Ralf Rangnick | ex-interim manager | does anyone rate him?

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I just listened to his post match interview. At least he gets annoyed and see the same things we are seeing. With Ole I felt he never saw the issues the same way we did.

Those Ole interviews were frustrating as hell.
At least RR sees exactly what we are seeing.
If he fails to address the issues, he'll be fired and he knows this, so you can bet that he is attempting to fix everything wrong that he is seeing on the pitch.
 
It's not that I'm not backing Ralf, I always back a manager until it's clear they've gone backwards, but I just don't think I can sit through another Norwich/Newcastle performance. Those two games have taken the last bit of wind from my sails. I know it's an impossible task to transition to a new formation and style mid-season on top of a pandemic but I just feel too exhausted by the misery that is United at the moment.

Not to sound a defeatist I just find watching us at the moment so fecking depressing and frustrating. Last two games have put me in such a mood afterwards, I just think it's time for me to give it a break. But it's easier said than done when you've never allowed yourself to miss a game for decades.

Sorry for the sob story. Watching my team not be able to put three passes together is painful.
 
We aren’t playing as a team which was different to how we played for the majority of the first two seasons. I hope that’s not due to Ronaldo.

In all hI wary I like the fact we press now.
 
How many more managers must we have before people realise you can tell players to do things, but you can't make them listen.

You could get away with the Ole's "tactially naive" excuse before RR, but not now, not with a guy with so much experience.

They're playing exactly the same as they did under Ole because they don't listen and most of them have little to no character which gets badly exposed when teams press us.
 
He's not really had that long has he, to be fair. The thing that surprises me is that nothing has really changed in terms of selection.. We're still playing McFred and Rashford still seems to be preferred to Sancho. That probably speaks a lot for what goes on in training. Ralf does seem more ruthless though, in the way he speaks. We probably need to start seeing that in his team selections now
 
How many more managers must we have before people realise you can tell players to do things, but you can't make them listen.

You could get away with the Ole's "tactially naive" excuse before RR, but not now, not with a guy with so much experience.

They're playing exactly the same as they did under Ole because they don't listen and most of them have little to no character which gets badly exposed when teams press us.
I am beginning to believe that Solskjaer was a little more tactically aware then we all thought. Perriera commenting on the PSG comeback supports that. These players have built an atmosphere of no accountability and maximum comfort.
 
Ronaldo needs dropping if we are to play Ralf to get his chance to implement his system. Ronaldo is now the archetypical Italian striker where they don't run much so that they can save their energy for when it counts -- in the penalty box. At 36 that's his only option.
I disagree. Watch the first 30 minutes against Palace and see how good Ronaldo is in this system.
 
How many more managers must we have before people realise you can tell players to do things, but you can't make them listen.

You could get away with the Ole's "tactially naive" excuse before RR, but not now, not with a guy with so much experience.

They're playing exactly the same as they did under Ole because they don't listen and most of them have little to no character which gets badly exposed when teams press us.

Quite right.
 
How many more managers must we have before people realise you can tell players to do things, but you can't make them listen.

You could get away with the Ole's "tactially naive" excuse before RR, but not now, not with a guy with so much experience.

They're playing exactly the same as they did under Ole because they don't listen and most of them have little to no character which gets badly exposed when teams press us.
I’ve been banging on about the lack of character in the team for ages. It’s so evident with this United team. Not a proper leader amongst them.

Regarding the players and how they play, it was clear they ignore tactical instruction under Ole, people liked to pretend Ole didn’t have a single ounce of tactical prowess but you can see it so clearly with these players in these last two games in particular, they either cannot or refuse to learn - I think it’s the latter.
 
Oles good football was built around counter attack. He bought a lot of these players and he would have been fine if he stayed with the counter attack system. But over the years he tried to change it. See the results against the top teams the first season and last season. We tried to go toe to toe with them and failed. I have no idea what Ole was trying to do because it was so confused but it looked like he was trying to be more like Liverpool and City. Basically keep the ball more.

