It’s not even just him, though. Look at the reception of all fans — half the forum here is still happy to keep him, and that’s pretty accurate with other social media (Twitter) and even match goers. We’ve seen our standards evaporate in real time.
Sir Jim reportedly deems ETH's position not a priority unless results are particularly dire - missed opportunity or the right decision?
- Thread starter fastwalker
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I think he should go but Ratcliffe has barely got his foot in the door and the season is half way through. The last thing he needs is the burden of bringing in a new manager. Summer is the time to move after he has had time to assess everything and get reports from his staff.
I think that EtH has been our worst manager in almost half a century, but I can understand this decision. The priority should be to first put the structure in place, and then that structure to find a new manager. EtH will be sacked at the end of the season when INEOS will be fully in charge. If not, they probably need a brain transplant.
However, even if they are not that much ‘EtH out’, EtH himself will force them to make the decision by showing these consistently awful performances.
However, even if they are not that much ‘EtH out’, EtH himself will force them to make the decision by showing these consistently awful performances.
I guess it depends on what Jim's aims for this season are, getting rid of ETH now is very short term thinking, and may be premature until Brailsford and co. have undertaken a full assessment of the club.
If they are to ditch ETH then it needs to be done with a plan of who they need and what infrastructure they need moving forward over several years.
So "dire" might just mean cannot put up with it until the end of the season, this guy is going to get us relegated
after all look how Ragnick did as caretaker when everyone only knew he was there for 6 months.
In 6 months time if ETH has continued to fail then it will be easier to justify getting rid, probably cheaper too and by then there should be a plan for top to bottom within the club.
However in terms of dire.... the football is dire, the tactics are dire, watching utd right now makes me feel dire.... but I would rather they take their time and get things right, so unless they already have ETH's successor lined up write off another season and hope for the next
If they are to ditch ETH then it needs to be done with a plan of who they need and what infrastructure they need moving forward over several years.
So "dire" might just mean cannot put up with it until the end of the season, this guy is going to get us relegated
after all look how Ragnick did as caretaker when everyone only knew he was there for 6 months.In 6 months time if ETH has continued to fail then it will be easier to justify getting rid, probably cheaper too and by then there should be a plan for top to bottom within the club.
However in terms of dire.... the football is dire, the tactics are dire, watching utd right now makes me feel dire.... but I would rather they take their time and get things right, so unless they already have ETH's successor lined up write off another season and hope for the next
There probably Top 4 clause to pay until mathematically impossible.
Not worried, things will look worse by the summer. They will have another 6 months of pain and then will realise he is not the solution to any sort of improvement.
They will sack him, or next season is another write off.
They will sack him, or next season is another write off.
I can't see a way he turns it around sufficiently that he avoids the sack.
It doesn't though. Nobody in their mind would want any of them near the club again. For a good reason. And Jose didn't win the EL with Roma. ECL is a Mickey Mouse competition.
What I'm saying is, "several managers failing" is nothing out of ordinary in football world. Do people think once this new structure is in place we're going to strike gold with the first managerial appointment? It is very unlikely we'll get the right manager on the first try and that's okay. Bayern have a proper structure in place and they've changed more managers than we have since SAF retired. Even with how badly the club is run, our mistake has been giving managers more time that we should have, rather than the other way around.
I read it as Ineos wanting to bring their own people higher up before coming round to ETH. Makes perfect sense to me. We can always replace ETH in the summer unless he is able to markedly improve our situation ( highly unlikely).
Bringing in someone mid way through an already chaotic situation won't do the new person any good. Let ETH see out the season, using the intervening period to sort out the upstairs structure and then bring in a new manager in the summer. I don't get the issue with this, seems the most logical course of action.
Bringing in someone mid way through an already chaotic situation won't do the new person any good. Let ETH see out the season, using the intervening period to sort out the upstairs structure and then bring in a new manager in the summer. I don't get the issue with this, seems the most logical course of action.
Yeah, this. I'm not overly bothered if he's going to get sacked now or near the end of the season. But if they don't recognize he's not the man for the job once everything is in place then that will give us a good look into the future and how will the club continue to be run.
He's ruined the season already so it kind of doesn't matter at this stage.
Yep. Ruthlessness should be one of the most important things that the new regime does. Not this ‘giving time’ that our idiots in charge do to managers and players. If you don’t perform, you are out, it should be as simple as that. Essentially, build a hedge-fund/Netflix-like culture, you’re either performing, or you are jobless. End this charity-like culture that the club has been run for a decade.
Eh, if having our worst 1st half of the season since the 30's and arguably our worst European campaign in the history of the club doesn't count as 'particularly dire' in the mind of Jim Ratcliffe
Then I worry for the future to be honest.
Then I worry for the future to be honest.
Thanks for that input
Ambitious
But thats the point. He didn’t say that, we’ve got no idea what he thinks, it’s just The Guardian copying other clickbaiters and making stories.
And then we make a thread about it. As we do.
They are clearly looking at all aspects of the club's operations. This is a nothing story.
Click-bait, tabloid newspeak, but probably exactly what I would say if I had taken over our dysfunctional club and wanted a bit of breathing space to decide if the current manager is up to his job.
Results can’t be more dire than this. Next step down would be fighting against relegation
You are bemoaning the game to game approach which is a short term or tactical concern when INEOS are focused on the strategic and more concerned with why we are failing with every manager and nearly every signing. The process audit must precede any other major decisions otherwise the same errors that were made when we appointed ETH and signed several duds will be repeated.
