The breakthrough of Garnacho is a blessing in many ways.
The centre-forward market...
- Thread starter Rozay
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Wouldn't mind Depay on loan
I don't think we should go for another stop-gap solution anymore. Is time to get a well-proven true centre forward. Someone in the mould of Haaland to truely challenge for top 4 and beyond. Otherwise we will just be stuck at currenr position and will struggle to even get top 4. However with that said, I can't thinj of any possible available option right now to fit the bill. (If only we can get Kane)
As you said, that forward most likely won't be available in January, so it will be smart to go for a stop-gap until we can reassess during the summer.
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I do think Garnacho makes Gakpo less likely but Gakpo could come in and Rashford be pushed central as rotation with Martial.
I’d like Gakpo regardless as I think he’s very good and could get even better.
Or Jonathan David as a good pressing forward who would create space for others like Rashford and Bruno.
I think more likely we just won’t sign anyone. Shame but I don’t see a clear favourite.
I’d like Gakpo regardless as I think he’s very good and could get even better.
Or Jonathan David as a good pressing forward who would create space for others like Rashford and Bruno.
I think more likely we just won’t sign anyone. Shame but I don’t see a clear favourite.
No, that simply means you would have to do business with Leipzig instead of Salzburg to sign him. The transfer window isn't open, so he hasn't formally transferred to Leipzig and become part of their squad. At least if we talk about a summer move, a winter move would include both clubs.
Just pay £200m in January for Felix
I'd be thrilled to get Kane in the summer. Sign him and watch him eventually break Shearer's record in a United shirt.
The problem is if we don't get a stop-gap this winter I don't like our chances of getting top 4, which will make signing top players much more difficult in the summer.
Wouldnt be the most surprising thing to hear something like the "no value in the market" excuse for not signing a striker this winter.
Really cannot do without
Really cannot do without
The key thing above all else is that we go into next season with a top quality first choice CF of the profile ETH wants. Not settling for a different type of CF, not relying on Anthony Martial as a first choice striker.
Once that's the case, pretty much everything else is justifiable. Be it overpaying to get that player in January, signing a different type of attacker we want in January and using Rashford centrally for the rest of this season, signing or loaning a player as a short term option for the rest of the season or even signing nobody if that's what it takes to get the guy we really want in the summer (though hopefully that's not the case).
Once that's the case, pretty much everything else is justifiable. Be it overpaying to get that player in January, signing a different type of attacker we want in January and using Rashford centrally for the rest of this season, signing or loaning a player as a short term option for the rest of the season or even signing nobody if that's what it takes to get the guy we really want in the summer (though hopefully that's not the case).
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Felix on loan is clearly the best and feasible January option.
So true! feck sake he better sign a proper contract
worth a gamble, can he play as a 9, looks a bit light?
Mbappe.
There's Ronaldo wages available and Mbappe could be available at the end of the season for an ambitious club.
The club being sold could finally mean we're a credible ambitious club once again.
Aim high.
There's Ronaldo wages available and Mbappe could be available at the end of the season for an ambitious club.
The club being sold could finally mean we're a credible ambitious club once again.
Aim high.
Definitely can play there and probably the false 9 role.
Who's not a striker...
So. With the Juve crisis. Cheeky Vlahovic bid?
Maybe his even better compatriot, Mitrovic?
Gakpo & Depay seem feasable until we go balls deep for a striker like Sesko in the summer.
That way we'd have 3 or 4 rotation for the coming season
Gakpo
Depay
Sesko
Martial
That way we'd have 3 or 4 rotation for the coming season
Gakpo
Depay
Sesko
Martial
Being greedy, I'd rather go for one (or both) of the young German strikers instead of Depay, namely Musiala and Moukoko. Musiala was brought up in England, and would possibly come back to the Premier League at some point, but is going to be expensive to prise away from Bayern any time soon. Moukoko is available for free in the Summer from our old friends in Dortmund.
Although it may take a year or two to get all the pieces in place, buying up some of the best young talent is the strategy that Madrid are using, and it will bear fruit over the longer term. Sesko, Gakpo, Garnacho, Moukoko and Musiala, together with Rashford, Martial, Sancho and Antony is a ridiculous talent pool to choose from. We have one spare space now with Ronaldo gone, arguably two without Greenwood. We could sell Elanga, Amad and Pellistri to make room for the above.
