Rugby 2017 Discussion

EdWeatherall said:
PLace kicking?
I am sure we can afford Farrell an off day, he's incredibly usually

There didn't seem much out of hand kicking, due to the Italy tactic, scrum-half couldn't do it himself and was unable to pass to 10
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Farrell and Ford both had howlers from the hand too. Farrell in particular had a good smirk after one (when he kicked to touch in goal I think), the commentators here said "I bet Eddie Jones isn't smiling" :lol: The Italian kickers had a mare too, I'm wondering if it was conditions or if everyone just had a bad kicking day.

Seems like it has been written about a bit http://www.telegraph.co.uk/rugby-un...acteristic-inaccuracy-summed-chaotic-england/
 
unchanged_lineup said:
Farrell and Ford both had howlers from the hand too. Farrell in particular had a good smirk after one (when he kicked to touch in goal I think), the commentators here said "I bet Eddie Jones isn't smiling" :lol: The Italian kickers had a mare too, I'm wondering if it was conditions or if everyone just had a bad kicking day.

Seems like it has been written about a bit http://www.telegraph.co.uk/rugby-un...acteristic-inaccuracy-summed-chaotic-england/
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Oh yeh, forgot those, they missed touch twice going for too much when it wasn't necessary
A bad day at the office for two normally extremely reliable kickers
 
Rawls said:
Interesting article as always from Murray Kinsella on how France also adopted the 'tackle-only' approach, albeit very briefly.

http://www.the42.ie/italy-tackle-on...d-owens-3261610-Feb2017/?utm_source=shortlink
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I was going to mention the Chiefs who indeed used it, it was effective with the likes of Leitch, Messam, Retallick and Cane but not everyone can sustain that type of tactic because you need to suffocate the opposition from the first to the last minute. But it was fun to watch the opposition disbelief.
 
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JPRouve said:
I was going to mention the Chiefs who indeed used it, it was effective with the likes of Leitch, Messam, Retallick and Cane but not everyone can sustain that type of tactic because you need suffocate the opposition from the first to the last minute. But it was fun to watch the opposition disbelief.
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The biggest problem for the Italians was that they got too tired to maintain it. That they were able to keep it going for so long was great work by them.
 
unchanged_lineup said:
The biggest problem for the Italians was that they got too tired to maintain it. That they were able to keep it going for so long was great work by them.
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Yeah, unlike Italy under Dave Rennie the Chiefs have had a great defensive line that is able to absorb pressure and very fit players.
 
unchanged_lineup said:
How are you feeling about Italy vs France?
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I'm not confident both teams have the same qualities and flaws, collectively they are both poor. So individualities will make the difference and France should edge it.
 
Phil said:
Or you know, when it happens in a high profile international game?
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No, it's Eddie Jones who is complaining and the RFU who could ask for clarification. Eddie Jones isn't going to pretend that he didn't saw it in Super Rugby.
 
JPRouve said:
No, it's Eddie Jones who is complaining and the RFU who could ask for clarification. Eddie Jones isn't going to pretend that he didn't saw it in Super Rugby.
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Why would he? It's no great David Gill conspiracy.

It was a gimmick tactic that would be shit to watch if employed regularly and would cause consistency confusion across the game.

I really don't care that much for the outcome either way but I'm glad it's at least being brought up as a talking point, as is the right of the RFU by the looks of things.
 
Former All Blacks coach Wayne Smith rejected suggestions that the law needed to be modified, saying: ‘It’s not an anomaly in the law, it’s just a part of the game, a shock tactic that a team might use now and again, but certainly if you became predictable by doing it you’d be cut to bits.’

Meanwhile, Ireland flanker Sean O’Brien was asked whether Joe Schmidt’s team would have known how to react if presented with the same spoiling tactics and he said: ‘Yeah, absolutely, up the jumpers stuff! You have to adapt to those situations if they arise and it took England a little bit to do that."
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Eddie Jones is obviously embarrassed by how slow him and his team were to react and now he's made a bit of a tit of himself with what he's said since.
 
Tbf to Bill Beaumount, he seems to have a sensible head on him.

Beaumont added: ‘Is it a loophole? I don’t know. Italy felt they were acting within the laws of the game, which they were. I’m not criticising Conor O’Shea or Italy because what they did was legal. Everyone was taken by surprise and it proved most of us have to revise our knowledge of the laws!’
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Phil said:
Why would he? It's no great David Gill conspiracy.

It was a gimmick tactic that would be shit to watch if employed regularly and would cause consistency confusion across the game.

I really don't care that much for the outcome either way but I'm glad it's at least being brought up as a talking point, as is the right of the RFU by the looks of things.
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You can't employ it regularly, like you said it's a gimmick and it's ridiculous to make a story out of it. It's like not contesting the line outs.
 
