Real Madrid need to get ready for a terrible season | It’s happening

Peyroteo said:
The end of a generation or the end of a cycle... it’s clearly the case even if next year your starting eleven has 10 players from last year. Clear shift from the club, starting with Lopetegui coming in for Zidane, Ronaldo leaving and the transfer strategy.

Saying Zidane and Ronaldo leaving was their own decision is accurate but also deceiving, I don’t think I need to explain you why.

I didn’t make a link with Neymar coming in and Madrid not winning the CL, I said that you gave up on being properly prepared to win a 4th Champions League in a row to save up 300+ million for Neymar. If the club had wanted to you’d be starting next season with Zidane as manager, Ronaldo up top and Hazard, Eriksen or another top attacker added to the team.
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In Ronaldo's case it might be deceiving (I never say that though), but sorry, in Zidane's case it's not. There is nothing the club could do about that.

I would say that unless you know what the squad is going to look like for the next season, you basically base your case on Ronaldo parting at 33 years old and Madrid's concern with the future, which is frankly understandable after a very successful period since 2014. And until we know such squad the full back and goalkeeper positions are much stronger now than before.

Hazard was never going to sign with Benzema, Ronaldo and Bale ahead of him in the pecking order, neither Eriksen with Modric and Kroos ahead. The landscape you describe is dreamy but also unreal.

And what would you do with guys such as Isco or Asensio. Would you condemn them to be eternal bench warmers? Managing a squad is not as easy as filling them with world beaters. If Morata, Danilo or James left last season or Kovacic this season that's because good players want to play no matter where they are.

I can see where you are coming from. But at the end of the day, this is about a 33 year old player parting after having given his best years to your club. It's a breaking point due to his legendary status, but the situation is not as extreme and voluntary as you are making it out to be. The risk is present, with him staying (for a price), or leaving.

If you think worrying too much about the future is dangerous, I could also say the same about the other extreme. Only that I personally think that until proven wrong, the balance between being strong now and in years to come has been taken care of.
 
GatoLoco said:
In Ronaldo's case it might be deceiving (I never say that though), but sorry, in Zidane's case it's not. There is nothing the club could do about that.

I would say that unless you know what the squad is going to look like for the next season, you basically base your case on Ronaldo parting at 33 years old and Madrid's concern with the future, which is frankly understandable after a very successful period since 2014. And until we know such squad the full back and goalkeeper positions are much stronger now than before.

Hazard was never going to sign with Benzema, Ronaldo and Bale ahead of him in the pecking order, neither Eriksen with Modric and Kroos ahead. The landscape you describe is dreamy but also unreal.

And what would you do with guys such as Isco or Asensio. Would you condemn them to be eternal bench warmers? Managing a squad is not as easy as filling them with world beaters. If Morata, Danilo or James left last season or Kovacic this season that's because good players want to play no matter where they are.

I can see where you are coming from. But at the end of the day, this is about a 33 year old player parting after having given his best years to your club. It's a breaking point due to his legendary status, but the situation is not as extreme and voluntary as you are making it out to be. The risk is present, with him staying (for a price), or leaving.

If you think worrying too much about the future is dangerous, I could also say the same about the other extreme. Only that I personally think that until proven wrong, the balance between being strong now and in years to come has been taken care of.
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Fair enough, I just don’t believe that balance was achieved given how good the current team is and how unlikely it is for that to repeat itself. I also don’t believe the key players are close to being done despite their age. Ronaldo and Modric are 33 but I think they can keep it up. I’m not vouching for a strategy where you disregard the future, I thought Madrid were very stupid to not sign Mbappe last season and if Ronaldo stayed I thought you should have sold Bale and went all in for Hazard, both moves would have prepared for the future while taking advantage of the last years of that Zidane team. Lots of people saw last year’s first half of the season struggle as a sign that it was the end of a cycle, I see it as an unmotivated team that had just won the double and failed to have proper competition among the team in key areas.

It’s a complex situation and we’ll never know which was the best course to take but I really believe that things should have been handled a lot differently. Let’s agree to disagree :)
 
Peyroteo said:
Fair enough, I just don’t believe that balance was achieved given how good the current team is and how unlikely it is for that to repeat itself. I also don’t believe the key players are close to being done despite their age. Ronaldo and Modric are 33 but I think they can keep it up. I’m not vouching for a strategy where you disregard the future, I thought Madrid were very stupid to not sign Mbappe last season and if Ronaldo stayed I thought you should have sold Bale and went all in for Hazard, both moves would have prepared for the future while taking advantage of the last years of that Zidane team. Lots of people saw last year’s first half of the season struggle as a sign that it was the end of a cycle, I see it as an unmotivated team that had just won the double and failed to have proper competition among the team in key areas.

It’s a complex situation and we’ll never know which was the best course to take but I really believe that things should have been handled a lot differently. Let’s agree to disagree :)
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Let's say that Madrid end up signing a world class attacking midfielder (Hazard?) and a competent striker (Werner?, Icardi?, Cavani?). Would it look so bad then? Youngsters might not ben proven, but if you don't look good they end up leaving. That's why Casemiro, Asensio, Marcelo, Varane did stay in the end.
 
