Rodrigo Dourado

Pogue Mahone said:
Bit fecking stupid to lump academy graduates in with players signed from other clubs as examples of why we should only sign established talent and never take a punt on talented youngsters.
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You miss my point completely

This club clearly can't handle talent given the lack of success stories and the nearly endless list of failed ones.

We shouldn't bother with taking a punt anymore because of a combination of questionable quality of our scouting (too many players that aren't good enough), poor talent management from the club (we don't use our young players, some even don't get to play a single game) and the fact we can't seem to get players signed up on long term contracts to prevent them going to other clubs when the rare talent does eventually become a great player.
 
NoArroJusBeta said:
You miss my point completely

This club clearly can't handle talent given the lack of success stories and the nearly endless list of failed ones.

We shouldn't bother with taking a punt anymore because of a combination of questionable quality of our scouting (too many players that aren't good enough), poor talent management from the club (we don't use our young players, some even don't get to play a single game) and the fact we can't seem to get players signed up on long term contracts to prevent them going to other clubs when the rare talent does eventually become a great player.
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The solution? Stop signing talent. Flawless logic.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
The solution? Stop signing talent. Flawless logic.
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Stop signing them for the first team atleast. And for the next 2 years our focus should be much more on experienced proven players rather than unexperienced talent because we have to get back to our former level, we have to be competing for the title and CL finals. You simply can't do that if you need to pay learning money for bringing young players in the side. The big exception being if we can't find a good enough established player for a position in our team it can be a plan B.

Going for 18-19 year olds that show promise I find a good idea. Put them in the U-21 side and see how they develop for 2-3 years. When one shows a lot of promise and looks like a consistent player that can really offer something for the first team, you sign him up on a longer deal and then you bring him to first team. Not with the intention of being a stop gap but really to integrate him as a first team player. If it doesn't work out loaning him to another PL team for a season can be option to see if he can become something but then you loan him out to a club that really wants him and promises to give him a lot of play time.

If that ain't possible for that particular player than I say indeed don't bother. You can still track progress and sign them up at a latter stage in their career. Might cost a bit more but it will result in more success.
 
NoArroJusBeta said:
Stop signing them for the first team atleast. And for the next 2 years our focus should be much more on experienced proven players rather than unexperienced talent because we have to get back to our former level, we have to be competing for the title and CL finals. You simply can't do that if you need to pay learning money for bringing young players in the side. The big exception being if we can't find a good enough established player for a position in our team it can be a plan B.

Going for 18-19 year olds that show promise I find a good idea. Put them in the U-21 side and see how they develop for 2-3 years. When one shows a lot of promise and looks like a consistent player that can really offer something for the first team, you sign him up on a longer deal and then you bring him to first team. Not with the intention of being a stop gap but really to integrate him as a first team player. If it doesn't work out loaning him to another PL team for a season can be option to see if he can become something but then you loan him out to a club that really wants him and promises to give him a lot of play time.

If that ain't possible for that particular player than I say indeed don't bother. You can still track progress and sign them up at a latter stage in their career. Might cost a bit more but it will result in more success.
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TL;DR version: "you'll never win anything with kids."
 
NoArroJusBeta said:
Stop signing them for the first team atleast. And for the next 2 years our focus should be much more on experienced proven players rather than unexperienced talent because we have to get back to our former level, we have to be competing for the title and CL finals. You simply can't do that if you need to pay learning money for bringing young players in the side. The big exception being if we can't find a good enough established player for a position in our team it can be a plan B.

Going for 18-19 year olds that show promise I find a good idea. Put them in the U-21 side and see how they develop for 2-3 years. When one shows a lot of promise and looks like a consistent player that can really offer something for the first team, you sign him up on a longer deal and then you bring him to first team. Not with the intention of being a stop gap but really to integrate him as a first team player. If it doesn't work out loaning him to another PL team for a season can be option to see if he can become something but then you loan him out to a club that really wants him and promises to give him a lot of play time.

If that ain't possible for that particular player than I say indeed don't bother. You can still track progress and sign them up at a latter stage in their career. Might cost a bit more but it will result in more success.
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I think you've cracked it
 
I've just read 2 pages on this guy filled with work permit speculation, the value of signing younger players, excuses why he hasn't played for his national team yet, the clubs relative successes and failures with young Brazillians, which is great and all. But I still have zero idea of Rodrigo's strengths and weaknesses.
Off season is really getting boring on the Caf
 
Fans tend to over complicate a game which in itself is pretty simple. You have 11 first teamers and around another 11-15 players who compete with them. If a player is good enough to be part of that bracket than he should kept irrespective of nationality, age, reputation and character. The day a player isn't considered good enough to at least compete for a first team place than we should show him the door. I know that many are obsessed about the 'servants of the club' who had no chance on earth of ever be first teamers. Actually we should be very grateful for them because they sticked to United when they could have easily moved to erm, Sunderland or Everton.
 
