I watched him against mexico few months ago. He was nothing impressive to me. The only big positive is that he was able to keep the ball while under pressure of the Mexico players. But other than that, nothing much what I saw. Play short simple safe passes and defensively offer not much in that match. But then again, only one game so not fair to judge him based on that.
Potential Matic Replacements
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I watched him against mexico few months ago. He was nothing impressive to me. The only big positive is that he was able to keep the ball while under pressure of the Mexico players. But other than that, nothing much what I saw. Play short simple safe passes and defensively offer not much in that match. But then again, only one game so not fair to judge him based on that.
He would be incredibly expensive but I would go for Ndidi.
Or I would go for a time machine and I would have us get Partey.
SMS is neither CDM nor CM. If you watched Lazio for last few seasons, you would see that they ve struggled to find his best position. He's the best when he enters as impact sub. Surely he can change the outcome of the game. But bloody hell Lotito is crazy for his overpricing.
People can't just let Pogba go can they, when will the penny drop..............
I think I am more inclined to say who I would want to stay far away from, rather than offer any insightful answers on potential gems. My wants are unrealistic, in Ndidi (Leicester would look to get Harry money out of us, which fair play to them), or Partey (the ship has sailed).
But I absolutely do not want us to sign --
Ruben Neves - doesn't do enough for me, apart from a smash from distance every few months or so. But every time we've played them I am always noticing Moutinho popping up all over the place, covering every blade of grass etc. Neves never stands out, unless he's belting one in.
Rice - he looks amazing against us every time, but then average when I see him against the likes of City or Chelsea, or when I've seen him with England. He would also cost a load, as he's young and English.
Phillips - just not that good. No thanks
Koopmeiners - I have only ever seen him against us, so the sample size is very small. But he looked slow and unathletic. Not what I would want in a CDM. Although, Carrick did ok, so what do I know.
To add one more - I don't want us to sign Ward-Prouse. He is undoubtedly hard working and puts in a great freekick, but he doesn't do much defensively. It looks like its Oriol Romeu doing the hard work for them and who makes JWP look better.
Romeu could have been a decent option two years ago. But he's close to 30 now I think, so don't want another Matic.
i should have said it could have worked if we’d put them together before Pogba wanted to leave. As in its a good balance. I’m not a huge pogba fan but I wouldn’t have minded unlocking him and getting him back to his best.
Can understand that to a degree
i don't think Pogbas mentality or style of play is suited to the tempo of the premiership unfortunately no matter where he's played or who's put around him. Itl go down as a major failed signing, times ran out , time to move on and buy a cog that functions smoothly
Exactly. Ole just wants midfielders capable of dovetailing with each other.
Even when Matic plays, he doesn't just strictly sit back.
That being said, whoever we do get should have good defensive attributes.
Fred and McTominay is no doubt our first choice midfield.
Some would say we need more creativity, but I'd honestly be happy getting someone similar to rotate.
If Ole does need someone slightly different, then players like Savic, Fabian, Saul, etc should all be considered to replace Pogba, although if I'm honest, I feel Van de Beek can fill that 10/8 role if/when needed.
A midfield four of:
Fred
McTominay
New CDM (Rice, Zakaria, Laimer, Bissouma, etc)
Caicedo (potential)
All of these are defensively very solid and we wouldn't see a drop off in intensity if we had to rotate one of them like we see when we put Matic and Pogba in.
Thing is, whilst this sounds good on paper, Ole clearly wants to play a 4231 and will more often than not stick to that system.
He likes Pogba deep because of his passing range. Ole played with Scholes and although Pogba nowhere as consistent as Scholes, he boasts a similar passing range when he's on it.
However, with Fred and McTominay doing such a good job in the pivot, I'm not sure of what kind of player Ole would want if (more a case of when) Pogba leaves.
Ole will either want a playmaker in the role of Carrick or a combative midfielder i.e. Fred/McTominay.
Guess time will tell.
Presumably you think we will still go for a starter CDM in the summer however Caciedo performs until then
One more option that I think could be a good signing for us -- David Luiz with Villa. I am not sure if he is on loan from City, or was sold, so that would probably complicate things. But he is good.
