Safer Future: Shaw or Wan Bissaka?

Massive Spanner said:
Sure, but all that is baseless when you consider what I said. The bolded part is where I fundamentally disagree. I know players can "work on" aspects of their game but you can still tell when watching a 22 year old if they have the natural footballing ability to be a top player in their position. AWB is severely lacking as a footballer. He can't dribble, he's a decent but not great passer, his crossing is terrible, his link up play is non existent. He's a brilliant tackler and good at marking his man and that's about it. You can say it's his first full season here but funnily enough last summer most critics towards us signing him were saying that he was nothing special on the ball and it turns out that's true.

As I already stated, the difference between him and Shaw is that Shaw always looked like a really good footballer who needed to work on his fitness, positioning, consistency etc. - sadly he hasn't as of yet fulfilled his vast potential.

I'd also just like to clarify that I actually think Shaw is a really good full back, he's not the player I'd hoped he'd become but I think if he remained fit he'd easily be good enough for a top four side. The main thing holding him back is injuries, the main thing holding AWB back is that he's not good on the ball.
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Not every fullback is set up to be an attacking one though and of course AWB is average on the ball but I personally don't believe he is so bad that he cannot improve to a level that he'll be good enough. He has the basic raw attributes to succeed and he now needs to be coached properly to achieve that. I think it's much easier to improve on things like link up play than it is to know how to tackle/mark this late in his career.
 
Shaw is far better but either way our full back situation is horrendous and if we want to challenge for titles etc we gotta upgrade our full backs. Its really really bad right now and they are really holding us back.
I would probably spend some 60 mil or so this summer and try to get 2 full backs.
We are generally fine, decent everywhere else. Dont have great depth but we can probably get by however we absolutely need to do something about our full backs. Get 2 for 60 mil.
 
Shaw is definitely better. But he needs to believe it himself too. When he gets going and makes those charging runs, he can be a handful and despite some stats favoring AWB, there's nothing that can convince me that he's a better attacking FB than Shaw.
 
Shaw is a far better player currently and was a bigger talent as a teen too so I think overall it has to be him. It’s been clear how much we have missed Shaw in the run in and it’s also clear that AWB has to seriously improve to make it at this club long term.
 
romufc said:
Agreed. Shaw is one of the better PL LB's.

He is 24! he is a very good defender and compliments Rashford on the left, just because he doesnt have Robertson level assists/ goals means he is crap? some people need to get a grip of themselves.
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25 mate. And he's still got to show he can last a full season himself!

Both he and Wan Bissaka are good defenders though, but that's not the question that has brought about this thread.
 
Am I the only one who doesn’t think AWB is as bad on the ball ad made out? He has a pretty secure touch, is good carrying the ball and he’s good at creating space with footwork to get a cross in. I think the last month of the season, where he looked absolutely dead on his feet has clouded people’s opinion.
Shaw’s probably better on the ball but his lack of a final cross is more problematic for me. He gets into good positions but very rarely has any sort of end product. I do think they’re both good enough though to be honest, but we do need capable back-up. Laird may provide this on the right but I’m not convinced in Williams as a back up for Shaw.
 
Shaw is the much better player but unfortunately he gets injured too much, so you’re going to get half a season from him.

AWB is just not that good. Ultimately both need to be replaced but it won’t happen for some time.
 
Shaw is good. Wan-Bissaka shouldn't have been signed. It was a horrible decision that was always going to backfire. Many pointed out his lack of ability before the deal was completed, but were dismissed. The faster he is out of the team, the better.
 
Shaw is one level above AWB and that will not change. Nothing to add anymore about this
 
In two year's time they'll both be the new manager's problem and meanwhile we'll still be fighting about it.
 
Shaw is definitely better than bissaka both defensively and offensively on the ball, another big plus with shaw is he has looked very good the occasions he has played as the left sided centre back of a 3, if only he could get over his injury woes but even then part of me think that could be more of an issue with our medical staff after what happened with lukaku when he left the club.
 
Shaw is good defensively & average going forward

AWB is good defensively & bad going forward

so Shaw I guess. He certainly looks like the better footballer.
 
They are both hopeless to be honest. Still this AWB transfer seems like a Lukaku one. His overall ability on the ball is so bad that at some point his weaknesses will no longer be tolerated. You look at bayern and 10/10 of their players are all comfortable on the ball. This is probably what Ole envisions which makes it strange why we even bought him in the first place. Blah blah blah he is a great defender but 70 percent of the teams we face his defensive abilities wont be needed. He will always be a weakness under pressure and for that his time here will be limited.
 
With AWB on the right we have way more cover and free roam ability given to Greenwood and Bruno. So the given is to find a more attacking LB.
Would be interesting to have Wan-Bissaka as a RCB and get a more attack minded RB but I think then you lose the cover for the two right sided attacking players.
 
Without doubt the better is AWB.

In his first season of playing 4 competitions he fought all the way.

Shaw meanwhile can't fight the urge to eat a McChicken sandwich.
 
AWB by a country mile. Shaw is a lost cause in my honest opinion, if we could get a decent fee, and put that into the market for a leftback, it would be for the better. The guy is guaranteed to get hurt during the year, every year, and he's getting paid as if he is a pillar at his position.
 
Great to see one only being rated higher because the other can't stay fit.
 
