Yeah it is.Keane16 said:
red bull buys jag
- Thread starter Rat
- Start date
What is with you always asking if i live on a farm? Your just been ignorant and annoying, as ive allready told you the answers NO.
Dave_B said:
Seeing as I expained that it clearly isn't the same thing - why don't you explain why it is?
miley_bob said:
Well, the farm thing is a reference to your name, which you don't understand, but I thought you might - don't worry about it.
As for being ignorant and annoying, well, actually I think I make pretty good points about Coulthard, where as you just roll out the soundbites about him being a 'good driver' and 'deserves a race seat' and then get a bit stroppy when I don't fully agree. Which is fair enough if thats what you want to do, but you're not covering yourself in glory. I always thought DC should have joined Red Bull, even before he started making a fool of himself at Williams, but he's not the sun and the moon. He'll do an adequate job, some may even harp on about him having a new lease of life at Red Bull, buts thats all waffle. His driving career just got a temporary stay of execution with low level team, that's it.
I admit he's been losing it over the last few years, but it doesnt mean that he cant turn things around. Id like to see him do well thats all. And looking back at my DC thread, it was you that seemed to be making dorogitory remarks about him, and posting stupid immature adverts on the thread. Thats why i get annoyed, not because you dont agree with me
Those advertisements were class! I can't believe you have a problem with them. I bet even DC could have a snigger at those.
You really are the biggest ignoramous on this forum.....Football & F1.....2 sports yes...with me so far?Keane16 said:
Jaguar.....team you supported in F1
Manchester United.....team you support in Football
you now kind of understanding how they are simular & very much a like?
He hasn't acheived more than Coulthard can you back it up with some stats??Keane16 said:
I think having won Le Mans, having a successful F1 career with (upto this point)10 GP victories, surviving a plane crash & winning your next GP with 3 broken ribs then I'm sure he can sit back & be happy with what he has acheived.
Keane16 said:
Yeah i'm sure he doesn't need that much convincing TBH with stats like Eddie's then I'm sure he is not worried about being the laughing stock cause his is hard to beat. No pole positions & having a championship winning Ferrari is a joke too far.
Oh & here's the stats for you.
Eddie's
http://www.4mula1.ro/history/driver.php/idd/795
David's
http://www.4mula1.ro/history/driver.php/idd/803
Dave_B said:
Oh dear....
MP4/19 said:
Achievements can be relative and the car you drive in motor racing and particularly F1 has a huge bearing on that. Fact is Eddie only had a car capable of winning races for four years - and in all but one of those years, it was capable of winning only in the hands of Michael Schumacher. He probably would have won Suzuka 1997 however, but thats another story - he was a definate number two at the time. Some of your stats are not quite right. I think Coulthard has won 13 F1 races in total over the years, rather than 10, and he certainly didn't win that race after the plane crash 'with 3 broken ribs', thats just gibberish.
MP4/19 said:Yeah i'm sure he doesn't need that much convincing TBH with stats like Eddie's then I'm sure he is not worried about being the laughing stock cause his is hard to beat. No pole positions & having a championship winning Ferrari is a joke too far.
Oh & here's the stats for you.
Eddie's
http://www.4mula1.ro/history/driver.php/idd/795
David's
http://www.4mula1.ro/history/driver.php/idd/803
Even McLaren thought Eddie was good enough to approach for Coulthard's seat in 2000, but Ron Denis thought Eddie's personality was a bit abrasive and couldn't really see him towing the corporate line at McLaren but he had no doubts about his driving abilities. Eddie had one realistic shot at winning the World Championship and but for idiocy and mistakes on the part of Ferrari, he would have. He still came closer than Coulthard ever will. Best not bring up the number of times that Coulthard has had a championship winning car.....
