Sofyan Amrabat | signs for United on loan

[Marwood]

Yeah he was a myth. His comments about open heart surgery and needing upto 10/11 players was nonsense. We added just 4 key players to the starting lineup and finished 3rd playing much better football. It just needed a coach who knew what he was doing.

How many players do you think ETH will have to sign from start to finish to get us seriously competing for league and champions league?

He's signed five first choice players already and we don't feel especially close(unless Hojlund is incredible).

 

[VP89]

Yeah he was a myth. His comments about open heart surgery and needing upto 10/11 players was nonsense. We added just 4 key players to the starting lineup and finished 3rd playing much better football. It just needed a coach who knew what he was doing.

He meant in context of needing to compete at the very top. And he wasn't wrong.

 

[captaincantona]

How is it 21st of August and van de Beek still hasn't been moved on?

Atrocious that VDB, McT, Maguire, Williams etc. that are clearly not in the managers plans were not explained the situation on the very last day of last season so their agents etc. could get the wheels in motion. Rather than bringing these players on pre season. It’s a joke.

 

[astracrazy]

How many players do you think ETH will have to sign from start to finish to get us seriously competing for league and champions league?

He's signed five first choice players already and we don't feel especially close(unless Hojlund is incredible).

And how many have other teams who finished above us prior to his arrival made in the same time period?

 

[Marwood]

And how many have other teams who finished above us prior to his arrival made in the same time period?

I don't know. The same, more?

But we're talking about Rangnick's belief 10 new players are needed. I agreed with him at the time. @Chief123 didn't. So I'm asking how many will ETH need to get ys back to the top. How many do you think?

 

[Chief123]

How many players do you think ETH will have to sign from start to finish to get us seriously competing for league and champions league?

He's signed five first choice players already and we don't feel especially close(unless Hojlund is incredible).

In that same time period, the ones we are trying to catch have signed even better players. Just look at city for example. Going out and signing some of the best in class.

Haaland
Alvarez
Gvardiol
Akanji
Ake
Kovacic

It’s not as straight forward as saying once we sign 10 players we have enough. If we are always playing catch up, we will never catch up. Until we are competing for players in the top of their class, we won’t compete against them on the pitch. That’s not Ten Hag’s fault. It’s a product of how shite the club has been run.

 

[gajender]

In that same time period, the ones we are trying to catch have signed even better players. Just look at city for example. Going out and signing some of the best in class.

Haaland
Alvarez
Gvardiol
Akanji
Ake
Kovacic

It’s not as straight forward as saying once we sign 10 players we have enough. If we are always playing catch up, we will never catch up. Until we are competing for players in the top of their class, we won’t compete against them on the pitch. That’s not Ten Hag’s fault. It’s a product of how shite the club has been run.

Sorry mate Barring Haaland none of them was rated best in Class before their transfer to City and would have been available for United had we gone for them .

 

[Marwood]

In that same time period, the ones we are trying to catch have signed even better players. Just look at city for example. Going out and signing some of the best in class.

Haaland
Alvarez
Gvardiol
Akanji
Ake
Kovacic

It’s not as straight forward as saying once we sign 10 players we have enough. If we are always playing catch up, we will never catch up. Until we are competing for players in the top of their class, we won’t compete against them on the pitch. That’s not Ten Hag’s fault. It’s a product of how shite the club has been run.

No its a lot simpler than that. We all know the calibre of player and team needed to compete for the top trophies. Whatever the opposition do that won't change. That standard still has to be met.

So you look at our team and say who is good enough to take us to leagues and champion leagues? How many need replacing. It's straightforward.

So how many do you think, of the team ETH inherited, were/are good enough to take us back to the top? Simple question really.

If you think Rangnick was wrong with 10 you must be able to come up with a figure. Yeah there are other factors, but just to give us a feasible chance of competing, get us in the conversation, how many are good enough from the team he was handed.

 

[Chief123]

No its a lot simpler than that. We all know the calibre of player and team needed to compete for the top trophies. Whatever the opposition do that won't change. That standard still has to be met.

So you look at our team and say who is good enough to take us to leagues and champion leagues? How many need replacing. It's straightforward.

So how many do you think, of the team ETH inherited, were/are good enough to take us back to the top? Simple question really.

