Summer 2019 Midfield Rebuild

Tielemans and Ndidi. If we sign one, we should sign the other as well. A midfield duo that is Premier League proven, work well together and has already shown they are capable of going toe to toe with Liverpool and Man City.
 
I’d love N’Dombele, Rice and Rabiot all brought in as all offer something different and are upgrades on what we have other than Pogba.
 
As I’ve said again and again, Bruno and Ndombele would sort it.

I’m not completely adverse to Rice as we really don’t have that kind of player. But only if the fee isn’t exorbitant.

What we’re missing is quality and workrate in midfield. Bruno and Ndombele would give us both.
 
I totally cannot understand what we are thinking by targeting Gueye, we have just let a player of a similar age run down his contract and leave on a free to PSG and now we want another player in their late 20s. Just goes to show that this board haven't a clue what needs to be done with this midfield rebuild
 
Our midfield might lack quality & creativity but the issue is deeper, we lack basic. Players are lazy & ball watching lot of time, lack of awareness. We need to bring some aggression & hard worker with intelligent to read the game well first.

For this summer, I'll start by bringing Rice first to our midfield rebuild before getting a deep playmaker. We need to have a holding midfielder, Matic is too lazy. After that if we can't keep Pogba, then we will need to find a replacement for him.

Next summer, we can start find a deep playmaker.
 
The Nani said:
As I’ve said again and again, Bruno and Ndombele would sort it.

I’m not completely adverse to Rice as we really don’t have that kind of player. But only if the fee isn’t exorbitant.

What we’re missing is quality and workrate in midfield. Bruno and Ndombele would give us both.
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This.

It's too important to get the best midfielders available to improve our game.
 
The Nani said:
As I’ve said again and again, Bruno and Ndombele would sort it.

I’m not completely adverse to Rice as we really don’t have that kind of player. But only if the fee isn’t exorbitant.

What we’re missing is quality and workrate in midfield. Bruno and Ndombele would give us both.
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We'd be left without a holding midfielder. Bruno Fernandes is a Pogba replacement, nothing else. You need a holding midfielder behind whatever all round midfielder we get, otherwise the midfield will be unbalanced.
 
OleGunnar20 said:
Out: Herrera, Matic, Pereira.
In: Fernandes, Ndidi.
Promoted: Garner, Gomes (As and when needed).

I'd have the following as the initial first-choice setup:

Pogba - Fernandes
Ndidi

Lots of work-rate between Ndidi and Fernandes. Ndidi has impressed me hugely with his Kante-esque ability to disrupt the midfield, while being decent enough on the ball to contribute.

Fernandes (from the little I've seen and read) seems like a hard-working yet offensively minded midfielder, perfectly compliments the need to have somebody creating other than Pogba while sticking with Ole's hard running high press system. I think we'd see Pogba thrive in the above setup.

Second string would be something along the lines of:

McTom - Fred
Garner

With Gomes coming in as and when needed. Lacking in creativity there, but I hope a functioning front three would negate the reliance on this ala Klopps Liverpool.

If Pogba was to leave I'd be looking to Zaniolo / Barella to come in, with Fernandes possibly moving to the main creator role if necessary.

Not ideal to have to rebuild this along with all of our other worries at the moment, however I'd say we're blessed with a wide selection of available, talented young midfielders to choose from (many of which from smaller clubs).

You could easily argue for the inclusion of players such as Rice, Pellegrini, Tonali, Brandt etc, there's no excuse in us not piecing together a good roster here if we truly want to spend this summer.
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Ndidi is criminally underrated on here, his strength/heading/ability on the ball is labelled as "poor" which is entirely not true, those who watch know he is literally the heart of that midfield. Win's the ball back and does the simple stuff well. That midfield really would work an cause a huge threat. That's my muppet trio midfield!
 
hanovercigars said:
Tielemans and Ndidi. If we sign one, we should sign the other as well. A midfield duo that is Premier League proven, work well together and has already shown they are capable of going toe to toe with Liverpool and Man City.
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It didn't work for Chelsea (Kante-Drinkwater). They build their own midfield with Jorginho, Kovacic/Barkley.
 
croadyman said:
I totally cannot understand what we are thinking by targeting Gueye, we have just let a player of a similar age run down his contract and leave on a free to PSG and now we want another player in their late 20s. Just goes to show that this board haven't a clue what needs to be done with this midfield rebuild
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It's strange. Anyone with a brain could see that Ndidi is the better buy because he's actually someone who could be a mainstay for our side and Gueye will be 30 years old next season.

