If the women's team got canceled tomorrow, no one will give a shit about the whole thing.

The gap in popularity and investment between men's and women's football is huge and it's not even a contest.
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Clown
 
MUW4Eva said:
I can assure you that a fair few people would care if the women's team got cancelled, just because by the looks of things, you personally might not care, you shouldn't be extrapolating that to mean more than that.
You are free to think however you personally feel, no issues or worries there, however of you start to say you are speaking for a large number of people, that is somewhat crossing a line.
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You are also free to feel whatever you want, the reality is this club's popularity, economy and business are all built on the men's first football team.

Just because you are invested in the women's football team doesn't change this absolute fact.

The women's team was founded just 4 years ago. Ridiculous to put it on the same level as men's football and consider the season successful because they had a good season. :lol:

I bet our rivals are laughing their arses on this discussion.
 
el3mel said:
You are also free to feel whatever you want, the reality is this club's popularity, economy and business are all built on the men's first football team.

Just because you are invested in the women's football team doesn't change this absolute fact.

The women's team was founded just 4 years ago. Ridiculous to put it on the same level as men's football and consider the season successful because they had a good season. :lol:

I bet our rivals are laughing their arses on this discussion.
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Yes the finances etc are built on the back of the men's team, I have never denied or said anything to the contrary, however the women team, and their respective development side, is still very much a part pf this whole club.

And the club itself, isn't just the men's first team, the club itself encompasses ALL of the players, staff, and teams that represent it.
Hence this is the Manchester United awards, not the Manchester United men's first team awards.
The awards night is a chance to recognise everyone who represents the club, it is bigger than any one team.
It brings everyone together for one night, of both genders, to celebrate all that has been achieved throughout the club, that of why there are lots of different awards.
There are not just the awards for the men's first team.
 
shut-up.gif
 
Why scrap it? They should have made it a grander, live streaming and all that jazz. Scrapping the event helps the cowards hide away after an utterly crap season from 95% of the team.
 
MUW4Eva said:
Yes the finances etc are built on the back of the men's team, I have never denied or said anything to the contrary, however the women team, and their respective development side, is still very much a part pf this whole club.

And the club itself, isn't just the men's first team, the club itself encompasses ALL of the players, staff, and teams that represent it.
Hence this is the Manchester United awards, not the Manchester United men's first team awards.
The awards night is a chance to recognise everyone who represents the club, it is bigger than any one team.
It brings everyone together for one night, of both genders, to celebrate all that has been achieved throughout the club, that of why there are lots of different awards.
There are not just the awards for the men's first team.
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Are they part of the club? Yes.

Are they all far, far inferior in terms of importance to the club than the men's football team? Yes.

If the men's team won the treble while the women's and youth team won feck all or got relegated, not many will care that much. The opposite isn't true. That just says it all I guess. Whether you like it or not what the first team does in the season affect everything else.

We aren't going to put a team who has been founded since 2018 on the same level of importance to the fans and club as the men's team who gave this club its popularity and money.

That's the reality so just deal with it.
 
el3mel said:
Are they part of the club? Yes.

Are they all far, far inferior in terms of importance to the club than the men's football team? Yes.

If the men's team won the treble while the women's and youth team won feck all or got relegated, not many will care that much. The opposite isn't true. That just says it all I guess. Whether you like it or not what the first team does in the season affect everything else.

We aren't going to put a team who has been founded since 2018 on the same level of importance to the fans and club as the men's team who gave this club its popularity and money.

That's the reality so just deal with it.
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Look for example at how Barcelona have developed with their respective women's team, twice they have broke the 90k attendance this very season.

Why is there this seeming hostility towards the women's section/department?

Why this rush to put what they do down?

Why not instead fully embrace them?

Why not take them to heart?

Why not think of them as just as much a part of the club as the men's side of things??

I find this need, this determination to sully their name, to drag them or their importance down, very odd.
To try and mock or to say "who cares" is very sad really.

Why not support the women's side of things just as much as the men's?
What is stopping people from doing just that??
Why not support one of the two first teams, especially when the men's first team isn't doing all that well?

I honestly don't understand this mindset of looking to knock/pull down/laugh at the women's side of things, and say they are not worthy of having awards, or they don't deserve to be in this conversation, it should just be all about the men's first team only.

Or that when people talk about the club, that automatically means, or is interchangeable with, the men's first team, when that isn't, or shouldn't be the case at all.
The club is ALL of the teams that wear the shirt, & represent the club, from the youngest of ages of both genders, to the very oldest.

So an awards night like we are discussing here, should be there to bring EVERYONE at the club together, and should be about celebrating EVERYONE, not just one particular team or gender.
 
MUW4Eva said:
Look for example at how Barcelona have developed with their respective women's team, twice they have broke the 90k attendance this very season.

Why is there this seeming hostility towards the women's section/department?

Why this rush to put what they do down?

Why not instead fully embrace them?

