Neves. Snatch him before City
Potential Matic Replacements
- Thread starter FootyGirl88
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I am all for keeping Matic for a season or two. What i am against is starting him almost every game. I'd like to to see us try Pereira in there against lesser teams (we look like the lesser team lately) and change how we approach our defending. I think it would be better if the front 6 was proactive in their defending, instead of retreating all the time.
By so doing, we could stop what we see happening almost all the time in that Matic/whoever is the DM forever playing like a 3rd CB. Also can we do away with dwelling on the ball, something Matic is prone to doing a lot, I'd like to see a 15s rule implemented by Mourinho/new manager that whenever we win the ball, within 15s it should have reached the opposition goal.
By so doing, we could stop what we see happening almost all the time in that Matic/whoever is the DM forever playing like a 3rd CB. Also can we do away with dwelling on the ball, something Matic is prone to doing a lot, I'd like to see a 15s rule implemented by Mourinho/new manager that whenever we win the ball, within 15s it should have reached the opposition goal.
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The state of the Caf sometimes. Jeez! There is just not enough proof to say that Matic is finished. calm yourselves
A man for 2 years in one position is not really bad, if the players in other position are long term replacements. We always don't get a player we want who is young and will stay on for long.
Only problem is if the said player can't do a 2 as well.
Anyways, given that the whole teams such sucks, I will wait and see how Matic does rest of the season. Even he might improve.
I has mentioned this in one of the other threads - Matic got dropped a lot in second half of Chelsea's winning season. Admittedly Baka turned out to be a horrible replacement.
Surely there is a Rakitic type player out there for Man Utd
Surely there is a Rakitic type player out there for Man Utd
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And this, ladies and gentlemen, is an example of how low we are setting our standards nowadays. Scott McTominay in the role made famous by Carrick. Scott can barely pass a ball, mate.
I keep seeing all these posts jumping to Matic's defense like a Captain save a ho, but most logical fans are saying keep him as back up, but he shouldn't be a regular starter anymore, he clearly has stamina issues, he played half a decent season for us and then his level dropped signifigantly, and even in Chelsea's team the season before he tailed off a lot, Kante just covers so much ground it hid his weaknesses, and you don't set up a top side by playing players to cover weakness, that's last ditch measures, it's papering over cracks.
As far as Herrera goes, I think he'll walk for free at the end of the season, and I think Pereira is wasted in that deeper a role. Fred could perhaps be coached into being a dynamic DM but from what we've seen so far I find it hard to see him having the discipline of the likes of Casemiro and Fernandinho.
Even though Lyon got demolished by PSG last night I thought Ndombele was excellent once again and has so much in his locker, I just question if he'd be wasted in a more restrained role sitting at the base.
As far as Herrera goes, I think he'll walk for free at the end of the season, and I think Pereira is wasted in that deeper a role. Fred could perhaps be coached into being a dynamic DM but from what we've seen so far I find it hard to see him having the discipline of the likes of Casemiro and Fernandinho.
Even though Lyon got demolished by PSG last night I thought Ndombele was excellent once again and has so much in his locker, I just question if he'd be wasted in a more restrained role sitting at the base.
Tough one really. Who out there is marketable and will shift sufficient number of shirts to satisfy the man who reigns over the transfer kity?
I see people saying Neves, but how marketable is he?
I see people saying Neves, but how marketable is he?
We don't need Neves. We have Andreas already.
Matic is 30, for crying out loud! Not old in today age standards. Would be old in th 90's though.
Rodrigo should have been the one. With him and Kovacic out of the picture, the options look a bit less convincing currently. Truthfully I'd rather see us spend money on NDombele and extend Herrera's contract for now. Maybe use Fred there as well.
As far as less known players go, Marc Roca from Espanyol and Sangare from Toulouse could be interesting, but they'd also be a lot more risky and we need players that might be a bit further ahead in their development. As much as I would like us to sign Neves, he's going to be very expensive and I wonder with everything we still need, if our money is better spend elsewhere.
Tthe value in the market options could be Danilo Pereira and Brozovic, but I don't think they'll get us where we want to be. I haven't seen enough of Danilo Pereira recently.
