T20 World Cup

anver said:
Excuses are being trotted out, and the usual " No excuses, but just for the record...." Kirsten came out with fatigue and niggling injuries to the Indians as one of the causes of their debacle, and in the same breath he said he was not making excuses!
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If he's asked about it, he has to say something. What's he supposed to do? Sit and pretend no one asked him any questions? What country are you from anyway?

Spoony! said:
That will always be your achilles heel. To be a great side, you need an excellent geniune pace bowler. Frankly, you've never had one. I think your batting has always been good enough, though.
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It won't ever happen. There's not a lot of motivation for kids growing up, because the domestic pitches are all batsmen-friendly, and it saps the life out of you when the weather's as humid as it is here throughout the year at a temperature of 30+ and every 5 year old wants to grow up and become Sachin Tendulkar.

Addict said:
What do you think of Ishant Sharma Pavan?

Read this on Cricinfo.

I cannot believe Cricinfo didn't pick-up on this. Millions of pages have been wasted on blaming India's batting. Has anybody thought maybe there is also a problem with the bowling as well. Ishant Sharma's T20 stats are (excluding 1 match against Bangladesh) is shameful: Matches 7, Average 93.5, Wickets 2, Strike Rate 64, and Economy Rate 8.76. This is the guy who was auctioned for a million bucks for the IPL. OPEN YOUR EYES SELECTORS
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He's new. He's the best prospect we've had in a long time in test cricket. He'll adapt to limited overs, eventually.


Was Yuvraj out? I was sure it'd be given not out because it looked very inconclusive. Couldn't spot an edge there.
 
mehro said:
You've got the voice of a 50 year old.
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Heh, reminds me of when I did a survey on the phone when I was 15

'So, sir, what age bracket are you in; 35-40, 40-45, 45-50'

'Actually, I'm 15'

'Err... what?'
 
zing said:
If he's asked about it, he has to say something. What's he supposed to do? Sit and pretend no one asked him any questions? What country are you from anyway?


If he's asked, he should have said 'we were not good enough'. End of story. Its stupid, saying fatigue and IPL was the cause. Seven Sri Lankan players were also heavily involved in the IPL. As professional cricketers you dont trot out excuses.

What country am I from? Why? What does it matter? Ok. If I said I was Indian? You'd call me unpatriotic? I am Indian.
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anver said:
zing said:
If he's asked about it, he has to say something. What's he supposed to do? Sit and pretend no one asked him any questions? What country are you from anyway?


If he's asked, he should have said 'we were not good enough'. End of story. Its stupid, saying fatigue and IPL was the cause. Seven Sri Lankan players were also heavily involved in the IPL. As professional cricketers you dont trot out excuses.

What country am I from? Why? What does it matter? Ok. If I said I was Indian? You'd call me unpatriotic? I am Indian.
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Eh? "We were not good enough."? Of course he's going to elaborate, it's a press conference. Everyone does that. He's entitled to his opinion. Why does it bother you so much?

The difference between the other countries players and our players is that our players are on the road continuously and start playing in the IPL. The NZ tour(3 tests, 2 T20s and 5 ODIs) ended 3 days before the IPL. We played Sri Lanka in 5 ODIs 10 days before the NZ tour started.

Our players played like shit, yes, but they're not helped by the fact that they're playing almost throughout the year. In the IPL, they aren't allowed to be rested/rotated unlike the other country players who get a bit of rest because of the 4 foreign player quota. There's not as much spotlight on foreign players as on Indian players when playing for their franchises. Far less pressure.

The IPL serves as T20 warm-up for the other players because they have a good rest before it, our players don't. Next week they go to the West Indies again for a ODI series. The BCCI needs to find a way to give them a rest before major tournaments.

I asked about your nationality because you're always making snide comments about India and talking SL up. Are you a Sri Lankan expat?
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zing said:
anver said:
Eh? "We were not good enough."? Of course he's going to elaborate, it's a press conference. Everyone does that. He's entitled to his opinion. Why does it bother you so much?

The difference between the other countries players and our players is that our players are on the road continuously and start playing in the IPL. The NZ tour(3 tests, 2 T20s and 5 ODIs) ended 3 days before the IPL. We played Sri Lanka in 5 ODIs 10 days before the NZ tour started.