Peyroteo said:
Fair enough, I just don’t believe that balance was achieved given how good the current team is and how unlikely it is for that to repeat itself. I also don’t believe the key players are close to being done despite their age. Ronaldo and Modric are 33 but I think they can keep it up. I’m not vouching for a strategy where you disregard the future, I thought Madrid were very stupid to not sign Mbappe last season and if Ronaldo stayed I thought you should have sold Bale and went all in for Hazard, both moves would have prepared for the future while taking advantage of the last years of that Zidane team. Lots of people saw last year’s first half of the season struggle as a sign that it was the end of a cycle, I see it as an unmotivated team that had just won the double and failed to have proper competition among the team in key areas.

It’s a complex situation and we’ll never know which was the best course to take but I really believe that things should have been handled a lot differently. Let’s agree to disagree :)
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IMO it was the perfect timing. I think last year's CL was pretty weak. I doubt they would've won it if there had been a team like Bayern 2012-2014, Barca 2009-2012, United 2008-2009 or Atletico 2014 in the competition. Overall, Real Madrid still was the strongest team but it was more of a case of the one-eyed among the blind. Bayern probably played the best football in the tournament and dominated Real Madrid although their team was nowhere near as good as some years ago. IIRC it was a similar story with PSG which went out thanks to their inexperience, lack of battlehardedness and the Neymar injury. Juve also nearly eliminated RM and were the better team in the second leg. Madrid's success was based on a mix of absolute ruthlesness, extreme individual quality and dumb mistakes by the opposition (Ulreich, Rafinha, Karius) but as a team they were far from being as good as in the previous years. Not because their players became worse but if you have so much success it is clear that the absolute hunger, drive and determination drop a little bit. If you ask me, Zidane felt that he squeezed the last bit out of this squad and his methods had worn out so that decided to leave while still at the very top. He sort of went as a hero before staying long enough to become the villain. If that development had continued (and why wouldn't it if they had just went on with what they were doing?) there was no way RM and Zizou could've won it again.

For what it's worth, this team needed a breath of fresh air more than anything. Player for player, RM is still as good as any team out there. What they really needed was a wake up call so that their sleeping beauties recover their actual form again. I think that they could've used a striker and in the best case also a left winger, too, but they seem to believe that it is enough to trust the young generation in order to restart the competition for starting spots. We'll see how that turns out but IMO it would be the first clear managerial mistake in years to trust on Benzema recovering his scoring capabilities after being a choker in front of the goal for quite a while. However, the Zidane era came to an end because of natural causes, not artificial ones.
 
GatoLoco said:
Let's say that Madrid end up signing a world class attacking midfielder (Hazard?) and a competent striker (Werner?, Icardi?, Cavani?). Would it look so bad then? Youngsters might not ben proven, but if you don't look good they end up leaving. That's why Casemiro, Asensio, Marcelo, Varane did stay in the end.
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I’m saying all of this because I don’t believe you’ll make any signings until the window closes, especially in attack which means Madrid fans will spend all season praying that Bale doesn’t get injured. He might not get injured and lead you to a league title, but it’s still bad planning to not sign another forward nevertheless.

If you now signed Hazard and a top striker you’d have the best squad in the world. As it stands I don’t believe that’s the case.

When Casemiro, Asensio, Marcelo, Varane, etc. got their chance there was the right balance.. last season you brought in Theo Hernandez, Ceballos, Mayoral, Hakimi, Llorente, Vallejo, Vinicius Jr. and they played no part at all in a team that needed it after losing players in the summer (Pepe, Morata, James and Danilo). What happened last year in the league was a direct result from that transfer window and if you read my posts from then I was saying the same thing as the transfer window was still going on and everybody was down on Barcelona for losing Neymar and signing Paulinho for 40 million. I was so certain you’d sign Mbappe... it made too much sense for it not to happen and Perez still passed up on it.
 
Peyroteo said:
I’m saying all of this because I don’t believe you’ll make any signings until the window closes, especially in attack which means Madrid fans will spend all season praying that Bale doesn’t get injured. He might not get injured and lead you to a league title, but it’s still bad planning to not sign another forward nevertheless.

If you now signed Hazard and a top striker you’d have the best squad in the world. As it stands I don’t believe that’s the case.

When Casemiro, Asensio, Marcelo, Varane, etc. got their chance there was the right balance.. last season you brought in Theo Hernandez, Ceballos, Mayoral, Hakimi, Llorente, Vallejo, Vinicius Jr. and they played no part at all in a team that needed it after losing players in the summer (Pepe, Morata, James and Danilo). What happened last year in the league was a direct result from that transfer window and if you read my posts from then I was saying the same thing as the transfer window was still going on and everybody was down on Barcelona for losing Neymar and signing Paulinho for 40 million. I was so certain you’d sign Mbappe... it made too much sense for it not to happen and Perez still passed up on it.
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If they brought Hazard, they hurt the development of Ceballos, Isco, Asensio, Vinicius and possibly even Rodrygo. That's a 150+M signing that closes the door on almost 200M worth of transfer fees, from that point of view it makes total sense that Real Madrid are betting on the guys they already have.

