Raphael Varane | Signed for United!

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glazed said:
Yes it's more complicated but the principles apply. There is a market for world class centre backs which tells you Varane's rough value.
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His value would be £75 mill approx if he had more time on his contract, he doesn’t, so what we are bidding is already largely discounted.

Where it gets complicated and any sort of ‘market value’ goes out the window is when we factor in our specific need for a centre back who is an upgrade on what we already have and the lack of available players on the market who would provide that improvement on what we have.

These things all come into play and ultimately leave you with a value that the buyer is willing to pay based on the various components involved.

Totally different to a marketplace of identical items on a production line.
This market can change based on the sale of a handful of players creating a new market like we saw post just prior to Covid.
 
glazed said:
Yes there is. Economics 101 is about supply and demand. At 50p the supply of Varanes is zero and demand is high (wages notwithstanding). You have to find the equilibrium price

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This type market isn't in Economics 101, if you assume that a player is a susbstitutable good, which is a big assumption in itself, you are in the case of a bilateral oligopoly. The graph that you shared is only relevant in the context of a market of perfect competition which implies atomicity which doesn't apply to the "transfer market". From memory, you will have to start with Nash equilibrium but I could be wrong.
 
Pulled a full moon in the afternoon at work in anticipation for lord Varane arriving. I tried to explain the moon system but my boss wasn’t interested. Not a muppet sadly.
 
Even when he is in the United shirt at Carrington, I'll still think it's a contract renewal ploy.
 
CallyRed said:
Even when he is in the United shirt at Carrington, I'll still think it's a contract renewal ploy.
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You're not paranoid. Di Maria was probably already signing for PSG before he accepted he wasn't going to get that big contract renewal from Madrid.
 
CallyRed said:
Even when he is in the United shirt at Carrington, I'll still think it's a contract renewal ploy.
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Agreed in fact even when he plays his first match for us i will be expecting him to at any moment take off his united top put on a Madrid one and run out of the ground into a Spain bound taxi
 
I think this one's done, Luckhurst seems too confident.

Might be a bit of a culture shock when he doesn't have a Casemiro or Kante playing in front of him though. Those that think signing a world class centre back negates the need for a world class defensive midfielder might be in for a bit of a shock too.
 
worldinmotion66 said:
I think this one's done, Luckhurst seems too confident.

Might be a bit of a culture shock when he doesn't have a Casemiro or Kante playing in front of him though. Those that think signing a world class centre back negates the need for a world class defensive midfielder might be in for a bit of a shock too.
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I don’t think you need world class players in every position to be successful
 
Yes Madrid and Perez wants the money but We'll make Untied bleed and bleed every penny or no deal!! Mark my words.
 
RUCK4444 said:
His value would be £75 mill approx if he had more time on his contract, he doesn’t, so what we are bidding is already largely discounted.

Where it gets complicated....
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Yes it's complicated. But you can be sure we have a maximum figure of what to pay. And Madrid have a minimum. So they have to overlap.

JPRouve said:
This type market isn't in Economics 101...
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Yes it's more far complicated. I was just refuting the idea that the demand price is the only factor - as simply as I could.
 
izak said:
Yes Madrid and Perez wants the money but We'll make Untied bleed and bleed every penny or no deal!! Mark my words.
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Considering there’s not much competition for him and how he prefers us to others even if there was competition, I’d love to see how much we ‘bleed’. I can assure you we won’t be paying you guys anything above 55m euros, if that!

This is a game of chess and we seem to be getting good at it. Last season we didn’t sign some of our players till the end of the window so let’s see how long you guys are willing to wait.
 
lsd said:
Agreed in fact even when he plays his first match for us i will be expecting him to at any moment take off his united top put on a Madrid one and run out of the ground into a Spain bound taxi
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Exactly
No doubt he will run his 4 year contract down then return to Madrid for more money, using us for 4 years just to get a bigger contract
 
izak said:
Yes Madrid and Perez wants the money but We'll make Untied bleed and bleed every penny or no deal!! Mark my words.
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Or we’ll get him for free next summer. Not got the leverage sadly babe.
 
Acquire Me said:
Are you okay, dear?
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Yes!!! We know United have got money to spend, if they're not ready to go the extra mile on Varane then go buy Ben fecking White, at least he's an Euro finalist that's good at keeping the bench warm or better still wait on the next Duncan Edwards recanation to come out of injury, which I'm sure he'll make another comic face at the sight of conceeding a foolish goal.

The Choice is yours, Cough up the Money or no deal!!
 