Our players played like shit, yes, but they're not helped by the fact that they're playing almost throughout the year. In the IPL, they aren't allowed to be rested/rotated unlike the other country players who get a bit of rest because of the 4 foreign player quota. There's not as much spotlight on foreign players as on Indian players when playing for their franchises. Far less pressure.

The IPL serves as T20 warm-up for the other players because they have a good rest before it, our players don't. Next week they go to the West Indies again for a ODI series. The BCCI needs to find a way to give them a rest before major tournaments.

I asked about your nationality because you're always making snide comments about India and talking SL up. Are you a Sri Lankan expat?
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Sri-Lanka too have been playing continuous cricket in 2009. No breaks. Added to the tours they had to face the trauma in Lahore, which can sap anybody's enthusiasm.

So, no excuses there, zing. You dont have a stand.

About the snide remarks: You call criticism snide remarks? You are a typical chauvinist. You just cant stomach realities. Always living in a world of make believe. I am not chauvinist. That is why you think I am a Sri-Lankan expat. You cant imagine an Indian being critical of our own side. Whether we play shit or not, the Indian side is the best in the world. That's what you want me to say?

Grow up, mate. Take a hard look at how we have performed, and then come up with excuses for excuses. And as for talking Sri_Lanka up: Look at how they are playing. No frills. Just getting on with the job. And no media hype rocketing the team to the top position in world cricket.

And Pakistan, Windies, and South Africa. They deserve to be in the semis because they performed.
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anver said:
zing said:
Sri-Lanka too have been playing continuous cricket in 2009. No breaks. Added to the tours they had to face the trauma in Lahore, which can sap anybody's enthusiasm.

So, no excuses there, zing. You dont have a stand.

About the snide remarks: You call criticism snide remarks? You are a typical chauvinist. You just cant stomach realities. Always living in a world of make believe. I am not chauvinist. That is why you think I am a Sri-Lankan expat. You cant imagine an Indian being critical of our own side. Whether we play shit or not, the Indian side is the best in the world. That's what you want me to say?

Grow up, mate. Take a hard look at how we have performed, and then come up with excuses for excuses. And as for talking Sri_Lanka up: Look at how they are playing. No frills. Just getting on with the job. And no media hype rocketing the team to the top position in world cricket.

And Pakistan, Windies, and South Africa. They deserve to be in the semis because they performed.
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There you go again. There's a difference between constructive criticism and making snide remarks. The latter is what you do.

And as for Sri Lanka playing continous cricket in 2009? Go back to the last 8-10 months in the cricketing calendar.

Since October 2008(which is what cricinfo, where I've gotten my stats from, are using as a reference for beginning of the cricket saeson 2008-2009)

India have played:
4 tests against Australia
5 ODIs, 2 tests against England
3 tests, 5 ODIs, 2 T20s against NZ

Sri Lanka:
2 tests against Bangladesh
1, 3 ODIs test against Pakistan(1 curtained, played for 2 days because of the shootings)
5 ODIs against Zimbabwe
A tri-nation trophy involving Bangladesh and Zimbabwe

How can you even compare the 2 assignments? India have played against far superior opposition. Barring Pakistan, Sri Lanka have been playing against the minnows when there's absolutely no pressure. Even ignoring the opposition, India have played a lot more than Sri Lanka.

Sri Lankan players in the IPL? Jayasuriya, Dilshan, Sangakarra, Jayawardene, Malinga, Muralitharan -- Mendis played 2 games for his franchise.

Indian players in the IPL? All of them, every single match.

Go on now, give me your response. You obviously don't follow enough cricket and you come in here and talk a load of bollocks. There was a lot of expectation for this Indian team because they won a majority of their matches recently and have had some of the best limited overs players in the last 6 months. Sri Lanka haven't had that and that's why the relative lack of hype. I have no idea why you hate India so much.
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zing said:
anver said:
There you go again. There's a difference between constructive criticism and making snide remarks. The latter is what you do.

And as for Sri Lanka playing continous cricket in 2009? Go back to the last 8-10 months in the cricketing calendar.