Some of the guys you mention (Casemiro and Marcelo) got thrown into Real Madrid in a swim or sink manner, Casemiro first "real" season was as the only DM in the squad, and Marcelo signed for Real Madrid in January to be the new Roberto Carlos, I doubt anyone thought Heinze was up for the task when they signed him for depth the summer Roberto left.

This squad still has a last bullet on them if things go right, maybe not enough for another UCL title, but plenty to challenge the league while at the same time nurturing a great batch of talent.
 
It just dawned on me that they must be fecking loaded with CL prize money after 3 consecutive wins.
 
Surely they're going to start splashing some ridiculous bids around soon. Suspect some club in the PL will have to stand their ground when they come calling.
 
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They can't enter the season with this forward line. No top goal scorer around. They'll struggle for goals when it matters.
 
I know it's only one game, but Modric looked old today. I'm talking Xavi/Pirlo 2014 levels of old.

Maybe he's just tired from the WC, who knows.
 
Infordin said:
I know it's only one game, but Modric looked old today. I'm talking Xavi/Pirlo 2014 levels of old.

Maybe he's just tired from the WC, who knows.
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He looked checked out to me more than looking old. Probably wants to move to Inter.
 
el3mel said:
They can't enter the season with this forward line. No top goal scorer around. They'll struggle for goals when it matters.
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Might have no choice. 2019 might be when they make a big splash again.
 
Mane's available for £200m. They won't be able to afford Salah now. :D
 
My only assumption for them not spending money is their stadium renovation. Otherwise where is all their money going?
 
Josep Dowling said:
My only assumption for them not spending money is their stadium renovation. Otherwise where is all their money going?
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Probably similar issue to us, teams are quoting them ridiculous fees for players. Imagine how much Chelsea would ask for Hazard? £150-180m? There’s no-one truly outstanding for them to buy - both Neymar and Mbappe would be £250m, even Real can’t afford the prices that are going round.
 
They should definitely buy a striker
Benzema and Mayoral as your options should be improved
 
European competitions Zidane failed to win as Real Madrid manager in 2.5 years - 0

European competitions Lopetegui failed to win as Real Madrid manager in 2.5 hours - 1

Games where Madrid conceded 4 goals with Zidane as manager in 149 games - 0

Games where Madrid conceded 4 goals with Lopetegui as manager after 1 game - 1



In all seriousness, they looked very good in the first half but then lost control. Varane and Asensio were terrible...

This still looked like a Zidane team though, they played the same way they played last season and Lopetegui has yet to leave his mark on the way they play. It was as tough of a start as possible so it’s impossible to take any conclusions. Last season Madrid spanked Barcelona in the supercup and 3 months later they were trailing in the league by 10 points.
 
Potch did a good job not going there. Worst job possible for any coach and then you have your best player leave.
 
Atlético look set to dominate for a few years while Madrid go through a lull or transition period. I’m unsure what the future holds for Barca
 
Theafonis said:
Atlético look set to dominate for a few years while Madrid go through a lull or transition period. I’m unsure what the future holds for Barca
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They'll still be favourites for the league this season.
 
This time last year Real spanked Barca by something like 4 goals and Barca looked screwed and ended up winning the double
 
I wouldn’t read too much into one match! The transfer window hasn’t closed for them. Even with their current team they’ll be in all the competitions late on whatever happens. I agree they probably will find Ronaldo impossible to replace but a transition season is acceptable, especially given how extremely successful they’ve been in recent memory.
 
Ali Dia said:
I wouldn’t read too much into one match! The transfer window hasn’t closed for them. Even with their current team they’ll be in all the competitions late on whatever happens. I agree they probably will find Ronaldo impossible to replace but a transition season is acceptable, especially given how extremely successful they’ve been in recent memory.
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Lose one player and they need a transition season? Their issue is the revolving door for managers.
 
Peyroteo said:
European competitions Zidane failed to win as Real Madrid manager in 2.5 years - 0

European competitions Lopetegui failed to win as Real Madrid manager in 2.5 hours - 1

Games where Madrid conceded 4 goals with Zidane as manager in 149 games - 0

Games where Madrid conceded 4 goals with Lopetegui as manager after 1 game - 1



In all seriousness, they looked very good in the first half but then lost control. Varane and Asensio were terrible...

This still looked like a Zidane team though, they played the same way they played last season and Lopetegui has yet to leave his mark on the way they play. It was as tough of a start as possible so it’s impossible to take any conclusions. Last season Madrid spanked Barcelona in the supercup and 3 months later they were trailing in the league by 10 points.
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Agreed to an extent, they have looked better in other pre-season matches in fairness, and imo Isco had a worse game than Asensio, he was really poor but they were better in the first half so it didn't stand out as much.
 
I find it inconceivable that a team loses a 50 goal a season player and doesn't buy anyone.
 
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