Fer said:
It didn't work for Chelsea (Kante-Drinkwater). They build their own midfield with Jorginho, Kovacic/Barkley.
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Chelsea changed Kante's role from a destroyer, to a Vidal box to box type. Clear to see that he's better at being a destroyer.
 
Am i the only one that thinks Ole will play a 442 Diamond next season? With the potential signing of Dybala, i think this could work with Rashford playing further up top. Would save us on buying a RW. Can't see any RW that is available in the market now. Sancho was a possibility but if Dortmund wants 100million for him, they can go feck themselves in all honesty. Doesn't seem logical to pay that amount for a kid who hasn't prove himself anywhere other than Bundesliga. But with Woody at the wheel, we probably should expect the impossible.

That 100million could bring in 2 CMs in Rice/Tielemans/Maddison. Would love a diamond of:
Rice/McTominay
Tielemans/Neves/Fred
Pogba/Bruno Fernandes
Maddison/Joao Felix/Mata

Back ups:Kids

Those in bold are those i think to be more realistic. We would have 7 midfielders which have top quality experience in EPL, and if these 7 are kept injury free, it should be good enough to challenge for the EL which is our most realistic chance of UCL the following year
 
teams like Wolves and Leicester are well backed financially these days. Wolves in particular will be looking to keep their best players for Mendes project.

I find it hard to imagine them parting with players like Ndidi or Neves unless we make huge offers to the clubs. West Ham dont need the money either so can't see Rice going for less than 60/70m

I think we are shopping lower down or abroad
 
From Pogba's, Rojo's, Bailly's, Jones' and Pereira's sale, and Sanchez's, Herrera's, Mata's and Matic's releases,

get Rodri (60 mil), Bruno Fernandes (45), Houssem Aouar (60 mil) and Maddison (50 mil)
then you add Garner, McTominay and Fred in the mix
 
This is just naming players that have done well. This is thankfully not how (good) scouting works!
Utd are world famous (historically) for building from youth, so trying to buy what worked in an unrelated/incomparable team is just spinning the wheel again and hoping for a different result.
Think Utd need to plan on buying the right project players, rather than just buying the flavour of the month/season.
The players listed are going to be hugely expensive from Prem teams, surely buying the likes of James and the ilk and using excellent coaching will produce (after time) a better sustainable result?
(No “projects” were injured during the making of this post)
 
Top priority: Havertz who can serve amazing as an false 9, connecting the midfield and attack in a Firmino or Tadic role. Wouldn't even come close to considering Dybala when you can get this guy.

AM's:
- Havertz
- Lingard
- Mata

DM's:
- Matic
- Rice

CM's:
- Rabiot
- McTominay
- Fred
- Pereira
 
Cheekiey said:
Ndidi is criminally underrated on here, his strength/heading/ability on the ball is labelled as "poor" which is entirely not true, those who watch know he is literally the heart of that midfield. Win's the ball back and does the simple stuff well. That midfield really would work an cause a huge threat. That's my muppet trio midfield!
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100%, and he's what, 22?

Perfect signing for me. Fernandes I know less about but any hard working, offensively minded box-to-box type would work there for me. Perhaps Pellegrini, Havertz, Brandt, N'Dombele or Maddison would fit the bill?

If anyone knows players of that ilk to suggest?
 
I think it depends on if Pogba goes but each league has some options, not all that I like but we should be able to get a couple.

PL - Neves/Rice/Ndidi
Serie A - Barella/Pellegrini/Allan
Ligue 1 - Aouar/Ndombele/Tielemans/Rabiot
La Liga - Rodri/Lo Celso/Kroos/Llorente

There's also van De Beek who is a versatile midfielder.
 
OleGunnar20 said:
100%, and he's what, 22?

Perfect signing for me. Fernandes I know less about but any hard working, offensively minded box-to-box type would work there for me. Perhaps Pellegrini, Havertz, Brandt, N'Dombele or Maddison would fit the bill?