Since October 2008(which is what cricinfo, where I've gotten my stats from, are using as a reference for beginning of the cricket saeson 2008-2009)

India have played:
4 tests against Australia
5 ODIs, 2 tests against England
3 tests, 5 ODIs, 2 T20s against NZ

Sri Lanka:
2 tests against Bangladesh
1, 3 ODIs test against Pakistan(1 curtained, played for 2 days because of the shootings)
5 ODIs against Zimbabwe
A tri-nation trophy involving Bangladesh and Zimbabwe

How can you even compare the 2 assignments? India have played against far superior opposition. Barring Pakistan, Sri Lanka have been playing against the minnows when there's absolutely no pressure. Even ignoring the opposition, India have played a lot more than Sri Lanka.

Sri Lankan players in the IPL? Jayasuriya, Dilshan, Sangakarra, Jayawardene, Malinga, Muralitharan -- Mendis played 2 games for his franchise.

Indian players in the IPL? All of them, every single match.

Go on now, give me your response. You obviously don't follow enough cricket and you come in here and talk a load of bollocks. There was a lot of expectation for this Indian team because they won a majority of their matches recently and have had some of the best limited overs players in the last 6 months. Sri Lanka haven't had that and that's why the relative lack of hype. I have no idea why you hate India so much.
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Whether you play strong or weak sides, you still have to play. Pressure is always there. So, your claim that India were under pressure, and Sri-Lanka were not, does not hold water.

Yes. India won most of their assignments last year, and a lot was expected of them. Fair enough. I, too expected India to walk away with the T20. But they failed. So, okay. They did not perform. They failed. Now, what happened after that is where we are in disagreement. No excuses, please. You are trying to justify their loss, blaming their heavy schedule,etc.etc. Aren't you being another whiner?

As for the hype. Dont you agree that our media go over the top every time we win a series? Praise is all good. But calling them the best in the world? We won a few tests, and we are the best test playing nation. We win a few ODIs, ad lo! We are the best in ODIs. We won the last T20 World cup. Fine. We were the best. But we are not anymore. So, look for excuses why we are not. And you split hairs by bringing in our fixtures from October 2008, as why we lost. Childish, man.

And you say I hate India. Not being in agreement with a few Indians does not make me an India hater. That is another puerile statement from you.
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zing this is T20 hardly strenuous stuff. It's only 4 overs each and none of our bowlers bowl it fast.

If our players are getting tired after playing a couple of T20s then they're even more unprofessional than I thought.
 
anver said:
zing said:
Whether you play strong or weak sides, you still have to play. Pressure is always there. So, your claim that India were under pressure, and Sri-Lanka were not, does not hold water.

Yes. India won most of their assignments last year, and a lot was expected of them. Fair enough. I, too expected India to walk away with the T20. But they failed. So, okay. They did not perform. They failed. Now, what happened after that is where we are in disagreement. No excuses, please. You are trying to justify their loss, blaming their heavy schedule,etc.etc. Aren't you being another whiner?

As for the hype. Dont you agree that our media go over the top every time we win a series? Praise is all good. But calling them the best in the world? We won a few tests, and we are the best test playing nation. We win a few ODIs, ad lo! We are the best in ODIs. We won the last T20 World cup. Fine. We were the best. But we are not anymore. So, look for excuses why we are not. And you split hairs by bringing in our fixtures from October 2008, as why we lost. Childish, man.

And you say I hate India. Not being in agreement with a few Indians does not make me an India hater. That is another puerile statement from you.
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How can you say that constantly playing for 8 months will not have an effect on any team? Your response to that was that "So have Sri Lanka.", and I've shown you stats showing that Sri Lanka 1] have not played constantly 2] when they have, they haven't played against top opposition. And that statement about the pressure being equal whether you play Zimbabwe or Australia is just plain wrong. Zimbabwe and Bangladesh don't have teams good enough to remotely compete at the top level anymore.

I'm not sure why giving reasons as to why a team failed is so wrong in your eyes. Sehwag didn't play, Zaheer was injured coming into this, fatigue... these are reasons why we couldn't do as well as hoped. No one's saying "We'd have won if this had happened.". No one's repeatedly going back to it, except you.

And your statement about the media. Who cares what they think? They've made the Indian team into a team of no-hopers in the media today. Are you going to defend the Indian team now because the media thinks they're shit?
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Predict the semis:

South Africa Vs Pakistan:

German like efficiency Vs Flair and unpredictability. South Africa should win this, they're easily the best all round side in the comp. Pakistan, however, can be box office when they click - but I think the South Africans will be too strong for them, that is unless Pakistan's batting line up decides to show up.

