[Idxomer]

Funny the guy who lost the plot after the Swiss goal kept creating chances for his teammates and was one of the few performing in extra time.

The absurd thing about the goal is Pogba actually progressed the ball forward but Benzema took the easy route and passed it back to him which created a bad situation out of nothing.

 

[laughtersassassin]

Paul Pogba ‘lost the plot’ during France’s Euro2020 exit to Switzerland, claims Emannuel Petit

https://metro.co.uk/2021/07/01/paul...e-plot-during-frances-euro2020-exit-14855337/

I'd say he did.

Created an insnae amount of chances. The quality of passes was top drawer.

Was a really a top performance. To this point he is still probably the player of the tournament.

 

[crossy1686]

I like Pogba the player but I can see why people dislike him, he can be so infuriating at times and probably isn’t worth the trouble. The Swiss game summed him up perfectly.

The good - Plays brilliantly (better than he does for United except for 8 times a season), scores a great goal, sets up a goal, looks solid.

The bad - spends a full minute dancing with Kimpembe after scoring his goal instead of getting on with the game. Got over run in a two man midfield because he goes wandering. Gets caught in possession deep in his own half and causes a goal that swings the momentum back into the other teams hands.

It has to be a maturity/concentration issue. It’s like he gets bored just being solid at the basics.

 

[Escobar]

I like Pogba the player but I can see why people dislike him, he can be so infuriating at times and probably isn’t worth the trouble. The Swiss game summed him up perfectly.

The good - Plays brilliantly (better than he does for United except for 8 times a season), scores a great goal, sets up a goal, looks solid.

The bad - spends a full minute dancing with Kimpembe after scoring his goal instead of getting on with the game. Got over run in a two man midfield because he goes wandering. Gets caught in possession deep in his own half and causes a goal that swings the momentum back into the other teams hands.

It has to be a maturity/concentration issue. It’s like he gets bored just being solid at the basics.

The dancing was really stupid and showed his mentality

 

[crossy1686]

The dancing was really stupid and showed his mentality

It doesn’t really bother me all that much but you’re right, it was a “this game is over” moment instead of just being professional and seeing at the last 20 minutes.

The thing is with something like that, if you don’t go on to win the game you look like a right twat.

 

[justsomebloke]

I'm telling you this is irrelevant, because Mbappe DIDN'T score, and France was only one goal ahead. The criticism is justified because you don't lose the ball in extra time in a game like this. All what happened before doesn't matter if you can't deliver in the end.

Anyway, this thread is like 5 people criticizing Pogba and 50 defending him with ridiculous claims. Like you said, it was a mistake. And I'm looking at it from neutral stand. If he did that for United, I'd be pissed off.

Let's agree to disagree as I don't share your level of empathy.

I think an important point here is that this was exactly the kind of mistake he regularly makes for United.

also, that Sterling is a forward, and that you have to be really unlucky for that sort of mistake to have serious consequences. Unlike giving the ball away as a deep midfielder deep into your own half.

 

[mu4c_20le]

Paul Pogba ‘lost the plot’ during France’s Euro2020 exit to Switzerland, claims Emannuel Petit

https://metro.co.uk/2021/07/01/paul...e-plot-during-frances-euro2020-exit-14855337/

So Pogba loses the plot, and the entire France team collapses? Makes sense

 

[laughtersassassin]

Back to Back to Back international tournaments where Pogba was undoubtedly better than KDB is good to see.

Obviously the opposite at club level though.

Assume in the interest of fairness that KDB will be the singular player blamed for them getting knocked out?

Especially considering he done very little tonight in comparison to Pogba versus Switzerland who was creating everything for France.

I know that won't happen because for whatever reason the rules aren't the same for comparing most players.

 

[Jeppers7]

More players losing the ball….more ‘consistent’ players playing shite….more posters who ‘ like’ Pogba queuing up to blame him for France

 

[laughtersassassin]

He had 57% pass completion.

My god that is shite.

Some posters might need to rethink what a bad performance looks like.

 

[pratyush_utd]

For some context




Now carry on your definitely not agenda against Pogba.

 

[Beans]

If we can't fit him into a midfield 3 with Bruno then we need to sell him.

 

[Mr Smith]

I like Pogba the player but I can see why people dislike him, he can be so infuriating at times and probably isn’t worth the trouble. The Swiss game summed him up perfectly.

