I did notice you talked about their height differential and aerial ability and I gave clear examples as to why we`d be ten times worse with them as a pair having to deal with both ground defending and aerial duels which I`ve noticed you intentionally negated. The difference between them and the likes of Dias/Stones is they`ve been much better trained under harder circumstances to deal with them Stones has plenty of PL experience and Dias was the leader of Benfica`s defence Axel/Bailly are NOWHERE near as commanding as them and which top team ever got away without a CB good in the air? Madrid have had Ramos, Barca Puyol/Pique, Bayern with Boateng and Dante who was ten times worse than Maguire but they still won a CL, City with Laporte, Liverpool with VVD, Chelsea with Terry, Utd with Vidic, Arsenal with Adams/Camphell etc I could go on and on but you are NOT going to challenge for major honors without a CB thats very good in the air
I was not suggesting Maguire is as good as VVD/Varane it was more a case of saying that you rate him waaay too lowly if you think he is that easy to upgrade on by just playing Axel/Bailly a sure bet upgrade on him would be the level of CBs I`ve said as some of these other names people brand about like Konate, Upamecano, Milenkovic etc whilst good are by no means sure upgrades on him and there is EVERY chance our defence becomes worse if you replace him with those level of players.
fulfilled so until he actually proves himself to the extent where we can trust him week in week out like Bailly/Maguire ridiculous to suggest we should drop our most consistent CB for him.
You're right I did ignore it because those examples didn't say much in my opinion I said it's overstated - not irrelevant. Your example of Bailly and Lindeloff the latter is actually worse than Bailly so I don't really get the relevance - and I disagree on your point about the aerial target for Instanbul there was a lot more wrong with that game. So I agree to disagree here I'm not going to harken on about it I feel they are adequate enough in the air. There are top teams in recent history who have won league titles and got to CL league finals and their CBs don't dominate in the air, - PSG, Madrid ( see previous post.
In regards to the double pivot listen to an interview Uncle Rio gave today on Full Time Devils regarding todays game at 10:38 he answers a question and he sums it up perfectly (apparently I can't post media yet). If you couldn't notice the difference between our double pivot in build up play, and Liverpool's single pivot in general play today then I don't know what will help you realise it. It's affecting the way we generally play.
See the thing with stats is that they're so subjective, so when you talk about "since we signed Maguire" we also signed AWB during that time - and I would wager prior to signing an RB that was where we were attacked down the most, many may have forgotten but that used to be the way to get at united down our right-hand side. We signed Spider and all that changed now people criticise him for so much else because we're never happy as fans I digress. Point is do we point out your clean sheet stat to him or Maguire how so you discern who to credit, should I point to AWB tackle rate as you go to HM interception rate (in a double pivoted midfield might I add)
We English we love to hype our own, Aurelio De Laurentiis - states how average Maguire is, Van Der Vaart - "England's worst CB", Uncle Pat wants him on the bench. A few of our fellow English pundits get around and create a narrative mix in a few favourable tabloids and suddenly the footy beer goggles are on and we can't be honest about with what we're seeing.
You mentioned Axel and Bailly performances, let me give you some of Maguire's.
He performed a world-class Ju-Jitsu takedown on Luke Shaw vs Spurs and produced one of the most tepid performances from a United Captain in one of our most embarrassing losses.
Players who have skinned him that have led to a goal win lose or draw:
FK Partizan Belgrad vs Man Utd: I've never from the stands seen one man get skinned so many time by attackers live at a game so much it was insane (PS, I bet English Commentary didn't even mention it).
1. Onel Hernandez - Man Utd 3 - Norwich 1
2. Batshyaui Man Utd - 2 Chelsea 1
3. Turned and skinned in a few Arsenal games.
Aerially wanting, Newcastle Calum Wilson De Gea save, legendary choke slam in the box vs Chelsea, Aston Villa Bailly block another tepid header from HM which led to Bailly digging him out (again). I'll stop here (but trust me I could go on and on, YouTube Harry Maguire what other centerback do you find such a vast amount of howler compilations for one centreback.
I don't want to become one of those fans who comes across negative about our club especially now, because I love what's happening at our club, top of the league! But Harry Maguire is an average CB at a great club, we just have to be honest about that.
Listen Ole has his favourite so it won't happen but I do feel rather than just say who can we buy or wait till our talent goes abroad and then want to buy him back for four times the price - fans should look at Axel and Bailly for what they are, VERY talented Centre Halves.
Out of curiosity, who was the better candidate at the time Maguire was given the armband? If you actually take a moment and look at the players that were here at the time, you would realise there weren't many other candidates. Players like Mata and Matic don't feature regularly. De Gea isn't any more captain material than Maguire - neither is Pogba with all his inconsistency and off field antics. The whole captaincy thing has been ridiculously blown out proportions. As if Bruno would have played any better if given the armband. I actually respect Solskjær for not headlessly drop Maguire as a captain due to fan pressure. You don't strip someone of a captaincy in the middle of a season. The short break between seasons didn't allow any changes as we basically went straight into this season. With that being said, I wouldn't be surprised if Bruno is given the captaincy before next season.
Probably would've said Mata Club captain (like we did with Gary Neville) matchday captain wasn't really set as not to ruffle any feathers. Remember Giggs was club captain at a point but he wasn't a starter - so we would switch it between Rio, Evra and Vida etc. Would've said something like that.
