[Garnacho's Shoelaces]

Actually thought we did okay first half. Some neat interchanges of the ball that carved open space, but our front three really needed to step up and when that didn’t happen we’d naturally invite pressure which happened second half.

Rashford’s close ball control was pretty dire, and what’s the deal with him and Garnacho? They looked like they were playing on different sides, that really needs to be sorted out.

Agreed. We should have been out of sight by half time between Bruno's header and the penalty.

 

[IamBurnsey]

A bit how I feel this morning. Trouble is Utd and I go back a long time, fecking daft really but that’s football, it annoys and it also makes you happy and all in the same game.
First half yesterday was ok, it was a genuine entertaining match and how it was 0-0 at HT I don’t know. Second half was like Utd were a different team, bloody awful and when the first goal went in we went from bad to worse.
Feck it and bollocks to it, until the next game that is.

Yea i am same, I have been supporting them now since 1990 so the hope always slowly trickles back after a bad match but there is something badly wrong with the club atm.

 

[sunama]

We desperately need a striker in his prime - no youth prospects!
To win games, we need to score goals and if we score 1 goal every 2 games, this won't work out well.

 

[antohan]

I don't think they could, unless he's hell bent on sticking with 4-3-3 which it looks like... Mount for me is not the answer to play a 4-3-3.. this could all fall into place better if Rashford played left and we put Greenwood as Striker.. and Hojlund from the right, Antony bench , Garnacho bench and brought on as impact subs... only ..

Splendid, sign a striker and play him wide right to pin your hopes on a chap who hasn't trained or played top level football for 18 months and whose head is likely completely fecked up.

Rashford’s close ball control was pretty dire, and what’s the deal with him and Garnacho? They looked like they were playing on different sides, that really needs to be sorted out.

The way to sort it out is both alternating as wide left options. Else you get one for the price of two first XI spots, if that.

 

[Cantonagotmehere]

On another note, was there any comment about the trash thrown at our players at Spurs. It was awful in my humble opinion and should be a fine etc... The announcer in the USA did not say a word. But Le Seaux and/or Dixon hate us anyway.

 

[redmanx]

We desperately need a striker in his prime - no youth prospects!
To win games, we need to score goals and if we score 1 goal every 2 games, this won't work out well.

We have to sign a proven scorer and until we do we'll keep letting teams of the hook, a decent striker, a Kane, would have put those first half chances away. But where do we find one?

 

[Hughie77]

Splendid, sign a striker and play him wide right to pin your hopes on a chap who hasn't trained or played top level football for 18 months and whose head is likely completely fecked up.



The way to sort it out is both alternating as wide left options. Else you get one for the price of two first XI spots, if that.

Hojlund is not a Striker he played wide , but ETH is going to play him as a striker and as for Greenwood it wouldn't take him long to settle back in imo, he's Bern training for over 2 mths or more OK on his own, match fit he won't be that won't take him long he's still young...

Anyway Rashford has to play left, and Antony can sit on the bench , put Sancho there.. because the guys not doing it.

 

[Lyng]

Hojlund is not a Striker he played wide , but ETH is going to play him as a striker and as for Greenwood it wouldn't take him long to settle back in imo, he's Bern training for over 2 mths or more OK on his own, match fit he won't be that won't take him long he's still young...

Anyway Rashford has to play left, and Antony can sit on the bench , put Sancho there.. because the guys not doing it.

Højlund is a striker. Not a winger. He can play wide but he is best as a striker.

 

[Buster15]

A bit how I feel this morning. Trouble is Utd and I go back a long time, fecking daft really but that’s football, it annoys and it also makes you happy and all in the same game.
First half yesterday was ok, it was a genuine entertaining match and how it was 0-0 at HT I don’t know. Second half was like Utd were a different team, bloody awful and when the first goal went in we went from bad to worse.
Feck it and bollocks to it, until the next game that is.

