Sofyan Amrabat | 2023/24 Performances

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As was the case before with other midfielders, he is only comfortable when going backwards to our own goal. I’d keep him till the summer but his loan should just stay a loan, he is not up to the standard.
 
I am ok with him as our backup midfielder, but he doesn't really add or improve much to our poor midfield.
 
Just nowhere near good enough

He will give 100% and that’s why he’s being picked, ETH is running on attitude because half the squad are done with him.
 
I don't quite understand the critics here. Amrabat is not the problem. Every time when he gets on the ball, there are not many options he can pass , and he usually was able to hold the balls well enough to wait other players getting into space, and then pass it out. You can't expect a No. 6 to play though balls every time or dribble pass 2 - 3 opponents and find your teammates . Even prime Casemiro could not do it. For the support he received, he has played more than decent and should not be blamed harsh just because he is a loanee.
 
He can be a squad player. Playing with Bruno and Scott requires a 10/10 performance from a world class pivot to work though
 
afatzp said:
I don't quite understand the critics here. Amrabat is not the problem. Every time when he gets on the ball, there are not many options he can pass , and he usually was able to hold the balls well enough to wait other players getting into space, and then pass it out. You can't expect a No. 6 to play though balls every time or dribble pass 2 - 3 opponents and find your teammates . Even prime Casemiro could not do it. For the support he received, he has played more than decent and should not be blamed harsh just because he is a loanee.
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I think he was fine on the ball yesterday. Off the ball he was again less impressive. It is an issue that he lack agility and pace.
 
FerociousCorgis said:
Not sure why people were so high on his Chelsea game. Swear every time I watched him on ball it was backpedaling 30 yards with the ball trying to avoid any pressure.
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He started that way, but as the game wore on he was getting more progressive with his play and passing. Same happened against Bournemouth, where he was constantly going backwards in the first half but then for the first 15 or so minutes of the second half he seemed to be the only one looking to drive us forward. So in these last couple of games he's shown he can do it, he's just got to start doing it more often.

In saying that, our ridiculous set-up does make it unnecessarily difficult.
 
MadDogg said:
He started that way, but as the game wore on he was getting more progressive with his play and passing. Same happened against Bournemouth, where he was constantly going backwards in the first half but then for the first 15 or so minutes of the second half he seemed to be the only one looking to drive us forward. So in these last couple of games he's shown he can do it, he's just got to start doing it more often.

In saying that, our ridiculous set-up does make it unnecessarily difficult.
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Or it has to do with opposition fitness level/freshness? The earlier in the games, the more intense the pressing/speed of play. Later on, tired legs lowers the tempo to his speed of thought/reaction level.
 
ti vu said:
Or it has to do with opposition fitness level/freshness? The earlier in the games, the more intense the pressing/speed of play. Later on, tired legs lowers the tempo to his speed of thought/reaction level.
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Possibly. But even if that is true, it doesn't mean he can't adapt. We have to remember that he basically didn't have a preseason, came to a new league, started the season injured, then played out of position when he did come back. It's hardly surprising that he seemed to take a while to get up to speed. Whether he can adapt or not is something we don't know yet, but there have been some signs of it the last couple of games. Only time will tell.
 
He’s a squad player just like McTominay , the problem is they are 1st choice at the moment because of injury and no options
 
I’m starting to warm to him. Never shys away from the ball and is always giving an option no matter how much preasure he is under. Makes a refreshing change. Now if only we could get the other players in midfield to do the same and then give him an option I figure we’d be doing far better at controlling games and breaking people down.

That one pass he hit to Dalot was beautiful.
 
Kostov said:
As was the case before with other midfielders, he is only comfortable when going backwards to our own goal.
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FerociousCorgis said:
Swear every time I watched him on ball it was backpedaling 30 yards with the ball trying to avoid any pressure.
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That’s a really bizarre criticism. He often comes under pressure from 2 prayers and with no easy sideways pass because the other two midfielders are much higher up the pitch. Yet he rarely gives the ball away (he had 92% pass rate, highest of the team yesterday) and quite often finds a nice forward pass.

What do you want him to do? Run towards the press and try to take them on? When he is the last line of defence from the midfield? He is in a position where it must be safety first. Of course he will shield the ball and backpedal in search of an outlet pass, if there’s no easy option. And he does that well.

He has his glaring weaknesses, like being slow and very poor aerially, the 2nd of which was (as some of you pointed out) part of the reason for their 2nd goal from the corner. But what you’re describing above isn’t his issue, given how isolated he is from the forwards. It’s a tactical problem. We play with 1 CM and 5 forwards. I count Bruno and McTominay in that category, given our current tactics/formation.
 
