Ridiculous red card given the other stuff that was going on. The inconsistency of the refereeing lately has been appalling! I hope we appeal. There’s loads of similar examples that go completely unpunished let alone sent off.
So... Was it a red? (Casemiro / Hughes Royal Rumble)
- Thread starter Vidyoyo
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It's not an obvious red otherwise this thread and discussion wouldn't be taking place.
How about neither get sent off because no one actually did anything apart from push and shove each other around?
Yellow at best. Bizarre that people can see the other angles and still stick to their guns that it was a red.
Never a red, Ref et al bottled it. We should appeal the decision but given VAR was involved the FA might use that as a caveat to keep the decision.
By the letter of the law it’s a red but in context it’s ridiculously inconsistent refereeing.
You don't need to tell me you've "given up", you just need to not bother to reply
Because they inform each other. One shows him "grabbing" the collar, but the other shows that he wasn't actually grabbing the collar, he was grabbing the neck and the collar came with. You can send someone off if a second angle informs on the first.
No.
The rules for violent conduct when it comes to the head/face are much lower bar, the contact only has to not be negligible. Nobody is suggesting Casemiro was trying to kill Hughes Homer Simpson style, but that's not the bar for a red card.
Is your neck part of your head or face?
You keep saying this, but then replying to me anyway.
And sure, if it gets overturned, or if Casemiro turns out to not actually have hands the same shape as everyone else. They're probably about as likely (EtH has already said Casemiro stepped over the line by the way. we won't be appealing).
Yes, in the referees guidance it is.
To be fair, if they did that then these scuffles would stop. The only reason we see so much shoving and forehead-to-forehead type situations is because the refs are soft on it. Physical contact on a football field should be limited to acts that are part of the actual game of football. When the ball is not in play there's no good reason for players to be assaulting each other.
What does anyone gain out of watching 22 grown adults push each other? It's pathetic and I cringe when I watch our players get involved in this crap because it always results in completely avoidable bookings and reds. I remember Fellaini vs Aguero and Martial vs Spurs getting stupid reds.
People don't realise how stupid needless yellows are either. Bruno was suspended for Villa game because he picks up completely needless yellows all the time for example. It also massive effects in-game play. The amount of times I've seen our players avoid making a tactical foul because they've already been needlessly booked earlier in the game. You have players who can't make a tackle for most of the game because they're walking a tight-rope due to their own lack of sense.
Look forward to our fine for failing to control players
I voted red but couldn’t watch the match and have only seen the still shot with his hands around the neck so maybe I’m wrong.
The still of Casimero incident looks a definite red. The full video - his hands holding his collar, and more in a restraining manner than violent one - makes it more of a yellow for me.
I can cope with them deciding it was a red - but just can't see how you can justify then not sending off Ayew for a raised hand to Fred's face in the same melee.
That's the biggest annoyance in all this for me - Palace player did the initial shove on Antony hoping to get a reaction and initiate a red card as a desperate attempt to get back in the game. That cynical tactic worked - but only because the officials completely ignored the raised hand to a face by Ayew yet deemed raised hands to a players collar as a straight red.
At worst, it should have been a red each. Just one red - that should have been Ayew, with yellow for Casimero. That Ayew went completely unpunished at all is the biggest joke.
I can cope with them deciding it was a red - but just can't see how you can justify then not sending off Ayew for a raised hand to Fred's face in the same melee.
That's the biggest annoyance in all this for me - Palace player did the initial shove on Antony hoping to get a reaction and initiate a red card as a desperate attempt to get back in the game. That cynical tactic worked - but only because the officials completely ignored the raised hand to a face by Ayew yet deemed raised hands to a players collar as a straight red.
At worst, it should have been a red each. Just one red - that should have been Ayew, with yellow for Casimero. That Ayew went completely unpunished at all is the biggest joke.
I keep replying because I’m a reasonable guy. I’m not trying to change your mind any more (if I ever thought I could).