The good - Plays brilliantly (better than he does for United except for 8 times a season), scores a great goal, sets up a goal, looks solid.

The bad - spends a full minute dancing with Kimpembe after scoring his goal instead of getting on with the game. Got over run in a two man midfield because he goes wandering. Gets caught in possession deep in his own half and causes a goal that swings the momentum back into the other teams hands.

It has to be a maturity/concentration issue. It’s like he gets bored just being solid at the basics.

I can understand the criticism of the dancing as it does hint at a mentality issue, but I'm not having the fact that he lost the ball for the third goal meaning he's at fault. There were two further phases of play there where France could of won the ball back. Watch Kante in that move; he's running around like a headless chicken, completely lost, when it is literally his job to mop up those situations. Kimpembe also dives in when he could have held his ground. The scapegoating of Pogba for this game has been out of control in my opinion. If Bruno or De Bruyne had the game Pogba had and then lost the ball in the same position there would be nowhere near the same level of criticism.

 

[Martial]

This sums it up well for me.

They lost because of Pogba’s lack of discipline and Mbappe’s arrogance. Mbappé should have come off for Giroud instead of Griezmann. Mbappé was having a terrible night and on top of that instead of trying to work harder he looked as if he was genuinely confused, as if there was no possible way it was his fault he was playing poorly… i.e. pretending to be hurt after shanking his one v one shot as if to say, there’s no way I can miss that shot, I must’ve been injured somehow. The replay showed that absolutely nothing happened to his ankle/foot. He just straight up fecked it up.

Pogba and Mbappé are 2 of my favorite players to watch, especially Pogba. The fluidity of his technical skill, game-style and athletic ability all at once is so unique and awesome. But it can all be erased in an instant because of over-estimated value, decreased moral, or outright mindlessness, and it happens all too often with Pogba because of that lack of discipline.

Credit: Arcturus1981

 

[Ole's screen]

Why do we have to punish a player for daring to run his contract down? Its fully his right. Especially in a depressed market, how can a player ever switch clubs then? We should play him next year and go all out and hope the team finally clicks around him and we win one of the big trophies then he can leave on good terms happily.

 

[crossy1686]

I can understand the criticism of the dancing as it does hint at a mentality issue, but I'm not having the fact that he lost the ball for the third goal meaning he's at fault. There were two further phases of play there where France could of won the ball back. Watch Kante in that move; he's running around like a headless chicken, completely lost, when it is literally his job to mop up those situations. Kimpembe also dives in when he could have held his ground. The scapegoating of Pogba for this game has been out of control in my opinion. If Bruno or De Bruyne had the game Pogba had and then lost the ball in the same position there would be nowhere near the same level of criticism.

Not blaming Pogba for France losing the game, simply saying he played a part in the French meltdown. You can't do what he did in that game and not expect to get some stick for it, every time he gets caught in possession deep in his own half it's a bad look.

He reminds me a lot of Rooney, he'd be playing well and then give away a free kick on the edge of United's box because he was frustrated, and without fail the opposition would always score.

 

[crossy1686]

Why do we have to punish a player for daring to run his contract down? Its fully his right. Especially in a depressed market, how can a player ever switch clubs then? We should play him next year and go all out and hope the team finally clicks around him and we win one of the big trophies then he can leave on good terms happily.

Or we can just sell him now if he doesn't want to sign a new contract and spend that money on a player that's good and wants to be here? You understand that letting good players go for free isn't a good business model right?

 

[RUCK4444]

For some context




Now carry on your definitely not agenda against Pogba.

This

People can’t even see it.

 

[tenpoless]

For some context




Now carry on your definitely not agenda against Pogba.

Statman Dave
Statman Bains

How many statmans are there?!

 

[Martial]

For some context

Not sure this is a favourable comparison...

 

[Escobar]

This sums it up well for me.

They lost because of Pogba’s lack of discipline and Mbappe’s arrogance. Mbappé should have come off for Giroud instead of Griezmann. Mbappé was having a terrible night and on top of that instead of trying to work harder he looked as if he was genuinely confused, as if there was no possible way it was his fault he was playing poorly… i.e. pretending to be hurt after shanking his one v one shot as if to say, there’s no way I can miss that shot, I must’ve been injured somehow. The replay showed that absolutely nothing happened to his ankle/foot. He just straight up fecked it up.