This is the right approach for the long term health, stability and growth of the club. All processes and procedures must be examined with regard to player and managerial talent ID, how we lure players here and how we take care of them, mentally and physically, once they get here. All those factors contribute to success or failure on the field.
They were never really there. The standards were set by Alex Ferguson - it was all down to him how much or little he wanted to achieve at the club.
Everyone else (especially the fanbase) is just there for the ride. We're a rich/historic club with the fanbase and culture of a midtable/lower league club.
I think he means dire from this point on. He's obviously given ETH a clean state from when his investment was approved.
If results continue this way he'll be gone. Basically ETH is on his last warning.
If results continue this way he'll be gone. Basically ETH is on his last warning.
One thing's for sure - looking into why 11 men can't kick a ball around as well as some other men is going to take some serious investigation.
Could it be that the players aren't very good?
Could it be that the coaches aren't very good?
Could it be that the people who find the players aren't very good?
Or is there more to it? Could there be a sinister plot at the top, a boardroom virus left by our dear friend Ed?
Probably just shit players and coaching.
Could it be that the players aren't very good?
Could it be that the coaches aren't very good?
Could it be that the people who find the players aren't very good?
Or is there more to it? Could there be a sinister plot at the top, a boardroom virus left by our dear friend Ed?
Probably just shit players and coaching.
So would you have them sack ETH? If so, who could we get?
More the former than the latter, in my opinion
How I expected, they will see how it's all failed first, get feedback from everyone. Set the ground for a new manager in 6 months most likely or remove ETH in a couple of months in needed. This is not a well run top club with a poor manager than needs sacking immediately and claims from fans of lamenting standards insert Bayern, the whole club needs assessing and sorting properly.
That’ll be tested if United crash out to Wigan tomorrow
Which would be a surprise, but not a shock
Which would be a surprise, but not a shock
It has never been as dire for us in 40+ years. Any worse and we’d be fighting relegation.
ETH has proven that he cannot coach a progressive, front foot, attacking style of play in the Premier League. We over-performed last season relative to our on pitch performance.
We’ve also over-performed this season. We’ve been slapped about in every game apart from Chelsea at home.
SJR knows this. They will be looking for a replacement Head Coach privately.
ETH has proven that he cannot coach a progressive, front foot, attacking style of play in the Premier League. We over-performed last season relative to our on pitch performance.
We’ve also over-performed this season. We’ve been slapped about in every game apart from Chelsea at home.
SJR knows this. They will be looking for a replacement Head Coach privately.
correct choice to wait until summer
privately I am certain ETH has been told things need to improve or he's a gonna
I mean it goes without saying anyway
privately I am certain ETH has been told things need to improve or he's a gonna
I mean it goes without saying anyway
We are sticking with ETH until summer then?
I just hope we would have potential managers and players lined up.
I just hope we would have potential managers and players lined up.
terrible management consultancy. they should have come in and fired a third of the workforce, before changing the club’s name and badge.
Don't worry Sir Jim. The results will get particularly dire pretty soon.
Sacking ETH and hiring someone new without a solid understanding of the structure of the club around him (and why it has already failed us 4 times before ETH) seems to me like it would just set us up for the same outcome yet again.
For that reason it makes sense that they'd wait and get the lay of the land before pulling the trigger.
For that reason it makes sense that they'd wait and get the lay of the land before pulling the trigger.
Have to say that I agree with him. There is no point just repeating the mistakes of the past is there. And the vast majority of fans have been calling for that for ages.
The whole footballing structure needs to be sorted out. And that is the number 1 priority.
The whole footballing structure needs to be sorted out. And that is the number 1 priority.
Bigger picture.
in a season already pretty much fecked why waste time, energy and resources on the managers position when there is far worse things above him that need sorting first.
Season is fecked, for sure, but truly believe we could have a positive bounce second half of the season with a change of manager now.
One thing is for certain. The player options available to EtH this season are even worse than the Ole/Rangnick season when we apparently needed open heart surgery. Most of this has been due to injury.
There was a terrible infrastructure/preparedness in place for when he joined. The club panicked and bought Casemiro and Antony due to 2 poor results. Results did improve.
The worry for Ratcliffe would be sacking ten Hag and then him being a massive success elsewhere. That would be stain on his decision making and would feed a "catastrophe narrative" around the club for years, potentially.
The whole left side of the defence has been missing for most of this season so far, it makes sense to give EtH the rest of the season to see if he can turn it round with players coming back. We know he can play good football because he did it at Ajax.
There was a terrible infrastructure/preparedness in place for when he joined. The club panicked and bought Casemiro and Antony due to 2 poor results. Results did improve.
The worry for Ratcliffe would be sacking ten Hag and then him being a massive success elsewhere. That would be stain on his decision making and would feed a "catastrophe narrative" around the club for years, potentially.
The whole left side of the defence has been missing for most of this season so far, it makes sense to give EtH the rest of the season to see if he can turn it round with players coming back. We know he can play good football because he did it at Ajax.
Dunno, you were always free to outbid him and buy United shares yourself.. didn't see your bid though.
Incredible, really. State of this club.
I don't think that would be on his mind at all
Even if he's "massive success" elsewhere, which is a huge doubt, it's got nothing to do with how he's doing at United. Ajax played good football under De Boer too.