Phil said:
Why would he? It's no great David Gill conspiracy.

It was a gimmick tactic that would be shit to watch if employed regularly and would cause consistency confusion across the game.

I really don't care that much for the outcome either way but I'm glad it's at least being brought up as a talking point, as is the right of the RFU by the looks of things.
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Nobody is going to employ it regularly though. It's a shock tactic that only works if the opposition isn't expecting it, otherwise it has glaring weaknesses that the opposition will rip apart. If England knew what they were doing against Italy they could still have put in a huge score on them and it wouldn't have been an issue.
 
Let's be real here, they got mauled in the second half, and now it's blown up as non-story, they'd simply just get mauled if they did it all game anyway, why change the rules for it when the surprise factor of it is more or less used up already.....for a fair few years anyway.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Eddie Jones is obviously embarrassed by how slow him and his team were to react and now he's made a bit of a tit of himself with what he's said since.
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People won't like it but Jones did a great job on Saturday. He was annoyed that he hadn't prepared his team well for the game and how his team were clueless about how to play this. I don't believe he thinks as he put it "not rugby" but rather wanted his players to feels as if they weren't to blame. Classic manager tactic. Fact that this is what people are talking about and not the poor performance then it's obviously worked.

Re watching the game. The errors by England in the first 15-20 minutes was bad, never seen England play that bad. The no ruck play did shock England but I'd be more inclined to blame the errors and awful kicking. Only Lawes, Launch, Itoje and Nowell (when he came on) had decent games. Still England did managed 6 tries and get the BP.

Single out a few players I thought Hartley for was poor again, I've been a fan of his but his form in 6N has been terrible and it's about time Jamie George got a start. Hartley is in because he is a good captain with an edge to him. But listening to the game you could see Farrell taking to ref regularly not Hartley if he's not gonna do his job as captain he shouldn't be playing. Also drop Brown, sick of seeing him just catch the ball and run in to first defender. I know both are characters but they are not playing well at all.
 
Good news for England that Billy V is playing for his club again and so may be in the running for the game against Scotland.
 
Just thinking ahead to the June internationals, France received some great news on Monday - Allister Coetzee will be of coach South Africa in that series.
 
unchanged_lineup said:
:lol:

6 Nations withdrawal weekend. Have to make do with watching the province matches for injuries...
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Super Rugby weekend for me. We've got 7 games all back to back through Saturday afternoon and early Sunday morning. Won't watch all of them but a good number of those will be worth watching.
 
Not 6 Nations, but in the Pro12 Leinster just scored a try where only people called Byrne touched the ball :D Ross Byrne crossfield kick to Adam Byrne offload to Ed Byrne, all no relation apparently! Scarlets getting destroyed.
 
unchanged_lineup said:
Not 6 Nations, but in the Pro12 Leinster just scored a try where only people called Byrne touched the ball :D Ross Byrne crossfield kick to Adam Byrne offload to Ed Byrne, all no relation apparently! Scarlets getting destroyed.
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There's some terrific young players in that Leinster side who will be part of the Ireland set up on a regular basis in the years to come (Leavy, Conan, McGrath, Carbery, Adam Byrne etc.). They've already set the record for the most ever tries in a Pro 12 season with 5 games to go.
 
unchanged_lineup said:
Not 6 Nations, but in the Pro12 Leinster just scored a try where only people called Byrne touched the ball :D Ross Byrne crossfield kick to Adam Byrne offload to Ed Byrne, all no relation apparently! Scarlets getting destroyed.
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Did Nigel Owens's cousin play?
 
Last week Italy's tackle only tactics caused much discussion. In 2015 at Ellis Park, the All Blacks utilised the line out version of this tactic. Much to Bobby Skinstad's annoyance, Jerome Garces ruled there was no maul. Was he right to do so? There are times i'll look at it and believe there's no maul in place, and other times i'm not so certain.

 
Mitchell Nicholas said:
Last week Italy's tackle only tactics caused much discussion. In 2015 at Ellis Park, the All Blacks utilised the line out version of this tactic. Much to Bobby Skinstad's annoyance, Jerome Garces ruled there was no maul. Was he right to do so?

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Dan Cole created a maul, so Woodcock was offside.
 
Mitchell Nicholas said:
Last week Italy's tackle only tactics caused much discussion. In 2015 at Ellis Park, the All Blacks utilised the line out version of this tactic. Much to Bobby Skinstad's annoyance, Jerome Garces ruled there was no maul. Was he right to do so? There are times i'll look at it and believe there's no maul in place, and other times i'm not so certain.

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Yeah, all it needs is one person to engage and then it doesn't matter if he disengages. The fact that this lineout tactic exists (albeit not successfully done here) is also why people were so amazed at Dylan Hartley not knowing about the ruck version of it.

 
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