Red_Beans said:
I've just read 2 pages on this guy filled with work permit speculation, the value of signing younger players, excuses why he hasn't played for his national team yet, the clubs relative successes and failures with young Brazillians, which is great and all. But I still have zero idea of Rodrigo's strengths and weaknesses.
Off season is really getting boring on the Caf
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Thanks for summing it up. That could be your thing.
 
Based on that video, he looks half decent to be fair.
 
He'll go to Porto, play well and be sold for £20M in a couple of seasons, and as usual we'll all complain about how we never buy players for cheap before they become big names and that our club's shit because it never taps up the South American market.

...Or we won't hear anything about him for the next 5 years. At which point he'll still be playing in Brazil and be a bit shit and we'll all just laugh about that time we were linked with him.

One or the other I guess.
 
Haven't seen enough of the guy to be honest, but he seems to be highly rated by the club scouts, and assisted Nilmar's goal vs Coritiba, where he was arguably the best player on the pitch IMO. Quite similar to Edmilson is his style of play, or even Lucas Silva, who we were also reportedly interested in, before he moved to Real Madrid. Like Lucas - he seemed rather elegant and composed in possession, has a decent passing range, read the game efficiently for his age, and completed a few well timed tackles. How that translates from the Compeanato to the Premier League I dunno, but it'll represent a significant jump in terms both of quality and physicality/ pace of the game.

@fontaine would be better placed to provide a more educated opinion.

As an aside, there are probably 3 or 4 young midfielders who in a couple of seasons could develop into adequate replacements for Carrick from a functional and stylistic perspective, more-so than some of their more experienced counterparts. The likes of Ruben Neves, Saul and Sergi Samper come to mind. Would Rodrigo be a better option than a couple of those, especially at the fee being mentioned ?
 
vodrake said:
He'll go to Porto, play well and be sold for £20M in a couple of seasons, and as usual we'll all complain about how we never buy players for cheap before they become big names and that our club's shit because it never taps up the South American market.

...Or we won't hear anything about him for the next 5 years. At which point he'll still be playing in Brazil and be a bit shit and we'll all just laugh about that time we were linked with him.

One or the other I guess.
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Well the fee being bandied about is €30m for an unproven youngster from Brazil. When United come into the fold, the selling clubs all add an extra zero to the price tag.
 
Señor said:
Well the fee being bandied about is €30m for an unproven youngster from Brazil. When United come into the fold, the selling clubs all add an extra zero to the price tag.
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Bloody hell, €30m? :eek:

Chairmens eyes must light up like Dollar signs whenever they hear United are rumored to be involved in a transfer.
 
NoArroJusBeta said:
You miss my point completely

This club clearly can't handle talent given the lack of success stories and the nearly endless list of failed ones.

We shouldn't bother with taking a punt anymore because of a combination of questionable quality of our scouting (too many players that aren't good enough), poor talent management from the club (we don't use our young players, some even don't get to play a single game) and the fact we can't seem to get players signed up on long term contracts to prevent them going to other clubs when the rare talent does eventually become a great player.
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We can handle talent. What we lack is that ruthless streak to show players the door when they are clearly not good enough
 
No idea who he is, but I find it really hard to get excited about these unknown players, to be honest. It's a genuine surprise when they actually manage to make any impact on the first team.

Buttner has quite literally been our most impactful 'who the heck is he?' signing in years, which says it all. If we sign him then fair enough, but people putting him as a back up for the first team? That's being really optimistic.

But maybe van Gaal will do better in this department than Sir Alex often did.
 
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I'm not a huge fan of untried/untested players from South America.
I'd much prefer a youngster, who has played a bit in Europe.
I hope we don't end up paying too much for this guy, because it wouldn't surprise me if this guy fails to make it past the reserves.
When he experiences the cold Manc weather, he may need counseling, to recover.
 
FC Ronaldo said:
According to wiki, he's played 3 games in the main league and is now worth €30m. Logic.
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2/3 games. He has also played 6/10 of the Copa Libertadores.

Honestly I think this is a bollocks story because I honestly can't see us punting all that money on a player that's not even played 10 senior games for his club.
 
