I’m not, he’s been impressive.
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I’m not, he’s been impressive.
Fair enough if you thought they would end up as mid table rubbish. Imo if Spurs finish ahead of them this season, then it’s failure for Arteta. Pretty sure Spurs have spent less money over recent years and Conte has been in job for a short amount of time.
I get the wanting to take time and build a project but they’ve dumped a ton of money and good number of years in order replicate a bad Wenger season.
Working with Guardiola can’t hurt (United fans will also be hoping this is the case!).
I still feel Arteta has some more to prove. He’s reduced the age profile of the squad and seems to be doing really well. But he’s also spent a lot of money, and would need to achieve top four to add some achievement to all of the progress.
They look great right now and have a good chance of making top four, in my opinion.
My word, bongo have been shite. 100% going down
What do you mean if!?
Good start, diametrically opposite last season. One game at a time.
Yup I think people forget that you lost your first 3 games last season.
I noticed it's been brought up in the last week due to United's current predicament
Have you seen their transfer activity in the last 4 transfer windows?
I'm hoping we get top 3 BUT Arsenal have the 6th highest wagebill in the league, United's is the highest about twice of Arsenal's and Chelsea's isn't far off twice as much either. If we get top 4 under those circumstances make no mistake that it's a coup.
Wage bill will go up once Saka, Saliba and Martinelli get their 200k contracts.
I mean that won't happen.
Saka will go to £170k. Saliba £100k, Martinelli £100k.
Something around those levels.
In which case, all three will leave for clubs willing to pay them much more.
Saliba, if he continues looking that good, is not signing a long term contract with Arsenal for half of what Forest are paying Jesse Lingard.
Saliba, if he continues looking that good, is not signing a long term contract with Arsenal for half of what Forest are paying Jesse Lingard.
I mean.. apparently he's already signed it but we'll see.
Our wages have nothing to do with what Lingard earns.
It's easier when you everyone involved understands and accepts what needs to be done and without sentiment. That's in the pitch and the support staff needed like a built out data analytics and sports staff that supports player identification and recruitment and development. It's been missing for at least 6 years by many accounts.
Arsenal made their bed with Arteta, but also the understanding that lots of players had to go and lots of particulars players had to be phased out like Chambers, Torerra, Lacazette, etc.
But they also bought a lot of players who had friendly wages.
There's too much blind faith and politics involved in the higher ups at United when it comes to football decisions such as Rashford or overpaying for DDG for 5 years and not believing in the overall direction of the club in finding an adequate replacement...which could have been Keylor Navas.
Point is Arsenal's wage bill is artificially depressed because we have young first teamers on their first or second first team contracts. It'll go up once we get them on new contracts to reflect that of a first team player for a top four team in the PL. Don't mind that because all of them deserve it, even if we do miss top four by a couple of points like last year.
I think it’s important to note the state of the squad when he came in. It was in need of a desperate overhaul, as well as being generally unbalanced and in free fall. ETH spending 200m this summer would be very different to Pep spending 200m because of the starting positions of the quality of their respective squads. He’s managed to create a new squad filled with young talent, while dealing with a substantially lower wage than four other teams.
The holistic approach approach Arsenal have took with their project is working out, I think they’re the youngest team and have the youngest manager. They could have spent on older players in their peak on bigger wages for quicker results, but they showed some decent foresight here.
They should be getting top 4 though, and I’m fairly certain they will
It's way too early to be certain about anything other than Spurs, Chelsea, Arsenal, and another club will fill out 3 to 6. Maybe Spurs could be a darkhorse for a top 2 position but that will depend on the fitness of Kane and Son, plus other Injuries are the great equalizer for all clubs as well.
Fulham just beat Brentford 3:2. The mighty Brentford that beat us 4:0. The one that a-hole Klopp trolled us about by "defending" United and saying everybody is forgetting how good Brentford is. Yeah, sure. They are gonna win the league this year.
Nah, I’m pretty certain. Feel free to quote me on it
They've barely made a mistake since Pepe 3 years ago?
How many cheap transfers/hidden gems did they buy? Also, Maguire and AWB looked decent to great after their first season, I suggest we give Arsenal's new players a bit more time to fail
To be fair we still have Pepe, Xhaka, El Neny & Cedric on our books. Ben White may also end up being an expensive bench warmer.
But you had Saka, which I've mentioned help you stay afloat with no drop off and a player like him being part of the change in a positive way. And he was cheap coming through your academy.
Xhaka and Partey are okay, but still functioning for what the team needs. Those other players were never big picture players and are fine as bench options considering they aren't a huge wage anchor. White was expensive but at least could start and be okay and fill in at RB or as part of a 3 CB, unlike Chambers or Holding.
Martinelli cost them £6.5m 3 years ago but it's not about 'hidden gems', there's lots of obvious signings out there at reasonable fees once you identify the type of players you need.
I think you'll be waiting a long time for Jesus and Zinchenko to be 'failures' at the price they paid.
Xhaka is a very important player in the team.
Why are Leicester in bad financial state? What did they do?
Neither Jesus nor Zinchenko were ever going to be sold to us at all or at least for anything remotely close to the prices Arteta (Pep's ex assistant) got for them.