Pogba and Mbappé are 2 of my favorite players to watch, especially Pogba. The fluidity of his technical skill, game-style and athletic ability all at once is so unique and awesome. But it can all be erased in an instant because of over-estimated value, decreased moral, or outright mindlessness, and it happens all too often with Pogba because of that lack of discipline.

Credit: Arcturus1981

Thats a load of crap. What about the other players? France as a team was poor. Pogba and Benzema where the only ones doing well. What about the others? Pogba lost the ball for that one goal - what about the other 3 that Switzerland scored? It is just so easy to blame one single incident or player. Like Rabiot's mam, yet her son was the worst player in every game...

 

[Fahad Jawaid]

We are in a catch 22 situation here. Firstly its difficult to find a player of his skill set for 50M, who can pass and take on players in the middle which open up space, coupled with his physicality and long range shooting. he is a very unique player, normally you find physical players with no technical ability, or technical players with no physicality.

However, we can't let him leave for free again, nor we have found a best position for him to thrive as clearly he is best in Bruno's position.

I think the best for us would be to try him at LM again with Camavinga as a CM alongside Mctominay/Fred specially in tough matches against top 6 sides. With Martial, Rashford and Greenwood of the bench, we will have some strike power.
Whereas, against majority of the sides we can just play flat 4-3-3 with Pogba, Bruno & Camavinga/Fred/Mctominay.

DDG
AWB Lindelof Maguire Shaw
Camavinga Fred/Mctominay
Sancho Bruno Pogba
Cavani

 

[The Urban Goose]

Still with the "we have to change the rest of the team so we can get the best out of him". It's been five years and he still hasn't shown the maturity or reliability to deserve building a team around him. Why did we have to buy Bruno in the first place? This is Manchester United, not Pogba FC, if he can't provide what the team needs he should go.

 

[pratyush_utd]

Not sure this is a favourable comparison...

Pogba played after recovering from Covid and was clearly struggling. Wasnt cut slack by most here. So why KDB is different?

 

[MattofManchester]

Should rename this thread the "Every Other Player and Paul Pogba thread.

It's just annoying now.

 

[Siezard]

This sums it up well for me.

They lost because of Pogba’s lack of discipline and Mbappe’s arrogance. Mbappé should have come off for Giroud instead of Griezmann. Mbappé was having a terrible night and on top of that instead of trying to work harder he looked as if he was genuinely confused, as if there was no possible way it was his fault he was playing poorly… i.e. pretending to be hurt after shanking his one v one shot as if to say, there’s no way I can miss that shot, I must’ve been injured somehow. The replay showed that absolutely nothing happened to his ankle/foot. He just straight up fecked it up.

Pogba and Mbappé are 2 of my favorite players to watch, especially Pogba. The fluidity of his technical skill, game-style and athletic ability all at once is so unique and awesome. But it can all be erased in an instant because of over-estimated value, decreased moral, or outright mindlessness, and it happens all too often with Pogba because of that lack of discipline.

Credit: Arcturus1981

Player gets complacent as they are paid too much to care anymore. Look at DDG... Half-heartedly wanted to save every penalty kicks against Villarreal and then just anyhow take his own spotkick.

 

[Borys]

We are in a catch 22 situation here. Firstly its difficult to find a player of his skill set for 50M, who can pass and take on players in the middle which open up space, coupled with his physicality and long range shooting. he is a very unique player, normally you find physical players with no technical ability, or technical players with no physicality.

However, we can't let him leave for free again, nor we have found a best position for him to thrive as clearly he is best in Bruno's position.

I think the best for us would be to try him at LM again with Camavinga as a CM alongside Mctominay/Fred specially in tough matches against top 6 sides. With Martial, Rashford and Greenwood of the bench, we will have some strike power.
Whereas, against majority of the sides we can just play flat 4-3-3 with Pogba, Bruno & Camavinga/Fred/Mctominay.

DDG
AWB Lindelof Maguire Shaw
Camavinga Fred/Mctominay
Sancho Bruno Pogba
Cavani

We don't need to find a player of his skill set, which is the whole point of letting him go. Like you said, Pogba is unique player, what makes him very difficult to accommodate (especially in current United team).

The way I see it, we should sell Pogba, and buy two players:
- wide forward who will contribute to assists and goals (in numbers: goal contribution every 316mins, I'd expect Sancho to beat that easily)
- an all-rounded Central Midfielder, focused more on defensive side of game (not necessarily a pure DM)

The thing is, we need both of those players anyway (whether Pogba stays or not).