If anyone knows players of that ilk to suggest?
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It depends on how Ole wants to play, there are other quality players that could be available in the transfer market like Van de Beek, Aouar, Doucoure, Partey, Fekir, Tielemans, Neves, Saúl, Rabiot, Barella, Eriksen, Rice, Rodri, Ndidi, etc. We need 2 new midfielders to improve our style of play.
 
Cheekiey said:
Ndidi is criminally underrated on here, his strength/heading/ability on the ball is labelled as "poor" which is entirely not true, those who watch know he is literally the heart of that midfield. Win's the ball back and does the simple stuff well. That midfield really would work an cause a huge threat. That's my muppet trio midfield!
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Put me down as not believing he's technically good enough for us. He'd be a CB for Guardiola or Sarri.
 
NoPace said:
Put me down as not believing he's technically good enough for us. He'd be a CB for Guardiola or Sarri.
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Well he wouldn't... He'd do the Fernandinho role just not to Fernandinho's level, then again how long did it take Fernandinho to reach the level he is at now? 3 maybe 4 seasons?

I'd pick Ndidi over nearly every othr CDM we are linked too, Neves, Tielemans ect. because I know Ndidi will run and work non stop for 90 minutes. Okay he isn't going to ping a cross field ball every minute like Neves but he does still do it just not as much.

His current role in that Leicester team is to win the ball back and give it to the creators while keeping it all simple which is why he is so effective, alot of players today keep it too long or go for the harder pass, Ndidi behind 2 creators would work wonders for us.

Pogba - Bruno
Ndidi​
 
bosnian_red said:
We'd be left without a holding midfielder. Bruno Fernandes is a Pogba replacement, nothing else. You need a holding midfielder behind whatever all round midfielder we get, otherwise the midfield will be unbalanced.
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Which is why I mentioned Rice.

Not that I’m sold on him. But I really don’t see many options for that position around ATM.

Would honestly rather go back to a double pivot in midfield if we can add Bruno and one or two other quality attackers.
 
Not possible now due to our situation and their likely transfer ban, but I think Kante could have been tempted since he’s not been played in his right position by Sarri. If we’d made CL that may have been possible, notwithstanding Chelsea’s transfer issue.
 
The Nani said:
Which is why I mentioned Rice.

Not that I’m sold on him. But I really don’t see many options for that position around ATM.

Would honestly rather go back to a double pivot in midfield if we can add Bruno and one or two other quality attackers.
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Yeah I would be happy enough with Rice but I have a lot of reservations about him. We need someone who can build up properly and receive and pass it under pressure. Rice I fear is just like a Dier, who I've always thought was very mediocre.
 
Rice would be my number one choice for DM and not because I think he's more talented than any of the others mentioned but because he's one of the most intelligent level headed 20 year olds I've seen. With his mindset he will only keep getting better and will be our captain within a couple of years.
 
with pogba:

rice/ndidi - tielemans - pogba (mctominay - fred - pereira as squad)

without pogba:

rice/nidi - tielemans - bruno/eriksen (mctominay - fred - pereira as squad)

much stronger midfield then this season, still I dont think it has nothing on city/barca/real/athletico
 
tonnas said:
with pogba:

rice/ndidi - tielemans - pogba (mctominay - fred - pereira as squad)

without pogba:

rice/nidi - tielemans - bruno/eriksen (mctominay - fred - pereira as squad)

much stronger midfield then this season, still I dont think it has nothing on city/barca/real/athletico
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It looks well balanced in paper. It seems that it could work really well. Do you prefer Tielemans over Ndombele or Van de Beek?
 
Cheekiey said:
Well he wouldn't... He'd do the Fernandinho role just not to Fernandinho's level, then again how long did it take Fernandinho to reach the level he is at now? 3 maybe 4 seasons?

I'd pick Ndidi over nearly every othr CDM we are linked too, Neves, Tielemans ect. because I know Ndidi will run and work non stop for 90 minutes. Okay he isn't going to ping a cross field ball every minute like Neves but he does still do it just not as much.

His current role in that Leicester team is to win the ball back and give it to the creators while keeping it all simple which is why he is so effective, alot of players today keep it too long or go for the harder pass, Ndidi behind 2 creators would work wonders for us.

