Mightberight vs me ehh? Batting vs bowling tbh. That's how I see it.
RedCafe Cricket Draft
- Thread starter KM
- Start date
Thinking of dropping one of my spinners for Afridi. I don't think anyone here rates Paul Adams much. Thoughts?
You need to be careful with Afridi. When he was a good test batsmen, he did not do much as a spinner. Now as a good spinner, his batting has gone down. But yeah, Afridi as a spinner plus batsmen > Paul Adams
Agreed. Its also about vote wins. For me fairly or unfairly, Paul Adams always seemed a slightly comical figure and didn't earn much respect as a bowler. On the other hand, everybody loves Afridi.
Expect the stats to be quoted a fair bit in the back and forth though. They're not pretty for Afridi.
Expect the stats to be quoted a fair bit in the back and forth though. They're not pretty for Afridi.
Is my game next?
Is it possible to have my match on Monday evening?
Going trekking from today in Himachal, will have zero internet access.
Going trekking from today in Himachal, will have zero internet access.
Yeah ok no problem with that.
Ok Grand! Hope Stretch agrees as well.. if he does not.. then I am mailing my write up to you anyway
So that's 1 match today, 1 tomorrow, then a 2 day break till yours on Monday?
EDIT: Oh and should I consider you an in for he WW game I'm planning?
Yeah.. people don't get on weekend anyway so should be fine. If people object then KM can post my write up, no issues. Just don't expect me online to respond to any points!
When is my match?
Think you're next. Up against Donadol. I actually considered if we should keep QF polls open for 2 days instead of 1 but I think that's better reserved for the Semis and Finals.
Yes you are.
Donadol post your write up in the thread or PM me. I'd like to start this match in 3-4 hours.
I'll be off the internet pretty much all of tomorrow and day after. Can someone else have a matchup before ours?
I could do ours but I won't have the write-up ready till tomorrow night.
Let me know whenever you want the game MBR. There won't be much interest over the weekend.. Might be better to wait. What do you think?
In the interest of fairness, I agree with this. Also, like crappy said, not many are online on the weekend in any event.
Let's postpone all the games till monday then?
I think that might be for the best though people should put their completed write-ups in the thread so they can be picked up when it's time.
I suppose they're worried about opponents looking at them and countering them but that's just silly. They'll have the chance to counter them in the thread anyway.
I suppose they're worried about opponents looking at them and countering them but that's just silly. They'll have the chance to counter them in the thread anyway.
I'll put mine up over the weekend.
Its not complicated to find a way round that. I PM'd KM yesterday itself :P
Ha_Rooney vs Red-Indian
Interval vs Donadol
NM03 vs MightbeRight
Crappy vs Stretch
Can we get this restarted gentlemen?
KM, have any of the 3 matchups PM'd you both of their write-ups?
Interval vs Donadol
NM03 vs MightbeRight
Crappy vs Stretch
Can we get this restarted gentlemen?
KM, have any of the 3 matchups PM'd you both of their write-ups?
Who's up next?
Only Crappy and IL have pmed me the team formation. Bit disappointing that.
Whoever's ready i think. From what i know, crappy and Interval have PM'd their stuff to KM. if you or Donadol can get yours in, one of the matchups can go ahead.
Edit: there's the confirmation from KM
Edit: there's the confirmation from KM
Ok KM, give me an hour or so. Will post in the thread here. Then you can get ours going. Crappy should be back online soon to answer questions. If he's not, then I won't answer questions/comments till he can, for fairness sake.
I m back, happy to do the match today
Ok, will post my team up later.
Km when u make the thread lemme post my write up
1. Kepler Wessels (c) – Scoring 2788 runs at an ave of 41.00; dogged opener capable of seeing of the most potent seam attacks as he showed on debut for Aus scoring 162 against an England attack with Botham and Bob Willis. He also averaged 56 vs a Windies side with Marshall, Garner and Walsh. Wessels was an innings builder but even if he failed to score much at times, he'd see of the shine on the new nut to allow others to flourish.
2. Tillakaratne Dilshan (wk) – Scoring 5028 runs at an ave of 41.21; he’s got 80 tests under his belt and the exact opposite to Wessels in batting style. Aggressive and loves playing his shots, Dilshan is well travelled boasting an average of almost 50 in England.
3. Hashim Amla – Scoring 4775 runs at an ave of 50.26; Hash is a genius in the making, if not already. He’s been in immense form since 2009 for SA scoring 3733 runs at an ave of 59.25 and 12 hundreds since then.
4. Younis Khan (vc) – Scoring over 6500 runs at an ave of 51.69 with 20 centuries; Younis is a modern Pakistan great. He’s known for being a fighter when the chips are down and is known for his rearguard specialties. A master of the 4th innings, could be vital against a potent bowling attack.
5. Thilan Samaraweera – Having scored over 5000 runs at an ave of 51.29; Samaraweera is mister dependable and a mainstay in the Sri Lanka line up. His main strength is his patience which wears bowlers down. His 2 recent centuries in South Africa is testament to his determination.
6. Andrew Symonds – Scoring 1462 runs at an ave of 40.61; Symonds provides an attacking option with gusto after a line-up featuring sturdy batsmen. A brilliant fielder and decent enough part time bowler, capable of the all-important ‘partnership breaking’ ball.
7. Tim Bresnan – The one risky pick in the line-up with only 15 tests, Bresnan does provide a much needed balance to the side having scored 3 50s and taken 56 wickets at 28s; between Tim and Strang (12th man), they provide good options to balance the side depending on opposition.