DC's had a decent career, but he has underachieved immensely given the machinery at his disposal. He's made too many high profile mistakes, been thrashed by successive team mates and been driving around anonymously in the midfield for far too long. I reckon the only reason he even had the drive this year, contracts or not, was because they couldn't buy out Montoya from Williams. He was chancing his arm at Williams and they saw through it. Teams like Williams and McLaren can't be carrying someone like that, they've got to have the best there is in every department. A one year deal at a low level team is about right, so long as he actually performs and brings them forward with his experience, which he should, but his days at the cutting edge of the grid are officially over now, although many would argue that that's been the case for a while.
Keane16 said:
Yeah sorry! He came second, it was a 1-2 for Mclaren which threw me off. Still driving a car that corners at 5 G's with 3 broken ribs is still some feat IMO.
Saying the Ferrari was only a capable winner in MS's hands just shows how completely owned he was by his teammate.
Keane16 said:
I remember that year when Eddie was trying to find a decent race seat & nobody would look at him apart from Jaguar. Shit doesn't that sound somehow familiar.
Keane16 said:
Again it's no more than what Eddie was trying to do with Mclaren, he knew there was no realistic chance of getting a seat but threw his name in anyway.
David Coulthard is a fast driver when he puts it all together, the problem has been that he hasn't been fast consistently. DC has one of the highest points totals in F1 & you don't get that from being poor.
Saying he underachieved with the machinery at his disposal is true, you've got to remember though, he was in a similar situation to what Eddie had at Ferrari. Hakkinen was no1 at Mclaren when he came & when Kimi came along, again he was looked upon as the no2 driver because Ron Dennis has a love affair with Finnish drivers. He still did IMO a better job than most in his situation based on how successful he has been.
You have your opinion of DC which your entitled to but there has to be a level of respect for him or any driver that has acheived some success at the highest level of motorsport. I give Eddie that for that alone, but that doesn't mean I dislike him any less (feckin arrogant ginger prick).
Anyways, I hope DC does well at Red Bull & I will look forward to seeing our new partnership of Montoya & Raikkonen in the MP4/20 next year.
Merry Xmas. :xmas-smil
The race after DC's plane crash, he did race with 3 broken ribs, but he finished second, just behind Hakkinen, to complete a Mclaren 1,2. And yes he has won 13 races, not 10.
Oh dear your arse.Keane16 said:
Isn't RedBull a Thai drink? No mention of the Thai co-owner?
Just wondering.
Just wondering.
Redbull is an Austrian drinks company. If youd have read all of the thread you would have realised this Kuanteen.
I don't know the details, but I'm fairly sure there is a Thai link alright, certainly in the actual drink and maybe in the finances as well. Something like the Austrian bloke went to Thailand on holidays and came away with the idea for the drink.....not sure about the co-owner business.
Shouldn't be too hard to find out.
Shouldn't be too hard to find out.
http://sport.guardian.co.uk/formulaone/theobserver/story/0,10541,1366960,00.html
How Red Bull woke up the teen market
It looks (and tastes) like medicine, but it still conquered the soft drinks trade. Now the edgy pick-me-up is moving into the grown-up world of motor racing. John Arlidge reports
Sunday December 5, 2004
The Observer
At this time of year fallen leaves shroud the carefully planned suburbs of Milton Keynes. Mist drifts in from the fields. The posh car firms - Mercedes, Volkswagen, Audi - whose UK head offices ring the Buckinghamshire town are gearing down for the winter. But last week the end-of-year gloom was lifted by the arrival of a most unlikely new inhabitant.
A bronzed and energetic Austrian, who has made a billion-pound fortune selling a drink that looks and tastes like medicine has just become the town's biggest private investor. Dietrich Mateschitz, 60, the owner of Red Bull, spent more than £60m buying up the Jaguar Formula One racing team. The thundering bull logo and 'Red Bull gives you wings' advertising slogan will replace the Jaguar logo on the wings of the silver F1 cars next year.
