That's real? And not AI-generated?
Peterson, Harris, etc....
- Thread starter prath92
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That's real? And not AI-generated?
Is Sam Harris a nutter too? I haven't listened to him much, but I've listened to a few of his latest podcasts (the short free versions) and he seems like a normal sensible guy?
I don't think he's a nutter I quite like him
he was always a bit of an outlier with these loons. I think he kind of rode the wave a little bit when they were all getting a lot of publicity, but ultimately realised he needed to distance himself from all this junk science and toxic mess
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He's an islamophobic nutter.
He’s got a massive bee in his bonnet about jihadism. So much so that you can’t take anything he says on the subject remotely seriously. He’s also weirdly pro gun.
On most other topics he’s ok. Certainly comes across infinitely more sensible than your average right wing grifter on Trump et al.
He’s a very smart man who generally has a lot of reasonable views but is so blinded by hatred for Islam that he struggles to analyse certain topics like Israel outside of this lens.
Judge for yourself. Here is Sam Harris talking about this on his podcast:
'What is Islamophobia? Someone once said on the Internet, it’s a word “invented by fascists and used by cowards to manipulate morons,” and that’s not far from the truth. There is no question that the term has been designed to confuse people. Its purpose is to conflate any criticism of Islam, which is a doctrine of religious beliefs, with bigotry against Muslims as people. In fact, it equates secularism itself—the commitment to keeping religion out of our laws and public policy—with hatred. The term is now being widely used in the mainstream media, and it is making it impossible to speak honestly about the consequences of dangerous ideas.
Let’s be clear about what is real here and what is fake: Racism is real. There are white supremacists in America, for instance. And, of course, these imbeciles can be counted upon to hate immigrants from Muslim-majority countries—Arabs, Pakistanis, Somalis, etc.—and to hate them for their superficial characteristics, like the color of their skin. This is detestable. But these people hate non-Muslim immigrants too—for instance, Hindus from India—and for the same reasons. We already have words like “racism” and “xenophobia” to cover this problem. Inventing a new term like “Islamophobia” doesn’t give us license to say that there is a new form of hatred in the world.
There is no race of Muslims. Islam is a system of ideas, subscribed to by people of every race and ethnicity. It’s just like Christianity in that regard. Christianity and Islam are both aggressively missionary faiths, and they win converts from everywhere. People criticize Christianity all the time and worry about its political and social influences—but no one confuses this for bigotry against Christians as people. There’s no such thing as “Christophobia.” If you criticize Christianity—and I’ve written an entire book excoriating Christianity—no one accuses you of being a racist against people from Brazil, or Mexico, or Ethiopia, or the Philippines. But even the New York Times will use the term “Islamophobia” as a synonym for racism against Arabs. This is pure delusion and propaganda. There are Christian Arabs. And I could become a Muslim in 5 minutes just by converting to the faith.'
If Islam is just a set of ideas, subscribed to by people of every race and ethnicity, how would you implement Harris's call to ethnically profile Muslims?
I imagine you've already read the conversation where he elucidates on this, but if you haven't. Here is the link.
https://www.samharris.org/blog/to-profile-or-not-to-profile
He's not really right wing in any meaningful sense of the word.
Last I heard from Harris he was beating off to the Lebanon pager attack.
Yep it’s real sicko stuff. For anyone who doesn’t know
Harris -
Amnesty International -
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All of these people have proven beyond doubt that they're genocidal scum. They deserve as much nuance as you would give nazis and white supremacists.
Yeah that one is certainly a bit a of a headscratcher.
Harris is a bigger bigot than many of these right wingers. He has the veneer of pseudo intellectualism which his followers gobble up and makes him more dangerous than many of the cartoonish right wing crowd.
For me he's a must-listen, who has brilliant, interesting guests on his show on a regular basis across a huge range of cultural, scientific and philosophical leanings and has a serious, detailed discussions with them. There is actual conflict in some episodes too, which is nice in the age of 'just asking questions'.
Personally I find it sad that certain people take his views on Israel/Gaza (or the absolute nonsense misinterpretation of the 'attack' on Charles Murray) and take that one thing to colour the entire palette of his discussions. If you see an episode that interests you, give it a listen and judge for yourself.
I checked the guest list of his podcast. The political part, at least, is a very narrow range. Matthew Yglesias, Jon Favreau, Bret Stephens, Jonah Goldberg, Niall Ferguson, Rory Stewart, Bill Maher. Kind of a standard mainstream center-left/right thing. If he was more curious about engaging with a wider range he might be a bit less credulous about the foreign policy propaganda that comes his way.
SH's on the right side of most issues. Left/right, anything Trump, Israel/Hamas, religion and mostly great guests on his podcast
he denies there is a genocide in Israel which is most definitely not the right side of anything in my world. I personally think that opinion is ignorant and most likely formed through cultural bias and misinformation
or at least he did think that once, I dunno if he changed his mind in the last few years
anyway I like Sam Harris, not that I agree with everything he thinks of course, but I do think he's sincere which is more than I think about any of these other intellectual dark web wankers
edit: just checked, still thinks it. And a bunch of other horseshit about the conflict too
https://www.samharris.org/blog/5-myths-about-israel-and-the-war-in-gaza
Myth #5: The two sides in this conflict are equally civilized, equally entitled to respect, and equally worth protecting.
okay I've changed my mind I don't like SH
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he denies there is a genocide in Israel which is most definitely not the right side of anything in my world. I personally think that opinion is ignorant and most likely formed through cultural bias and misinformation
or at least he did think that once, I dunno if he changed his mind in the last few years
anyway I like Sam Harris, not that I agree with everything he thinks of course, but I do think he's sincere which is more than I think about any of these other intellectual dark web wankers
edit: just checked, still thinks it. And a bunch of other horseshit about the conflict too
https://www.samharris.org/blog/5-myths-about-israel-and-the-war-in-gaza
Myth #5: The two sides in this conflict are equally civilized, equally entitled to respect, and equally worth protecting.
okay I've changed my mind I don't like SH
What I find interesting about people like Harris is the combination of almost nothing being racist, while so much is antisemitic.