Pogba will soon be gone so we're looking for a holding player to sit next to Fred/McTominay in a two. While both of them are reasonable ball winners, neither are particularly expansive passers, so whoever we bring in really needs to be decent at circulating the ball. I'd say that we're looking for a Carrick type.
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Which for me makes Koopmeiners the best pick of all available able to play CM/DM/CB left footed, brilliant expansive passer, leader on the pitch and not going to cost the earth so low risk high reward. With DVB at the club would also add another Dutch friend for him to play with
I'd like to think so. We need options. I mean, I wouldn't even necessarily say a starter, whatever a 'starter' is these days because as you know, there's so much rotation. I just want that a player who is extremely hard working and can cover every blade of grass, i.e. Fred/McTominay, because as I said before, we see the distinct drop off in work rate when we go from Fred/McTominay to Pogba/Matic.
That's not being disrespectful to the latter pair, but they're just not those types of players I guess (Matic was but has lost his legs). I just think in this system and the way we play, having two workers in the pivot suits us more.
Can only see us buying a DM in the summer if Matic leaves,otherwise expect Caciedo (if signs) to play in a similar area but not be a replacement
I`m not sure about that you`d have too many midfielders to rotate from and it would be tricky to keep everyone happy. Matic(he`s not leaving he just signed a 3yr deal nobody is gonna buy him anyway with his wages), Fred, Scott, Caicedo and another new signing that would presumably start considering the latter(based off media noise) wants an assured minimum amount of game time on top of the mentioned others also wanting to play may be an overkill to rotate wisely for 2 positions
I agree, and because the thread is called 'Matic replacements' my midfield was based off the assumption that he wouldnt be here next season. If not, as you said, it'd be an overkill.
That being said, I think he should be 4th choice next season, meaning we should rotate with Fred, McT and new signing.
I personally wouldnt be comfortable with Caicedo as our 3rd choice because lets be honest, it'd be a risk. He has zero experience and only turned 19 last month.
I would, however, be happy to buy him and loan him back out, whilst we have our four midfielders and then in a couple of seasons, he can replace what would be a 35 year old Matic, who will most likely become surplus.
Tielesman? I know he is not the same type as Matic, but I thought he had shades of Carrick today. And I think we could need someone like that next to Fred or McTominay. A good passer, but not a luxury player.
I like him but we have Bruno and DVB plus Pogba and McFred. Tielesman would be more of the same imo: good player but not someone that can anchor the midfield.
We don’t play anchor, we play 4231 anyway.
I think he did that, in a similar fashion Carrick/Xabi often did. Ndidi was pressing much more, and a bit all over the place breaking up play, while Tielesman dropped deeper dictating play.
True but he did have Ndidi. Carrick had Scholes
I don't disagree with you I think, I just rate Carrick very highly for the job he had to do and how well he did it. I would love to find a player like that.
True but he did have Ndidi. Carrick had Scholes
I don't disagree with you I think, I just rate Carrick very highly for the job he had to do and how well he did it. I would love to find a player like that.
I do too. A player like that would mean a lot for us right now. But remember, Carrick was more attacking as a youngster too. Became deeper and deeper as he became more experienced. Not seen that much of Tielesman. Looked a bit hyped when he arrived, but improved. And he do looks to play a bit deeper now. Interesting development.
Assuming we’re going to be using McTominay or Fred next to them, whoever we sign has to be comfortable on the ball. If it was Pogba staying in the double pivot, we’d need an outright ball winner, without as much thought about on ball ability.
Was actually thinking this. Made the most passes (76) and the most touches (107) in the game today with a pass accuracy of 86.1%.
Now, I keep changing my mind regards what type of midfielder we should get and today it was pretty evident that we needed someone to just get on the ball and control the game.
In terms of stats, Fred was that player for us today, with 68 passes and a pass accuracy of 76.5%. Whilst I don't believe Fred is bad passer of the ball, I just don't think he should be our midfield dictator, as I feel his best attribute is breaking up play.
Because of this, as you said, it'd be nice to get someone like Tielemans, who not only gets on the ball and creates but also has good defensive attributes to play next to a McT or Fred.
With it looking likely that Pogba will go, we probably are in need of more of a ball player rather than ball winner but ill change my mind again next week.
If not Tielemans, players like Fabian, Ward-Prowse, Savic, etc, all might be better players to help us get on the ball a bit more.
