Spurs 2022-2023 thread | Bentancur out for the rest of the season

If Tottenham could be just half decent they'd win the league based on the fact they constantly seem to be about 6 places further up the table than they deserve to be.
 
Pintu said:
You are the one failing to see context. He comes in to a Tottenham side that finished 6 th in 19/20, finsihed 7th in 20/21... Was 9th when he is appointed (see the trend here) with no preaseason and he is projected to make them 7 th.... And you somehow call it an underachievement to reach CL football in that context...
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You keep saying this but Spurs were 5 points off the top 4 at this point and only 2 points behind Man Utd and Arsenal. It was a decent job to finish 4th but nothing spectacular.
 
noodlehair said:
If Tottenham could be just half decent they'd win the league based on the fact they constantly seem to be about 6 places further up the table than they deserve to be.
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Or if they had a decent goalkeeper doing his job.

Donk87 said:
You keep saying this but Spurs were 5 points off the top 4 at this point and only 2 points behind Man Utd and Arsenal. It was a decent job to finish 4th but nothing spectacular.
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It was better than decent. But I certainly wouldn't have reacted to someone calling it "not spectacular". I was answering a poster who was pretending that Conte has underachieved massively.

Again, all I did was to add some context.

Last year when he was appointed...
https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/premier-league-table-predicted-conte-25361313
Predicted Premier League table via (Sporting Index)
4th Man Utd points - 69
5th Arsenal points - 62
6th West Ham points - 60
7th Tottenham points - 58
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But according to you taking that Spurs side to 13 points more than Data science projections is a massive underachievement. You are the one ignoring context.
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Pintu said:
Or if they had a decent goalkeeper doing his job.



It was better than decent. But I certainly wouldn't have reacted to someone calling it "not spectacular". I was answering a poster who was pretending that Conte has underachieved massively.

Again, all I did was to add some context.
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I dont know why you keep posting this super computer prediction like its mean to mean something. If you are going to do that, what are the parameters ? do you know?

Conte done a good job, it was nothing special or a miracle. He was up against the worst ever United team and an Arsenal team that was just looking to come good but ran out of steam with injuries.
 
Pintu said:
Most of those were accomplished by Poch with top players in many positions… Their last 2 finishes before Conte were 6th and 7th (behind West Ham and Leicester).


Beating us and specially Arsenal (free from Europe all season) with a manager that have been there for a while, to that fourth spot last year was a great achievement. Nobody expected that.

When Conte took over they were f**g 9th… And the data science predicted Conte would take them up to 7th with 58 points… They ended up 4th on 71 points. He has many flaws but underachieving in the leagues is not one of them. And it’s never been…
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People need to look at that spurs squad and say with a straight face that it's a good side. Bash contes football all you like but that squad is shit, not many managers would've taken them to fourth last season.
 
RVN1991 said:
People need to look at that spurs squad and say with a straight face that it's a good side. Bash contes football all you like but that squad is shit, not many managers would've taken them to fourth last season.
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Plenty of managers would have with Kane & Son propping you up and Arsenal bottling it. Conte's going to leave Spurs in a right old state, quote me on that.
 
Mr. Robot said:
Plenty of managers would have with Kane & Son propping you up and Arsenal bottling it. Conte's going to leave Spurs in a right old state, quote me on that.
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I'll quote you on it. Considering the squad has been a disaster for a while and needs at least 5 new first team players I'd say Spurs is already in a right old state with or without Conte. At least with signings like Kulusevski and Bentancur we can only improve.
 
romufc said:
Conte done a good job, it was nothing special or a miracle.
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This is a much more reasonable statement.

You were saying: “he is massively underachieving.” That’s what provoked my reaction…
 
Pintu said:
This is a much more reasonable statement.

You were saying: “he is massively underachieving.” That’s what provoked my reaction…
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Yes, last season but I feel as if this season he is underachieving.