In a sport dominated by tobacco giants, banks and telecom multinationals, the arrival of the Austrian health entrepreneur has raised eyebrows. From Suzuka to Silverstone, everyone is gossiping about Herr Bull. How has he transformed a slim blue-and-silver can into a 200mph silver arrow? Is a mix of taurine, detoxicants, caffeine, sugar and vitamins any match for petrol? What makes Red Bull run and run?
The sugary drink was launched in the UK a decade ago. At that time no one had heard of an 'energy drink' and most people assumed Red Bull was a brand of Austrian lager. What has happened since has written a new chapter in drinks and marketing history and might be about to give F1 a much-need image boost.
Red Bull's journey to Milton Keynes started with toothpaste. Mateschitz worked in Bangkok, where he was international marketing director for Blendex, a German toothpaste-maker that is now part of Procter & Gamble. A Thai colleague, Chaleo Yoovidhya, sold a local tonic syrup called Krating Daeng - 'Red Bull'. Mateschitz tried it and was hooked. 'It cured my jet lag in seconds,' the reclusive billionaire recalls.
The idea of marketing it in Europe came to him when he read in a magazine that Taisho Pharmaceuticals, a producer of tonic drinks, was Japan's biggest corporate taxpayer. In the 1980s he quit his job and set up a company with Yoovidhya. They played around with the drink's formula, translated the name into English and applied for a licence to sell the brew in Germany and Austria.
Early taste tests were discouraging. 'Most people said it was disgusting and created a sticky mouth,' one former employee recalls. Bars initially refused to stock it, seeing it as a medicinal or health-related product, rather than a mixer.
But Mateschitz was convinced that it would be a hit with core youth groups. He guessed - correctly - that some clubbers wanted to dance all night without taking illegal drugs, such as ecstasy, and skiers and snow-boarders would enjoy enhanced performance, while hot bars would become even hotter when drinkers woke up to Red Bull as a vodka mixer.
To create a youth-oriented 'underground' feel for Red Bull, Mateschitz deliberately restricted supply and refused to advertise. He pioneered the now commonplace practice of 'viral' marketing - paying students, DJs and young opinion formers to host parties where the drink was served. The young of Austria caught the bug and, by the time the drink was launched in Germany in the early 1990s, it was so popular it sold out within days.
France and Norwway helped to bolster the drink's edgy image when they banned it on health grounds, following claims that too much caffeine could be damaging. When the drink was launched in Britain nine years ago, backed by whimsical TV advertisements claiming 'Red Bull gives you wings', this country soon became the drink's number one market.
Today, like alcopops 15 years ago, Red Bull has created a whole new drinks category. The health and energy drinks market is the fastest-growing sector of the burgeoning soft drinks market, doubling in size every year to reach £1.5bn last year. Red Bull is the market leader and its revenues rose 10 per cent to £1bn last year, on sales of 1.5bn cans. Vodka and Red Bull is still the most popular alcoholic drink for under-20s.
The pick-me-up's 'anti-brand brand' status explains its rapid success, argues Nirmalya Kumar, senior analyst at the London Business School. 'Red Bull has never done anything in a conventional way. It has not used normal advertising, nor marketing. When it sponsors events or sports, it tends to go for minority ones.'
While the no-logo generation is happy, the premium price on cans - more than £1, compared with 50p for Coke or Pepsi - has kept the money flowing in to the firm's Alpine HQ. But what is an irreverent Austrian doing in one of Britain's newest towns and why is he spending a fortune buying his way into a big-brand sport in crisis?
Frustrated by the dominance of business interests over sport and the continued dominance of Ferrari, some of the big F1 teams are threatening to leave the F1 circus and form a new competition. Some observers say Red Bull is keeping pace with its core market as it gets older. 'Formula One has the kind of dangerous, edgy, masculine image that suits Red Bull,' says Richard Hall, chairman of the drinks consultancy Zenith International. 'The early adopters who made it what it is and who are still a huge market do not go to clubs any more. They stay at home and watch TV on Sunday, so F1 is the perfect vehicle to reach them.' Others take a broader view. 'Red Bull is edgy and unpredictable - two qualities sorely lacking in modern day Formula One,' says Sean Pillot de Chenecey, a youth marketing analyst who has worked for Pepsi.