There is a world of a difference between Shaw and Bissaka. Shaw is extremely unlucky that after that horrible injury he never fully recovered. AWB on the other hand is a very average player suitable to a mid table side. Only United can pay 50 m for such average players.
 
If he can stay fit Shaw is definitely the better player. His final ball isn't good enough and he doesn't get forward as much as we'd like (although he does go through periods where he does, such as just before his recent injury), but otherwise he is a damn good fullback. His great touch and short passing ability makes it harder to press us and also helps the midfield control the game quite a lot. Whereas AWB tends to actually be a negative in both those aspects.
 
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limerickcitykid said:
Shaw is far better than any fullback at the club. He’s also better than any flavour of the month fullback we’d likely sign and everyone creams themselves over until a year later when they have a new name to talk about. We can go through the list of names mentioned here every year and see how the majority are conveniently never mentioned again as it turns out they aren’t much good.
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His problem is staying fit.
 
Shaw shouldn't even be at the club anymore. He's a crock who keeps breaking every single season.
 
Shaw is more talented but his injury record means you can’t invest time into him. Thus I’d go with AWB but next season is crucial - he needs to show signs of progress with the ball at his feet but my fear is we don’t have the coaching staff to make rapid technical improvements to players.
 
Eventually, we need at least one good fullback on whichever side. If we can find good fullback who can replace Shaw but can also play on the right fullback position at decent level, that would be ideal.
 
Amar__ said:
Eventually, we need at least one good fullback on whichever side. If we can find good fullback who can replace Shaw but can also play on the right fullback position at decent level, that would be ideal.
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I think we are more likely to go for an all out left back. At the end of the day Shaw wasn't available when we needed him the most. We can get away with Williams in most games but high pressure games like semi finals we needed Shaws experienced head.
 
romufc said:
Agreed. Shaw is one of the better PL LB's.

He is 24! he is a very good defender and compliments Rashford on the left, just because he doesnt have Robertson level assists/ goals means he is crap? some people need to get a grip of themselves.
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Shaw is 25 and is in no way one of the better LB's in the league.

The biggest problem with AWB isn't that he isn't scoring or assisting enough. It is that his passing nad ball use is so underwhelming. Solskjaer didn't want Smalling because of his passing, yet he bought AWB. Makes no sense.
 
AWB > Shaw and it's not even close.

Defending ability
Ability to stay fit and play games
Mistakes
Ability to run for 90 minutes

Also, talking about end product. Shaw has 6 PL assists in six years. AWB has 4 assists this season alone.

Additionally I've never seen Luke Shaw cover a flank the way AWB does, which is almost Valencia like.
 
AWB is a fantastic defender on the ball capable of effectively shutting down a flank on his own. He's tactically poor, but he's young and tactical ability is both the easiest to teach and natutally improves with experience

He's poor in attack, but he what he offers defensively is imho enough to consider building around it(i.e. get a RW attacker to provide width who can function at a high level without great support)

Shaw is a pretty good player, but he's great at nothing and definitely can be improved upon. Still, good enough not to be a priority atm imho

Tl;dr Wan-Bissaka has the potential to become a game-changing defensive player. Shaw is a solid player but likely will never be more than that
 
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Lot of stats flying around. I think it is a more straightforward debate, we need press resistant fullbacks for about 25% of our games, AWB is not press resistant so far, the question is, is this something he can learn?
 
sincher said:
Good defenders. The problem is our 4-3-3 really requires much more of them in the attacking third.
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Then we need to take out Pogba or Bruno and put another worker if you want the fullbacks to stretch the play more

The whole thing would look better if we had a top quality right winger. This will create more space for AWB and also not be reliant on Over loading the left side
 
OL29 said:
Am I the only one who doesn’t think AWB is as bad on the ball ad made out? He has a pretty secure touch, is good carrying the ball and he’s good at creating space with footwork to get a cross in. I think the last month of the season, where he looked absolutely dead on his feet has clouded people’s opinion.
Shaw’s probably better on the ball but his lack of a final cross is more problematic for me. He gets into good positions but very rarely has any sort of end product. I do think they’re both good enough though to be honest, but we do need capable back-up. Laird may provide this on the right but I’m not convinced in Williams as a back up for Shaw.
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I thought I was the only one. If you watch closely he’s got some skills!
 
golden_blunder said:
I thought I was the only one. If you watch closely he’s got some skills!
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He absolutely does. It's just one of those things like people reading a review beforehand, then watches something with that review in mind. Confirmation bias? I think both are fine and far from a problem. When both are fit and on form United probably have the 2nd or 3rd best fullback pairing in the PL, quality-wise.
 
The solution to every problem isn't simply to buy more players, we have to be coaching these players and improving them. I hate how people keep referencing TAA as a comparison, he has so much more attacking freedom, plays in a midfield that covers him defensively superbly and also, most importantly, has been coached and practised his crossing to get the silly level of stats he has.

Shaw was THE highest rated young left back in the PL when we signed him and his ceiling is much higher than what we see. The one coach we have had who was renowned for bringing through youth was LVG and Shaw was looking great that season until the injury, then Mou came and destroyed his confidence and probably desire by constantly calling him out.

AWB was one of the best RBs in the league at Palace, playing in a pretty average team and after one year with us where he's actually been really good (a few games he's looked dead on his feet and obviously we want to see him being more involved in creating goals but he's been f'ing solid 90% of games) there's a huge section of fans calling him useless.
 
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