After last season, they invested in their squad and yes the table is looking favourable, the football they play is dire.
 
balaks said:
I'll quote you on it. Considering the squad has been a disaster for a while and needs at least 5 new first team players I'd say Spurs is already in a right old state with or without Conte. At least with signings like Kulusevski and Bentancur we can only improve.
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He will leave you with a load of players only suited to his archaic 3-5-2 system. Spurs fans won’t have it of course because you’ve gone all in on “Conte is the one!” and refuse to acknowledge that he’s a toxic personality in decline.
 
balaks said:
I'll quote you on it. Considering the squad has been a disaster for a while and needs at least 5 new first team players I'd say Spurs is already in a right old state with or without Conte. At least with signings like Kulusevski and Bentancur we can only improve.
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Kulusevski is on loan and obligation if they get to the CL. Once the season finishes and Spurs dont get top 4, there will be other clubs in for him.

I dont see Conte there too much longer and I suspect once Kane and Son leave, it is a long way back for Spurs
 
Mr. Robot said:
Plenty of managers would have with Kane & Son propping you up and Arsenal bottling it. Conte's going to leave Spurs in a right old state, quote me on that.
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Why didn't they finish top four the two seasons before then? The literally looked like lower mid table quality months before with Nuno at the helm.
 
romufc said:
Kulusevski is on loan and obligation if they get to the CL. Once the season finishes and Spurs dont get top 4, there will be other clubs in for him.

I dont see Conte there too much longer and I suspect once Kane and Son leave, it is a long way back for Spurs
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Pretty sure they have an option on kulusevski regardless of whether they make the CL or not, making the CL would only make the option mandatory
 
romufc said:
Kulusevski is on loan and obligation if they get to the CL. Once the season finishes and Spurs dont get top 4, there will be other clubs in for him.

I dont see Conte there too much longer and I suspect once Kane and Son leave, it is a long way back for Spurs
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We can make Kulusevski permanent anytime we want and will do it in the summer. He's going nowhere.
 
RVN1991 said:
Why didn't they finish top four the two seasons before then? The literally looked like lower mid table quality months before with Nuno at the helm.
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I can’t tell the difference between Spurs under Nuno and Conte to be honest, both negative, boring sides.
 
Mr. Robot said:
I can’t tell the difference between Spurs under Nuno and Conte to be honest, both negative, boring sides.
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Maybe not but the results were totally different, I don't have the exact numbers in front of me but didn't Spurs get more points than anyone bar City once Conte took over?
 
There’s no need for people to rewrite history and make Conte out to be a lesser manager - when he won the league with Chelsea it was because no one had a clue how to deal with his 5 at the back formation, fast forward to nowadays and almost every team has used it in various games. Guy had a big influence on the league and Chelsea were incredibly consistent under him 1st season.

What we’re seeing now is football that looks outdated. Every club knows how to deal with wing backs and CBS coming into a midfield. They have some good players, particularly in attack but anyone with eyes can tell you for the last 5 years, maybe more, attack focused and aggressive pressing football is what is winning titles. Conte coaches neither. They will do well to get top 4, personally think they’ll be EL places.
 
tomaldinho1 said:
There’s no need for people to rewrite history and make Conte out to be a lesser manager - when he won the league with Chelsea it was because no one had a clue how to deal with his 5 at the back formation, fast forward to nowadays and almost every team has used it in various games. Guy had a big influence on the league and Chelsea were incredibly consistent under him 1st season.

What we’re seeing now is football that looks outdated. Every club knows how to deal with wing backs and CBS coming into a midfield. They have some good players, particularly in attack but anyone with eyes can tell you for the last 5 years, maybe more, attack focused and aggressive pressing football is what is winning titles. Conte coaches neither. They will do well to get top 4, personally think they’ll be EL places.
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I agree and would also add that this happens a lot with managers, especially those who are relatively dogmatic about their tactics and ideas about the game. Mourinho essentially had a 12 year run at the top of the game from 2003-2015, Wenger was similarly on top from 1996-2008, Simeone arguably had his time from 2011-2021 and is looking pretty outdated now, etc. Conte is now 12 years from his first appointment at Juventus. It would be completely unsurprising for a manager of his profile to be falling behind competitors and looking increasingly outdated in terms of his approach to the game and I would argue that is largely what we are seeing happen.
 
balaks said:
Would be interested to know how much money these events generate for the club
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From concerts at the Emirates in 2013:
The combined attendance at the two Muse concerts on the 25th and 26th May was just under 86,000.
The Green Day concert had an audience of around 58,000. The average was therefore around 48,000. Ticket sales across the three concerts generated £7.7
million meaning the average ticket sales was £2.6 million per concert. The average ticket price was £53.