You and me both mate. I first started to support Manchester United just after Munich and despite living some way away, I have done ever since. Like you, I find performances like that incredibly frustrating. Not just because of how they lost, which was more of a capitulation, but the way they played.
These are some very good players who just lost their heads and their discipline. They ended up as a disorganised rabble.

And by the way, did you see how easily Brighton put 4 past Wolves away.

 

[Borys]

I actually think the mentality problem is players are not buying this setup from ETH. Neither player feels comfortable in this.
We're playing worse than the sum of the parts.

 

[sglowrider]

 

[Melville Red]

You and me both mate. I first started to support Manchester United just after Munich and despite living some way away, I have done ever since. Like you, I find performances like that incredibly frustrating. Not just because of how they lost, which was more of a capitulation, but the way they played.
These are some very good players who just lost their heads and their discipline. They ended up as a disorganised rabble.

And by the way, did you see how easily Brighton put 4 past Wolves away.

Oh yes Brighton who allegedly sold their best midfield players, makes you laugh doesn’t it. Still look on the bright side Chelsea got embarrassed by West Ham and when things go really bad just think you could have been born to support Everton, oh the thought of it

 

[BobFromParva]

I actually think the mentality problem is players are not buying this setup from ETH. Neither player feels comfortable in this.
We're playing worse than the sum of the parts.

The negativity in here is OTT, you’re in transition between styles of play and have new players bedding in.
It won’t just happen seamlessly, it takes time but you’ll get there, so have patience.
You started very well, bossed the park for the first half hour against a very good spurs side, missed some chances petered out a bit and then went out of shape in the 2nd half.
TH swapped things around ‘in game’ used all your subs, I think, and he’ll have learnt a lot from that, which all adds to improvements going forwards.
Losing your opening away game isn’t the end of the world, you’ll be hit and miss until the players get comfortable with a new way of playing but I’m sure you’ll be in the mix come Xmas.

Think you have problems? We’ve just totally dominated our early round FA cup game but ended up drawing 1 all at home to bloody Barnoldswick!

 

[gorshed]

My biggest concern is the lack of fitness and physicality, how do we look so far off the pace, especially when we have players who can’t seem to do the basics so many sloppy passes or choosing the wrong option or just blindly lumping the ball into the box hoping something might come off, struggling to see what United game plan is at the minute

 

[Denis79]

Yea i am same, I have been supporting them now since 1990 so the hope always slowly trickles back after a bad match but there is something badly wrong with the club atm.

I don't believe anything is wrong, I just believe the competition has improved. If you want to be competetive at the highest level so many things need to click nowadays.

 

[Paul778]

I don't believe anything is wrong, I just believe the competition has improved. If you want to be competetive at the highest level so many things need to click nowadays.

In business if all you competitors are improving, becoming more effective, increasing their margins. etc whilst your company stands still I would say that is wrong.

Typically it means that company is in reactive mode trying to catch up with it's competitors as fast as possible. In those cases they have to outspend their rivals.

 

[redshaw]

Something is a little odd, we saw how pumped Martinez and Casemiro were last year. Antony doing everything to get a move here. There was a lot of optimism and drive to get us back.

It's like the players know they can't do much better, they will probably be up for the CL games but another top 4 battle is not that enticing. Some are looking to Saudi, the momentum and morale we had last year has gone.

 

[Borys]

The negativity in here is OTT, you’re in transition between styles of play and have new players bedding in.
It won’t just happen seamlessly, it takes time but you’ll get there, so have patience.
You started very well, bossed the park for the first half hour against a very good spurs side, missed some chances petered out a bit and then went out of shape in the 2nd half.
TH swapped things around ‘in game’ used all your subs, I think, and he’ll have learnt a lot from that, which all adds to improvements going forwards.
Losing your opening away game isn’t the end of the world, you’ll be hit and miss until the players get comfortable with a new way of playing but I’m sure you’ll be in the mix come Xmas.

Think you have problems? We’ve just totally dominated our early round FA cup game but ended up drawing 1 all at home to bloody Barnoldswick!