If you think Rangnick was wrong with 10 you must be able to come up with a figure.

Yes I do believe Ragnick was wrong with a figure of 10. Just like it’s wrong to think you can say a specific figure is the solution.

It’s not about quantity, it’s about the quality we can bring in.

This particular team we have right now, I believe could challenge for a title if you introduced best in class in specific positions or best potential young players . Haaland, Caicedo and Gvardiol in this setup has us challenging for the title in my opinion.

But it comes back to the initial point. We simply aren’t able to compete with the best in class for players which isn’t ETH’s fault. Meanwhile the teams we are trying to catch are.

Do you really think ETH wouldn’t welcome the players I’ve mentioned above. Also the likes of Enzo and Nkunku. Ultimately he’s not able to shop in that store because he’s hampered with the terrible spending we’ve had in previous years which has had a big impact on our FFP limits as well. So then you are shopping in the tier below while you’re rivals are shopping in the top tier.

You can introduce just 2/3 players into this team and we become contenders. But that’s if you introduce the best in class. We’re never in the conversation at this moment in time.

 

[Marwood]

Yes I do believe Rangnick was wrong with a figure of 10. Just like it’s wrong to think you can say a specific figure is the solution.

It’s not about quantity, it’s about the quality we can bring in.

This particular team we have right now, I believe could challenge for a title if you introduced best in class in specific positions or best potential young players . Haaland, Caicedo and Gvardiol in this setup has us challenging for the title in my opinion.

But it comes back to the initial point. We simply aren’t able to compete with the best in class for players which isn’t ETH’s fault. Meanwhile the teams we are trying to catch are.

Do you really think ETH wouldn’t welcome the players I’ve mentioned above. Also the likes of Enzo and Nkunku. Ultimately he’s not able to shop in that store because he’s hampered with the terrible spending we’ve had in previous years which has had a big impact on our FFP limits as well. So then you are shopping in the tier below while you’re rivals are shopping in the top tier.

You can introduce just 2/3 players into this team and we become contenders. But that’s if you introduce the best in class. We’re never in the conversation at this moment in time.

Do you think 2 or 3 would have been enough with the team he inherited? Even if they were best in class? You must if you believe quantity isn't relevant.

But in anycase he's currently signed 5 first teamers and you think it would require another 3. So that's 8. Rangnick said 8,9 or 10. We're hardly miles apart here.

 

[Cassidy]

Yes I do believe Rangnick was wrong with a figure of 10. Just like it’s wrong to think you can say a specific figure is the solution.

It’s not about quantity, it’s about the quality we can bring in.

This particular team we have right now, I believe could challenge for a title if you introduced best in class in specific positions or best potential young players . Haaland, Caicedo and Gvardiol in this setup has us challenging for the title in my opinion.

But it comes back to the initial point. We simply aren’t able to compete with the best in class for players which isn’t ETH’s fault. Meanwhile the teams we are trying to catch are.

Do you really think ETH wouldn’t welcome the players I’ve mentioned above. Also the likes of Enzo and Nkunku. Ultimately he’s not able to shop in that store because he’s hampered with the terrible spending we’ve had in previous years which has had a big impact on our FFP limits as well. So then you are shopping in the tier below while you’re rivals are shopping in the top tier.

You can introduce just 2/3 players into this team and we become contenders. But that’s if you introduce the best in class. We’re never in the conversation at this moment in time.

He didn't say a specific figure, he said 8,9 maybe 10 as in the clubs needs lots of players.
Bare in mind he was also talking about the fact we were about to lose up to 6 players for free that summer and the coming summer

He was absolutely right about that he said, he was also right that it could have been done in 2/3 transfer windows if the club was serious about it

We're here now starting a season without a no 9 yet again, same as last season after ETH making 8 signings.

 

[UnitedSofa]

In that same time period, the ones we are trying to catch have signed even better players. Just look at city for example. Going out and signing some of the best in class.

Haaland
Alvarez
Gvardiol
Akanji
Ake
Kovacic

If United had signed those very players, this place would be up in arms for signing mediocre players, players who aren’t ready for the first team and “will be deadwood” in a few years.

 

[Ole90+3]

In that same time period, the ones we are trying to catch have signed even better players. Just look at city for example. Going out and signing some of the best in class.