Even in the setup you presented, you put Pogba on left wing. At this point it seems a bit forced to keep him here.

Why do we have to punish a player for daring to run his contract down? Its fully his right. Especially in a depressed market, how can a player ever switch clubs then? We should play him next year and go all out and hope the team finally clicks around him and we win one of the big trophies then he can leave on good terms happily.

Not punish him, but if he doesn't want to be here, then it makes no sense to build the team around him. Which as many suggested is the only way to "unleash" Pogba.
The second obvious answer is the money. The third important aspect is the club image.

Don't people feel giving him another year, finding a perfect midfield partner, etc is a bit forced at this point? Bruno came in and it just clicked. Cavani at 67 looks like a perfect fit. Shaw improved massively, feckin Scott McTominay scored more goals than Pogba last season. And what has Pogba done in the last few years here, that suggests he'll finally fulfill his potential, which is arguably much higher than all those players I mentioned? It just doesn't seem justified at this point.

 

[He'sRaldo]

We don't need to find a player of his skill set, which is the whole point of letting him go. Like you said, Pogba is unique player, what makes him very difficult to accommodate (especially in current United team).

The way I see it, we should sell Pogba, and buy two players:
- wide forward who will contribute to assists and goals (in numbers: goal contribution every 316mins, I'd expect Sancho to beat that easily)
- an all-rounded Central Midfielder, focused more on defensive side of game (not necessarily a pure DM)

The thing is, we need both of those players anyway (whether Pogba stays or not).

Even in the setup you presented, you put Pogba on left wing. At this point it seems a bit forced to keep him here.


Not punish him, but if he doesn't want to be here, then it makes no sense to build the team around him. Which as many suggested is the only way to "unleash" Pogba.
The second obvious answer is the money. The third important aspect is the club image.

Don't people feel giving him another year, finding a perfect midfield partner, etc is a bit forced at this point? Bruno came in and it just clicked. Cavani at 67 looks like a perfect fit. Shaw improved massively, feckin Scott McTominay scored more goals than Pogba last season. And what has Pogba done in the last few years here, that suggests he'll finally fulfill his potential, which is arguably much higher than all those players I mentioned? It just doesn't seem justified at this point.

Selling him is now an option due to his contract situation, but I'd rather we replaced him first before we sold.

Even till last season we looked worse with Pogba out of the team, so selling him before we've actually proven the replacements will work, isn't smart. Imagine if we sold him last season and bought Donny. That would be one step forward, three steps back.

I'd only take that risk if we had a world class coach.

 

[Schmeichel's Cartwheel]

If this was the case would you:

1. Let him rot in the PL2?

2. Play him anyway?

3. Sell him for?

Either 2 or 3. No point having a world class player on 250-300k a week in the ressies. Might as well play him. If Varane is 50m in the last year of his contract, Pogba should be at least 60m no?

Selling him is now an option due to his contract situation, but I'd rather we replaced him first before we sold.

Even till last season we looked worse with Pogba out of the team, so selling him before we've actually proven the replacements will work, isn't smart. For instance imagine if we sold him last season and bought Donny. That would be one step forward, three steps back.

I'd only take that risk if we had a world class coach.

Doesn't always work like that. We sold van Nistelrooy in 2006 and didn't replace him and actually made several steps forward. It's more about whats best for the team as a whole than just who has the most quality. Bruno and Donny might work better together than Bruno and Pogba, despite Pogba being a much better player than Donny.

 

[Borys]

Selling him is now an option due to his contract situation, but I'd rather we replaced him first before we sold.

Even till last season we looked worse with Pogba out of the team, so selling him before we've actually proven the replacements will work, isn't smart. Imagine if we sold him last season and bought Donny. That would be one step forward, three steps back.

I'd only take that risk if we had a world class coach.

We need a midfielder whether Pogba stays or not. We can't go into another season with McTominay acting as the more defensive of the two midfielders. And with Sancho we don't need like for like replacement for Pogba. It all fits into place.

 

[He'sRaldo]

And with Sancho we don't need like for like replacement for Pogba. It all fits into place.

Doesn't always work like that. We sold van Nistelrooy in 2006 and didn't replace him and actually made several steps forward. It's more about whats best for the team as a whole than just who has the most quality. Bruno and Donny might work better together than Bruno and Pogba, despite Pogba being a much better player than Donny.