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Yet another good player we're making to look bang average or worse. Trust me, even Rodri would struggle with the way our midfield is setup. He constantly has to sprint around the pitch to extinguish fires because our frontline treats the ball like a bomb and even when he's got the ball there are no clear options to progress play. You'd have to be an exceptional player to look good at Man Utd right now.

Amrabat is not that but he's certainly not a poor player. He's fairly press resistant and has good technique, good physicality as well. Ten Hag is just lost at this moment in time, i don't think he even knows what he's trying to do. Just trying to survive game after game.
 
Litch said:
Upgrade on Fred?
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They are very different players.

I think as a sitting, ball-playing DM Amrabat is far better. Fred would make horrible passing mistakes when pressured. He was also physically weak. So when he was receiving the ball in our 3rd of the pitch and under pressure, you would always sweat that he would get dispossessed or pass it to the opposition. Amrabat by comparison is safe hands. He rarely gets dispossessed or gives away the ball despite being much more isolated in DM than Fred ever was.

On the other hand, Fred had energy, pace and agility which Amrabat is lacking. When freed from the DM role, he could press the opposition up the pitch and get many ball recoveries. On the counter attack he could carry the ball fast up the pitch and he could also find a crisp, low pass to unlock a defence. He could also arrive late in the box and score goals. He was a significantly better box-to-box CM.

They could unironically complement each other well. Because Fred would contribute more in the build-up and defensive phase than McTominay, while also pressing better high up the pitch and getting his share of goals and assists. So what I don’t understand is that after the last few years had clearly shown that Fred was a better midfielder than McTominay and moreover that he would suit this current formation even more (we played Fred as AM few times last year, to good effect, but never McTominay). Why, if we were to planning to play the way we do, did we not sell McTominay instead and get the 30m from West Ham while giving Fred a 1-year extension? That would give us a better backup option to Mount, while giving the latter more time to bed in.
 
andersj said:
Lack pace and agility. Not good at covering space. But yes, decent on the ball yesterday.
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Most top DMs lack pace though. Speed isn't really a top requirement for the position. Rodri isn't quick, Casemiro was never quick and neither was Busquets. I'll agree that he seems to have issues keeping up with the speed of play in the Pl but I'll put that down to adaptation issues.

The fact is that playing as a DM in this Man Utd team, with the current setup is borderline impossible. Too much space to cover with a team that can't even hold possession for a few mins to enable you to recover. It's constantly end to end. Amrabat is not perfect but most DMs will struggle here. Casemiro did it for a year and looked shattered by the end of the season. Probably ran more here in a year than he did in the last 3 at Real Madrid
 
TempusFugit said:
Most top DMs lack pace though. Speed isn't really a top requirement for the position. Rodri isn't quick, Casemiro was never quick and neither was Busquets. I'll agree that he seems to have issues keeping up with the speed of play in the Pl but I'll put that down to adaptation issues.

The fact is that playing as a DM in this Man Utd team, with the current setup is borderline impossible. Too much space to cover with a team that can't even hold possession for a few mins to enable you to recover. It's constantly end to end. Amrabat is not perfect but most DMs will struggle here. Casemiro did it for a year and looked shattered by the end of the season. Probably ran more here in a year than he did in the last 3 at Real Madrid
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Yep, as soon as the ball goes near the halfway line there’s a turnover and we have Mctominay and Bruno occupying higher positions with nobody covering. Happened time and time again v Chelsea and obviously yesterday. We don’t like keeping the ball, but when we lose it we’re too slow collectively to get back by that point it’s too late. Can’t say Amrabat is great or anything but it has been the same with anybody else who plays. Even these smaller teams know the importance of possession nowadays and play in a way that is pretty well oiled. We are just all over the place. No cohesion, no plan, no clue. Watch us when we get the ball. Pressed, pushed back, then hoof.
 
Watching the highlights and where the hell was he running to for the second goal? 2 attacking midfielders and he pushed beyond them, pass doesn't make it and they are immediately in on the back 4. I like his industry and willingness to take the ball but he is not a smart player.
 
MadMike said:
That’s a really bizarre criticism. He often comes under pressure from 2 prayers and with no easy sideways pass because the other two midfielders are much higher up the pitch. Yet he rarely gives the ball away (he had 92% pass rate, highest of the team yesterday) and quite often finds a nice forward pass.

What do you want him to do? Run towards the press and try to take them on? When he is the last line of defence from the midfield? He is in a position where it must be safety first. Of course he will shield the ball and backpedal in search of an outlet pass, if there’s no easy option. And he does that well.