I'm genuinely shocked that anyone in here has actually seen him play, maybe the term skeptical is more applicable.
 
NoArroJusBeta said:
Unproven Brazilian of 20 years old

No thx got my stomach full of these so called talents most of them don't make it, some even without playing a single minute for the club and the ones that do have potential to be great first team players tend to depart the club because of poorly handled contract situations.

Pogba to Juve for 300k and De Gea to Real for the same fee we bought him for 4 years ago all because poor management !

Powell, Henriquez, Obertan, Bébé not a single one made it to the first team because they aren't weren't good enough or they even didn't get a chance to begin with.

Januzaj our so called golden boy that had a breakthrough season last year is nowhere to be seen in the team anymore. Wasted season for him and god knows what the plan for his future is ?

Wilson promoted to the first team way too fast and similar situation to adnan.

Cleverley, wasted 4 years with him just be happy to see him finally leave on a free to everton.

Rafael and Fabio another 2 great examples of talents that never materialized into anything for the club.

Many more examples of absolute poor talent management by our club

I won't even start about Anderson.

No thx sign a proven player that can be off value for us right now and stay away from these kind of players that we just clearly can't handle as a club. It is a waste of time, resources and it hinders our evolution as a club to become a football powerhouse again (apart from generating revenue and being the world fanciest billboard !)
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You do notice that in the past few years we've had 3 managers, 2 CEOs and a wide variety of different coaches etc? What happened in the past doesn't necessarly mean it will happen now.

Also can you blame LVG if Cleverley hasn't developed properly, the twins are crocked and Ando is a leech?
 
30m :lol: Didnt we also pay 30m for the captain of the U20 Brazil team? :lol: Brazilian media at their best
 
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/ar...ing-Brazilian-midfielder-Rodrigo-Dourado.html

The Mail saying we're close to signing him, the article is from yesterday evening.

Manchester United close to signing Brazilian midfielder Rodrigo Dourado

Manchester United are on the brink of signing highly-rated Internacional midfielder Rodrigo Dourado.

United boss Louis van Gaal is believed to have sent scouts to Brazil to monitor the 20-year-old recently, and they were impressed with what they saw.

Van Gaal is keen to bolster his midfield options ahead of the new Premier League season, and Dourado would certainly fit the bill.

Internacional though, are reluctant to sell until next month and after the Copa Libertadores semi-finals.

Dourado, who has made 20 appearances so far this season, has been touted as Michael Carrick's potential successor at Old Trafford.
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devilish said:
We can handle talent. What we lack is that ruthless streak to show players the door when they are clearly not good enough
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I think that part of our past left when SAF retired. LVG does not seem to hold such sentiments towards under performing players. Quite a few left last season and a few more to leave this summer. RVP is certain to be off IMO.
 
Speak said:
Must be in another thread then. People have talked about what they've seen in that short Youtube video. Unless I'm missing something.
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Someone on this page said "from the little I have seen of him" and then went on to talk about a specific match. Maybe they caught it on YouTube, it wasn't specified.
 
ravi2 said:
I think that part of our past left when SAF retired. LVG does not seem to hold such sentiments towards under performing players. Quite a few left last season and a few more to leave this summer. RVP is certain to be off IMO.
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I agree
 
This was posted on reddit by an Internacional supporter:

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devilish said:
You do notice that in the past few years we've had 3 managers, 2 CEOs and a wide variety of different coaches etc? What happened in the past doesn't necessarly mean it will happen now.

Also can you blame LVG if Cleverley hasn't developed properly, the twins are crocked and Ando is a leech?
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You do know we'll be up for another management change in 2 years time.

Obviously I don't blame LVG for ando, cleverly. I'am just pointing out they are amongst the numerous examples of absolutely failed talents here at the club and I'am kinda tirred about them now.

We should focus on getting back to the top and stablising that position. Than we can start looking at these so called talents and see if they could have a role here at United. But right now I don't see the point in at, at all.
 
He might worth a punt, but not more than a £5M or similar.
If this guy comes good...then great.
If he fails (which I expect)....then it wont be a huge loss.

I don't like to see us wasting resources on players from South America, who have not proven themselves at high level.
Di Maria is struggling right now....and Di Maria is World Class.
Some unheard of South American might be shell shocked when he experiences the physical brutality of our league.
 
sunama said:
Some unheard of South American might be shell shocked when he experiences the physical brutality of our league.
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Not really. An 18-year old Rafael, came in and slotted in immediately and was performing great till Moyes struck and then of course Van Gaal's madness.
 
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