8. Brett Lee – Having taken 312 wickets at 30s, Brett was just short being a great due to his injury concerns. At his best though, Lee took 58 scalps (shortly after McGrath’s retirement, 07/08) at 21s allowing Australia to still dominate. Capable of bowling at 150clicks with outswing with the new ball and reverse swing (to right hander) with the older ball, he’s a dependable wicket taker at his best. Having scored 5 50s and averaging 20.15 with the bat, he’s a great lower order batsman to have.
9. Dale Steyn - My frontline opening strike bowler. With 272 wickets at 23s and taking a wicket every 41 balls, Dale is devastating, and bar any serious injuries will certainly surpass other SA fast bowling greats to become the best from SA. He can swing the ball both ways, and lift his pace to 150clicks when needed. His accuracy is his strongest feat.
10. Rangana Herath – Rangana has taken 146 wickets at 31s as a left arm orthodox spinner with a ball ‘that goes the other way’. Well capable of being the lead strike bowler on a turning and slow wicket as well as holding an end for long spells, he’s a great spin option. He’s shown that he can bowl a side out in the last innings on a fading pitch. He’s no mug with the bat either having 80 n.o. as his highest score.
11. Ian Bishop – The teams other main opening strike bowler, Bishop took 161 wickets at 24s and strike rate of 52. With a high side on action, he had pace and could move the ball of the seam. He got steep bounce from just back of a length and could really upset batsmen. Unfortunately for him, his career was cut short with injuries, else we’d be talking of the great trio of Walsh, Ambrose and Bishop today.
12th man: Paul Strang over since he's an agile fielder
Strengths:
Arguably the best pace attack in the draft with Steyn, Bishop and Lee supplemented with Bresnan. Herath is a decent spinning option who can take wickets on a turning pitch as well as hold an end with long spells to allow me to rotate the quicks. Symonds can assist if need be but I don't foresee the need. My opening batting pair is solid and proven openers at test level, especially Wessels who's record shows that he could face the fiercest pace attacks in the world. The middle order oozes class with Amla, Khan and Samaraweera. Amla has been scoring runs for fun against all kinds of attacks since 2009 at averages of 60. Khan is a fighter, an accumulator and provides valuable leadership to assist Wessels with captaincy issues. Thilan can occupy the crease for long periods and shows sheer grit when bats. He along with Khan have been shown to be masters of batting with the tail.
And to stop the blatant lying that's been going in some matches (
) I will post what I perceive my weaknesses to be.
Weaknesses:
I concede, Dilshan as WK is a liability. I admit I thought he played more as wk in tests. However, he's a very agile fielder and I have great slip fielders in the likes of Wessels, Khan and co to make up for any mishaps. Also, I do know Bresnan is a risk as he's not played that much, but I do believe he can add to the team. He's not meant to be a striker bowler, just a stock bowler and he can hold his bat just fine.
I will comment on crappy's team once I see it.
2. Tillakaratne Dilshan (wk) – Scoring 5028 runs at an ave of 41.21; he’s got 80 tests under his belt and the exact opposite to Wessels in batting style. Aggressive and loves playing his shots, Dilshan is well travelled boasting an average of almost 50 in England.
3. Hashim Amla – Scoring 4775 runs at an ave of 50.26; Hash is a genius in the making, if not already. He’s been in immense form since 2009 for SA scoring 3733 runs at an ave of 59.25 and 12 hundreds since then.
4. Younis Khan (vc) – Scoring over 6500 runs at an ave of 51.69 with 20 centuries; Younis is a modern Pakistan great. He’s known for being a fighter when the chips are down and is known for his rearguard specialties. A master of the 4th innings, could be vital against a potent bowling attack.
5. Thilan Samaraweera – Having scored over 5000 runs at an ave of 51.29; Samaraweera is mister dependable and a mainstay in the Sri Lanka line up. His main strength is his patience which wears bowlers down. His 2 recent centuries in South Africa is testament to his determination.
6. Andrew Symonds – Scoring 1462 runs at an ave of 40.61; Symonds provides an attacking option with gusto after a line-up featuring sturdy batsmen. A brilliant fielder and decent enough part time bowler, capable of the all-important ‘partnership breaking’ ball.
7. Tim Bresnan – The one risky pick in the line-up with only 15 tests, Bresnan does provide a much needed balance to the side having scored 3 50s and taken 56 wickets at 28s; between Tim and Strang (12th man), they provide good options to balance the side depending on opposition.
8. Brett Lee – Having taken 312 wickets at 30s, Brett was just short being a great due to his injury concerns. At his best though, Lee took 58 scalps (shortly after McGrath’s retirement, 07/08) at 21s allowing Australia to still dominate. Capable of bowling at 150clicks with outswing with the new ball and reverse swing (to right hander) with the older ball, he’s a dependable wicket taker at his best. Having scored 5 50s and averaging 20.15 with the bat, he’s a great lower order batsman to have.
9. Dale Steyn - My frontline opening strike bowler. With 272 wickets at 23s and taking a wicket every 41 balls, Dale is devastating, and bar any serious injuries will certainly surpass other SA fast bowling greats to become the best from SA. He can swing the ball both ways, and lift his pace to 150clicks when needed. His accuracy is his strongest feat.