He has his glaring weaknesses, like being slow and very poor aerially, the 2nd of which was (as some of you pointed out) part of the reason for their 2nd goal from the corner. But what you’re describing above isn’t his issue, given how isolated he is from the forwards. It’s a tactical problem. We play with 1 CM and 5 forwards. I count Bruno and McTominay in that category, given our current tactics/formation.
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What you describe seems plausible and fair. I guess, the player gets some stick (I may be a culprit of that as well) because a) he was sold as this bulldog warrior during the summer and b) because probably people want to make sure, that this loan deal stays a loan deal. I think, he does alright, yesterday he wasn't bad, he was alright once again and with being alright, he might have been one of the top5 players from our team for that particular match, but still, being better than our shit players shouldn't really equal to being seen as good. Especially not for such a clueless club as us (I am actually worried, that if a player has a good standing it would effect the clubs decision making). For 20 million there must be somebody out there who is just as good and has age on his side and more potential to gamble on. That being said, his start wasn't optimal, I agree so he might turn the corner. I just think, he needs to do it soon... It is a one year loan and a good end of the season wouldn't turn the tide at least not for me. We have limited funds and are notorious for wasting them. Based on right now, I would be worried that those 20 million would be going right into the deadwood cabinet.
 
Bobski said:
Watching the highlights and where the hell was he running to for the second goal? 2 attacking midfielders and he pushed beyond them, pass doesn't make it and they are immediately in on the back 4. I like his industry and willingness to take the ball but he is not a smart player.
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Casemiro did this all the time too, so it must be the manager's instructions.
 
OrcaFat said:
My impression is that most people did not expect him to start games often. I didn’t. But I did expect him to be a useful squad player who would challenge for a place and sometimes get in. At least he should be able to keep Casemiro honest and could be used a lot off the bench or start sometimes as a relief or tactical option.

My worry now is that he doesn’t seem to have great natural fitness. To stay sharp he may need to be playing regularly which, in turn, means he might not do well if he only gets a few minutes here and there.
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That's fair. Unfortunately we still need a starting DM though. But as a squad player, might be ok, need more time to evaluate.
 
NZT-One said:
What you describe seems plausible and fair. I guess, the player gets some stick (I may be a culprit of that as well) because a) he was sold as this bulldog warrior during the summer and b) because probably people want to make sure, that this loan deal stays a loan deal. I think, he does alright, yesterday he wasn't bad, he was alright once again and with being alright, he might have been one of the top5 players from our team for that particular match, but still, being better than our shit players shouldn't really equal to being seen as good. Especially not for such a clueless club as us (I am actually worried, that if a player has a good standing it would effect the clubs decision making). For 20 million there must be somebody out there who is just as good and has age on his side and more potential to gamble on. That being said, his start wasn't optimal, I agree so he might turn the corner. I just think, he needs to do it soon... It is a one year loan and a good end of the season wouldn't turn the tide at least not for me. We have limited funds and are notorious for wasting them. Based on right now, I would be worried that those 20 million would be going right into the deadwood cabinet.
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It shouldn't, but again I reiterate that doing well and being in the top 5 players of the team, while playing as a lone CM in this United team, is no small feat. It's not the same as any other position.

Casemiro who has been one of, if not the best, DM over the last 10 years and who was phenomenal last season for us, has been looking rather inept at playing this role this season. It is simply a monumental task to ask a single CM to bridge the gap between attack and defence. Both in terms of playmaking and defensively in terms of covering space when the opposition breaks through the press. Which is why I'm defending both Amrabat and Case, as well as young Mainoo, when people criticise them.

Playing with 1 CM is for the few clubs at the top of the game that are incredibly well drilled at pressing the opposition and skilled at retaining the ball. We are not there. We don't have the confidence, or the tactics or even the players (I mean, two #10s with McTominay being one of them?) to do that. So play 2 CMs, like most clubs around us in the table do, and if the CMs are failing to playmake or to contain the opposition on their breaks through the middle, then I will criticise them too. But I cannot criticise a midfielder for not being able to cover the whole midfield by himself, or for not being able to pick quarterback-style passes while being pressed by 2 opposition CMs all the time. It makes no sense.
 