Haaland
Alvarez
Gvardiol
Akanji
Ake
Kovacic

It’s not as straight forward as saying once we sign 10 players we have enough. If we are always playing catch up, we will never catch up. Until we are competing for players in the top of their class, we won’t compete against them on the pitch. That’s not Ten Hag’s fault. It’s a product of how shite the club has been run.

There’s no way you would have classified Ake, Akanji or even Kovacic as the best in class for their relative positions before they signed for City. These players are coached to be best. These City coaches elevate every single player in the squad, that’s the difference

 

[Chief123]

Do you think 2 or 3 would have been enough with the team he inherited? Even if they were best in class? You must if you believe quantity isn't relevant.

But in anycase he's currently signed 5 first teamers and you think it would require another 3. So that's 8. Rangnick said 8,9 or 10. We're hardly miles apart here.

My point is you are focusing on the fact he’s signed 5 first teamers.
But would those 5 he’s signed be his first choice if he was able to choose from any of the players that have been available? Most likely not. He has to work within his limitations to try and get us to compete with the top. We only see the end product of our transfer activity but we don’t see what his desired players would be if we were able to compete for any signing. He would probably snap your hand off for some of the players that have gone to rival clubs. But we’re having to sign players lesser in ability and still expected to compete against them.

 

[Chief123]

There’s no way you would have classified Ake, Akanji or even Kovacic as the best in class for their relative positions before they signed for City. These players are coached to be best. These City coaches elevate every single player in the squad, that’s the difference

I most definitely don’t regard those names as best in class. I mentioned “some of the best in class”. My point of adding those names was to show even though they dominated city still went out and strengthened. We are trying to strengthen just to catch up to them.

 

[Gandalf]

Atrocious that VDB, McT, Maguire, Williams etc. that are clearly not in the managers plans were not explained the situation on the very last day of last season so their agents etc. could get the wheels in motion. Rather than bringing these players on pre season. It’s a joke.

I am fairly sure the situation was explained to them. So far as Maguire and McTominay go I do believe Erik is happy to use them if they stay and there had obviously been hopes that the other fringe players would generate more in sales which has not happened. With guys like VDB and Williams, they have barely played in the last 12 months so I think the idea behind pre season was to put them in the shop window a little, confirm that they are fit and able to add something to a prospective buyer. The problem is their market is not materializing because they really are not all that good and are stuck on colossal wages relative to their actual ability.

 

[Marwood]

My point is you are focusing on the fact he’s signed 5 first teamers.
But would those 5 he’s signed be his first choice if he was able to choose from any of the players that have been available? Most likely not. He has to work within his limitations to try and get us to compete with the top. We only see the end product of our transfer activity but we don’t see what his desired players would be if we were able to compete for any signing. He would probably snap your hand off for some of the players that have gone to rival clubs. But we’re having to sign players lesser in ability and still expected to compete against them.

So why hasn't ETH done what you said then. Why not spend nearly £400 million on just three players? That gets you three best in class players without a doubt. Which gets the team he inherited competing for leagues and champs leagues right?

 

[garelo]

Yes I do believe Rangnick was wrong with a figure of 10. Just like it’s wrong to think you can say a specific figure is the solution.

It’s not about quantity, it’s about the quality we can bring in.

This particular team we have right now, I believe could challenge for a title if you introduced best in class in specific positions or best potential young players . Haaland, Caicedo and Gvardiol in this setup has us challenging for the title in my opinion.

But it comes back to the initial point. We simply aren’t able to compete with the best in class for players which isn’t ETH’s fault. Meanwhile the teams we are trying to catch are.

Do you really think ETH wouldn’t welcome the players I’ve mentioned above. Also the likes of Enzo and Nkunku. Ultimately he’s not able to shop in that store because he’s hampered with the terrible spending we’ve had in previous years which has had a big impact on our FFP limits as well. So then you are shopping in the tier below while you’re rivals are shopping in the top tier.

You can introduce just 2/3 players into this team and we become contenders. But that’s if you introduce the best in class. We’re never in the conversation at this moment in time.

No way we cant compete to sign the likes of Enzo, Nkuku, or even Caicedo. We've spent close to 400m in just 2 summer transfer windows alone. the problem lies in how we identify our signings as thing stand we seem to be signing the wrong players again. Heck we sign a 20 ST with 1 year of experience in Serie A for 72M so whyd some people think the likes of Enzo Nkuku Caicedo were beyond our reach IDK.