Can the mighty energy drink revive both itself and motor sport? For the past 10 years, Mateschitz has boosted sports ranging from wind-surfing to hang-gliding, but he will need all the verve that young partygoers seek from Red Bull if he is to transform F1. Whatever his motives for moving to grey, cold Milton Keynes last week, few would bet against a man who has taken a bubble-gum-flavoured caffeine drink and made it more profitable than Coca-Cola.
How Red Bull woke up the teen market
It looks (and tastes) like medicine, but it still conquered the soft drinks trade. Now the edgy pick-me-up is moving into the grown-up world of motor racing. John Arlidge reports
Sunday December 5, 2004
The Observer
At this time of year fallen leaves shroud the carefully planned suburbs of Milton Keynes. Mist drifts in from the fields. The posh car firms - Mercedes, Volkswagen, Audi - whose UK head offices ring the Buckinghamshire town are gearing down for the winter. But last week the end-of-year gloom was lifted by the arrival of a most unlikely new inhabitant.
A bronzed and energetic Austrian, who has made a billion-pound fortune selling a drink that looks and tastes like medicine has just become the town's biggest private investor. Dietrich Mateschitz, 60, the owner of Red Bull, spent more than £60m buying up the Jaguar Formula One racing team. The thundering bull logo and 'Red Bull gives you wings' advertising slogan will replace the Jaguar logo on the wings of the silver F1 cars next year.
In a sport dominated by tobacco giants, banks and telecom multinationals, the arrival of the Austrian health entrepreneur has raised eyebrows. From Suzuka to Silverstone, everyone is gossiping about Herr Bull. How has he transformed a slim blue-and-silver can into a 200mph silver arrow? Is a mix of taurine, detoxicants, caffeine, sugar and vitamins any match for petrol? What makes Red Bull run and run?
The sugary drink was launched in the UK a decade ago. At that time no one had heard of an 'energy drink' and most people assumed Red Bull was a brand of Austrian lager. What has happened since has written a new chapter in drinks and marketing history and might be about to give F1 a much-need image boost.
Red Bull's journey to Milton Keynes started with toothpaste. Mateschitz worked in Bangkok, where he was international marketing director for Blendex, a German toothpaste-maker that is now part of Procter & Gamble. A Thai colleague, Chaleo Yoovidhya, sold a local tonic syrup called Krating Daeng - 'Red Bull'. Mateschitz tried it and was hooked. 'It cured my jet lag in seconds,' the reclusive billionaire recalls.
The idea of marketing it in Europe came to him when he read in a magazine that Taisho Pharmaceuticals, a producer of tonic drinks, was Japan's biggest corporate taxpayer. In the 1980s he quit his job and set up a company with Yoovidhya. They played around with the drink's formula, translated the name into English and applied for a licence to sell the brew in Germany and Austria.
Early taste tests were discouraging. 'Most people said it was disgusting and created a sticky mouth,' one former employee recalls. Bars initially refused to stock it, seeing it as a medicinal or health-related product, rather than a mixer.
But Mateschitz was convinced that it would be a hit with core youth groups. He guessed - correctly - that some clubbers wanted to dance all night without taking illegal drugs, such as ecstasy, and skiers and snow-boarders would enjoy enhanced performance, while hot bars would become even hotter when drinkers woke up to Red Bull as a vodka mixer.
To create a youth-oriented 'underground' feel for Red Bull, Mateschitz deliberately restricted supply and refused to advertise. He pioneered the now commonplace practice of 'viral' marketing - paying students, DJs and young opinion formers to host parties where the drink was served. The young of Austria caught the bug and, by the time the drink was launched in Germany in the early 1990s, it was so popular it sold out within days.