Trump telling non-white people to go back to where they came from? Not racist. A young Liam Neeson roaming the streets, armed with a club, looking for black people to beat up? Not racist. New York's stop-and-frisk program, ruled unconstitutional because of the way it targeted black people? Not racist. Believing that white people are more intelligent than black people because genetics? Not racist. Milo Yiannopoulos, working directly to promote the altright and performing for sieg heiling Nazis? Eh. Tommy Robinson? Impossible to say. The Christchurch shooter? Looks like a troll.
Student protestors? Antisemitic. Bernie Sanders? Self hating Jew. Black people not voting for Pete Buttigieg? Homophobia.
You’ve said repeatedly that there is no such thing as “looking Muslim”—but there is.
An interesting quote from someone who continues to insist that Islamophobia cannot be a thing because people aren’t racially Muslim.
Have i said that there is no such thing as looking muslim?(please reference me on that)
Ive said there is a difference between Islam the religion, a set of ideas and all the people who identify as muslim, believe and or attempt to practice it.
Ive argued before that Anti-Muslim hatred would be a better term for discrimination against Muslims than because Islamophobia is often thrown around at whoever critizes Islam.
Im also not endorsing Sam Harris conversation there, i was sharing it in this thread with the poster in case he hadn't read it since he sought elucidation on what Sam Harris meant.
If you going for a lengthier personal attack, i have more enjoyable ways i want to spend my time today, but do please quote me correctly rather than putting words in my mouth. And then we might as well move our exchange to the religion what's the point thread.
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Sorry, this is a classic internet misunderstanding, based on my initially not being very clear.
To be clearer, the quote was a Sam Harris quote, from the article linked. The second paragraph was also referencing Sam Harris and his views on the matter. Literally none of it was supposed to be about you in any way, so apologies for my lack of clarity.
For what it’s worth, I have a huge amount to criticise Islam on, as well as religion in general and how many Muslims interact with extremism and the religion as a whole.
There is still quite clear Islamophobia/ anti Muslim hatred though to me and I feel Harris has veered strongly into this territory.
It's not a genocide. On myth 5, I'm pretty sure he's talking about Hamas and its supporters.he denies there is a genocide in Israel which is most definitely not the right side of anything in my world. I personally think that opinion is ignorant and most likely formed through cultural bias and misinformation
or at least he did think that once, I dunno if he changed his mind in the last few years
anyway I like Sam Harris, not that I agree with everything he thinks of course, but I do think he's sincere which is more than I think about any of these other intellectual dark web wankers
edit: just checked, still thinks it. And a bunch of other horseshit about the conflict too
https://www.samharris.org/blog/5-myths-about-israel-and-the-war-in-gaza
Myth #5: The two sides in this conflict are equally civilized, equally entitled to respect, and equally worth protecting.
okay I've changed my mind I don't like SH
Everyone and everything is considered Hamas by these folks. Every hospital, refugee camp, ambulance, aid worker and journalist is considered Hamas by these scumbags. Its how they dance around the accusations of genocide. Harris knew exactly what he meant with that, to people like him (and seemingly you) a Palestinian child (or thousands of them) is considered a lesser human being than an Israeli. They're just using the convenient crutch of Hamas-coating everything to absolve themselves from being labelled heartless bigots.
If that’s your reading of it, I’m not sure what good adding more words to it would do.
It's the ultimate litmus test of human decency in our times. If you fail it, your views and opinions just become worthless.https://www.samharris.org/blog/5-myths-about-israel-and-the-war-in-gaza
Myth #5: The two sides in this conflict are equally civilized, equally entitled to respect, and equally worth protecting.
okay I've changed my mind I don't like SH
Imagine writing this and being a cheerleader for Israel.
Did you catch the recent Douglass Murray episode ?
Casual racism at the beginning of this.
No, not yet. Any topic of interest?
It was basically Sam placating Douglass about how good he was against Dave Smith on Rogan last week. Murray seems to continue fixating on the idea that Dave Smith isn't educated about Israel/Gaza because he's never been to the region.
I know of it because of youtube, but I didn't watch the Rogan episode. I understand his larger point in that episode to have been about misinformation and the dangers of it. Israel/Hamas, vaccines, politics, you name it. A comedian, self thought expert on Israel/Hamas, given a huge platform to voice his opinions to millions.
Sam is brilliant, as long as you skip all of his content around politics and current events.
I found Murray's attack on Smith a bit over the top. Murray has obviously been to Israel quite a bit, but that doesn't mean Smith can't educate himself and talk about the issue, which isn't particularly hard given all the books and online content available. Smith is obviously an easy target because he, like Rogan, is a comedian, but it just felt like Murray was attempting to suggest Smith was misinformed because he had never travelled to the region.
You can catch that bit here.
Out of interest, what is Murray’s formal education on the region or on European politics and culture, two topics on which he has no qualms giving his opinion on repeatedly, to a large audience?
He's researched and written some books. He's a journalist, I think. I really don't know. Google/Chtgpt it
He's researched and written some books. He's a journalist, I think. I really don't know. Google/Chtgpt it
I have googled it. He did English as his degree.
Which makes me wonder what qualifications he has to speak to geopolitical conflicts or the social and economic effects of migration. Going by his own criteria, as opposed to mine.