WIndies Vs Sri Lanka:

WIndies have impressed, their batting is powerful and is perhaps the best in the touro, whereas Sri Lanka's batting can be a bit laboured. However, their bowling is fantastic - The three Ms are quality. This one's a bit more difficult to predict. I think Sri Lanka will probably shade it. Just. Probably.
 
Psmith said:
zing this is T20 hardly strenuous stuff. It's only 4 overs each and none of our bowlers bowl it fast.

If our players are getting tired after playing a couple of T20s then they're even more unprofessional than I thought.
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It's not about playing the game, it's about how long they've played in the build up to it. Hardly any rest.


I think Windies v S Africa final. And hopefully West Indies win it.

They're showing the Ashes that England won on TV. Highlights of it. Quality.. can't wait for the tests to start.
 
zing said:
It's not about playing the game, it's about how long they've played in the build up to it. Hardly any rest.


I think Windies v S Africa final. And hopefully West Indies win it.

They're showing the Ashes that England won on TV. Highlights of it. Quality.. can't wait for the tests to start.
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Bollocks. What channel were they showing the 2005 Ashes on? :(
 
Got a free ticket to the Pak v SA game!! Woohoo! Blooming long drive from London though. Need to find some green paint now. My banner will read: "Choke! Choke! Choke!"
 
Pakistan to win.

Just so some of the deluded Indian kids on here hang themselves.
 
Can anyone remember anything that SA have done? They aren't anything special, just need Pak to play their proper game. I don't think the bowlers will rip through SA at all but they'll be able to keep them in check enough - the batting needs to be spot on or a little bit of "boom boom" Afridi....

On paper I'd say Sri-Lanka and South Africa. Everything else points towards Pak v WI. Not sure about Sri-Lanka, they are one of the best but I have this feeling they'd feck up in the semi or the final.

I can't imagine SA winning the Twenty20 WC but unfortunately it might be the case. Dropped catches and shoddy fielding matters - something which WI and Pak don't exactly excel at.
 
ZIDANE said:
Can anyone remember anything that SA have done? They aren't anything special.
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That's just it, they're a well oiled machine. Frankly, I've always found them boring to watch. Sure, Australia were also very scientific in their approach but they were watchable. It's the little things that make the difference, saving 10 or 20 runs in the field can be the difference between winning and losing. Which is why the others will have to be at top of their game to beat them.

Come to think of it, I can't think of any SA player I'd pay to watch.
 
I've been telling my Indian friends they peaked too early when they beat us in the friendly. Same with Sri Lanka to some extent - I can see Windies do them. SA are just so bloody robotic and efficient. However a choking semi final is probably the best place to meet them. Let's hope so.
 
zing said:
anver said:
How can you say that constantly playing for 8 months will not have an effect on any team? Your response to that was that "So have Sri Lanka.", and I've shown you stats showing that Sri Lanka 1] have not played constantly 2] when they have, they haven't played against top opposition. And that statement about the pressure being equal whether you play Zimbabwe or Australia is just plain wrong. Zimbabwe and Bangladesh don't have teams good enough to remotely compete at the top level anymore.

I'm not sure why giving reasons as to why a team failed is so wrong in your eyes. Sehwag didn't play, Zaheer was injured coming into this, fatigue... these are reasons why we couldn't do as well as hoped. No one's saying "We'd have won if this had happened.". No one's repeatedly going back to it, except you.

And your statement about the media. Who cares what they think? They've made the Indian team into a team of no-hopers in the media today. Are you going to defend the Indian team now because the media thinks they're shit?
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Sehwag injured; Zaheer injured. If these are not excuses, what are they? Ah. I forgot. You are an expert at cricket stats. Only stats, and trotting out excuses, and not call them excuses. You call them reasons why. They under performed. They lost. Dont look for reasons why they under performed. Maybe they were not interested; dont know. maybe their TV commercial income was higher than the cricket income. So, why bother? The bottom line is they were not up to it. As professionals, they cannot trot out the fatigue excuse. That is only good for bigoted supporters to pick up.