If you are telling me Martinelli is the kind of signing we should make (Brazil 2nd division) well... I shudder to think of the reactions here on the Caf, considering the hate James got when we got him from Swansea (and sold him for profit)
Today was a good day in showing how competitive the league is now and why if you don’t get recruitment or your manager right (Villa and Everton) you can get heavily sucked into a relegation battle despite the size of your club. If we don’t get a striker sorted asap we are going nowhere this season. Doesn’t matter how many minutes we play or shots we take, not having a good striker is killing us.
Villa are being killed by a naff manager who is tactically inept. Lampard isn’t miles better but I do think he’s shown better things in the PL than Gerrard has (Gerrard has had a better career overall though).
Villa are being killed by a naff manager who is tactically inept. Lampard isn’t miles better but I do think he’s shown better things in the PL than Gerrard has (Gerrard has had a better career overall though).
I never said they would but I'm not the one trying to argue their transfer business hasn't been good.
No, as I said they don't have to be hidden gems. A lot are just obvious sensible transfers. Like Gabriel for £27m, it wasn't high risk.
On Martinelli no one here would care if we bought players for fees like £6.5m who may or may not make the first team. You can take gambles with fees like that. Our effort for similar was on the likes of Diallo (£20m+) which just looks daft right now.
Had to look up my posts from the Odegaard transfer thread, January 2021, that's now closed.
Dude: "Elite players don't usually get sent away on loan." "If he's that good why does an average Madrid team not need him now?"
Red Pumpkin replied:
"On the contrary. Bayerns elite prospects Lahm, Alaba, Kroos all got sent out on loan for 18-24 months at approximately 18-22 years of age. Ödegaard is terrific, but like Özil, James Rodriguez or Guti before him at Real he might need the managers unwavering trust to prosper. In general, although there are exceptions, you shouldn't move to Real before being established and 24-26 years of age like Kroos, Bale, Modric, Cristiano Ronaldo, Xabi Alonso, Arbeloa and Pepe."
"Ödegaard looks the real deal to me. He is just entering his prime and will be a top, top player between 2023-2029 when he is 24-30.
De Bruyne to City - 24
David Silva to City - 24
Kroos to Madrid - 24
Salah to Liverpool - 25
Ribéry to Bayern - 24
Zidane to Juventus - 24
Generally players need to mature, the Mbappes of the world just make us believe that 20 year olds should be further ahead than they usually are - even the elite ones. Xavi and Iniesta became elite when they were 24-26, Deco was better than them when they were 21-24."
Seems to have aged well those quotes. Granted most sensible people backed Odegaard.
And on that note: what is Oyarzabal still doing at Real Sociedad? The guy is around Odegaards level and like Cazorla once upon a time would come from a good but not top club. A signing should be possible without too much hassle.
Dude: "Elite players don't usually get sent away on loan." "If he's that good why does an average Madrid team not need him now?"
Red Pumpkin replied:
"On the contrary. Bayerns elite prospects Lahm, Alaba, Kroos all got sent out on loan for 18-24 months at approximately 18-22 years of age. Ödegaard is terrific, but like Özil, James Rodriguez or Guti before him at Real he might need the managers unwavering trust to prosper. In general, although there are exceptions, you shouldn't move to Real before being established and 24-26 years of age like Kroos, Bale, Modric, Cristiano Ronaldo, Xabi Alonso, Arbeloa and Pepe."
"Ödegaard looks the real deal to me. He is just entering his prime and will be a top, top player between 2023-2029 when he is 24-30.
De Bruyne to City - 24
David Silva to City - 24
Kroos to Madrid - 24
Salah to Liverpool - 25
Ribéry to Bayern - 24
Zidane to Juventus - 24
Generally players need to mature, the Mbappes of the world just make us believe that 20 year olds should be further ahead than they usually are - even the elite ones. Xavi and Iniesta became elite when they were 24-26, Deco was better than them when they were 21-24."
Seems to have aged well those quotes. Granted most sensible people backed Odegaard.
And on that note: what is Oyarzabal still doing at Real Sociedad? The guy is around Odegaards level and like Cazorla once upon a time would come from a good but not top club. A signing should be possible without too much hassle.
agree
Odegaard is Real Madrid reject. Jesus and Zinchenko are City reject. KDB and Salah are Chelsea reject. Do not want!
Astute, Sir. Just like Yaya Youre was a Barcelona reject, Robben and Sneijder were Real Madrid rejects. Aubameyang was AC Milan reject. Hummels was Bayern reject. Clearly terrible players the lot of them
He shouldn't be. I think he holds us back in the same way that Giroud/Chesney/Rosicky/Mertesacker/Vermaelen/Alex Song all did. Good but flawed players who shouldn't be part of the spine of the team because they'll let you down when it matters most or just blow hot and cold throughout the season.
Agree to most part but in general it seems the trend now is to get players when they are younger between 20yrs-24yrs. (This is especially true for Madrid, probably learnt it with the Hazard transfer although they have been doing this for some time now)
Aside from football related reasons, I think it makes sense in terms of finances. As well as likely paying a smaller fee and wages for players at 20 - 22, you have a higher likelihood of recouping some of your investment upon a resale, or even making a profit after years of service.