The next area of on-site impact comes from the expenditure of the event organiser. Data provided by SJM Concerts shows the average spend across the three events
was just over £1 million.
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Beyonce will definitely be a full house and the average ticket price higher so probably around 4M+ per date. Nice bonus if you can get regular use of the stadium during the year.
 
I can’t link it but if you see the response the club had to the Tottenham Supporters Trust questions in the club direction you can see the contempt Levy has for the fans. An absolute disgrace.
 
LASpurs said:
I can’t link it but if you see the response the club had to the Tottenham Supporters Trust questions in the club direction you can see the contempt Levy has for the fans. An absolute disgrace.
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Club responds to Trust questions on strategy and direction
Like everyone at the Club, our Head Coach wants the team to compete for top honours. The Club has invested heavily in the squad. This is a continual process with the aim of standing the Club in good stead on the pitch for years to come. Since opening the stadium in April 2019 we have spent more than £500m putting us in the top quartile of spending in the Premier League - and we have made significant investments in the Women’s team too. In addition to the summer investment of over £200m we have committed to a further £47m spend this January.

Despite this we consistently see references to our perceived lack of backing for head coaches and lack of spending.
It’s important that we deal with facts - our spend levels quite clearly show that we have backed our football side. There is always a fine line between long-term investment and short-termism – which is why our recruitment has to be first class. Mistakes at this level leave a financial and sporting impact for future seasons. We have felt the financial impact of supporting player purchases which have not worked out as hoped. We have taken steps to improve this area of operations and the recent windows reflect this.
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They do spend but most of it on dross. Also building a billion pounds stadium during a pandemic is a bit unlucky. Kulusevski, Bentancur are the only good acquisitions they've made. Maybe Romero but i think he's overrated. Richarlison and Porro should be good but same was said with Reguilon, Bissouma etc... Ndombele, Lo Celso, Gil, Royal were not good enough.
Apparently Spurs had a deal completed for Deulofeu but he got injured. It should be a worry if that's who they identified to improve their midfield and attack link-up.
 


This is Mourinho’s CV… And soon to be Conte’s as well (though not a successful coach in Europe so far).

How do our spurs’ residents feel about this?
 
Pintu said:


This is Mourinho’s CV… And soon to be Conte’s as well (though not a successful coach in Europe so far).

How do our spurs’ residents feel about this?
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Spurs sacked Mourinho when he was in a final too.
 
Pickford was meant to sign a new contract post WC but since then talks have stalled - likely due to our position - but also because clubs like Spurs are sniffing around.
 
acnumber9 said:
Fraser Forster. They’re as bad as each other.
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Forster is worse... He is just plain useless. Lloris, when he doesn't play against them (like he did in the NLD), can be like his old self for some games... But they should have spent money on this position during the winter. Could be the difference between finishing in or outside the top 4..


SilentWitness said:
Pickford was meant to sign a new contract post WC but since then talks have stalled - likely due to our position - but also because clubs like Spurs are sniffing around.
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@SilentWitness
That's the best signing they could make right now. Good for Everton to at least keep him until the summer. Without him, you'd be even closer to the Championship...
 
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acnumber9 said:
Spurs sacked Mourinho when he was in a final too.
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For Levy's defence, I think Mourinho would have lost that one as well... Or had he won it, he would be kept for the next year (21/22) and I'm not sure he'd have done as well as Conte did securing the top 4 (which certainly boosted their finances, spending abilities and attractiveness on the market).
 
Bit of a nightmare for us to lose Lloris for such a long period of time. I do think Forster is a decent back-up though but really we need a new keeper in the summer.
 
balaks said:
Bit of a nightmare for us to lose Lloris for such a long period of time. I do think Forster is a decent back-up though but really we need a new keeper in the summer.
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I think the Pickford rumours are probably fairly substantial and we would be open to letting him go.
 
SilentWitness said:
I think the Pickford rumours are probably fairly substantial and we would be open to letting him go.
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Yeah I wouldn't be against bringing Pickford in if we could get him - the fact he is English also would help us with our quota of home grown players.
 
Pintu said:
This is Mourinho’s CV… And soon to be Conte’s as well (though not a successful coach in Europe so far).

How do our spurs’ residents feel about this?
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Levy is a specialist in failure so it's consistent with his tenure at Spurs.
 
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