Which players are bedding in? Mount seems like a guy who is just following instructions, not sure if he needs to "bed in". The rest of the players are either not comfortable in role they are being asked to play or not fit.

 

[Denis79]

In business if all you competitors are improving, becoming more effective, increasing their margins. etc whilst your company stands still I would say that is wrong.

Typically it means that company is in reactive mode trying to catch up with it's competitors as fast as possible. In those cases they have to outspend their rivals.

From a fan's standpoint, you're absolutely right. However, I have a feeling that the Glazers' ambitions don't stretch beyond securing a top 4 spot and Champions League football. If I'm correct and they are content with just achieving a top 4 position, then we can say we're doing well enough.

 

[Gordon Godot]

I don't believe anything is wrong, I just believe the competition has improved. If you want to be competetive at the highest level so many things need to click nowadays.

So how are other teams doing so much better. We should have been annihalated by Wolves and then they were whipped at home. Of course things are wrong.

 

[Gordon Godot]

From a fan's standpoint, you're absolutely right. However, I have a feeling that the Glazers' ambitions don't stretch beyond securing a top 4 spot and Champions League football. If I'm correct and they are content with just achieving a top 4 position, then we can say we're doing well enough.

Glazers never cared about winning, their original buyout business plan was based on top 4 and a good cup run. Thats the limit of their ambition

 

[Denis79]

Glazers never cared about winning, their original buyout business plan was based on top 4 and a good cup run. Thats the limit of their ambition

That is the point I was trying to make. Last season we finished third and qualified for the Champions League, the club has invested in a few players and in their logic this is what is needed to make top 4 again. There is no ambition to go further than that because the cost and restructure needed to be a powerhouse again is very high without equal return in profits. Hence nothing is wrong according to the people in charge.

 

[Lyng]

Excellent video. Its a bit shocking to see how we completely abandon the gameplan in second half.

 

[MadMike]

I thought the problem on Saturday was not the midfield (I actually liked Mount this time) but the attack.

The whole triplet up-front is simply not working. Garnacho is still too raw to be starting games, his decision making is too poor. Antony is still very far from convincing anyone he's a good enough RW, there's more hope on Sancho or even Amad Diallo at the moment. Finally Rashford seems clueless in the middle. We need Hojlund to hit the ground running and our attack to start being a danger to the opposition, if we're to have any hope of a high placed finish.

Would having a DLP next to Casemiro help in certain games or certain phases of games? Yes, absolutely. But like with the new ball-playing GK, it's not panacea, it won't fix everything. The team needs to improve its fitness and to discover a goal-scoring threat that is currently lacking. We have started the season very slow form a level of performance perspective. Adding one more defence-minded CM won't fix that at all.

 

[sglowrider]

Excellent video. Its a bit shocking to see how we completely abandon the gameplan in second half.

Yes. I like the guy's analysis usually. He is very pro-Aramabat .. being a fellow Tunisian.

 

[trevor newnham]

I am very much of the opinion that we should show some patience but it seems plain to me that Mount is struggling to fit into the game plan and he and Bruno do not fit together, that Bruno can lose his head when it isn't going his way, that Antony is a one trick pony, that Garnacho is more of an impact off the bench, that Rashford must play in his preferred position on the left, we need another DM to help Cas. Of course, this might change when Hojlund starts. I am fearful of being too pessimistic this early in the season, but it is worrying

 

[The Corinthian]

We probably deserved a draw vs Wolves and the same vs Spurs, so a win and a loss is a better outcome than that. But the performances need to start improving and fast.

 

[Infra-red]

My biggest concern is the lack of fitness and physicality, how do we look so far off the pace, especially when we have players who can’t seem to do the basics so many sloppy passes or choosing the wrong option or just blindly lumping the ball into the box hoping something might come off, struggling to see what United game plan is at the minute

United don't look fit. The physical data from the Spurs defeat doesn't make great reading for United's conditioning coaches:

Distance Covered
115km — TOT
110km — MUN

Sprints
191 — TOT
127 — MUN

High Speed Runs
801 — TOT
666 — MUN

Low Speed Runs
2,176 — TOT
1,966 — MUN

Jogging
4,809 — TOT
4,770 — MUN

Walking
3,561 — MUN
3,475 — TOT

 

[Cans&Bans]

Such a disappointment - first half, I thought we were the better team and could have been 2-0 up (don't get me started on the penalty)
2nd half, classic United - come out looking like they've never played football before. Sloppy as feck at the back again for the opener. It's a worry and needs addressing asap.