Why not take them to heart?

Why not think of them as just as much a part of the club as the men's side of things??

I find this need, this determination to sully their name, to drag them or their importance down, very odd.
To try and mock or to say "who cares" is very sad really.

Why not support the women's side of things just as much as the men's?
What is stopping people from doing just that??
Why not support one of the two first teams, especially when the men's first team isn't doing all that well?

I honestly don't understand this mindset of looking to knock/pull down/laugh at the women's side of things, and say they are not worthy of having awards, or they don't deserve to be in this conversation, it should just be all about the men's first team only.

Or that when people talk about the club, that automatically means, or is interchangeable with, the men's first team, when that isn't, or shouldn't be the case at all.
The club is ALL of the teams that wear the shirt, & represent the club, from the youngest of ages of both genders, to the very oldest.

So an awards night like we are discussing here, should be there to bring EVERYONE at the club together, and should be about celebrating EVERYONE, not just one particular team or gender.
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Why so many why's in one post ffs
 
Corridor of Uncertainty said:
Why so many why's in one post ffs
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Because they are all questions that are very pertinent to this discussion.

Let's take just one then shall we to start off with, if more than one is too much of an issue, how about, why is there this need to rush to put down anything to do with the women's team?

Then we can go from there to perhaps answering the other ones....
 
They should have organized one without the first team. The women team and the youths deserve to be celebrated
 
MUW4Eva said:
Hopefully the saga is over, hopefully he can come in, and look to work with Skinner to make the two sides more closely linked together.
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I've got a question for you. Why do you think a manager, specifically brought in to take the men's team back to the top, should be working closely with the women's team to bring them closer together? What has that got to do with Ten Hag's role? Don't think you think he's got enough of a job on his hands as it is?

You're on the wind up.
 
devilish said:
They should have organized one without the men's first team. The women team and the youths deserve to be celebrated
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This should be an occasion where everyone at the club comes together to celebrate those who have done well, why shouldn't the men's first team players be there to applaud and to appreciate those at the club who have done what for the most part, most of them have not?

Why deny for example, Ella Toone the chance to talk to her fellow first team number 7?
Or the two first team goalkeepers in Mary and Dave??
This event should be about bringing everyone at the club together, not building walls, and having separate award nights etc.
 
MUW4Eva said:
This should be an occasion where everyone at the club comes together to celebrate those who have done well, why shouldn't the men's first team players be there to applaud and to appreciate those at the club who have done what for the most part, most of them have not?

Why deny for example, Ella Toone the chance to talk to her fellow first team number 7?
Or the two first team goalkeepers in Mary and Dave??
This event should be about bringing everyone at the club together, not building walls, and having separate award nights etc.
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Fully agree.
 
Corridor of Uncertainty said:
I've got a question for you. Why do you think a manager, specifically brought in to take the men's team back to the top, should be working closely with the women's team to bring them closer together? What has that got to do with Ten Hag's role?

You're on the wind up.
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There isn’t really a negative to Ten Hag doing such a thing though, and it has the potential to very much be a positive for club morale, which seeps into the team.

A rising tide lifts all ships.
 
Corridor of Uncertainty said:
I've got a question for you. Why do you think a manager, specifically brought in to take the men's team back to the top, should be working closely with the women's team to bring them closer together? What has that got to do with Ten Hag's role?

You're on the wind up.
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No wind up at all, I can assure you of that.

It is about bringing the two teams together in harmony, making it much more of a one club mentality or ethos.

Why this need or desire to separate them, to act as if both are separate entities, rather than being the two first teams at the club?

Why not see what both first team managers/head coaches (whichever title best suits their respective roles) can learn from each other, and how that can translate into better ways for both sides.
 
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phelans shorts said:
There isn’t really a negative to Ten Hag doing such a thing though, and it has the potential to very much be a positive for club morale, which seeps into the team.

A rising tide lifts all ships.
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Thank you, it is good to see that someone else can see where I am coming from.
 
MUW4Eva said:
Look for example at how Barcelona have developed with their respective women's team, twice they have broke the 90k attendance this very season.

Why is there this seeming hostility towards the women's section/department?

Why this rush to put what they do down?

Why not instead fully embrace them?

Why not take them to heart?

Why not think of them as just as much a part of the club as the men's side of things??

I find this need, this determination to sully their name, to drag them or their importance down, very odd.
To try and mock or to say "who cares" is very sad really.

Why not support the women's side of things just as much as the men's?
What is stopping people from doing just that??
Why not support one of the two first teams, especially when the men's first team isn't doing all that well?

I honestly don't understand this mindset of looking to knock/pull down/laugh at the women's side of things, and say they are not worthy of having awards, or they don't deserve to be in this conversation, it should just be all about the men's first team only.

Or that when people talk about the club, that automatically means, or is interchangeable with, the men's first team, when that isn't, or shouldn't be the case at all.
The club is ALL of the teams that wear the shirt, & represent the club, from the youngest of ages of both genders, to the very oldest.