 

[Chief123]

So why hasn't ETH done what you said then. Why not spend nearly £400 million on just three players? That gets you three best in class players without a doubt. Which gets the team he inherited competing for leagues and champs leagues right?

That’s the whole point I’m making. We can’t attract the best in class. Who are Haaland and Gvardiol choosing right now, us or City?

 

[UnitedSofa]

No way we cant compete to sign the likes of Enzo, Nkuku, or even Caicedo. We've spent close to 400m in just 2 summer transfer windows alone. the problem lies in how we identify our signings as thing stand we seem to be signing the wrong players again. Heck we sign a 20 ST with 1 year of experience in Serie A for 72M so whyd some people think the likes of Enzo Nkuku Caicedo were beyond our reach IDK.

Enzo and Caicedo have had 1 year at their respective clubs before moving.

Fans want us to take a gamble & sign unknown hidden gems. We do so & then we also moan they’re not experienced enough. Absolute incredible.

 

[garelo]

Enzo and Caicedo have had 1 year at their respective clubs before moving.

Fans want us to take a gamble & sign unknown hidden gems. We do so & then we also moan they’re not experienced enough. Absolute incredible.

Not me though.

 

[Care_de_Bobo]

There’s no way you would have classified Ake, Akanji or even Kovacic as the best in class for their relative positions before they signed for City. These players are coached to be best. These City coaches elevate every single player in the squad, that’s the difference

How on earth did they manage to turn Kovacic into such a great player after just a couple of games? This is the same scrub who only has four CL medals and was recently part of the team that only managed to finish 3rd in the World Cup. They really are miracle workers which makes it strange that they never bother fully integrating the youth from their academy and have to spend so much money buying ready made players.

 

[Marwood]

That’s the whole point I’m making. We can’t attract the best in class. Who are Haaland and Gvardiol choosing right now, us or City?

City can't sign everyone. We're not always competing with them are we. That's two players you've mentioned.

What about Caicedo and Enzo Fernandez? We can't attract players like Chelsea can now? Why not drop £240 million on those two?

Those two and the sqaud he inherited. Title challengers?

Or another reality, ETH has split £400 million across 8 players, as Rangnick said, because he's recognised the squad needs improving in many different areas.

 

[Ole90+3]

How on earth did they manage to turn Kovacic into such a great player after just a couple of games? This is the same scrub who only has four CL medals and was recently part of the team that only managed to finish 3rd in the World Cup. They really are miracle workers which makes it strange that they never bother fully integrating the youth from their academy and have to spend so much money buying ready made players.

That’s not the point and you know it.
Kovacic was always a squad player at Chelsea and Real

 

[Ollie Derbyshire]

There’s no way you would have classified Ake, Akanji or even Kovacic as the best in class for their relative positions before they signed for City. These players are coached to be best. These City coaches elevate every single player in the squad, that’s the difference

Correct, and not only City’s coaches do that, you just need to look at Brighton to see what top class coaching can do for a team.

 

[Marwood]

Correct, and not only City’s coaches do that, you just need to look at Brighton to see what top class coaching can do for a team.

More so than coaching its putting players together who blend well. Who suit each other.

If you stick Kovacic next to Matic and Fellaini would he look as good.

Guardiola hasn't improved Kovacic in just a few weeks. It's not possible. He's simply put him in a very good team with players that compliment him. Which anybody could see was a great match up.

Big question is does Amrabat blend will with our current first XI. I'm not sure.

 

[Longlivekeano]

Amrabat adds dynamism, energy and urgency into our play. Should complement Casemiro better than Mount. I would actually play mount as a right winger/left winger or false 9

 

[croadyman]

Amrabat adds dynamism, energy and urgency into our play. Should complement Casemiro better than Mount. I would actually play mount as a right winger/left winger or false 9

Yet rumours say Utd are unconvinced,apparently someone from the clubs face squeezed up when he got mentioned which I find very strange

 

[Overhaul FC]

Might be too soon for some to hear or consider, but the club should use the Greenwood wages we won't be paying, to pay for deals for Amrabat or Pavard.

We shouldn't be moving backwards by not adding to the squad.

