Good post. Being adequate isn’t a good enough reason to stand still. That sounds like like a play out of the Glazers book to me.
Sir Jim Ratcliffe: I want to buy Manchester United | Will make a bid for the club [Telegraph]
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Sorry what
Am I living in an alternate world where Salford Quays isn’t a 15/20 minute walk away and the city centre isn’t a 15 minute tram ride away?
In what world does taking the family outside the ground for food instead of taking them into the ground for the match “keep the next generation coming through the door”?
Think outside the box. There's clearly reason as to why United, and other clubs, build complexes in other countries, to get "closer" to the fans.
If you struggle to understand this concept, I can share with you with what the likes of Dallas Cowboys and Spurs do.
The Lowry Centre is ~10 minute walk away, with a lovely stroll past the Manchester Ship Canal and Media City for any coffee shop/bar needs or even tours!
Hell to get there you walk past the Imperial War Museum if that’s more of the educational entertainment that would be preferred.
Oh yeah, it's absolutely mental which is why I always take the tram back to the city centre or head to Salford Quays first and have a pint before making my way home.This always sounds great in practice, however, have you ever experienced the traffic after the game? It's manic. I'd rather be able to stay in the same complex and let things die down a little. Especially on rainy days...which is a plenty in Manchester!
Real and Barca have gone down that route and all. They want to rinse the punters, sorry....maximise revenue. To be fair, we were the first club in Europe to have exec boxes thanks to Sir Matt. We've always been ahead of the curve. We're Manchester United not Colchester United.
Thank you. This exactly what I mean. We have always been pioneers. Club wanting to go and play in Europe. The whole marketing set up, etc.
The thing is, whether people choose to hang around or not, that's up to them. But the world has moved on. People, like myself, get to a certain age and want to experience the whole match day with my family...even if I can only get two tickets.
Sorry, that comment wasn’t aimed at you - I miss quoted because I was considering your question about top 3 grounds and got in a muddle.
To be honest I’ve been to OT, Wembley, Cardiff Millenium Stadium, Stoke’s Bet365 and Boro’s Riverside stadium so I’m not best placed to answer - and it’s subjective anyway depending on what you want from your experience. For me being 6ft I am cramped at OT, and the concourse in the Sir Bobby stand seems small compared to Wembley for example.
I agree however that we don’t want to lose our historic ground in favour of a soulless bowl the same as every other ground. The cost of engineering a solution to the railway line may make a renovation a poor value option though.
I was surprised how dated the stadium looked behind the scenes. The other problem is eventually we'll need to redevelop regardless and it'll only get more expensive. Better spending a £1b than double that a decade down the line.
It can be done. We could have larger steeper stands and maximise the South Stand - there's still enough space behind it. (tunnel and what not...)
Compared to what? What have you seen that makes OT look dated?
Use of materials, finishing etc etc. Even the newly refurbed changing rooms are economically put together. Just look around. I think the architects of the Stadium of Light Sunderland did the extensions and what not. Hardly top quality architects. But if you're fine with it that's your perogative. No matter how you look at it, redevelopment won't get cheaper, though. I'm not asking for a shiny new stadium next to the current ground. I just want a plan put in place where we could tear down the stands one by one over the next 5 years or so. And improve things like the seating. Old Trafford when built was the most modern stadium in the world, I just feel we've always gone big on ideas before most.
The point is that the best way of bringing the next generation "through the door" is to literally bring them "through the door", not "bring them up to the door and leave them outside". I'm baffled how many more eateries and the like you need given that you've got the Qauys, Trafford Centre and city centre all within 15 minutes or so, then you've got Hotel/Cafe Football about 12 seconds away which you can pretty easily get a booking for the week before most games. I've got nothing against modernisation but this is baffling.
As for Real & Barca I've been to both multiple times in the last 12 months and these supposedly amazing supporter areas really aren't that - the area outside the SAF stand is larger for example. I'm not saying the new Bernabeu won't be outstanding because it clearly will be but it's pertinent to note that they are redeveloping the stadium from a position of strength on-field, they're the best team in the country and are on the back of numerous Champions League wins- they got the team right first. Dallas Cowboys I'm not taking seriously as it's a different sport for a very different type of supporter, that being said at least they make a lot of money despite being a shite team so I guess there's that?
I'd also add to this that I listen to the United We Stand podcast (the lads selling the fanzines outside the ground on match days, Andy Mitten's side gig) on the regular and they always speak to some of the away fans after the game. Some Spurs fans were saying that they loved OT because it was a proper stadium, the statues outside, the history of the ground the sheer size of it as you walk up to the ground. They said there weren't many better in the country and that their's needed some of the stuff we had because there's feels hollow in comparison.
They're absolutely right. The only PL stadium I haven't done currently with us is the new Spurs ground and I'm yet to visit a stadium better to watch football at than Old Trafford in this country. For example people tend to say how nice the Emirates is until they actually go to it & Wembley is huge but I'm yet to come across anyone that actually likes it. None of the others are even worth a mention.