Of course, I dont think the Indian team are no hopers. They will come back, if and only if, they forego their TV commercials programs, and pay more attention to cricket. If not, you cant call them professional cricketers. Just flashes in a pan.
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anver said:
zing said:
Sehwag injured; Zaheer injured. If these are not excuses, what are they? Ah. I forgot. You are an expert at cricket stats. Only stats, and trotting out excuses, and not call them excuses. You call them reasons why. They under performed. They lost. Dont look for reasons why they under performed. Maybe they were not interested; dont know. maybe their TV commercial income was higher than the cricket income. So, why bother? The bottom line is they were not up to it. As professionals, they cannot trot out the fatigue excuse. That is only good for bigoted supporters to pick up.

Of course, I dont think the Indian team are no hopers. They will come back, if and only if, they forego their TV commercials programs, and pay more attention to cricket. If not, you cant call them professional cricketers. Just flashes in a pan.
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................

You are like a broken record. Why can any team not point to the reasons they failed? What is so wrong with that if asked about it? Go on. Explain.

And your commercials point is another in a long line of bullshit you've been spewing. The BCCI put a rule in place 3 years ago saying that more than 3 players can't appear in the same commercial and we've had very less number of players coming in them since then. Right now, only Dhoni comes in a bunch of ads. No one else does. Yuvraj, Sehwag, Gambhir, Raina, Yusuf, Irfan, RP, Ishant, Ojha.. none of them come in any TV ads. I'm sure I can name more. You just have no clue about cricket or Indian cricket and you just have this baseless dislike for the Indian cricket team.
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anver said:
Sehwag injured; Zaheer injured. If these are not excuses, what are they? Ah. I forgot. You are an expert at cricket stats. Only stats, and trotting out excuses, and not call them excuses. You call them reasons why. They under performed. They lost. Dont look for reasons why they under performed. Maybe they were not interested; dont know. maybe their TV commercial income was higher than the cricket income. So, why bother? The bottom line is they were not up to it. As professionals, they cannot trot out the fatigue excuse. That is only good for bigoted supporters to pick up.

Of course, I dont think the Indian team are no hopers. They will come back, if and only if, they forego their TV commercials programs, and pay more attention to cricket. If not, you cant call them professional cricketers. Just flashes in a pan.
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Amen
 
zing said:
anver said:
................

You are like a broken record. Why can any team not point to the reasons they failed? What is so wrong with that if asked about it? Go on. Explain.

And your commercials point is another in a long line of bullshit you've been spewing. The BCCI put a rule in place 3 years ago saying that more than 3 players can't appear in the same commercial and we've had very less number of players coming in them since then. Right now, only Dhoni comes in a bunch of ads. No one else does. Yuvraj, Sehwag, Gambhir, Raina, Yusuf, Irfan, RP, Ishant, Ojha.. none of them come in any TV ads. I'm sure I can name more. You just have no clue about cricket or Indian cricket and you just have this baseless dislike for the Indian cricket team.
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More appropriate to you.

Commercials? I see Tendulkar, Yuvraj, Harbajan, Dhoni, Sehwag, come on quite a few commercials. I dont exactly remember how many other commercials involve Indian players. I will come back to you with names in a few days. It is the weekends that I get time to watch Dish TV and the like.

Another puerile statement. I think I am dealing with a juvenile. Go brush your teeth, and wear your pampers when you go out.
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:lol: Puerile. You love that word, don't you.

And it is pretty obvious that you are the one with agenda here. People trot out excuses for loses or poor performances all the time, be it any sport. Dhoni or Indian cricket team have not done something ground breaking here.

Even this season, Fergie maintained till the end that we played well against Liverpool when they smashed us 4-1. Not to mention the we couldn't see each other in sun due to our shirt colour theorem a decade or so ago.
 
anver said:
zing said:
More appropriate to you.

Commercials? I see Tendulkar, Yuvraj, Harbajan, Dhoni, Sehwag, come on quite a few commercials. I dont exactly remember how many other commercials involve Indian players. I will come back to you with names in a few days. It is the weekends that I get time to watch Dish TV and the like.

Another puerile statement. I think I am dealing with a juvenile. Go brush your teeth, and wear your pampers when you go out.
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I've mentioned Dhoni already. Harbhajan, Zaheer come in 1. Sehwag used to be in one till a couple of months ago. They're hardly over-commercialized, which is what you said the Indian players are. Funnily enough, all the players who come in commercials(except for Dhoni's recent slump) have been the best performers for India over the last 16 months.
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crappycraperson said:
:lol: Puerile. You love that word, don't you.