We could bring in Gakpo, but we really need a proper CF.
Sesko is much less experienced than Gakpo. None are what we need…a proven centre forward that can be relied upon to hit the ground running.
3 or 4 strikers rotating for one position? I can't think of any other team that has this, especially those who play with one up top.
Martial, New Striker and Rashford as back up is enough, in my opinion.
Problem is we won't get that player in January
An open question:
Everyone wants a star, but there's probably another Ciro Immobile out there and that would hardly be a disaster.
He moved to Lazio at 26 for half of what he cost Dortmund after a somewhat meh career (one huge Serie B season at 21 and a great Serie A season at 23 then a move that didn't go well to a big team and okay but not great on some loans) and is basically exactly at 3 goals in 4 appearances over that period for Lazio in the league. 15 in 55 for Italy looks a bit disappointing but 14 in his last 42 not taking penalties is okay, really, considering they've lacked creativity for a big side at times post-Pirlo (though Verrati and the fullbacks are decent and Chiesa has been around when healthy) and played a lot of tough games.
Basically I'm talking about a guy entering his prime who's shown promise and had at least one good season and might be a much better player from 25 or so to early 30s.
Used this list: https://www.transfermarkt.com/spiel...&jahrgang=0&land_id=0&kontinent_id=0&yt0=Show
Options I could see:
-Ollie Watkins (Don't see the technical qualities myself but he would score goals, so definitely some Immobile potential here)
-Ivan Toney (discussed a ton here already)
-Marcus Thuram (likeliest option in January or the summer and probably 2nd likeliest option among all strikers after Memphis because free in 6 months, discussed here already though would be nice to hear more frequent accounts from Bundesliga watchers. Guess he might start against Tunisia.)
-Fullkrug is a little old and slow but he does look a handful and worked his ass off when he came on against Spain and improved their play while scoring. Will surely start against Costa Rica). Would have to be cheap but might be. Probably would be happy to be a cult hero backup for us if we spent on a big #9 in 18 months or Martial somehow stays healthy, gets more desire for ugly goals or some dad strength in the air and becomes the Immobile figure.
-Calvert-Lewin (injuries and price mean it won't be him, bit raw technically but pressing and heading provide a high floor I would thinhk)
-Mitrovic (he'd have to force the move and we'd have to pay a ton. 28 but should age like Giroud if he'd be okay being 2nd choice striker in 2-3 years, but then spending 60M on him makes less sense, though say 4 years as starter, 2 as a good backup wouldn't be a horrible return)
-Enes Unal (25 year old and 20 in his last 51 for Getafe isn't bad, but ugly record for Turkey)
-Pedro (2 Brazil caps, including one in 2022, which is pretty good since Firmino can't even make a 26 man squad up top. Failed move to Fiorentina too young, top scorer in the Libertadores and 70 in 159 overall for Flamengo. I've literally never seen him play).
-Moussa Dembele (free in 6 months so cheap choice to give a year. Similar career so far to Immobile really. 5 good seasons then 2 bad ones sandwiched by a good year scoring goals)
-Embolo (good team player, only 25 and 7 in 15 for Monaco after stabilizing as a 1 in 4 player in the Bundesliga. 12 in 61 for Swiss isn't good but not terrible really considering he started so young and they're a pretty defensive squad with Xhaka and meh wingers to provide him the ball. Moved for 12 so Monaco might take say 22 and call it a win)
-Daka or Iheanacho. Daka looks better and probably isn't available but Iheanacho is a potentially nice for Ten Hag's style. Not really flourished as a lone striker.
-Solanke, would have to improve but he does sort of have everything you want in a #9 and tall strikers sometimes peak later because their strength hasn't caught up to their height yet really.
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Everyone wants a star, but there's probably another Ciro Immobile out there and that would hardly be a disaster.
He moved to Lazio at 26 for half of what he cost Dortmund after a somewhat meh career (one huge Serie B season at 21 and a great Serie A season at 23 then a move that didn't go well to a big team and okay but not great on some loans) and is basically exactly at 3 goals in 4 appearances over that period for Lazio in the league. 15 in 55 for Italy looks a bit disappointing but 14 in his last 42 not taking penalties is okay, really, considering they've lacked creativity for a big side at times post-Pirlo (though Verrati and the fullbacks are decent and Chiesa has been around when healthy) and played a lot of tough games.