You are right, I think, about us not appealing, due to the risk of the ban being increased if unsuccessful. Luckhurst thinks we should appeal but it’s no skin off his nose is it? I’m basically just surprised that a few posters are insisting it is cut and dried Violent Conduct instead of somewhere in the grey. (I don’t agree with the other extreme either - that it’s not a Red in a million years - but I do think it was the wrong decision).
So, you are one of the 40% or one of that 80%, I guess.
Never a red.
Well worth an appeal I'd say.
Well worth an appeal I'd say.
And what? Want to give me a badge for it, wannabe hardman?
Surprisngly even Lineker, Shearer and Wright discussed the harshness of the red on MotdD and also suggested it was very harsh due to Casemiro actually holding the shirt, rather than the throat.
APPEAL!
APPEAL!
MOTD lot didn't think it was a red either. Definitely appeal territory. Won't be overturned though we already know that.
Not even the first cousin of a red card. Games gone.
Both Shearer and Ian Wright say the red is really harsh and the VAR view made it looks worse, without seeing a different angle. And I agree 100% - it was just handbags and never a red
It's not a red card, doesnt even grab him by the neck. Can see that from other angles.
Motd, shearer and wright saying the ref got shown a shit angle and from the other he clearly grabs the shirt and harsh red. May upset a few in here
Now i've seen it on MOTD, I've changed my mind from Yes, to No.
Yes.
We have very good grounds for an appeal but this is the FA we are talking about, confirmed Utd haters so it would be rejected.
Agreed. MOTD showed it just now. Never a red, and Shearer and Wright agreed strongly. Appeal, I'd say, particularly after that.
On second thoughts after looking at the replays from different angles on MOTD it looks a lot different. Wouldn't surprise me if it's appealed (which the club should) and overturned
I thought it was a red until I saw the video after the event. Case anf the dude are walking next to each other. If he was really choking him that wouldn’t have been the case.
Surprised so many thought it was a red. All fooled by the slowed down footage, like the ref was. Yellow at most and Ayew deserved the same.
Unbelievable! I thought there would be zero chance of this decision being overturned, but if this lot are even saying it was harsh then we may just have a chance.
Hmm guess I should be watching MOTD...
Chris Waddle called it correctly on radio comms.
That fact that Alan Shearer is on Match of the Day, saying that it looked a harsh red and that VAR chose to show just the one angle that made it look worse is a miracle. The other angle at normal speed and in slow more shows there was nothing in it.
Yeah that angle does make it look like bullshit.
Same.
A good rule of thumb is too see what Gabby Agbonlahor says a believe the opposite
And as shit as the ref was here VAR gave him no option really. Really should be rescinded
I've just seen it on Match of the Day
Both Shearer and Wright think a red card is harsh; they and Lineker said there could have been others
Edit: oh I see several posts above beating me to saying the same thing
Both Shearer and Wright think a red card is harsh; they and Lineker said there could have been others
Edit: oh I see several posts above beating me to saying the same thing
It won't be overturned though. They don't do it very often as it makes them look incompetent.
Actually, I just watched it again and this time I did think he briefly had his hands around his neck. So I think I’ll apologise to you for saying they were not.Are you trying to suggest Casemiro is hover-handing Hughes like a 17 year old with his prom date?Of course they're around it ffs
It was not aggressive, there was no choking and I would say negligible (even if you wouldn’t) - not Violent Conduct, under the definition in the laws of the game, unless you want to interpret the wording in a way that goes against the spirit of reasonableness and fair play.
There was contact, yes, but the full video shows how brief and non-violent it was. In any case, l’m not daft enough to think the FA will back down.
We’ll definitely appeal. I think there are clear grounds due to the angle in slow motion being shown to the ref not giving the full picture which would make it impossible to deem it frivolous. Doubt it’ll succeed but there’s no way that should be a red card - and fair play to linekar for changing his mind after seeing the new footage rather than just repeatedly posting about a still image which clearly incorrectly implies he has his hands around his throat and is throttling him like some on here have been.