JJ12 said:
I don’t think you need world class players in every position to be successful
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I would agree but I think the best teams tend to have a top quality defensive midfielder. Jorginho, Kante, Fernandinho, Rodri, Casemiro, Busquets. Just look at how Liverpool suffered without Fabinho in there. It's a key position.
 
izak said:
We know United have got money to spend, if they're not ready to go the extra mile on Varane then go buy Ben fecking White, at least he's an Euro finalist that's good at keeping the bench warm or better still wait on the next Duncan Edwards recanation to come out of injury,
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Do feck off
 
izak said:
Yes!!! We know United have got money to spend, if they're not ready to go the extra mile on Varane then go buy Ben fecking White, at least he's an Euro finalist that's good at keeping the bench warm or better still wait on the next Duncan Edwards recanation to come out of injury, which I'm sure he'll make another comic face at the sight of conceeding a foolish goal.

The Choice is yours, Cough up the Money or no deal!!
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There's only two choice here. Acepting United bid or loosing him on a free next season.
 
Lynty said:
It's short sighted to think that this haggling is for Varane. We're haggling over £5m (reportedly) to solidify our stance on future transfers.

We developed a transfer culture of always paying the asking price, even when it we were obviously being ripped off. A conscious decision has been made to change tactics and it requires patience. We called Dortmund bluff last summer, fully prepared to lose out. Looks like we are doing it again. Clubs will know in future not to play chicken on negotiations, because we aren't as easy to move as we once were.

We give in and our future stance on transfer fees becomes very movable in the eyes of opposition.
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You're not trying to make out that we now have some sort of transfer strategy instead of the old "lets just throw shit at the wall until something sticks", are you?
 
Lynty said:
It's short sighted to think that this haggling is for Varane. We're haggling over £5m (reportedly) to solidify our stance on future transfers.

We developed a transfer culture of always paying the asking price, even when it we were obviously being ripped off. A conscious decision has been made to change tactics and it requires patience. We called Dortmund bluff last summer, fully prepared to lose out. Looks like we are doing it again. Clubs will know in future not to play chicken on negotiations, because we aren't as easy to move as we once were.

We give in and our future stance on transfer fees becomes very movable in the eyes of opposition.
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Good point

glazed said:
Isn't it just that these things are a game of bluff and counter bluff and human judgements and they are impossible to read. Remember when DdG fell through because we faxed the documents too late? Anything really can happen. For what it's worth Ed isn't very good at this stuff.
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I always thought it was Real who screwed up, which turned De Gea off and make him resign with us instead?
 
The amount of stories coming out I would have believed them if it was any other club, take Sancho for example. As it’s RM until he’s holding the shirt I don’t believe anything. This has Ramos 2.0 written all over it!!!
 
Lj82 said:
I always thought it was Real who screwed up, which turned De Gea off and make him resign with us instead?
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I thought we faxed through his papers a minute before the transfer deadline had expired leaving no time for Madrid to forward it to the Spanish FA

" Real, however, insist United are responsible and claim they received a vital fax at 11.59pm, leaving them with no time to submit it to the Liga de Fútbol Profesional. The document is understood to have been forwarded a minute past the deadline and, as such, De Gea was informed that the two clubs would have to abort the £29.3m player-plus-cash exchange involving Keylor Navas that had been agreed during the day. "

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2015/aug/31/david-de-gea-joining-real-madrid-manchester-united
 
Tip to the person responsible for updating the thread title.

Please add useful updates that make sense to most of us fans who are interested in how this potential transfer is going.

Many of us don't have the luxury of sitting on a football forum all day to know what 'powers up to United mode but not into arm wrestling' means. And this is not the only thread it has happened in.

I don't understand what's so difficult in adding updates that make sense to everyone.
 
If Carlo is a fan of Dalot, I hope we're using him as part of the deal, even if it's a loan.
 
glazed said:
I thought we faxed through his papers a minute before the transfer deadline had expired leaving no time for Madrid to forward it to the Spanish FA

" Real, however, insist United are responsible and claim they received a vital fax at 11.59pm, leaving them with no time to submit it to the Liga de Fútbol Profesional. The document is understood to have been forwarded a minute past the deadline and, as such, De Gea was informed that the two clubs would have to abort the £29.3m player-plus-cash exchange involving Keylor Navas that had been agreed during the day. "

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2015/aug/31/david-de-gea-joining-real-madrid-manchester-united
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Ah. But utd denied all that and insisted they did everything with time to spare, and had time stamp on all documents to prove it.

I wonder what really happened. But it felt to me at that time that de gea happily signing a new c contract with us instead of moving out at the next window suggested that he felt Real was messing with his future by low balling utd and leaving everything till late in the window.
 
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