10. Rangana Herath – Rangana has taken 146 wickets at 31s as a left arm orthodox spinner with a ball ‘that goes the other way’. Well capable of being the lead strike bowler on a turning and slow wicket as well as holding an end for long spells, he’s a great spin option. He’s shown that he can bowl a side out in the last innings on a fading pitch. He’s no mug with the bat either having 80 n.o. as his highest score.
11. Ian Bishop – The teams other main opening strike bowler, Bishop took 161 wickets at 24s and strike rate of 52. With a high side on action, he had pace and could move the ball of the seam. He got steep bounce from just back of a length and could really upset batsmen. Unfortunately for him, his career was cut short with injuries, else we’d be talking of the great trio of Walsh, Ambrose and Bishop today.
12th man: Paul Strang over since he's an agile fielder
Strengths:
Arguably the best pace attack in the draft with Steyn, Bishop and Lee supplemented with Bresnan. Herath is a decent spinning option who can take wickets on a turning pitch as well as hold an end with long spells to allow me to rotate the quicks. Symonds can assist if need be but I don't foresee the need. My opening batting pair is solid and proven openers at test level, especially Wessels who's record shows that he could face the fiercest pace attacks in the world. The middle order oozes class with Amla, Khan and Samaraweera. Amla has been scoring runs for fun against all kinds of attacks since 2009 at averages of 60. Khan is a fighter, an accumulator and provides valuable leadership to assist Wessels with captaincy issues. Thilan can occupy the crease for long periods and shows sheer grit when bats. He along with Khan have been shown to be masters of batting with the tail.
And to stop the blatant lying that's been going in some matches (
) I will post what I perceive my weaknesses to be.Weaknesses:
I concede, Dilshan as WK is a liability. I admit I thought he played more as wk in tests. However, he's a very agile fielder and I have great slip fielders in the likes of Wessels, Khan and co to make up for any mishaps. Also, I do know Bresnan is a risk as he's not played that much, but I do believe he can add to the team. He's not meant to be a striker bowler, just a stock bowler and he can hold his bat just fine.
I will comment on crappy's team once I see it.
....
Will make the thread around730 pm IST.
My write up is ready, and can be posted whenever my game is up.
Hey no poll yet?
KM - If you're busy, someone could start the thread and you could add the poll later. We should try and get all the Quarters done this week so we can have the Semis and the Final next week.
It'll have been a long fecking haul. A month since we started already and a couple of weeks to go before we're done.
KM - If you're busy, someone could start the thread and you could add the poll later. We should try and get all the Quarters done this week so we can have the Semis and the Final next week.
It'll have been a long fecking haul. A month since we started already and a couple of weeks to go before we're done.
So here we are then... to start with my lineup... not elaborating on each player, much.. but a long write up on my thoughts on the match.
1. Gary Kirsten - As solid as they come even of not a fancy or swashbuckling batsmen ala Vivs or Lara. If Germany had a proper cricket team, he would be in it given the efficient style of his batting. Was without any doubt SA's best batsmen before likes of Kallis arrived. Has 21 hundreds, first one to score a hundred against every test playing nation as well. Average of 45.34.
2. M. Hafeez - Simply an above average batsmen, in the side to provide a handy second spin option as the fifth bowler. Has an average of above 38. He has a solid enough technique to cope against any attack, but prone to mental lapses. As a bowler coming into his own as well over the last year.
3. Dravid (vc) - errrrr
4. Martin Crowe (c) - A smart cricketer, who is credited with introducing the cricket world to concepts such as pinch-hitters. That's just a value addition given he averages 45.77 as a batsman and is a former wisden cricketer of the year. Interestingly averages above 66 in Australia. Captain of the team, and his record in 16 tests as captain improves some bounds as well
5. Daryl Cullinan- If not for Dravid, would be batting at no.3 probably. Another supremely solid batsmen. Seems to be a forgotten one as well given he his understated style. Average of44.21
6. Misbah-ul-Haq- Arrived on the cricket scene with his heroics (or near heroics) in the first T20 WC. Has been one of the most solid Pak batsmen since then. Averages above 45. Also has shown good experience batting with tail-enders, which will be handy at no.6 position.
7. Chris Cairns - One of my fav crickters. Better all-rounder than Flintoff for my money. Batting average above 33 with 5 hundreds and a bowling average of 29.40, better than many of the other strike bowlers in this draft. Has 13 5-wickets haul to his name as well. Contender for the best third pace bowler in any team on this draft IMO.
8. Adam Parore(wk)- Wicketkeeper. Averages above 26 with the bat, with 2 hundreds and 14 fifties to his name. Not good enough to out bat an attack on his own but should provide good support to the batsmen above him. Holds the NZ record for most WK dismissals so a very safe keeper to have. Something that is being bizarrely overlooked in this competition. Your bowlers are going to suffer if your keeper keeps spilling stuff.
