Stam brands SAF a hypocrite

Stam was a favourite player of mine, and one of the best defenders I've ever seen. It was a combination of his pace, his enormous size and strength, aggression and brave and hard tackling. Any player foolish enough to go within range of him, even in the penalty area, was going to lose the ball. He was intimidating in the same way Schmeichel was, and was the Pillar of our defense.

I was completely shocked when he was sold, because he was still our best defender whatever anyone says about his loss of pace, I think many are saying in hindsight that he wasn't as good, but I thought he was simply just recovering, he still looked like Stam to me. But he wasn't sold during the summer, he was only sold once the book was out, and even then in a rushed way with a stop gap solution. This wasn't something he'd planned from before the end of the season, and for a player who was one of the world's best defenders, 16m was a fecking bargain. And even then it was in installments.

Stam was understandably shocked, as was Keano evidenced by his 'meat' comments - basically there had been no indication of unhappiness with Stam's performances. Stam fecking loved United, he was as Red as any of them and he was gutted when he left, never have I seen a more unhappy player being unveiled at a new club. Yes he seems bitter and upset that Keano can cause more controversy, and get away with it. I'd be fecking livid. Stam will always be a legend in my eyes and if I got the chance to have his autograph I would beg for it, and I hope one day he plays for United's Masters team.

The difference between the books though has been pointed out, Keano's is controversial because he admits taking revenge against a Shitty player, but Stam's made reference to United players and manager. SAF has a funny thing about loyalty, he demands it absolutely, but, like with Brian Kidd, he can be colder than ice towards someone suddenly, in a way which I personally find very disloyal.
 
Originally posted by Amir:
<strong>I just think that the combination between the fact he slowed down, the book and the very good offer from Lazio made it very hard to refuse.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Sounds about right to me. Dull. But about right.

The only other thing that might have contributed is the Nandrolene issue. What if he was using it to aid his recovery and Fergie found out?
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Originally posted by Jopub the Gooner:
<strong>One question I'll leave you to ponder about Adams .

Had he been playing skipper for England in the Brazil game this summer that game could / would have had a VERY DIFERENT conclusion .</strong>

I agree. Brasil's pace would have been too much for him and we would have lost by another goal or two.

<strong>I think you do TA a gross injustice and the 'donkey' label is very much unjustified in his case .</strong>

I don't dislike him or doubt that he worked well enough at the centre of your defense. But he was a huge donkey. He became a slightly smarter donkey in his latter years but a donkey still. Why he every got picked when England could have had Pallister and Bruce is beyond me.<hr></blockquote>
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Wib

You're splitting hairs here, you know what I mean about Adams had he played v Brasil sure they could have got walloped 5-1 but he'd have feckinwell died trying to get even with them and maybe, just maybe it could have ended 3-2 to us which is a lot more than can be said for the capitulation that actually happened.

As for donkey ...agree to disagree . Naah......Adams was much better player than you credit and as SAF obviously thought better than Bruce and Pallister etc , although don't get me wrong , I rated Pallister and Bruce, Lionhearted both of them . Mind you Stam was a better player technically than all of them ,

Fergy was mental ejecting him

Do you think Rio is the 'one' or not ?
 
Originally posted by Jopub the Gooner:
<strong>Wib

You're splitting hairs here, you know what I mean about Adams had he played v Brasil sure they could have got walloped 5-1 but he'd have feckinwell died trying to get even with them and maybe, just maybe it could have ended 3-2 to us which is a lot more than can be said for the capitulation that actually happened.

As for donkey ...agree to disagree . Naah......Adams was much better player than you credit and as SAF obviously thought better than Bruce and Pallister etc , although don't get me wrong , I rated Pallister and Bruce, Lionhearted both of them . Mind you Stam was a better player technically than all of them ,

Fergy was mental ejecting him

Do you think Rio is the 'one' or not ?</strong><hr></blockquote>

Splitting hairs? Moi? <img src="graemlins/angel.gif" border="0" alt="[Angel]" />

I think Rio could be the one. He bloody well better be for 30 million quid.

I think you have a point re. leadership against Brasil but I don't think Adams would have been the answer. Beckham isn't captain material no matter how good a player he is and I like CBs as captain in any case, Sol is too quiet so I would have taken a risk on Rio.

I have always thought that Adams was a donkey - not just a reaction to this thread. I also think Bruce and Pallister were more than a bit donkey like at times. But they did work very well together. Just like your old defense they were more than the sum of their parts.

Stam was a better player than all of them but I thought that it was plain to see that he was not the same player in the few games he played just before he was sold. I was a huge fan of his but I also thought that it was great business getting 16 million quid for a player well past his sell-by-date. And I suspect we would have sold him if he had still been playing for us when he was sprung for Nandrolene use - and for alot less than 16 million quid.

The one defender that you have that I envy is Ashley Cole and I think he is going to get better. Silvestre is nowhere near as good. Sol is good if a bit lacking in the leadership stakes. A Sol/Rio partnership might have been a modern era Bruce/Pallister (with more skill and speed) but I think Sol always wanted to stay in London. Rio/O'Shea will do for me.
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I am going to agree with Jopub the Gooner and defend Tony Adams even if he is not a Red Devil. It is true that Sir Alex was interested in him and I don`t think any objective assessment of Tony`s performances down the years can label him a donkey with any credibility.

I always remember that Tony was about the only person in the England squad to comfort Becks in the dressing room after the debacle of that arsehole Simeone that resulted in Becks being sent off.