I think having a consistent style of play would help identify what we need....
I think if we sign young Caicedo then I'm hoping we put forth a considerable offer to Rennes for Camavinga. Both players in tandem in a double pivot would provide everything we require potentially in the build up phase and provide defensive balance.
We are not getting Cama Adnan.
He will end up with Zidane at RM.
He will end up with Zidane at RM.
If Madrid are all in for mbappe they can’t afford him.
You're probably right but i'm sure we will test the waters.
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I don’t know enough about Caicedo but a double pivot with Camavinga would work with a similarly energetic player. The thing is we have that double pivot already with McTominay and Fred so do we want more of the same or a holding player?
I don't believe Fred and McTominay are good enough as a pair in the mid to long-term to help us control games and play on the front foot. We need energy but also quality on the ball which is something that Caicedo is also said to provide.
I've never seen the kid Caicedo play apart from YouTube highlights. But according to people who have, they believe he will shock people if/when he arrives and they also say he has the ability to advance play at a very good level from deeper and can also be deployed as the Libero to advance play in the first phase of the build up. He's also quick and mobile and has been described by several regular observers as having very high in game intelligence which is likely why the Ecuador coach had no qualms about giving the player the responsibility against the likes of Argentina, Colombia and Uruguay.
We usually play 4231 (or 4213) at the moment but that’s more about the players we have than some philosophical ideal. If we get a top CDM we can play a different formation.
Our defensive frailty is partly down to the lack of reliable protection from midfield. Sure, we have guys who can tackle and we do okay but I prefer a top class number-six-type these days.
But there are different types of sixes. The perfect player does not exist as, of course, you’d want an intelligent, positionally disciplined guy with pace, strength, stamina, tackling and passing ability. Good luck finding that freak of nature. If we can’t have it all we should prioritise intelligence, positioning and passing, in the Carrick mould. Can’t think of anyone in his class except maybe Kroos, hopefully there are others.
Our defensive frailty is partly down to the lack of reliable protection from midfield. Sure, we have guys who can tackle and we do okay but I prefer a top class number-six-type these days.
But there are different types of sixes. The perfect player does not exist as, of course, you’d want an intelligent, positionally disciplined guy with pace, strength, stamina, tackling and passing ability. Good luck finding that freak of nature. If we can’t have it all we should prioritise intelligence, positioning and passing, in the Carrick mould. Can’t think of anyone in his class except maybe Kroos, hopefully there are others.
Assuming we need four options for our midfield two, I think we're building the squad towards:
Fred
McTominay
Matic
One out of Garner/Caicedo
The fourth slot will be taken by whomever out of the two matures the most in the next 6 months. If they both do, that'll be the end of Matic right there. If neither does, we'll probably let them rotate minutes while holding fire to buy a replacement in 2022.
I just don't see us buying any additional midfielders this summer. Ole will want to keep the pathway clear for the kids. He'll see the three senior players alongside them as sufficient to lead them through most matches.
Fred
McTominay
Matic
One out of Garner/Caicedo
The fourth slot will be taken by whomever out of the two matures the most in the next 6 months. If they both do, that'll be the end of Matic right there. If neither does, we'll probably let them rotate minutes while holding fire to buy a replacement in 2022.
I just don't see us buying any additional midfielders this summer. Ole will want to keep the pathway clear for the kids. He'll see the three senior players alongside them as sufficient to lead them through most matches.
It's not unlikely but the approach is so slow it's driving everyone insane. The world is moving at one pace, Man Utd at another.
You could be right and I’m sure Ole hopes the kids will come through but that group of 4 or 5 looks painfully short of top quality to me. I’m not saying it’s easy to get players in to improve that but unless those kids exceed expectations we’re going to have to buy.
Dendoncker please. Young Matic right there.
Kalvin Phillips. MOTD just did a lovely piece on in dropping into a back 3, plus he has great long range passing, something with our speedy attack could create lots of one v ones for us.
He is leeds through and through. No way he will come to united. Will get dogs abuse from the leeds fans.
I mentioned Locatelli awhile ago. Very unrealistic that we would be interested, but he looks very exciting. Excellent passer of the ball, two footed, tactically adept, big unit and defends well. A Ferrari of a midfielder. 22 years old, two years left of his contract. Milan, Juve or Inter will get a good player there.