9. Murali- errr
10. C. Walsh- errr
11. Aldermann- Ah.. my sole controversial pick perhaps. Never saw him play but then we had to pick players who debuted after 1980. And I am sure many of the younger ones here picked some 90s players solely by their reputation, having never seen them play much. So I only am going to post his record here.. Average of 27.15, strike rate of 59.8, 170 wickets in 41 tests. Took 9 wickets on his debut, 42 wickets against England in his debut series! Wisden cricketer of the year in 82. His record would be better if not for a ban for playing in SA during apartheid period. Even after that ban, he came back and took 41 wickets in a series against Eng. All time leading wicket taker for Western Oz with 956 first class wickets. To give a taste of his bowling -
12th man- S. Macgill- I am one of those who believe if not for Warne, Macgill would have been the premier Oz spinner and would have been counted as one of the best to play the game. But alas, life is never fair, he was destined to live in the shadow of Warne and go down as a forgotten cricketer. Great turner of the ball and as a leg spinner would trouble many a batsmen. Bowling average of 29.02, strike rate of 54(better than Warne's!) One of his best bowling performances
My batting vs. his bowling
Going by average his middle order may seem better but I will choose mine. Crowe over Khan and Cullinan over Samarweera every time for me. They played better bowlers in their time in conditions which suited bowling much more than now. Opening wise it is probably one each and Dilshan is more reliable than Hafeez but opening after keeping which is not his forte anyway? Might as well count him out IMO
Bowling wise he has Steyn, I have Walsh.. I have Murali, he has Hearth.. even Macgill > Hearth. His second pacer Lee is better than Cairns though stats below suggest the gap is very narrow.
He will be relying purely on his pace attack trio to get wickets against me. Worth pointing out that match is supposed to take place at Eden Gardens, Kolkatta. Even if we don't assume it to have a generic Indian pitch, it is fair to say you will need at least one top quality spinner to get wickets in the second innings.
Quality of pacers Kirsten, Dravid, Crowe, Cullinan faced: Walsh, Ambrose, Mcgrath, Akram, Younis, Donald, Pollock, Gillespie, Akhtar (In case of Crowe- Marshall, Holding, Lille, Garner etc. )
Lee and Bishop belong at the end of that list, Steyn probably in the middle. I am not saying my batting order will just blunt his attack but that they have proven over the course of their career that they can negotiate superior quality than these three. And once the top order does weather the storm, he has no back up to rattle the middle. He will essentially be waiting for the second new ball.
Cairns as a batsmen is a great option at no.7, if situation demands he can move up the order to quicken the scoring as well. Parore at 8 is more than good enough with 2 centuries and 14 fifties. After that it is the tail.
My bowling vs his batting
I think Walsh would dislodge Dilshan pretty quickly. Especially if, he is batting after having kept already. If his middle order gets exposed to Walsh early on.. it won’t be pretty...
Amla is a tougher cookie to crack, I do agree with Stretch that he is batting himself to greatness, nowhere near yet close to the class of Dravid mind. But his record against Murali is not good. His average against Lanka is 26.. with Murali dismissing him twice out of 4 innings he had against him. Amla in his short career so far has not gotten the chance to prove himself against spinner of supreme quality like Murali. I don't think you can bank on him surviving against Murali at his peak.
Younis and Samaweera will be two players I guess, he will rely on to tackle Murali. Khan is an accomplished player of spin, no question about it. But if you are going to bank on anyone to come out on top against good players of spin, then who better than one of the two best spinners of all time. Highest wicket taker ever aswell. Of course Walsh will always be about to have a go at these two too.
Symonds at 6 for me is a poor option to have in tests. He is simply not reliable enough to perform. He could not even prove himself in tests when he got the opportunity to play in a great team like Oz who had many an inferior opponents to toy with. I see zero reason to believe he would have any impact in this game what so ever. After that it is tail really, Bresnan and Lee can try to hit out and get some runs at best. Won't be easy to do so against Murali anyway
So far I have concentrated on Murali and Walsh. But someone oddly getting undervalued as a bowler is Chris Cairns.
Here is a comparison between Cairns and Lee
Now I don't believe in blindly following the stats so yeah I will have Lee at his pomp over Cairns as far as bowling goes (overall Cairns everytime). But Cairns was no mug with the ball as proven by these stats. Some people oddly discounted him as feeble fifth bowler in my last match when in reality he is better than my second pacers picked by people in this draft!
Hafeez as a fifth bowler: Thos who have watched him over last two years know that he is come to the fore as a bowler only since then. In his last 16 matches starting from 2011, he has 23 wickets at an average of 25.43. Yes that is not enough stats but you have people selecting players who have played 15 matches in all during their career. In any case role I define for a fifth bowler is to bowl around 6-8 overs per innings, maximum of 10 if needed. More if he gets breakthroughs. Hafeez is more than capable of playing that role.
I am not going to say much about Aldermann or Macgill. With the former, you have to take the stats on faith, it is up to people to do that or not. I would point out that many people picked players in this draft based on stats having not seen them. With Macgill, if you rated him as a spinner or not. I most definitely did think he was good enough to play for any top test nation. Not in the class of Murali or Warne and even Kumble, Saqlain were better than him. But his peak level was close to what Swann does now days. I know that I would happily have a spinner like him in the current Indian test team.
Finally, I want to highlight his main weakness. The keeping. I think it is a bit baffling how people are underrating the role of a specialist keeper in test matches. Again limited over matches seems to have affected the mind set here. I could have also committed hara-kiri and used Dravid as a keeper, who is actually more of a proven keeper than Dilshan, but that would have been insane.
Dilshan has kept in 3 test matches and 3 ODIs. Another thing worth noting- his batting average as a keeper goes down to 28. Also keeping and then opening the batting is going to hamper him as a batsmen even more. I don't think he will have any kind of impact as a keeper or batsmen in this game
To sum up:
• Batting wise at best it is even, though I would pick my line up over his anytime
• I have one of the best spinners of all time in Murali, he has no quality spin option
• His keeper is a liability, especially since he will have to contend with Steyn, Lee and Bishop. I have a specialist keeper with plenty of experience under his belt
1. Gary Kirsten - As solid as they come even of not a fancy or swashbuckling batsmen ala Vivs or Lara. If Germany had a proper cricket team, he would be in it given the efficient style of his batting. Was without any doubt SA's best batsmen before likes of Kallis arrived. Has 21 hundreds, first one to score a hundred against every test playing nation as well. Average of 45.34.