Basically I'm talking about a guy entering his prime who's shown promise and had at least one good season and might be a much better player from 25 or so to early 30s.
Used this list: https://www.transfermarkt.com/spiel...&jahrgang=0&land_id=0&kontinent_id=0&yt0=Show
Options I could see:
-Ollie Watkins (Don't see the technical qualities myself but he would score goals, so definitely some Immobile potential here)
-Ivan Toney (discussed a ton here already)
-Marcus Thuram (likeliest option in January or the summer and probably 2nd likeliest option among all strikers after Memphis because free in 6 months, discussed here already though would be nice to hear more frequent accounts from Bundesliga watchers. Guess he might start against Tunisia.)
-Fullkrug is a little old and slow but he does look a handful and worked his ass off when he came on against Spain and improved their play while scoring. Will surely start against Costa Rica). Would have to be cheap but might be. Probably would be happy to be a cult hero backup for us if we spent on a big #9 in 18 months or Martial somehow stays healthy, gets more desire for ugly goals or some dad strength in the air and becomes the Immobile figure.
-Calvert-Lewin (injuries and price mean it won't be him, bit raw technically but pressing and heading provide a high floor I would thinhk)
-Mitrovic (he'd have to force the move and we'd have to pay a ton. 28 but should age like Giroud if he'd be okay being 2nd choice striker in 2-3 years, but then spending 60M on him makes less sense, though say 4 years as starter, 2 as a good backup wouldn't be a horrible return)
-Enes Unal (25 year old and 20 in his last 51 for Getafe isn't bad, but ugly record for Turkey)
-Pedro (2 Brazil caps, including one in 2022, which is pretty good since Firmino can't even make a 26 man squad up top. Failed move to Fiorentina too young, top scorer in the Libertadores and 70 in 159 overall for Flamengo. I've literally never seen him play).
-Moussa Dembele (free in 6 months so cheap choice to give a year. Similar career so far to Immobile really. 5 good seasons then 2 bad ones sandwiched by a good year scoring goals)
-Embolo (good team player, only 25 and 7 in 15 for Monaco after stabilizing as a 1 in 4 player in the Bundesliga. 12 in 61 for Swiss isn't good but not terrible really considering he started so young and they're a pretty defensive squad with Xhaka and meh wingers to provide him the ball. Moved for 12 so Monaco might take say 22 and call it a win)
-Daka or Iheanacho. Daka looks better and probably isn't available but Iheanacho is a potentially nice for Ten Hag's style. Not really flourished as a lone striker.
-Solanke, would have to improve but he does sort of have everything you want in a #9 and tall strikers sometimes peak later because their strength hasn't caught up to their height yet really.
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I wonder if we should not cross Harry Kane completely off our list, for the below reason? What do you guys think?
Harry Kane started again for England yesterday. 3 games in the World Cup so far.
Before the WC, he had this season played in app 2,100 minutes for Tottenham and England in the NL Almost all games and in all competitions. In comparison, Diego Dalot had played 1,700 minutes, and we all know how hard his work load was.
Tottenham and Conte is not giving Kane a month off after the World Cup. He played him in the Caraboe, even after playing him in all CL and PL games. He always plays him. They have not had any easy wins lately, and often scrambling to get pts during the last 15 minutes. Seems like they suck for 70 min, then play well the last stretch.
Sure, he has played a lot in the past. But this season will be something else with the tight schedule after Christmas. It seems to me that players being asked to put in a Herculean work load on the pitch one season, almost always follow that up with sluggish season.
But maybe that is too much of a generalization? If we got the Kane we see right now, it’s undeniable that he would help us a lot. But how will the Kane look that show up for pre season next season?
Harry Kane started again for England yesterday. 3 games in the World Cup so far.
Before the WC, he had this season played in app 2,100 minutes for Tottenham and England in the NL Almost all games and in all competitions. In comparison, Diego Dalot had played 1,700 minutes, and we all know how hard his work load was.
Tottenham and Conte is not giving Kane a month off after the World Cup. He played him in the Caraboe, even after playing him in all CL and PL games. He always plays him. They have not had any easy wins lately, and often scrambling to get pts during the last 15 minutes. Seems like they suck for 70 min, then play well the last stretch.