And it is pretty obvious that you are the one with agenda here. People trot out excuses for loses or poor performances all the time, be it any sport. Dhoni or Indian cricket team have not done something ground breaking here.

Even this season, Fergie maintained till the end that we played well against Liverpool when they smashed us 4-1. Not to mention the we couldn't see each other in sun due to our shirt colour theorem a decade or so ago.
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Puerile means childish. I have been unknowingly making it out with a juvenile. :boring:

Yes. I have an agenda. I dont want the Indian side to be laughed at. We have already been made a laughing stock in this very forum. Read the posts, and decide for yourself. When we lost to England, it was due to our inept performance. When we lost to Windies, again it was our inept performance. And with just 130 or so to win against SA, our so called stars just flopped. Still, some posters were looking for excuses.

Vettori, Mahela, and a South African player ( forget his name) have also said that fatigue should not be an issue. So, there you are.

If you feel excuses should be the order of the day when we lose, keep going. Good luck to you.

Fergie never gave excuses for the losses against Liverpool. He never gave excuses when we lost the CL final. He simply said the better side won.
 
Spoony! said:
That's just it, they're a well oiled machine. Frankly, I've always found them boring to watch. Sure, Australia were also very scientific in their approach but they were watchable. It's the little things that make the difference, saving 10 or 20 runs in the field can be the difference between winning and losing. Which is why the others will have to be at top of their game to beat them.

Come to think of it, I can't think of any SA player I'd pay to watch.
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They had loads of flair under Cronje Spoons (if that counts). I loved their fighting spirit and were a premature catch celebration away from lifting the 1999 World Cup.

That team had flair in every department - Kirsten, Gibbs, Cullinan and Kulsener in the batting line-up, Gibbs and Johnty while fielding and Donaldo and Pollock while bowling.

Plus, they included Paul Adams just for his funny action.
 
anver said:
Puerile means childish. I have been unknowingly making it out with a juvenile. :boring:

Yes. I have an agenda. I dont want the Indian side to be laughed at. We have already been made a laughing stock in this very forum. Read the posts, and decide for yourself. When we lost to England, it was due to our inept performance. When we lost to Windies, again it was our inept performance. And with just 130 or so to win against SA, our so called stars just flopped. Still, some posters were looking for excuses.

Vettori, Mahela, and a South African player ( forget his name) have also said that fatigue should not be an issue. So, there you are.

If you feel excuses should be the order of the day when we lose, keep going. Good luck to you.

Fergie never gave excuses for the losses against Liverpool. He never gave excuses when we lost the CL final. He simply said the better side won.
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You have clearly got an agenda hence your pathetic attempt to make a mountain out of a molehill. I can't be arsed to troll the net but you can easily find quotes by Fergie and countless other football managers making excuses any loss or bad performance.

And I could not give a feck who laughs at my cricket team. If you troll other football forums, you will find people laughing at United after every single loss.

Losing two back to back T20 matches, suddenly does not make India the worst team in the world.

And if your problem is with the Indian press, then that is not exclusive to India either. Indian press has gone to the gutter just like American and British one.
 
Salvation said:
They had loads of flair under Cronje Spoons (if that counts). I loved their fighting spirit and were a premature catch celebration away from lifting the 1999 World Cup.

That team had flair in every department - Kirsten, Gibbs, Cullinan and Kulsener in the batting line-up, Gibbs and Johnty while fielding and Donaldo and Pollock while bowling.

Plus, they included Paul Adams just for his funny action.
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Hey, I heard you became a religious nutjob?
 
crappycraperson said:
You have clearly got an agenda hence your pathetic attempt to make a mountain out of a molehill. I can't be arsed to troll the net but you can easily find quotes by Fergie and countless other football managers making excuses any loss or bad performance.

And I could not give a feck who laughs at my cricket team. If you troll other football forums, you will find people laughing at United after every single loss.

Losing two back to back T20 matches, suddenly does not make India the worst team in the world.

And if your problem is with the Indian press, then that is not exclusive to India either. Indian press has gone to the gutter just like American and British one.
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:boring:
 
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