I don't recall Onana having much else to do. Their keeper made one incredible save from Casemiro

Anyway, roll on Saturday for a fantastic 1-0 home win against Forest

 

[Hughie77]

Højlund is a striker. Not a winger. He can play wide but he is best as a striker.

OK then that's why he played mainly wide for Atalanta.. ETH will play him mainly as a Striker and that remains to be seen..

 

[lex talionis]

I thought the problem on Saturday was not the midfield (I actually liked Mount this time) but the attack.

The whole triplet up-front is simply not working. Garnacho is still too raw to be starting games, his decision making is too poor. Antony is still very far from convincing anyone he's a good enough RW, there's more hope on Sancho or even Amad Diallo at the moment. Finally Rashford seems clueless in the middle. We need Hojlund to hit the ground running and our attack to start being a danger to the opposition, if we're to have any hope of a high placed finish.

Would having a DLP next to Casemiro help in certain games or certain phases of games? Yes, absolutely. But like with the new ball-playing GK, it's not panacea, it won't fix everything. The team needs to improve its fitness and to discover a goal-scoring threat that is currently lacking. We have started the season very slow form a level of performance perspective. Adding one more defence-minded CM won't fix that at all.

The attack was the problem. In the first half we had two sitters -- Rashford and Bruno -- from point blank range with nothing to show for it. Spurs grew in confidence, we lost confidence and that was that. I don't know how many different ways this can be said, but if you don't have a natural goal scorer we're not going to score many goals.

Clearly I wasn't paying attention over the last week but I learned on Saturday on the caf that Hojlund has a broken back. That is not good. Even if we expect a full recovery, and I'm sure the doctors have given such an assurance, recovering to full match fitness from a broken back takes a long time. How long I don't know but no one should expect Hojlund under the best of circumstances to score 10-15 goals for us this season. Early days, but this may be a lost season for young Rasmus.

So it's either Rashford or Sancho up top. It's clearly not working with Rashford up top, but Antony has also been a disaster so far on the right. I don't have the answers to this predicament, but ETH clearly needs to make adjustments on the front line.

 

[Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber]

we are being killed by two thinks currently: Lack of clinicality (we are second in the league this season behind Brighton with big chances created) and lack of compactness in our shape in and out of possession

 

[SirScholes]

we are being killed by two thinks currently: Lack of clinicality (we are second in the league this season behind Brighton with big chances created) and lack of compactness in our shape in and out of possession

Most definitely, and it’s a horrible cycle
The lack of being clinical leads to us being desperate which leads to us losing our shape, which leads to more desperation which leads to losing our shape even more….and so on

 

[BobFromParva]

Which players are bedding in? Mount seems like a guy who is just following instructions, not sure if he needs to "bed in". The rest of the players are either not comfortable in role they are being asked to play or not fit.

Which players are bedding in?
I’m surprised that anyone would ask that but I’ll elucidate.

You have some players completely new to the club and all players in the middle of a fast education trying to get up to speed with a new way of playing.
They won’t function flawlessly as a unit until they’ve bedded into a system of play that simply wasn’t possible with DeGea stood on the goal line and it doesn’t happen instantly.
I was impressed by how they outperformed a very good spurs side, away from home, for the first 30 minutes and, even after that, they had their fair share of possession, shots and shots on target.
It wasn’t a rout, no where near a rout, but posters in here are acting as if it were. You dominated a third of the game and were more or less evens for the rest of it.

The difference was down to not much more than some sloppy finishing and some bad luck.