Where will women's football be in 5 years? I'd say build new and redevelop the current one for the women let them grow into it and attract finance/grow the support/team.
How do United engage with thier fans abroad? Do you think our supposedly 1bn fans all came "through the door?"
Barcelona and Real haven't even completed their redevelopments, so I'm not too sure how you can comment on them?
It's about building upon the current, not stagnating. We could be more profitable with the way we use our stadium. Works towards a self sustainable club.
As mentioned before, imagine the likes of Busby not pushing yhe boundaries of this club. Where would we be?
Of course, we can stay where we are. Nice lick of paint. We will be left behind.
yeah I think they will ultimately
Agreed. Women's game will grow and we've already been left behind by the likes of City.
Makes sense to. I'm going to spend my money elsewhere, why not just keep me there and profit from it?!
I was impressed with Wembley, was a clean spacious and pleasant to visit. I didn’t dislike it, but it didn’t have any of the feel, magic or history of OT. I might be biased though
You've changed the goalposts. We're talking about the stadium redevelopment and you now want to discuss people that never go near the stadium. What does redeveloping the stadium do to help those people?!How do United engage with thier fans abroad? Do you think our supposedly 1bn fans all came "through the door?"
Barcelona and Real haven't even completed their redevelopments, so I'm not too sure how you can comment on them?
Do you really think United aren't self sustainable?! Christ on a bike
I'm in agreement we should be looking to improve certain aspects of OT, just not a clean rebuild because it isn't worth it. Do you want an iconic stadium or do you want a money grabbing theme park for the entire family? At a certain point you sell you soul because an events space has to account for all events equally, and the football becomes one of the on offer events. The Rolling Stones won't play OT if the MEN or Etihad is better, so you have to put more effort into that aspect than what's necessary for somewhere you predominately play football.
And by improve I mean look at more ways to get marginal gains out of the team, improve the pitch if we can, not build a Michelin star burger joint and a shopping centre next door as part of the 'experience'. We should be looking to expand the stadium, re-do the roof, maybe even rebuild an entire stand if necessary but OT isn't standing still, it has small work done constantly otherwise they would condemn it and shut it down.
Put it this way, we’ll end up with a much cooler, more historic and unique stadium if we decide to renovate.
No brainer for me.
No brainer for me.
Yeah, as I say, we're on different pages. I can look at it as my experience and how I took the games in. However, the world is changing. Complexes are changing. The way the new generation will interact is changing. We have to keep progressing. If we are making changes, then let's future proof it.
I literally explained how you changed the goalposts. If that's too complicated for you I don't know what to say really. We're discussing renovating the stadium, tell me what that has to do with the majority of the supposedly 1bn fans who will never go near the stadium?
You said "works towards a self sustainable club" which would surely suggest you don't think they already are.
You have to engage with more fans that just come through to the turnstiles. That's what my point has to do with talking about 1bn fans.
Works towards a self sustainable club, I agree, I could have worded it better. I meant to say keep it that way. We only have to look at the big companies that never moved with ties and how they no longer exist.
And NO, I'm not saying we're going bust. However, I wouldn't want to keep getting bank rolled as a club by its owners, such as City.
Wait!
People don't seriously think that we have a fanbase of 1 billion people, do they?!
The population of the planet is 8 billion! That would mean that one in eight people in the world support United!
People don't seriously think that we have a fanbase of 1 billion people, do they?!
The population of the planet is 8 billion! That would mean that one in eight people in the world support United!
When they say fanbase, their definition is probably something tenuous - e.g. they add up social media engagements plus website traffic plus feck knows what else until they come up with a figure of 1 billion.
E.g. United can "reach" 1 billion people - when you add in the number of people who watch United games around the world. Obviously there aren't 1 billion die hard United fans, but that won't stop PR bollocks.
People will continue to come to OT if we continue to win things, having a big stadium with a shopping mall next door doesn’t guarantee anything, and building additional amenities doesn’t bring any more fans in the door on match day. The draw is the team, it’s the players, it’s the football and the atmosphere, not pumpkin spice lattes.
The new generation interact with United via socials, not getting ripped off with a £25 burger.
Fulham just built a swimming pool on top of one of their stands to attract people, United don’t have to do any of that, it’s Manchester United.
I’d be willing to bet a good half are people who had their childhood ruined by United and now watch so they can enjoy the times we lose. My grandad who’s a city fan watches United for this reason.
Already stated it a few times, spend upwards to a billion doing a Bernabeú esque renovation.
Spurs ground is nothing special to attend as an away fan. Architecture etc… may be decent but if that’s the gold standard then it’s a waste of money.
Particularly when the main thing people are clamouring for from a rebuild are all available a very short walk away from the ground.
Sugababes?
If any of the past 10 years are to go by, then we will need every help we can to bring people to Old Trafford...as we haven't been winning much.
You just have to see what Dallas Cowboys have done. Not won a Super bowl since 1995, but yet still are amongst the the top brass, due to the help of all their "fan experience."
So why do the majority of games still sell out without an in built Brewdog*spits* bar
When did I say it doesn't?