Pogba - Bruno
Ndidi​
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We disagree on the hypothetical. Fernandinho was the #8 on a technically strong CL quarter-finalist, where his midfield partner was a dour Czech ex-center back who never got forward. N'Didi would I think be a CB for them and maybe a good one since they press high and their CBs have to play a high line, or play Walker's inside RB position. I don't think he'd be ahead of Gundogan as a #6.

N'Didi works his ass off and has done well in this league and if we do press high there are worse ideas than him being our #6 in charge of covering big amounts of space, and he has age on his side, but I think McTominay is better on the ball, for instance, and I don't think he's good enough for our midfield either.

I look at someone like Casemiro, which would be the hope if we signed N'Didi, right? I'm just not sure N'Didi has Casemiro's comfort moving the ball forward and sideways.

Tielemans looks like the interesting Leicester midfielder for me.
 
bosnian_red said:
We all know there is the need for a lot of work this summer (and the next, as it'll take more than one season to rebuild us). One thing that I'm looking at very curiously is the midfield rebuild. In my opinion, we'll need pretty much a whole new midfield pretty soon.
  • Herrera announced today that he's officially leaving this summer, which we all suspected was the case.
  • Matic looks like he's excluded from the squad for the final day of the season for whatever reason, and he's barely been involved under Ole and frankly looked woeful all season. Don't think anyone would bat an eyelid if he left this summer
  • Pogba there is always talk about if Real Madrid will manage to get him from us, but given that he probably is open to leaving, will either leave this summer or next
  • Fred has struggled massively since joining and looks distinctly average, and while he is safe this summer (probably), he really needs to improve next season
  • McTominay has impressed more and more, but question marks whether he is just a squad player level or if he can be more. Probably the only one who I'd bet is even in the squad 2-3 years from now
  • Andreas Pereira has been tried in every position, hasn't really impressed in any while he's shown in the past that he is willing to move to play regularly.
Given we (and most other bigger sides these days) play with a midfield 3, that's usually split up into a holding mid, a pure central midfielder and an advanced midfielder. If Pogba decides to stay here long term, then he has the advanced midfielder locked up. But that still leaves 2 starting 11 midfielders to sign this summer next to him, and if Matic and Pereira leave this summer, that probably opens up squad space for McTominay to be first choice squad player in any of the midfield positions, Fred to be 2nd, and then James Garner possibly to be the youngster rotating in now and then. Get the feeling that Pogba might be off as well though, so that would leave us needing an entirely new midfield, which while it isn't an easy task, it is probably the easiest way for a manager to leave their stamp on how they want the team to play. Also since you are building the whole midfield, there really shouldn't be any talk of the midfield lacking balance or trying to shoehorn others in to get the best out of somebody. Neither McTominay and Fred will really cause up much of a stir if they're only squad players, that's probably what everyone expects out of them anyway. So this is a rare opportunity for a manager to build it how he wants and stamp their mark on the team and have them change how the team plays.

Given all these points, and a pretty big budget (but no CL football to get maybe those most sought after players), how would everyone build their midfield? Assume Pogba, Matic, Herrera and Pereira leave, so we need 3 starting midfielders.

Some midfielders that have been talked about over the past year at some point or other (obviously not all realistic, but just throwing down names of players since we do need a whole new midfield):

Advanced mid - Bruno Fernandes, Houssem Aouar, Sergej Milenkovic-Savic, Donny Van De Beek, Christian Eriksen

Center mid - Youri Tielemans, Marco Verratti, Miralem Pjanic, Tanguy Ndombele, Saul Niguez, Nicolo Barella, Sandro Tonali, Adrian Rabiot, Thomas Partey, Franck Kessie, Abdoulaye Doucoure

Holding mid - Declan Rice, Ruben Neves, Rodri Hernandez, Idrissa Gueye, Wilfred Ndidi
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Rice, Ndombele, and Fernandes. would be my pick.
 
Replace Herrera with Thomas Partey.
Replace Matic with Ndidi.
Bench Fred & McT, replace Pereira with Brozovic.
Replace Mata with Ziyech.

Play 5 in midfield.

Pogba | Ziyech
Partey | Brozovic | Ndidi

It's time for Africa!
 
I can't help but feel this has been our biggest issue for years.
We have not had a dominant midfield since Scholes left. A good midfield feeds the forwards, and protects the back 4. This should be a top priority.
 
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