IMO losing in that manner, by that score, under those circumstances, isn’t cause for doom and gloom.
There are many positives to be taken from the game and I very much doubt that you would have surrendered your dominance if it had been played 3 months down the line with the players better bedded in.

 

[RuudTom83]

Something is a little odd, we saw how pumped Martinez and Casemiro were last year. Antony doing everything to get a move here. There was a lot of optimism and drive to get us back.

Yeah I noticed that as well, the players don't seem mentally dialled in or prepared for the season yet!

The spirit is rather flat in comparison to last season...where clearing it for a throw in instead of a corner was high five and chest bumps all round.

 

[Lyng]

OK then that's why he played mainly wide for Atalanta.. ETH will play him mainly as a Striker and that remains to be seen..

Because they have used him that way, which has hampered his scoring. Look at the national team instead.

 

[Hughie77]

Because they have user him that way. Look at the national team instead.

I don't realy care anymore who plays were .. when we got a CEO who's a shithouse..

 

[Mkhitaryan]

United don't look fit. The physical data from the Spurs defeat doesn't make great reading for United's conditioning coaches:

Distance Covered
115km — TOT
110km — MUN

Sprints
191 — TOT
127 — MUN

High Speed Runs
801 — TOT
666 — MUN

Low Speed Runs
2,176 — TOT
1,966 — MUN

Jogging
4,809 — TOT
4,770 — MUN

Walking
3,561 — MUN
3,475 — TOT

TOT 2-0 MUN
— Sprints Split by Half


First Half


93 — TOT
70 — MUN


Second Half


98 — TOT (+5)
57 — MUN (-13)


Tottenham made 41 more sprints than us in a single half of football

 

[Borys]

Which players are bedding in?
I’m surprised that anyone would ask that but I’ll elucidate.

You have some players completely new to the club and all players in the middle of a fast education trying to get up to speed with a new way of playing.
They won’t function flawlessly as a unit until they’ve bedded into a system of play that simply wasn’t possible with DeGea stood on the goal line and it doesn’t happen instantly.
I was impressed by how they outperformed a very good spurs side, away from home, for the first 30 minutes and, even after that, they had their fair share of possession, shots and shots on target.
It wasn’t a rout, no where near a rout, but posters in here are acting as if it were. You dominated a third of the game and were more or less evens for the rest of it.

The difference was down to not much more than some sloppy finishing and some bad luck.

IMO losing in that manner, by that score, under those circumstances, isn’t cause for doom and gloom.
There are many positives to be taken from the game and I very much doubt that you would have surrendered your dominance if it had been played 3 months down the line with the players better bedded in.

Well you said "new players bedding in", and we have a total of 1 new outfield player. Maybe you meant "all players bedding in with completely new system that doesn't seem to suit anyone apart from maybe two players".

I admire your positive approach tbh.

 

[BobFromParva]

Well you said "new players bedding in", and we have a total of 1 new outfield player. Maybe you meant "all players bedding in with completely new system that doesn't seem to suit anyone apart from maybe two players".

I admire your positive approach tbh.

Thanks Mr B, nice of you to say so. I enjoyed our little discussion.
I must say though that it’s easier for me, a none league supporter, to watch a massive club like Utd and appreciate that they’re going in the right direction than it is for dyed in the wool supporters like yourself.

I think I understand where you’re coming from though.
You’ve been frustrated by a number of false starts over a decade or more but IMO the club bringing in Ten Hag / Ten Hag agreeing to join the club, put down a marker that the club was committing to make the changes necessary to move up a level.

Since TH came in the he’s been whittling away at the dead wood, albeit slower than many would like. And new players are coming in, likewise slower than most are comfortable with.
But there was massive movement, a tectonic shift indeed, at the start of this season.
There’s been very little fanfare but Onana supplanting De Gea, was Utd crossing the Rubicon - and there’s no going back to the old ways now.
You now have a sweeper keeper, you’re playing high line possession football and playing out from the back. When I parrot on about bedding in it’s all the players, the club, the supporters, the reporters, everyone adapting to this new reality.