In theory yes. My point is I'd rather see that on the pitch first before we get rid of a player whose absence is noticeable in our team.

If we had prime Fergie then sure I'd take the risk, but not with Ole. I've seen enough dire football from him to doubt any miracles will be happening if we sell one of our best players.

 

[M16Red]

Either 2 or 3. No point having a world class player on 250-300k a week in the ressies. Might as well play him. If Varane is 50m in the last year of his contract, Pogba should be at least 60m no?


Doesn't always work like that. We sold van Nistelrooy in 2006 and didn't replace him and actually made several steps forward. It's more about whats best for the team as a whole than just who has the most quality. Bruno and Donny might work better together than Bruno and Pogba, despite Pogba being a much better player than Donny.

I'd sell him for 40mil and that hurts me saying it, as I don't like being ripped off.

The idea of him wearing a PSG shirt after a free move would drive me fecking mad.

 

[justsomebloke]

We need a midfielder whether Pogba stays or not. We can't go into another season with McTominay acting as the more defensive of the two midfielders. And with Sancho we don't need like for like replacement for Pogba. It all fits into place.

This.

 

[Borys]

In theory yes. My point is I'd rather see that on the pitch first before we get rid of a player whose absence is noticeable in our team.

If we had prime Fergie then sure I'd take the risk, but not with Ole. I've seen enough dire football from him to doubt any miracles will be happening if we sell one of our best players.

How would you do that? Start the season and see how it goes? Or do you suggest we should keep Pogba for a year and see how it goes?

 

[United in sin]

It doesn’t really bother me all that much but you’re right, it was a “this game is over” moment instead of just being professional and seeing at the last 20 minutes.

The thing is with something like that, if you don’t go on to win the game you look like a right twat.

Golly, are players not allowed to celebrate? What's the difference with Pogba doing a little dance and Rooney running to the corner flag after scoring that bicycle kick against City and celebrating for even longer for instance? Is one expression more acceptable than the other?

 

[#07]

Some insightful comments from Rooney on Pogba today.

He says Pogba's impact with France is greater cos teams fear Mbappe and sit off, allowing Paul to have more time on the ball and more options to pick out in behind. Praises Paul's character and application too.

 

[Mainoldo]

Not sure this is a favourable comparison...

Unfortunate. Didn’t Pogba comeback and had a top performance for us against Leicester even after no Pre-season after winning the World Cup? I don’t remember him throughing out claims or against Rochdale.

 

[Borys]

Since I have a deep feeling this is one of the very last pages in Pogba performance thread (ever), I would like to share an interesting stat I came by. One poster said " the stats say we are a better team with him in it than without him", what obviously trigerred me to verify if that's actually true.

Turns out it's quite the opposite:

Source
Turns out we're actually getting the least points per game (PPM) with Pogba in the team from all of Matic (tops that list but significantly lower number of appearances), Fred, McTominay and Bruno (who by the way played a shocking amount of games). We've also scored the least number of goals with him on the pitch. The goals scored/conceded is a bit screwed by Leeds/Tottenham games (although I don't see a reason not to take them into account). However, the points per game number is very interesting and maybe eye-opening for some people here.

As @bosnian_red mentioned, the explanation might be some players subbed off with a good score (although that rarely happened for us), and some players being picked for easier games. But I don't think it would explain such a difference as Fred and McTominay were used against every heavy opponent after the Tottenham game.

Anyway, however you look at it, Pogba impact on this team is rather overrated.

 

[romufc]

Anyway, however you look at it, Pogba impact on this team is rather overrated.

Correct. Even though he will produce moments of magic, he is capable of doing that, his value in the team is overrated.

Especially next season, if he doesn't sign a contract, he won't have any motivation to play for us and win stuff. If he doesn't sign a contract by the time the season starts, he should not be in Ole's plans as first choice. I would rather see him on the bench and us build a team around players who want to be at the club.

 

[Walters_19_MuFc]

If we sign Sancho, Varane, and Camavinga and sell Pogba, I won't be happy.

Pogba is a world-class player, and whether people like it or not, people are attracted to the club, not only because of the stature of the club, but because of the current players.

Amad spoke about how Pogba was his idol growing up.

Players want to play with top-class players and that's exactly what Pogba is.

If we want to achieve great things next season, it will be easier with than without Paul Pogba.

Sign the fecking contract, Paul!