Problem with that is now we have all these players that cant do that and the ones we do have DVB etc are not wanted for whatever reason. Now we bring in Rangnick that also wants things that this team doesnt do. Press. Who out of this team are pressing players? Im not saying can they press. Every player can even Ronaldo. But who would you say are top pressers? Not many. Who in this team are number 9's? Ronaldo but he s not a natural presser. Then? Cavani. Wants out and is injured a lot. So we put Rashford there. He is not a 9 and cant press and is not natural on the right side. So thats already the front 2 fkd. Then what do you want from the two 10's? Hard working, pressing, passing, through balls, assists, goals. Who can do that? Bruno no. He gives the ball away too much. Sancho possibly but he is better on the right and not really a number 10. Again DVB not wanted. So thats the two number 10's fkd. Plus the front four need top wing backs. Yeah Dalot and Telles have done ok. But are they top wing backs? Game in game out over the season? We dont know. So that fks the strike force again. Then we need the 2 midfielders to dominate the game - can they? Not week in week out over a whole season by the looks of it.

Basically if we started from scratch to build a 4-2-2-2 team how many of these players would be a natural fit? This has been United main problem since Sir Alex left. We build then change managers to a completely different style and try to shove in players to fit. Pogba - is he a double pivot? A LW? No!!! But we will keep playing him here instead of a 3. Mata ruined his career at RW. Lingard never given a chance at 10. Martial is a LW not a number 9. And on and on we go. Moyes, Van Gal, Mourinho, Ole, Rangnick - all completely different styles of football. What happens in the summer? Get someone that doesnt play 4-2-2-2 and then try and get the team to change all around again? It makes no sense.
 
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It's not that I'm not backing Ralf, I always back a manager until it's clear they've gone backwards, but I just don't think I can sit through another Norwich/Newcastle performance. Those two games have taken the last bit of wind from my sails. I know it's an impossible task to transition to a new formation and style mid-season on top of a pandemic but I just feel too exhausted by the misery that is United at the moment.

Not to sound a defeatist I just find watching us at the moment so fecking depressing and frustrating. Last two games have put me in such a mood afterwards, I just think it's time for me to give it a break. But it's easier said than done when you've never allowed yourself to miss a game for decades.

Sorry for the sob story. Watching my team not be able to put three passes together is painful.
How did you survive 3 years under Ole?
 
I think he will turn the corner with most players at the club but by god he's got his work cut out. Im sure most of this mob turning up for training have the mindset they will outlast the manager given he is very publicly 'The Interim'. Agree with all here who say we have no leaders. No fecker apart from Edi and DDG look like the give a shit. Sick to death of the crocodile tears on Social right after a game, we must do better, try harder, do it for the fans. Don't feckin say it, do it.

I give RR the benefit of the doubt in that he has been here five minutes, there has been massive change to the coaching set up and coaching has been disruptive with The Carrington Shutdown.
 
I’ll just say it takes 2-3 months to see signs of a change in system, that’s when managers have a pre season. Then it takes a season to perfect it. Really don’t get why Rangnick is already getting pressured we’ve still got 7/9 points, results are a huge improvement from before and will help in the fight to top 4.
 
Those Ole interviews were frustrating as hell.
At least RR sees exactly what we are seeing.
If he fails to address the issues, he'll be fired and he knows this, so you can bet that he is attempting to fix everything wrong that he is seeing on the pitch.


Hopefully the players will listen to him. I can't help wondering if all our players really have the hunger to win things and work harder.

The likes of Ronaldo yes some of the others no
 
Maybe Ole worked out these players are never going to press and best thing would be just sending them out and depending on his star players to do something
The thing is Ole’s time at United is no different to his time at Cardiff in regards to tactics, decisions, etc
 
Lack of pressing is just one of our many problems right now.
We can't do a lot of the basics right, like passing quickly and accurately, marking players, holding position etc.
And the attack doesn't function at all. We barley laid a glove on some of the crapper teams in the league recently, and although I hope for better against Burnley, we've only beaten them at home something ridiculous like once in 4 seasons!
 