2. M. Hafeez - Simply an above average batsmen, in the side to provide a handy second spin option as the fifth bowler. Has an average of above 38. He has a solid enough technique to cope against any attack, but prone to mental lapses. As a bowler coming into his own as well over the last year.
3. Dravid (vc) - errrrr
4. Martin Crowe (c) - A smart cricketer, who is credited with introducing the cricket world to concepts such as pinch-hitters. That's just a value addition given he averages 45.77 as a batsman and is a former wisden cricketer of the year. Interestingly averages above 66 in Australia. Captain of the team, and his record in 16 tests as captain improves some bounds as well
5. Daryl Cullinan- If not for Dravid, would be batting at no.3 probably. Another supremely solid batsmen. Seems to be a forgotten one as well given he his understated style. Average of44.21
6. Misbah-ul-Haq- Arrived on the cricket scene with his heroics (or near heroics) in the first T20 WC. Has been one of the most solid Pak batsmen since then. Averages above 45. Also has shown good experience batting with tail-enders, which will be handy at no.6 position.
7. Chris Cairns - One of my fav crickters. Better all-rounder than Flintoff for my money. Batting average above 33 with 5 hundreds and a bowling average of 29.40, better than many of the other strike bowlers in this draft. Has 13 5-wickets haul to his name as well. Contender for the best third pace bowler in any team on this draft IMO.
8. Adam Parore(wk)- Wicketkeeper. Averages above 26 with the bat, with 2 hundreds and 14 fifties to his name. Not good enough to out bat an attack on his own but should provide good support to the batsmen above him. Holds the NZ record for most WK dismissals so a very safe keeper to have. Something that is being bizarrely overlooked in this competition. Your bowlers are going to suffer if your keeper keeps spilling stuff.
9. Murali- errr
10. C. Walsh- errr
11. Aldermann- Ah.. my sole controversial pick perhaps. Never saw him play but then we had to pick players who debuted after 1980. And I am sure many of the younger ones here picked some 90s players solely by their reputation, having never seen them play much. So I only am going to post his record here.. Average of 27.15, strike rate of 59.8, 170 wickets in 41 tests. Took 9 wickets on his debut, 42 wickets against England in his debut series! Wisden cricketer of the year in 82. His record would be better if not for a ban for playing in SA during apartheid period. Even after that ban, he came back and took 41 wickets in a series against Eng. All time leading wicket taker for Western Oz with 956 first class wickets. To give a taste of his bowling -
12th man- S. Macgill- I am one of those who believe if not for Warne, Macgill would have been the premier Oz spinner and would have been counted as one of the best to play the game. But alas, life is never fair, he was destined to live in the shadow of Warne and go down as a forgotten cricketer. Great turner of the ball and as a leg spinner would trouble many a batsmen. Bowling average of 29.02, strike rate of 54(better than Warne's!) One of his best bowling performances
My batting vs. his bowling
Going by average his middle order may seem better but I will choose mine. Crowe over Khan and Cullinan over Samarweera every time for me. They played better bowlers in their time in conditions which suited bowling much more than now. Opening wise it is probably one each and Dilshan is more reliable than Hafeez but opening after keeping which is not his forte anyway? Might as well count him out IMO
Bowling wise he has Steyn, I have Walsh.. I have Murali, he has Hearth.. even Macgill > Hearth. His second pacer Lee is better than Cairns though stats below suggest the gap is very narrow.
He will be relying purely on his pace attack trio to get wickets against me. Worth pointing out that match is supposed to take place at Eden Gardens, Kolkatta. Even if we don't assume it to have a generic Indian pitch, it is fair to say you will need at least one top quality spinner to get wickets in the second innings.
Quality of pacers Kirsten, Dravid, Crowe, Cullinan faced: Walsh, Ambrose, Mcgrath, Akram, Younis, Donald, Pollock, Gillespie, Akhtar (In case of Crowe- Marshall, Holding, Lille, Garner etc. )
Lee and Bishop belong at the end of that list, Steyn probably in the middle. I am not saying my batting order will just blunt his attack but that they have proven over the course of their career that they can negotiate superior quality than these three. And once the top order does weather the storm, he has no back up to rattle the middle. He will essentially be waiting for the second new ball.
Cairns as a batsmen is a great option at no.7, if situation demands he can move up the order to quicken the scoring as well. Parore at 8 is more than good enough with 2 centuries and 14 fifties. After that it is the tail.
My bowling vs his batting
I think Walsh would dislodge Dilshan pretty quickly. Especially if, he is batting after having kept already. If his middle order gets exposed to Walsh early on.. it won’t be pretty...
Amla is a tougher cookie to crack, I do agree with Stretch that he is batting himself to greatness, nowhere near yet close to the class of Dravid mind. But his record against Murali is not good. His average against Lanka is 26.. with Murali dismissing him twice out of 4 innings he had against him. Amla in his short career so far has not gotten the chance to prove himself against spinner of supreme quality like Murali. I don't think you can bank on him surviving against Murali at his peak.