France and Norwway helped to bolster the drink's edgy image when they banned it on health grounds, following claims that too much caffeine could be damaging. When the drink was launched in Britain nine years ago, backed by whimsical TV advertisements claiming 'Red Bull gives you wings', this country soon became the drink's number one market.
Today, like alcopops 15 years ago, Red Bull has created a whole new drinks category. The health and energy drinks market is the fastest-growing sector of the burgeoning soft drinks market, doubling in size every year to reach £1.5bn last year. Red Bull is the market leader and its revenues rose 10 per cent to £1bn last year, on sales of 1.5bn cans. Vodka and Red Bull is still the most popular alcoholic drink for under-20s.
The pick-me-up's 'anti-brand brand' status explains its rapid success, argues Nirmalya Kumar, senior analyst at the London Business School. 'Red Bull has never done anything in a conventional way. It has not used normal advertising, nor marketing. When it sponsors events or sports, it tends to go for minority ones.'
While the no-logo generation is happy, the premium price on cans - more than £1, compared with 50p for Coke or Pepsi - has kept the money flowing in to the firm's Alpine HQ. But what is an irreverent Austrian doing in one of Britain's newest towns and why is he spending a fortune buying his way into a big-brand sport in crisis?
Frustrated by the dominance of business interests over sport and the continued dominance of Ferrari, some of the big F1 teams are threatening to leave the F1 circus and form a new competition. Some observers say Red Bull is keeping pace with its core market as it gets older. 'Formula One has the kind of dangerous, edgy, masculine image that suits Red Bull,' says Richard Hall, chairman of the drinks consultancy Zenith International. 'The early adopters who made it what it is and who are still a huge market do not go to clubs any more. They stay at home and watch TV on Sunday, so F1 is the perfect vehicle to reach them.' Others take a broader view. 'Red Bull is edgy and unpredictable - two qualities sorely lacking in modern day Formula One,' says Sean Pillot de Chenecey, a youth marketing analyst who has worked for Pepsi.
Can the mighty energy drink revive both itself and motor sport? For the past 10 years, Mateschitz has boosted sports ranging from wind-surfing to hang-gliding, but he will need all the verve that young partygoers seek from Red Bull if he is to transform F1. Whatever his motives for moving to grey, cold Milton Keynes last week, few would bet against a man who has taken a bubble-gum-flavoured caffeine drink and made it more profitable than Coca-Cola.
Seems to be a clever marketeer.
But having a couple of Red Bull cars wallowing at the tail end of the field won't do much for the image. This season will be tough for them, midfield at best. As I said earlier, it's not just a case of going into Jaguar and carrying on as before - which was midfield anyway.
But having a couple of Red Bull cars wallowing at the tail end of the field won't do much for the image. This season will be tough for them, midfield at best. As I said earlier, it's not just a case of going into Jaguar and carrying on as before - which was midfield anyway.
kuanteen said:
So this bloke reckons that Red Bull's 'edgy and unpredictable' qualities are going to rub off on F1?
Are they going to refuel the cars with Red Bull and hope they take on human characteristics?
That bloke probably gets paid a fortune too.
Back to the soap opera.
The two top men in Red Bull have left. Tony Purnell and David Pitchforth have both left the company. Purnells departure was always on the cards in fairness, but the loss of Pitchforth leaves them without a technical director with less than 2 months to go before the start of the season. Christian Horner and Vitantonio Liuzzi have arrived though.
Next year will be a write-off for Red Bull unless they get their act together fairly sharpish.
The two top men in Red Bull have left. Tony Purnell and David Pitchforth have both left the company. Purnells departure was always on the cards in fairness, but the loss of Pitchforth leaves them without a technical director with less than 2 months to go before the start of the season. Christian Horner and Vitantonio Liuzzi have arrived though.
Next year will be a write-off for Red Bull unless they get their act together fairly sharpish.
Keane16 said:
Are you suggesting they sack DC before he's even had a race?
I am.
......expect Rod and Todd will be here soon with their high-pitched squeals about me being some kind of monster.