His managerial CV is far from impressive. He has mostly influenced, not mentored, the big names. This is a big difference.

I expect us to be more cohesive and entertaining to watch than what Carrick produced in 3 games come end-Jan, which really isn't much. The past 2 matches have been more akin to Ole's 4-2-4 mess.

perhaps. I watched the German football correspondent on Sky who said something Along the lines that if you look at him taking hoffenheim from the 3rd/4th tier and what he did with scouting and building the squad value it is a big achievement. But the skeptic in me thought that we could accredit that to someone like Eddie Howe. Or look how Dave Moyes can punch above his weight. Its a different scenario to coming into an already huge club and already having £800m worth of players. I expect to see most of Rangnicks effect take place when he goes to the advisory role - improvements in our sports science, fitness, scouting etc
 
The biggest problem is that he came in at a time when we had a packed fixture list, and then had the training ground shut and covid issues.
It was always going to take a while to get any sort of new system working well.
 
Has he even had 10 training sessions with a full squad? My main concern is the players don't look motivated and there appears to be a split or at least trouble in the dressing room. He is going to have to sort that out as well as everything else.
 
People need to relax. First off, he's an interim. Second, it'd take a while to sort out Ole's ineptness and the disarray this football club has fallen into. Before anyone gets on me with the usual "but the players". Yes, the players, but who brought these players? Ole has caused this complacency and lack of desire that will be very hard to turn around. Ralf is not Conte, Klopp or Guardiola, so don't expect a quick fix here. All we can hope for is a top 4 place, nothing more. Hopefully Spurs end up being Spurs and bottle it.
 
I’m still not sure what in his CV made people assume he was going to come in and have us playing attractive, successful football immediately. He’s more of a DOF than a manager and, let’s be honest, there’s nothing to suggest he’s a top class manager at all. He may well be very useful in helping us shape the club for the future and can hopefully help with our recruitment issues but the situation is relatively similar to Ole’s time in that Liverpool, City, Chelsea and now Spurs all have considerably better managers than us. We’re in a fight for fourth place now and I suspect he and we will fall short.

Just an example but when he took over Leipzig after Hassenhuttl, they went from conceding a ton of goals to becoming miserly.
 
How did you survive 3 years under Ole?
There was slow progress and this season I agreed it had gone backwards, I’m not expecting Ralf to turn it around in days but part of that patience I’ve already given to Ole and previous managers is catching up to me now, I’m just sick of how bad we are and the constant negativity around the club. Sad to see.
 
Dunno why people are talking about Ralf, had Conte come in we’d be seeing the same thing, horrendous attitude, mentality and application from the players who seem to clearly be downing tools already
 
A serious question - have we done a very man United thing and totally flip flopped styles again? Fans on the forum saying Ralf can't get anything from Bruno, Ronaldo, pogba, Sancho and needs a team of hard working young players to be signed... If that is true, is he the stupidest interim manager possible and either should have been a long term appointment and commit to a new project / clear out the Bruno's of the team or we should have signed someone who had a chance of getting the best out of the squad we have over the time he will be here.

Given we are where we are, we should really be looking at getting a very similar manager in the summer and trying to move Bruno and rashford etc on. I know people saw rangnick doesn't get on well with hassenhuttl but rangnick will barely be involved with the club by the sounds of things, and Ralf H is the closest available manager to RR based on what we are hearing today, that he can't work with top players and needs them replaced by hard working hungrier players.

I'd be fine with that if we actually commited to it, just annoying that we 'committed' to a different type of build and recently spent 80m on Sancho and 60 on Bruno who are both two of the best players in the world

Yep. Exactly this. Although I think Bruno and Sancho are capable of pressing if that's what we want. But that's not the point, we've just accepted being a "team in transition" yet again despite putting together a very talented (and expensive) squad that are not particularly well suited to the latest hipster style we've decided we should play. And they don't look at all motivated to try for the most part sadly.