Edit: And Kondogbia, had a really good season last year.
As far as less known players go, Marc Roca from Espanyol and Sangare from Toulouse could be interesting, but they'd also be a lot more risky and we need players that might be a bit further ahead in their development. As much as I would like us to sign Neves, he's going to be very expensive and I wonder with everything we still need, if our money is better spend elsewhere.
Tthe value in the market options could be Danilo Pereira and Brozovic, but I don't think they'll get us where we want to be. I haven't seen enough of Danilo Pereira recently.
Edit: And Kondogbia, had a really good season last year.
I don't think there's such a thing as a marketable holding midfielder, it's not really a glamour posiiton.
Good talent but is he worth the hype?
Baka and matic are 2 different style players. I don't think Baka could be classified as matic replacement, he was just a midfielder bought by conte. Jorginho was proper matic replacement for Chelsea.
Has all the basis for a top player.
I'm not too fussed about his price or even the idea of easing him in slowly...but you can only really do that when you have the luxury to do so.
Playing Matic and then sticking someone next to him who is just going to do the same job but worse, just isn't good enough. Even a raw and adapting Fred will offer more to the team than this. As would Pereira or Herrera.
You leave players out because in the circumstance you believe someone else will offer more to the team, I would have thought. Mourinho seems to have started leaving people out just because he doesn't want to play them, or possibly because someone else is taller than them. There is very little actual logic to it.
We are losing games and not getting near our own expectations. You can't afford the luxury of leaving people out when the people you pick instead bring next to nothing to the table.
I don't mean to be harsh, but if we're honest, Mctominay shouldn't be near a premiership starting line up, never mind United's. He does not offer anything. I now people don't like criticising our young players, but you can't afford to carry players just for the sake of it even at the best of times. You also can't just pick a young player repeatedly based on nothing as it sends tge wrong message both to other young players and the senior players being left out as a result.
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Do you think Ndombele is really a holder though? I'm a big fan of his an he is good defensively, but I feel he's more of a box to box as he can contribute at both ends.
Kondogbia is an interesting shout as a more mobile like for like replacement for Matic.
What I suggested was basically in line with what you said, use Matic, Herrera and Fred as the #6 and NDombele as the #8. If I remember it correctly I've seen him play deeper for Lyon in 4-2-3-1, but that was just once or twice, and he did well. As you know Lyon mostly play with a 4-3-3 or 4-4-2 with a diamond and that's what I think we should use as well. Basically, I'd rather see us sign NDombele first and replace Matic later. I don't think we'd be able to do both, since we probably need a #10, a right winger and at least one CB. Neves and NDombele would obviously be ideal.
Sander Berge. Strong, fast, good with the ball, good passing. Doesn't contribute much in the final third, but that's not important for this role. Perfect age to rotate with Matic for a season or two, before advancing to first choice (if he doesn't take the spot before that).
We just signed him for 40m a year ago and now we are already thinking about his replacement. We have spent tons of money in our midfield and it's madness that we haven't settle with Carrick's replacement. We need identity in our formation or system, I am seriously got no clue what is Jose wants us to play.
If we are going to find a new player in that no 6 role, that guy better be the pivot point of how we build up our attack. I don't think Matic & Fellaini are the right man for the role.
If we are going to find a new player in that no 6 role, that guy better be the pivot point of how we build up our attack. I don't think Matic & Fellaini are the right man for the role.
Gotcha, I really rate Ndombele but I wouldn't go another season with Matic starting as our main #6 as I don't see Herrera being here next season and I am not convinced Fred has the discipline to play that kind of holding role. I do agree that the diamond is the formation we should be looking at making our main one going forward given the players we have.
I am hoping you are wrong on that one. And I agree that Matic probably shouldn't (and can't) play as many games as he has in recent years.
Fred definitely has the discipline to play as a holding midfielder. He played there plenty of times for Shakhtar and Guardiola wanted him to take over from Fernandinho.
Anyone who has the audicity to move would be a good start.
Only joking.I dont mind Matic but I see him more as a decent bench option now.
I hear that young Lyon chap,who I believe recently got a national team call-up,is well regarded.