I also know he faced his alcohol problems courageously, something that maybe Keano should be doing. Note I say maybe as I don`t know but it seems to me Roy could be classified a functional alcoholic. There are such people. Tony Adams is a decent man and was a bloody good player.
 
stam is a fecking hypocrite, one stuffed to the teeth with steroids. its fecking obvious that roy's book is nothing like jaaps, he dont grass on his manager for going out of his way i mean tapping him up for a start. stam is an arsehole and i'm glad he's gone. :mad:
 
That's pretty harsh there re Stam.

Of all the athletes that have suffered / been convicted about nandralone abuse / bans Stam is one I could hardly believe.

I was not on here at the time but did you lot actually think he was guilty ?

What was the general consensus of opinion .?

Sorry if I'm dragging up old ground but Jap Stam seems a very decent and honest bloke .

Have I had him wrong all along then.?

Maybe
 
&gt; Yes he seems bitter and upset that Keano can cause more controversy, and get away with it. I'd be fecking livid. Stam will always be a legend in my eyes

Spot on mate.
 
Originally posted by Sharkey:
<strong>stam is a fecking hypocrite, one stuffed to the teeth with steroids. its fecking obvious that roy's book is nothing like jaaps, he dont grass on his manager for going out of his way i mean tapping him up for a start. stam is an arsehole and i'm glad he's gone. :mad: </strong><hr></blockquote>
If Keano was tapped up, he'd say it too, cos he's honest.
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I have a bit of sympathy for dear old Jakob. But Keano would have admitted that he was tapped up, cos he knows he would probably get away with it. I still think Jaap is a legend, and to me he always will be. I am forced to wonder whether he was given the boot, not so much for the book, but because the club doctors found the nandrolone in his system. The Boss knew of Lazio's interest, and knew he could make a profit on a 29 year-old who seemingly was struggling with Achilles problems. Why get the club embroiled in a drugs scandal under those circumstances? Jaap rightly feels hard done by, and given his performances for Lazio last season I reckon he was sold too soon. Jaap and Rio would have been awesome, but c'est la vie.
 
I think we have suffered alot because Stam was sold, it was one of SAF biggest mistakes.

In terms of Stam calling ferguson a hypocrite, the one huge difference between the two books is that ferguson gave Keane the OK on the book, stam didn't even bother to ask. Ferguson backed Keanes'book...........
 
Stam has just proved he is an air head. Revealing Fergie tapped him up would have got Sir Alex in hot water not to mention Man Utd. And Fergie could have been sacked as a result if PSV has decided to investigate the matter. With his reputation out the window. And what would have that done for Stam's career at OT and his popularity in the dressing room?. On the other hand Keano just talked about plotted revenge and how he brought it to fruition. I beleive there is a big diffrence. In actual sense Stam lokks more like the hypocrite now that he spoke. :mad:
 
Originally posted by seanoc:
<strong>...one huge difference between the two books is that ferguson gave Keane the OK on the book, stam didn't even bother to ask...</strong><hr></blockquote>

i get the feeling from SAF that he's the kind of manager who appreciates being consulted beforehand to avoid nasty surprises. that and the nadrolone in the system of course.
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Originally posted by giggsgirl:
<strong>
I always remember that Tony was about the only person in the England squad to comfort Becks in the dressing room after the debacle of that arsehole Simeone that resulted in Becks being sent off.

</strong><hr></blockquote>

Not only that...I think you could count on one hand the number of footballers who came out and publicly defended Roy Keane after his bust-up with McCarthy this summer. Tony Adams was one of them.
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Yes, Tony Adams is a good man and footballer regardless of what team he played for. After the World Cup debacle the first (and last) instinct of most the of England players was to blame Becks.

Yet in the midst of this bitter disappointment (straight after in the dressing room, not when the heat had died down), Tony Adams gave Becks unconditional support. He didn`t gain anything from that and he certainly hasn`t gained anything from supporting Keano. A classy man is Tony.

As for Keano probably letting the cat out of the bag if he had been tapped by Sir Alex - I don`t think so. Roy is honest, too honest for his own good sometimes as we know, but he is not stupid. He would see no need to be honest about another person`s private wheeler dealings, let alone the respected manager of his club.

Roy would never have done a Stam and never will. <img src="graemlins/devil.gif" border="0" alt="[Devil]" /> <img src="graemlins/devil.gif" border="0" alt="[Devil]" /> <img src="graemlins/devil.gif" border="0" alt="[Devil]" /> <img src="graemlins/devil.gif" border="0" alt="[Devil]" /> <img src="graemlins/devil.gif" border="0" alt="[Devil]" /> <img src="graemlins/devil.gif" border="0" alt="[Devil]" /> <img src="graemlins/keano.gif" border="0" alt="[Keano]" />
 
Originally posted by Gazza:
<strong>What did Adams say in Roy's defence ?</strong><hr></blockquote>

Here's a link to his comments...

<a href="http://football.guardian.co.uk/worldcup2002/comment/story/0,11925,722266,00.html" target="_blank">http://football.guardian.co.uk/worldcup2002/comment/story/0,11925,722266,00.html</a>
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Stam is a world class defender.
To said that he's past it is just rubbish.
Anyone see how well he played for Lazio last season in the serie A last game?
He was absolutely superb, marked Vieri out of the game completely.
I still think that the book is the main reason why he was sold.
 
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