MadMike said:
It shouldn't, but again I reiterate that doing well and being in the top 5 players of the team, while playing as a lone CM in this United team, is no small feat. It's not the same as any other position.
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I see your point but I don't agree with it. I agree with you that our system isn't the most functional and needs improvements on all levels. But it still shouldn't make it impossible to have an opinion if somebody played well or not. As I said, being too harsh makes no real sense for the reasons you laid out but being too generous is also not helping us. Systems evolve forever. Once we come upwith a good plan, our opponents will figure out how to counter that plan so we will have to evolve again. It is a neverending circle. Amrabat is on loan, he did alright under the circumstances but to bring him in, another 20 million would be asked for. This is not just a few bucks for somebody who will be 28 next year and hasn't really anything to prove than a good world cup. I am glad we gave him the chance and who knows, if he finds his feet and we finally see what got him his very good fbref stats in terms of passing then things might look different but if not, we should use our funds smarter. I like Amrabat. And right now, I prefer him to Casemiro as he seems to be really out of form (hopefully it is only that and not overall decline). But we shouldn't just settle for ok to good. He isn't really strong defensively, he isn't mobile and covers a lot of ground. And his passing while reliable isn't anything to be excited about. In terms of passing, his stats suggest that there is more potential to unlock. But apart from that...

MadMike said:
But I cannot criticise a midfielder for not being able to cover the whole midfield by himself, or for not being able to pick quarterback-style passes while being pressed by 2 opposition CMs all the time. It makes no sense.
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You don't have to criticise them. But you should be able to evaluate fairly. Him being weak, a little slow, bad at headers and a little unimaginative in his passing isn't exclusively down to the system. It might emphasize that, yes, but as I said, perfect conditions will likely not be around on short term.
 
NZT-One said:
You don't have to criticise them. But you should be able to evaluate fairly. Him being weak, a little slow, bad at headers and a little unimaginative in his passing isn't exclusively down to the system. It might emphasize that, yes, but as I said, perfect conditions will likely not be around on short term.
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I was talking about the overall performance. Opinions on performance are skewed by results and difficulty of the task of being a DM for this team.

I also think being unimaginative is down to the system. He cannot take many risks. But I have many times spoken about the fact that he is slow and poor aerially. Those weaknesses are rather obvious.
 
He does some good stuff, when he is hunting the ball down, closing passing lanes he is quite good, but as soon as someone is able to turn he is gone defensively, painful lack of mobility. Passing is also extremely limited, don't think this transfer should be completed.

I do like his industry and willingness but he just doesn't have enough.
 
I think, it was alright. He is too unambitious with his passing for my liking. I mean, I get it, in his position, he needs to keep it simple but too simple? I mean, what does have going for him if it isn't passing? He did alright in the DM position today but he is hardly anybody to rely there. He is the player who plays next to someone like Casemiro. Providing legs and progression. But this DM thing isn't his thing in my eyes.
But I hope today gives him a bit of confidence for Anfield. I am a bit scared about him being overawed at Anfield if the crowd there is really up for it.
 
He did alright but just not a fan of him. Mainoo is a better player, Amrabat does mostly the same sort of stuff just to a lower level and entirely unambitious passing.
 
NZT-One said:
I think, it was alright. He is too unambitious with his passing for my liking. I mean, I get it, in his position, he needs to keep it simple but too simple? I mean, what does have going for him if it isn't passing? He did alright in the DM position today but he is hardly anybody to rely there. He is the player who plays next to someone like Casemiro. Providing legs and progression. But this DM thing isn't his thing in my eyes.
But I hope today gives him a bit of confidence for Anfield. I am a bit scared about him being overawed at Anfield if the crowd there is really up for it.
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Fred was a much better fit next to Cas due to his speed and progressive if erratic play. They actually did well last season in the odd spells they played together only for Fred to be dumped 2/3rds of the way through the season despite being pretty good. We really miss good Fred, pity he wasn't more of a regular visitor.
 
He's fine as a loan who covers the DM - he looks so tubby though, like Shaw in his pomp
 
Bobski said:
Fred was a much better fit next to Cas due to his speed and progressive if erratic play. They actually did well last season in the odd spells they played together only for Fred to be dumped 2/3rds of the way through the season despite being pretty good. We really miss good Fred, pity he wasn't more of a regular visitor.
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Well I think, it is good to have a reliable passer next to Casemiro. Thats why I liked the idea of Amrabat being a more mobile, robust version of Eriksen. I agree with you though, good Fred helped this team a lot. But I don't think, it was because of Fred the player but more because of Fred the guy who moved sooo much that he covered the workrate of 1.5 players. That really helped us. Was always a fan of him and thought the criticism was often pretty harsh. But he wasn't fit for a United midfield. It is a bit of a shame, that we managed to get such a player out and a few good players in without (by now) making a step up...
 
He’s simultaneously better than I thought he’d be, but still should be nowhere near a team with our aspirations.

He’s rubbish, but he’s not fecking rubbish.
 
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