Ed is a complete feckwit and has learned precisely nothing from his many feck ups. I genuinely don't think we can afford to "commit" to being a "bargain hunting, high energy youngster" team. If we don't look like competing to win anything in the next 3 years then I think we might as well consider ourselves a big midtable club like Arsenal rather than a top club.
 
perhaps. I watched the German football correspondent on Sky who said something Along the lines that if you look at him taking hoffenheim from the 3rd/4th tier and what he did with scouting and building the squad value it is a big achievement. But the skeptic in me thought that we could accredit that to someone like Eddie Howe. Or look how Dave Moyes can punch above his weight. Its a different scenario to coming into an already huge club and already having £800m worth of players. I expect to see most of Rangnicks effect take place when he goes to the advisory role - improvements in our sports science, fitness, scouting etc

Yes. I understand the benefit of experiencing the rot first-hand but hope Rangnick’s up to the task of man-managing this dressing room. I have a sneaky suspicion that he isn’t, but I hope he proves me wrong. It’s a real pity that Carrick’s left because it was clear that he had clout over this dressing room. It’s an invaluable asset during this transitional period and Rangnick made it clear that he wanted Carrick to stay on.

Instead, we got a half-rate MLS coach coming in and those wanting an immediate backroom clear-out fawning over themselves.
 
It's an extremely strange line of argument. For some reason whenever we look crap on the pitch (something we've done under 4 different managers and largely completely different squads), it's always the players being prima donnas. Same argument I'm trying to wrap my head around in that "Ralf should play the kids" thread.

If we had Salah and Mane up front right now, people would probably be watching them look confused in this mess and saying they "can't play pressing football".

Yeah it's a running theme on here going back over a decade even to Fergie's time. Whenever we're in shit form half the squad are Prima Donna's, who don't work hard enough, don't fight hard enough and don't show enough 'Pashun'. And the answer of course is always just get a load of hard working players because that'll change everything for the better instantly.

It would be great if it were that simplistic but turning around an underperforming team in football is a lot more nuanced than that I suspect.
 
A serious question - have we done a very man United thing and totally flip flopped styles again? Fans on the forum saying Ralf can't get anything from Bruno, Ronaldo, pogba, Sancho and needs a team of hard working young players to be signed... If that is true, is he the stupidest interim manager possible and either should have been a long term appointment and commit to a new project / clear out the Bruno's of the team or we should have signed someone who had a chance of getting the best out of the squad we have over the time he will be here.

Given we are where we are, we should really be looking at getting a very similar manager in the summer and trying to move Bruno and rashford etc on. I know people saw rangnick doesn't get on well with hassenhuttl but rangnick will barely be involved with the club by the sounds of things, and Ralf H is the closest available manager to RR based on what we are hearing today, that he can't work with top players and needs them replaced by hard working hungrier players.

I'd be fine with that if we actually commited to it, just annoying that we 'committed' to a different type of build and recently spent 80m on Sancho and 60 on Bruno who are both two of the best players in the world
I can only imagine that it’s tacit acknowledgement that the previous rebuild has failed and that we need a different direction. Rangnick’s way is definitely more profitable though (at the potential expense of winning titles). So there’s that for the money men.
 
Yes. I understand the benefit of experiencing the rot first-hand but hope Rangnick’s up to the task of man-managing this dressing room. I have a sneaky suspicion that he isn’t, but I hope he proves me wrong. It’s a real pity that Carrick’s left because it was clear that he had clout over this dressing room. It’s an invaluable asset during this transitional period and Rangnick made it clear that he wanted Carrick to stay on.

Instead, we got a half-rate MLS coach coming in and those wanting an immediate backroom clear-out fawning over themselves.

Yeah I would agree to that. I personally have reservations about how the likes of Ronaldo, Bruno, Varane will take to the sort of ‘this is my philosophy’ reeducation approach. These arent the sort of players who will mumble ‘i’ll do anything the boss asks me to’ in tv interviews.
 
Can we ditch the 4222 and go 433 please? Our best team has Cavani in it also, end of story. He has to start for me. I think RR is in a unique position whereby he doesn't have to try and "save his job" whereby he's afraid to mix it up.