 

[NZT-One]

Amrabat adds dynamism, energy and urgency into our play. Should complement Casemiro better than Mount. I would actually play mount as a right winger/left winger or false 9

Pheww, thank god all of that is next to impossible to measure. He will be a success for sure then.

ETH will not get rid of a real winger. Those players are tasked with creating the width that is needed to stretch defences. So if Amrabat comes, one of the current midfield will go to the bench.

 

[Bobski]

I fear a Casemiro/Amrabat pairing would be a rather one paced and possess sub optimal playmaking. If, and it is a big if given his slow starting history, Casemiro's legs are gone or going his ability on the ball does not make him indispensable, he is not Scholes on the ball.

I think he will recover to have a decent season, especially if Ten Hag stops playing him behind Bruno and Mount totally isolated but Utd should be looking at his replacement now, don't think Amrabat is that guy as a full time starter.

 

[Skills]

I fear a Casemiro/Amrabat pairing would be a rather one paced and possess sub optimal playmaking. If, and it is a big if given his slow starting history, Casemiro's legs are gone or going his ability on the ball does not make him indispensable, he is not Scholes on the ball.

I think he will recover to have a decent season, especially if Ten Hag stops playing him behind Bruno and Mount totally isolated but Utd should be looking at his replacement now, don't think Amrabat is that guy as a full time starter.

It could work if he's an elite long/medium range passer. What we'd still lack is a great dribbler in midfield, who can play his way through tight spaces to progress the ball.

Shaw possibly has the skillset to do this but that means the LW has to keep width rather than be a defacto LF. Unless you do some clever shuffling which puts Rashford on the right, with Dalot as the overlapping RB but it seems too risky losing Rashfords production.

 

[Superden]

It could work if he's an elite long/medium range passer. What we'd still lack is a great dribbler in midfield, who can play his way through tight spaces to progress the ball.

Shaw possibly has the skillset to do this but that means the LW has to keep width rather than be a defacto LF. Unless you do some clever shuffling which puts Rashford on the right, with Dalot as the overlapping RB but it seems too risky losing Rashfords production.

There isn't a midfielder we can sign who can do both.. Ie top level dynamic buildup and act as a top level destroyer. We just need a decent upgrade on mctom, of which there are quite a few...

 

[RedOrange]

I fear a Casemiro/Amrabat pairing would be a rather one paced and possess sub optimal playmaking. If, and it is a big if given his slow starting history, Casemiro's legs are gone or going his ability on the ball does not make him indispensable, he is not Scholes on the ball.

I think he will recover to have a decent season, especially if Ten Hag stops playing him behind Bruno and Mount totally isolated but Utd should be looking at his replacement now, don't think Amrabat is that guy as a full time starter.

Amrabat would likely be played where Casemiro is in the same tactical approach as the last 2 matches.

 

[gaffs]

I suspect this happens tomorrow.

Best way to bury the Greenwood news.

 

[DevilRed]

I suspect this happens tomorrow.

Best way to bury the Greenwood news.

Wishful thinking as 1. Our club can't handle two major things at the same time and 2. all the noise has died down on this move.

 

[El-Manos]

I suspect this happens tomorrow.

Best way to bury the Greenwood news.

Nah we’re done

 

[OrcaFat]

He meant in context of needing to compete at the very top. And he wasn't wrong.

He was right but a lot of us had been saying that long before he showed up.

Some said the players were fine and pointed out how much money we had spent but we all know spending doesn’t correlate very well with quality.

 

[Ollie Derbyshire]

More so than coaching its putting players together who blend well. Who suit each other.

If you stick Kovacic next to Matic and Fellaini would he look as good.

Guardiola hasn't improved Kovacic in just a few weeks. It's not possible. He's simply put him in a very good team with players that compliment him. Which anybody could see was a great match up.

Big question is does Amrabat blend will with our current first XI. I'm not sure.

I’m not saying City have made Kovacic better but they do a lot better at identifying the correct targets and integrating them into their style of play without much hassle.
I honestly have no idea if Amrabat suits how we play but I do have doubts of how well we’ll integrate him into the team as our track record is pretty poor to say the least.

 

[Cantonagotmehere]

I suspect this happens tomorrow.

Best way to bury the Greenwood news.

Would not surprise me.