Younis and Samaweera will be two players I guess, he will rely on to tackle Murali. Khan is an accomplished player of spin, no question about it. But if you are going to bank on anyone to come out on top against good players of spin, then who better than one of the two best spinners of all time. Highest wicket taker ever aswell. Of course Walsh will always be about to have a go at these two too.
Symonds at 6 for me is a poor option to have in tests. He is simply not reliable enough to perform. He could not even prove himself in tests when he got the opportunity to play in a great team like Oz who had many an inferior opponents to toy with. I see zero reason to believe he would have any impact in this game what so ever. After that it is tail really, Bresnan and Lee can try to hit out and get some runs at best. Won't be easy to do so against Murali anyway
So far I have concentrated on Murali and Walsh. But someone oddly getting undervalued as a bowler is Chris Cairns.
Here is a comparison between Cairns and Lee
Now I don't believe in blindly following the stats so yeah I will have Lee at his pomp over Cairns as far as bowling goes (overall Cairns everytime). But Cairns was no mug with the ball as proven by these stats. Some people oddly discounted him as feeble fifth bowler in my last match when in reality he is better than my second pacers picked by people in this draft!
Hafeez as a fifth bowler: Thos who have watched him over last two years know that he is come to the fore as a bowler only since then. In his last 16 matches starting from 2011, he has 23 wickets at an average of 25.43. Yes that is not enough stats but you have people selecting players who have played 15 matches in all during their career. In any case role I define for a fifth bowler is to bowl around 6-8 overs per innings, maximum of 10 if needed. More if he gets breakthroughs. Hafeez is more than capable of playing that role.
I am not going to say much about Aldermann or Macgill. With the former, you have to take the stats on faith, it is up to people to do that or not. I would point out that many people picked players in this draft based on stats having not seen them. With Macgill, if you rated him as a spinner or not. I most definitely did think he was good enough to play for any top test nation. Not in the class of Murali or Warne and even Kumble, Saqlain were better than him. But his peak level was close to what Swann does now days. I know that I would happily have a spinner like him in the current Indian test team.
Finally, I want to highlight his main weakness. The keeping. I think it is a bit baffling how people are underrating the role of a specialist keeper in test matches. Again limited over matches seems to have affected the mind set here. I could have also committed hara-kiri and used Dravid as a keeper, who is actually more of a proven keeper than Dilshan, but that would have been insane.
Dilshan has kept in 3 test matches and 3 ODIs. Another thing worth noting- his batting average as a keeper goes down to 28. Also keeping and then opening the batting is going to hamper him as a batsmen even more. I don't think he will have any kind of impact as a keeper or batsmen in this game
To sum up:
• Batting wise at best it is even, though I would pick my line up over his anytime
• I have one of the best spinners of all time in Murali, he has no quality spin option
• His keeper is a liability, especially since he will have to contend with Steyn, Lee and Bishop. I have a specialist keeper with plenty of experience under his belt
...
Right I'm starting this off. I'll PM KM to add a poll.
Sorry lads I dozed off. The match thread is made. Let the best team win!@
I decided to pick players who make my squad a balanced, fighting unit, because I believe a great Test team requires that balance, and compromising on a spot like opening or the middle order or the strike bowling option in lieu of the other can be quite detrimental.
The addition of Vettori in the last round has given Hansie a top quality spinner to add to his already talented pace attack. My team will be attacking from the word go, in all departments. I bat till 8 with a variety of players in my team, the attacking sort, the staid, partnership builders, the flamboyant, the ruthless, the gritty. Personally, I would've loved to see this team bat.
The bowling is very balanced with Amir included...Donald and McDermott complement each other brilliantly, and Amir provides raw talent with good pace and a bag of tricks in his armoury. Vettori's can provide a masterclass of left handed spin bowling at his peak, and can chug along without getting too tired over sessions. Hansie provides invaluable support, as do Waugh and Hooper.
I'd rather not get into a slating match, so I will reserve my comments on IL's team as responses.
My team,
Saeed Anwar - One of the most elegant strokeplayers of the 90s along with Lara and Waugh. Anwar was capable of single-handedly changing the nature of a game. With no evident weaknesses against the pacers or the spinners and with his wide range of shots, Anwar was, for a time regarded as one of the best in the business along with Sachin. An average of 50 while opening in Tests (it's 45 overall after his failed experiments in the middle order) make him one of the best openers for Pakistan in the last 20 odd years.
Michael Atherton - To complement Anwar's free stroke-playing abaility, I have the dour, dogged Atherton, England's captain at 25, scorer of 16 centuries. His average of 41 batting at number 2 doesn't do him complete justice, but he made his name as the best batsman of the 90s for England. A determined 98 against a fuming Donald and co remains one of the most memorable innings of late. Excellent slip fielder.
Kumar Sangakkara (WK) - Possibly among the greatest number 3's of all time, with 30 centuries (8 double centuries), an average of 56 overall (almost 70 at number 3), centuries against every test playing nation, and to top that, each of his highest scores against those nations is 150+. When he gets past that piddly 100 mark, Sangakkara makes it count. And all this at a relatively pacy average SR of 54. An excellent captain and strategist to boot. 168 catches, 20 stumpings.
Mark Waugh - I love my team, and I love it purely because the sight of Mark Waugh walking nonchalantly out to bat, collars up and fluttering was possibly one of the greatest sights while growing up watching cricket. A peerless stroke player, he could make batting looking absolutely effortless. With no apparent weaknesses against spin or pace, he was one of the triumvirate which battled it out for the 'Best Current Batsman' title (largely in my head) along with Anwar and Sachin.