So an awards night like we are discussing here, should be there to bring EVERYONE at the club together, and should be about celebrating EVERYONE, not just one particular team or gender.
Click to expand...

Hell, you're making a meal out of a trivial thing, just because we're saying the truth.
 
MUW4Eva said:
This should be an occasion where everyone at the club comes together to celebrate those who have done well, why shouldn't the men's first team players be there to applaud and to appreciate those at the club who have done what for the most part, most of them have not?

Why deny for example, Ella Toone the chance to talk to her fellow first team number 7?
Or the two first team goalkeepers in Mary and Dave??
This event should be about bringing everyone at the club together, not building walls, and having separate award nights etc.
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fair enough but having been cancelled simply because Ole's team is shit is far worse then the option I had suggested
 
el3mel said:
Hell, you're making a meal out of a trivial thing, just because we're saying the truth.
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You are not saying the truth, far from it, and I note that the questions that I posed have yet to be answered at all, or in any meaningful way sadly.
 
MUW4Eva said:
You are not saying the truth, far from it, and I note that the questions that I posed have yet to be answered at all, or in any meaningful way sadly.
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No you're making a meal out of it, pretending there's a hostility towards the women's team and turning it into a ridiculous conspiracy theory, while we're just saying they're inferior in terms of importance to the club and ultimately, the club's popularity and business was, is and will always be dependent on the men's team. Everyone following Manchester United follow the men's time, but not everyone follow the women or youth. Trying to turn this into a conspiracy against them is silly and just going over the top.

And cancelling the awards decision ultimately is up to the club.
 
el3mel said:
No you're making a meal out of it, pretending there's a hostility towards the women's team and turning it into a ridiculous conspiracy theory, while we're just saying they're inferior in terms of importance to the club and ultimately, the club's popularity and business was, is and will always be dependent on the men's team. Everyone following Manchester United follow the men's time, but not everyone follow the women or youth. Trying to turn this into a conspiracy against them is silly and just going over the top.

And cancelling the awards decision ultimately is up to the club.
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Of course it is up to the club what they do with anything, be it this awards night or anything else, it is just the reasoning behind the decision which is what the discussion is about here, as unless I am mistaken, one hasn't been publicly announced has it??

There definitely does appear to be a hostile nature or intent on the purpose of a few people towards the women's team, or people who push the idea of celebrating what the women's side of the club have achieved this season.

Again, no where have I suggested, or denied that the men's side of things doesn't bring in the most money etc, I agree fully with that, however, that shouldn't be what a night like this about.

This night should be about bringing everyone at the club together, to celebrate those who have achieved success, no matter their age or gender, hence why there are all of the various awards given out.
This isn't and shouldn't be an evening or an event dedicated only to one side, or one team.

And as for not everyone follows the women's team, well celebrating their respective achievements at a night like this, being alongside the men's first team, and getting the high profile coverage which comes with such an event, surely only helps in that respect, for people who are curious and want to check out who these award winners are, what the fuss is all about etc.

If it helps to get people to become more interested in the women's team, then it is surely a good thing.
 
It would feel wrong to have a PotY award this season but we gave out the award in 88/89, 89/90 and 90/91 when we finished 11th, 13th and 6th respectively so I'm struggling to articulate why.

I feel like it's the sheer scale of underachievement that has annoyed me so much this season, but then surely that was the case too in 88/89 when we'd finished 2nd the previous season.
 
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jeff_goldblum said:
It would feel wrong to have a PotY award this season but we gave out the award in 88/89, 89/90 and 90/91 when we finished 11th, 13th and 6th respectively so I'm struggling to articulate way.

I feel like it's the sheer scale of underachievement that has annoyed me so much this season, but then surely that was the case too in 88/89 when we'd finished 2nd the previous season.
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I think that it is different now, there are more teams, and more players to look and and give their dues this time around, then back then.

It is certainly hard to find an accurate justification to not holding the awards this time around, so I am in agreement with you there.
 
devilish said:
fair enough but having been cancelled simply because United's team is shit is far worse then the option I had suggested
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Corrected that for you, no need to thank me.

The current is pretty much equal part LVG, Jose and Ole signings - 2 or 3 of the players go as far back as Moyes and Fergie.
 
MUW4Eva said:
I think that it is different now, there are more teams, and more players to look and and give their dues this time around, then back then.

It is certainly hard to find an accurate justification to not holding the awards this time around, so I am in agreement with you there.
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You should probably put your argument to the club. They might just reconsider their stance on this year's awards ceremony if there is enough call for it.
 
Random Task said:
You should probably put your argument to the club. They might just reconsider their stance on this year's awards ceremony if there is enough call for it.
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I would love belive that my voice carried as much power and influence as that which you suggest, but I fully recognise that I don't sadly, even with one or two other people writing/contacting them.
 
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