I don't want to say drop Ronaldo, but it's glaringly obvious he's not offering anything when we don't create chances. I don't think he's the player to get you through a tough time, Cavani should be starting up top instead. Also, let's play our players in the best positions.

If we persist with 4222 that isn't really used anymore, and unimaginative football like we are being served up, then this project is going to get old real quick.
 
To be honest, most managers in the league, regardless of their squads, seem to get a new manager bounce. The lack of one seems to point towards two possible reasons, either the squad is ill-prepared or just don’t give a feck, or the reasons are covid related. I’ll wait for 5-6 games more before forming any concrete opinions.

But the lack of energy from the squad in the Newcastle game has to be a physical issue with lack of training or something, just drained me of the optimism I had.
 
Yeah I would agree to that. I personally have reservations about how the likes of Ronaldo, Bruno, Varane will take to the sort of ‘this is my philosophy’ reeducation approach. These arent the sort of players who will mumble ‘i’ll do anything the boss asks me to’ in tv interviews.
Yep. Pretty much.
 
Dunno why people are talking about Ralf, had Conte come in we’d be seeing the same thing, horrendous attitude, mentality and application from the players who seem to clearly be downing tools already

I believe that Conte would have started to do something about the awful attitude of many of the players.
And if they were not prepared to change, he would have started to either educate them or move them on.

Having said that, he is with Tottenham. And so we have who we have and I am prepared to at least give him a reasonable chance.
 
Did anyone really think he was going to turn it around overnight?

No of course not. Although we've seen no new manager bounce to speak of, no uplift in effort from the players which usually you see short term and can get you over the hump of adjusting to the managers new methods.

I think people are justified in being worried but I agree patience is required and I'm seeing a lot of hot takes.
 
I have no problem with Rangnck. When we don’t play well he openly identifies where he feels the problem is. Unlike a lot of others who just say stuff like “we’ll sort it out on the training ground”. I’m sure if the 4 2 2 2 doesn’t work he,ll make changes to the system.
 
Way too early to judge the bloke. It’s clear that the players are struggling with his work ethic and tactics though. What’s needed is a genuine leader on the pitch (which we have had for some time) to kick a few arses and stop the whining and remind the players that they play for Manchester United not some Oil Sheiks vanity club with no history and if they don’t like it, do one.
 
I don't expect an overnight transition - but the last 2 performances are worrying.

I struggle to support a manager who sits there and watches Rashford stink up the place that much and continues to select him in an area of the pitch where we are not short of options.

I'd like to see a bit more adaptability from Ralf. The quality of the other two/three successful managers in this league is not only their persistence in drilling a style of play, but being adaptable within games or within extenuating circumstances. So far, Ralf hasn't shown any interest in mixing things up other than dropping Bruno into a midfield 2, or playing Greenwood and Rashford well out of position.
 
A serious question - have we done a very man United thing and totally flip flopped styles again? Fans on the forum saying Ralf can't get anything from Bruno, Ronaldo, pogba, Sancho and needs a team of hard working young players to be signed... If that is true, is he the stupidest interim manager possible and either should have been a long term appointment and commit to a new project / clear out the Bruno's of the team or we should have signed someone who had a chance of getting the best out of the squad we have over the time he will be here.

Given we are where we are, we should really be looking at getting a very similar manager in the summer and trying to move Bruno and rashford etc on. I know people saw rangnick doesn't get on well with hassenhuttl but rangnick will barely be involved with the club by the sounds of things, and Ralf H is the closest available manager to RR based on what we are hearing today, that he can't work with top players and needs them replaced by hard working hungrier players.

I'd be fine with that if we actually commited to it, just annoying that we 'committed' to a different type of build and recently spent 80m on Sancho and 60 on Bruno who are both two of the best players in the world

Rangnick was brought in as a long term plan not a short term fix, the club are well aware he'd want to instill a totally new playing style. It's very early days to be talking about moving people on, he's barely had a couple of weeks with the squad massively hampered by Covid and Carrington being closed and he is still arranging his own back room staff.