A vital part of the great Aussie teams under Taylor and Waugh, Mark enjoyed a healthy average of 50 (career average of 42), with 6 centuries, against an England team almost always comprising of Fraser and Gough. Waugh was also a handy offspinner(59 wickets, best bowling of 5/40), and amongst the best slip fielders ever, with 181 catches.
Kevin Pietersen - One of the most dangerous batsmen in the modern game, Pietersen is yet another player in my team capable of turning a game on its head. With 21 centuries in 89 matches, and a strike rate of 63, Pietersen can give middle order that impetus when he walks in at 300 or 400-3. A safe fielder, and less than decent bowler. His Test average in nearly 50 and looks set to improve as he finally looks to be coming into his own as a premier batsman of our time. 3 Saffers and only one Englishman will make him feel right at home in my team.
Carl Hooper - Coming in at number 6, Hooper is another of my favourites from the 90s and a splendid option to have in the middle order. A calm, level headed player capable of ripping the best spinners apart when in the mood, Hooper has a highest score of 233 and 13 centuries in Test cricket, but probably did not do full justice to his batting as his career average of 36 odd suggests. Towards to latter stages of his career, however, his average takes a massive jump to 50.
In 102 matches, Hooper, with his languid, measured action, took 114 wickets, with 4 five-fors. He, along with Waugh would provide my spinning options. Another excellent slipper with 115 catches.
Hansie Cronje (C) - At 7, he is a position below where he or I would like him to be, but Hansie, as a captain and cricketer showed more than enough drive and ruthlessness to care more about the good of the team, until that fateful day in 1999-00. A number 7 with an average of 36, 6 centuries, and a bowling average of 29. Captain at 24, Hansie led SA to 27 victories and 11 losses in 53 tests, an outstanding record. Fantastic player of spin and pace and excellent fielder.
Daniel Vettori - Vettori's boyish innocence can mask the wily and crafty customer that he usually is with the ball. I think he's class, and has had to take a large burden of responsibility in a usually toothless NZ bowling attack. 360 wickets, with 20 five fors and 3 ten fors. Has a batting average of nearly 40 at number 8, with 6 centuries in Test cricket.
Mohammed Amir - I won't even pretend this is anything other than a punt, and a consequence of the fact that this left handed pacer got me genuinely excited about cricket after a long period of dissonance. You get a gut feel about some players when you first see them. Notwithstanding the media attention on them, there are some who are genuinely worth that scrutiny. I fully believed this kid was one of them. Fantastic control on swing and pace, and that innate ability only the great bowlers have of making the ball follow their will. 3 five fors and 2 four wicket hauls in an innings in an admittedly short 14 Test Career.
Craig McDermott - He virtually carried the Aussie bowling for a time in the late 80s and early 90s. For a bowler plagued with injuries, it could be expected that he would have a loss in form or a drop in statistics, as it were. However, McDermott boasts quite outstanding figures for his time, 30 wickets in his first 6 Tests, 291 overall in 71 tests, with 14 five fors and 2 ten wicket hauls. Classic outswing bowler with immense experience, he's capable of taking on a larger burden of the bowling to complement Donald's attacking bursts.
Allan Donald - Few sights were as exciting in the 90s than of Allan Donald steaming in, sunscreen smeared like warpaint, cheeks puffed out, stretching every muscle in his body to hurl it with hostile, fearsome pace at a quaking batsman.With 330 wickets in 72 matches, he boasts the 5th best strike rate, 47.0, in the modern era (minimum 20 Tests), has a stupendous average of 22, and was regularly out-thinking the great batsmen of his time.
12th Man
Lance Klusener - I remember watching that match in Kolkata (?) when he took an 8 for on debut with his direct, attacking, two-length bowling. Injuries in later years meant that he added subtle variations and guile, which got him 80 wickets in 49 matches. A gutsy, committed cricketer, he was one of the most feared hitters in international cricket for a time. A batting average of 32, with 4 centuries for my number 9. To be honest, I hadn't even factored in Lance's outstanding 174 (after coming in at 153/5) against England when I picked him.
13th Man
Yuvraj Singh - Will field well and run quickly onto the field with the water bottle.
The addition of Vettori in the last round has given Hansie a top quality spinner to add to his already talented pace attack. My team will be attacking from the word go, in all departments. I bat till 8 with a variety of players in my team, the attacking sort, the staid, partnership builders, the flamboyant, the ruthless, the gritty. Personally, I would've loved to see this team bat.
The bowling is very balanced with Amir included...Donald and McDermott complement each other brilliantly, and Amir provides raw talent with good pace and a bag of tricks in his armoury. Vettori's can provide a masterclass of left handed spin bowling at his peak, and can chug along without getting too tired over sessions. Hansie provides invaluable support, as do Waugh and Hooper.
I'd rather not get into a slating match, so I will reserve my comments on IL's team as responses.
My team,
Saeed Anwar - One of the most elegant strokeplayers of the 90s along with Lara and Waugh. Anwar was capable of single-handedly changing the nature of a game. With no evident weaknesses against the pacers or the spinners and with his wide range of shots, Anwar was, for a time regarded as one of the best in the business along with Sachin. An average of 50 while opening in Tests (it's 45 overall after his failed experiments in the middle order) make him one of the best openers for Pakistan in the last 20 odd years.