Edit.
Wouldn't be against the idea of Matic being utilised as a CB.
Only joking.I dont mind Matic but I see him more as a decent bench option now.
I hear that young Lyon chap,who I believe recently got a national team call-up,is well regarded.
Edit.
Wouldn't be against the idea of Matic being utilised as a CB.
Andreas Perreira,
Give him a run of 3-4 games, he can do it
Give him a run of 3-4 games, he can do it
If Mourinho sees anyone as Matic's replacement it would probably be McTominay, although he might just try and convert both of them into CBs in any case.
While he probably is better than our other options at those aspects, saying that he's incredible is a massive over-rating. Carrick was miles better than him in those aspects. Matic regularly gets caught out of position, gets dribbled straight past or is easily played around. Compare that to Carrick who had a natural ability to position himself so as to make the opposition have to slow down and ultimately pass the ball sideways or backwards. Not to mention his passing and vision far surpassed Matic.
Well, hopefully we give a shot then.
Matic is in Valencia territory IMO, one game a week, which is why he shouldn't be a starting fixture. As far as Herrera and Fred go, I'm pretty sure Ander's contract is up at the end of this season and there doesn't seem to be any sign of a new one, he could possibly even go for a small fee in January I think. I know the poster above said Fred can play as a holder but when I saw him for Shaktar it was a double pivot in midfield and he was the more offensive of the two, but perhaps he can be coached into being the solo holder, worth a try at least.
Personally think Thiago looks good in that position. Good technical ability, good vision and decent defensive contribution as well.
Still prefer Andreas further forward personally. Don’t want to see him sitting in front of the defence, he has much more to offer going the other way. He can play alongside Pogba in front of whoever, as he’s more aggressive and can press.
Ndombele would be wasted as a holding CDM, like the role Matic usually plays in. A role in which playing safe is vital. Additionally a future CDM would need to be efficient on the ball, unless we improve our CBs passing. But seeing as we would likely have a new manager and potentially a new style of play soon/next season then we do not really know how we will play.
But as for a replacement of Matic and the role he currently plays in; the player that is most similar to Matic is Sander Berge. But i reckon most norwegians would say this.
But as for a replacement of Matic and the role he currently plays in; the player that is most similar to Matic is Sander Berge. But i reckon most norwegians would say this.
You do realise his partner is Moutinho, whos hardly the defensive type player.
You do realize thats complete nonsense?
If anything Moutinho has been the more impressive player this season, but he's 32 so not a likely transfer target
Which signings since Summer 2016 do you believe fell into this category prior to signing them?
I certainly wouldn't say any out of Bailly, Lindelof, Fred, Lukaku, Pogba, Dalot or Mkhitaryan were. Ibrahimovich was free so the short term nature of his signing was self-explanatory. That leaves Matic and Sanchez... The former of which was a key reason for us getting Champions League football last year (so paid for himself), the latter was one of the best players in the league who was also on Guardiola's radar. Therefore
I've no idea where people get the idea that we've had a short term transfer strategy these last few years... I'd argue the opposite is actually true (probably why Mourinho was after Alderweireld and Perisic) and particularly the likes of Lindelof/Bailly/Smalling need a more experienced leader next to them. Our signings have been poor no doubt but that has nothing to do with them being "short term".
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I agree, I'm not making a direct comparison obviously, but I'd love to see Pogba and Pereira play as #8's ahead of a holder, like Kroos and Modric at Real.
We are grooming Pereira to do that. Whilst Fellaini, Herrara, Pogba as he matures and the developing McTominay can all hold fort there. Plus we have Fred. Its not really a priority
Besides Matic isnt even finished. He has just been in bad form like most of our squad.
Besides Matic isnt even finished. He has just been in bad form like most of our squad.
Really hope when we do buy Matic's replacement that is not based on the number of shirt sales. I think that the man who reigns over the transfer kitty stay away from it and pass the decision on to someone else.
We should bring in a Director of Football as soon as possible so Ed sticks to the commercial side and we should not worry so much about who sells the most shirts but rather be more concerned about what his replacement can contribute on the pitch.
Vidal.
January here we come.
January here we come.