Look at any other club that committed to such a thing - it has always taken time. Fergie, Wenger, Klopp, I could go on - these are managers that come in and mold things into their own fashion and don't necessarily hit the ground running. Often players will eventually adapt and buy in to the changes.

It isn't even "writing off the season" for a long term plan, Rangnick is bringing a much more disciplined style of play. Sticking with Ole when things clearly weren't working would have been writing the season off. We may end up playing some less exciting football over the next couple months while the players begin to pick up and feel comfortable in the philosophy but in the short term we certainly look less of a calamity. Plus we'll be starting next season with much of the system in process rather than having to write off the first half of next season while players adjust, and the intention is to get a manager in who while they'll have their own ideas they will be building off the work Rangnick has started and will continue to advocate.

One thing Rangnick, and others of his ilk, always say is that their squads need a telepathic understanding - it is drilling this instinct into them that takes time. Since he has come in you can visibly see our players thinking on the ball and taking a second longer and this is what will take the most work and time. For now with the ball at their feet they'll be thinking a million miles an hour of how to progress play, the drills, who will be moving for them whereas if we stick to the training and game plans eventually you'll see that progress to being far more fluid and intuitive.

For what it is worth I think Sancho will flourish, he is the player we have who is most used to an adjacent system of football and what he spent his formative years playing. He isn't some wild card fancy winger like many thought, he's a very technical player who is used to floating centrally and inter-linking with similar players with quick triangular movements and passing. The team is moving more in line with football suitable for Sancho. Bruno is a bit of an odd one; he has all the talent in the world but is the most undisciplined - which worked in more chaotic structures where he could constantly try things but now he is going to be forced to playing in a system that relies on cohesion - he has the talent to do so but he needs some serious coaching to reign his style of play, if his mind adjusts then he will be a force of nature with the talent and work ethic he possesses. Plus of course these style of teams aren't all 100% robotic and often have a player of two with a wild card nature about them - look at De Bruyne at City, while he perfectly plays their system sometimes he does break the expected passage of play to do something remarkable, similarly with Salah at Liverpool, or even look at Tiki Taka teams they also tend to have players that while playing the style also have somewhat of a license to operate independently. The most boring and robotic inclination of Tiki Taka was likely Spain 2010-2012 and Iniesta and Mata (when played) contributed heavily to the drilled play but also tried passages of play independently.

Pogba is a very intelligent player (who sometimes makes very stupid decisions) but he hasn't played in a system like we're moving towards at all, but his biggest challenge will probably contributing off the ball when he is used to working alongside a player who would cover for him. I have my doubts, but the "system" is flexible and there could very well be room for him. Either way all signs point to him leaving anyway.

Rashford I like and he has repeatedly shown us what he can offer, but his decision making is appalling. He is in serious need of coaching and given a proper football education. He needs to be dropped for the time being, as currently it is hard to see Rashford as a first XI player for the club - but he is excellent to keep in the squad and be used rotationally. Not in a "plays cup games and the odd 5 minute appearance" sense, I mean someone who still gets a considerable amount of game time and some league starts.

People writing off Rangnick already are mentalists, it is incredibly knee jerk to be doing so. We're weeks into the process that has been hampered massively by Covid and an inability to train properly with the whole squad, and the gradual introduction of coaches and training methods. Hey, at least we got our first clean sheet in about two years. I don't consider myself a massive disciple of Rangnick and if things don't work then we reassess and change trajectories (sigh... again), but outwardly it looks to be the right direction for the club and the very least they can do is commit to it and see how it pans out. And that includes fans actually backing this club for a change. A lot of our fan base is pathetic Football Twitter types who unless we win 8-0 in a trailblazing fashion every week will always moan, and whinge, and target players or staff and it is getting far far worse. There were probably types who wanted us to sack Fergie and sell Ruud during that period but now they have platforms to spout that shite on and have multiplied massively.
 
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