Michael Atherton - To complement Anwar's free stroke-playing abaility, I have the dour, dogged Atherton, England's captain at 25, scorer of 16 centuries. His average of 41 batting at number 2 doesn't do him complete justice, but he made his name as the best batsman of the 90s for England. A determined 98 against a fuming Donald and co remains one of the most memorable innings of late. Excellent slip fielder.
Kumar Sangakkara (WK) - Possibly among the greatest number 3's of all time, with 30 centuries (8 double centuries), an average of 56 overall (almost 70 at number 3), centuries against every test playing nation, and to top that, each of his highest scores against those nations is 150+. When he gets past that piddly 100 mark, Sangakkara makes it count. And all this at a relatively pacy average SR of 54. An excellent captain and strategist to boot. 168 catches, 20 stumpings.
Mark Waugh - I love my team, and I love it purely because the sight of Mark Waugh walking nonchalantly out to bat, collars up and fluttering was possibly one of the greatest sights while growing up watching cricket. A peerless stroke player, he could make batting looking absolutely effortless. With no apparent weaknesses against spin or pace, he was one of the triumvirate which battled it out for the 'Best Current Batsman' title (largely in my head) along with Anwar and Sachin.
A vital part of the great Aussie teams under Taylor and Waugh, Mark enjoyed a healthy average of 50 (career average of 42), with 6 centuries, against an England team almost always comprising of Fraser and Gough. Waugh was also a handy offspinner(59 wickets, best bowling of 5/40), and amongst the best slip fielders ever, with 181 catches.
Kevin Pietersen - One of the most dangerous batsmen in the modern game, Pietersen is yet another player in my team capable of turning a game on its head. With 21 centuries in 89 matches, and a strike rate of 63, Pietersen can give middle order that impetus when he walks in at 300 or 400-3. A safe fielder, and less than decent bowler. His Test average in nearly 50 and looks set to improve as he finally looks to be coming into his own as a premier batsman of our time. 3 Saffers and only one Englishman will make him feel right at home in my team.
Carl Hooper - Coming in at number 6, Hooper is another of my favourites from the 90s and a splendid option to have in the middle order. A calm, level headed player capable of ripping the best spinners apart when in the mood, Hooper has a highest score of 233 and 13 centuries in Test cricket, but probably did not do full justice to his batting as his career average of 36 odd suggests. Towards to latter stages of his career, however, his average takes a massive jump to 50.
In 102 matches, Hooper, with his languid, measured action, took 114 wickets, with 4 five-fors. He, along with Waugh would provide my spinning options. Another excellent slipper with 115 catches.
Hansie Cronje (C) - At 7, he is a position below where he or I would like him to be, but Hansie, as a captain and cricketer showed more than enough drive and ruthlessness to care more about the good of the team, until that fateful day in 1999-00. A number 7 with an average of 36, 6 centuries, and a bowling average of 29. Captain at 24, Hansie led SA to 27 victories and 11 losses in 53 tests, an outstanding record. Fantastic player of spin and pace and excellent fielder.
Daniel Vettori - Vettori's boyish innocence can mask the wily and crafty customer that he usually is with the ball. I think he's class, and has had to take a large burden of responsibility in a usually toothless NZ bowling attack. 360 wickets, with 20 five fors and 3 ten fors. Has a batting average of nearly 40 at number 8, with 6 centuries in Test cricket.
Mohammed Amir - I won't even pretend this is anything other than a punt, and a consequence of the fact that this left handed pacer got me genuinely excited about cricket after a long period of dissonance. You get a gut feel about some players when you first see them. Notwithstanding the media attention on them, there are some who are genuinely worth that scrutiny. I fully believed this kid was one of them. Fantastic control on swing and pace, and that innate ability only the great bowlers have of making the ball follow their will. 3 five fors and 2 four wicket hauls in an innings in an admittedly short 14 Test Career.
Craig McDermott - He virtually carried the Aussie bowling for a time in the late 80s and early 90s. For a bowler plagued with injuries, it could be expected that he would have a loss in form or a drop in statistics, as it were. However, McDermott boasts quite outstanding figures for his time, 30 wickets in his first 6 Tests, 291 overall in 71 tests, with 14 five fors and 2 ten wicket hauls. Classic outswing bowler with immense experience, he's capable of taking on a larger burden of the bowling to complement Donald's attacking bursts.
Allan Donald - Few sights were as exciting in the 90s than of Allan Donald steaming in, sunscreen smeared like warpaint, cheeks puffed out, stretching every muscle in his body to hurl it with hostile, fearsome pace at a quaking batsman.With 330 wickets in 72 matches, he boasts the 5th best strike rate, 47.0, in the modern era (minimum 20 Tests), has a stupendous average of 22, and was regularly out-thinking the great batsmen of his time.
12th Man
Lance Klusener - I remember watching that match in Kolkata (?) when he took an 8 for on debut with his direct, attacking, two-length bowling. Injuries in later years meant that he added subtle variations and guile, which got him 80 wickets in 49 matches. A gutsy, committed cricketer, he was one of the most feared hitters in international cricket for a time. A batting average of 32, with 4 centuries for my number 9. To be honest, I hadn't even factored in Lance's outstanding 174 (after coming in at 153/5) against England when I picked him.
13th Man
Yuvraj Singh - Will field well and run quickly onto the field with the water bottle.
You've got 4 Saffers in your team. Change the first XI.