Sure, he has played a lot in the past. But this season will be something else with the tight schedule after Christmas. It seems to me that players being asked to put in a Herculean work load on the pitch one season, almost always follow that up with sluggish season.
But maybe that is too much of a generalization? If we got the Kane we see right now, it’s undeniable that he would help us a lot. But how will the Kane look that show up for pre season next season?
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Think Toney is most likely off the list now after that betting stuff,in terms of the others there's been little talk of that proper number 9 in January.
Great post! I don’t have much additional input on the above names, but the cathegory you look at shouldn’t be underrated.
Choupo-Motin is an interesting case study. He has 11 goals in 16 games for Bayern according to the stats, but broken down it’s really impressive,1 goal every 89th minute. He has been really good in the World Cup too.
He is 33 y/o. He was a bust for Stoke.
But he has just kept improving. Better technically now, definitely smarter. He have been relatively injury free lately.
For various reasons, there is always a group of strikers out there in the periphery of the elite football world who reach a pretty high level, without ever getting to the top clubs.
The career path for a young striker with size is just very narrow. Big lads takes a little longer time to develop technically, find that coordination. But the potential is obvious, they are big, fast, can finish. So they are given a chance. If they don’t score regularly, get injuries, they are often set aside by the gaffer for a more experienced guy who puts in the work 110%, is a little smarter. They start to move around. For a striker to do well, chemistry is really important. It takes time for a striker to learn his team, and for his team to learn exactly how the striker wants the ball. And when you get outside the better teams in every league — being the lone striker in today’s game can be a real graveyard shift.
It is not that uncommon that top strikers are late bloomers.
I get what you’re saying but Sir Alex always believed to compete on all fronts in the league, the league cup, the FA cup and CL you need a set of four strikers. I think even if we play one up top we need at least 4 that can comfortably play up top. I think we already have two and need another two.
That's an underwhelming collection of players. Only Toney is on the required level, but he's out of question at the moment.
Don't know enough about Thuram and Pedro, maybe they have enough potential.
I wouldn't expect any big moves considering the club is likely up for sale. More likely a backup or "cheeky punt" type of signing, if any.
Well that's the point of that post, isn't it? Finding players who might be late bloomers, but aren't playing on that level right now. Of course they are underwhelming right now.
This is not aimed at you but I have seen a trend where lots of people find Mitrovic underwhelming yet fawn over Vlahovic, and I struggle to wrap my head around it. Vlahovic might have a higher ceiling (debatable), but even then ceilings are rarely reached. And he might well be unable to reach whatever his ceiling is in this league, due to his player profile.
Currently Mitrovic keeps Vlahovic on the bench for Serbia, and on merit. He's also performing in England, a tougher league, with a midtable team. We also know the risk of importing strikers form Italy, a league where pace, athleticism and aggression always plays a minor secondary role compared to skill, technique and tactical awareness. Something that simply doesn't apply here. Decent (but not great) players like Lukaku, Immobile, Dzeko, Quagliarella, Icardi and now Arnautovic have literally shined in that league but looked pretty mediocre out of it.
Is it because he plays in a foreign league and there's a "grass is always greener" mentality. Is it because he's younger and there's an obsession with emerging talents as opposed to players on their peak?
Disclaimer: I know Mitrovic isn't available unless it's a silly sum. It's more about what drives fans preferences.
https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...eparture-marks-end-of-an-era?CMP=share_btn_tw
It feels like there absolutely is a chance to get Vlahovic with Juve's financial issues
My judgement is no good obviously but from what I've seen of Vlahovic (few games), he has an excellent touch, is a proper 9, in the box, decent pace etc.
I actually haven't seen Mitrovic much weirdly enough. But yeah maybe Mitrovic is better and someone like me is looking at Vlahovic as the fancier option so to speak.
I think Vlahovic's age means we are building for the future, rather than Mitrovic. So that is why I suggest him instead.
I'm back on my bullshit with this. We can make this happen in Jan.
I have never been impressed by Vlahovic at all. Hyped up Chris Wood.
So, genuine January options? Gakpo, Depay, Thuram?
Then a proper striker in the summer?
Then a proper striker in the summer?