Of course every player goes through hot and cold periods in a season. But when Pogba’s bad... he’s absolute garbage and in centre mid that ruins our whole team. You can get away with performances like that as an attacker if your fellow attackers are on form. That’s why I think Ole played him into form as a left attacker and now he’s reaping the rewards
6
Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 42
- Goals
- 6
- Assists
- 6
- Yellow cards
- 9
- Status
He has been on a consistent run now for 2 months I think. Still I dont know if he can be consistent as a CM for a whole season. he literally cost us 2 games early on in the league. What is our plan for his starting position. Are we just going to shift him all over the field according to how difficult the team is?
Interesting summary of our start to the season.
Absolutely, it maybe a bit hyperbole but on an individual level this was one of the best goals scored by a United midfielder. The touch, the footwork and placement were incredible, he basically assisted himself with his work before the shot.
Lord Jesus.
Second bit.
Tell him to sign a new contract so I can get behind him.
There you go jumping to conclusions. All I said is he has to maintain that level. If he plays 14 pl games in the 2nd half of the season and performs well in 9 that's evidence of keeping a good level. No player, even messi and Ronaldo play great in every match.
Looks like the bolded part to me. Crap? He played like you expect most CM to play tbh... he also put in 2 crosses which if our forwards stayed onside, he would have had an assist.
He played the ball out to Bruno for the Cavani chance.
He tracked back and picked up a yellow card, not something you see Pogba doing...
He showed for the ball in midfield all game.
Think this thread will only reach consensus when Pogba next plays poorly.
You can’t help but think some posters must be genuinely conflicted when Pogba scores. I don’t doubt that their initial reaction is to celebrate, but once calm again, they must spend some time trying to work out how they actually feel about it. Like, it would have been a lot simpler for them had Scott McTominay or Bruno scored instead. On here it reads like joy that is tempered by the fact that they are not actually supposed to like the player, although not to the extent where they cannot like the goal. Maybe if he scored the 5th goal in a 5-0 win it will be easier to dismiss as ‘look, even Pogba saw the team was winning so of course he decided to try and steal some of the glory’ or something to that effect. Equalisers and winners though? Awkward!
You can’t help but think some posters must be genuinely conflicted when Pogba scores. I don’t doubt that their initial reaction is to celebrate, but once calm again, they must spend some time trying to work out how they actually feel about it. Like, it would have been a lot simpler for them had Scott McTominay or Bruno scored instead. On here it reads like joy that is tempered by the fact that they are not actually supposed to like the player, although not to the extent where they cannot like the goal. Maybe if he scored the 5th goal in a 5-0 win it will be easier to dismiss as ‘look, even Pogba saw the team was winning so of course he decided to try and steal some of the glory’ or something to that effect. Equalisers and winners though? Awkward!
I don't have a personal issue with Pogba at all, I just don't think he's as good as everyone makes out in half of these games. It's genuinely terrifying when he has the ball in our half of the field, and he consistently loses his man/doesn't track back when playing as an out and out midfielder, which is criminal. He scores goals every so often, get some assists, and sometimes has proper worldies, but most of the time he is average. Bruno at least makes up for all of the mistakes he makes by racking up G+A, and putting in 100% effort no matter how bad he's playing.
You don’t understand a basic concept in football and you call other people clowns. The fact that the offside trap didn’t work and they scored a goal has nothing to do with Pogba. Your question is irrelevant and doesn’t warrant answering.
The goal was on Wan Bissaka for keeping Lookman onside
best paid outfield player in the league
he simply isnt, not on the average of his performances. it is absolutely ridiculous that you are saying his form is as good as de bruynes over the last several seasons, ridiculous
Quote where I said that.
Does semi professionally mean someone paid you to play center back when you don’t understand how an offside trap is applied?
If he’s playing for a transfer he’s shooting himself in the foot, cause his price goes up with each passing game
Its a win / win for us.
Even though I’ve been a massive critic of Pogba and his agent, I’ve always maintained that if he plays consistently well and helps us move forward non of it really matters, football moves on.
Which is also nonsense. Or depends on what you choose to believe. According to the football leaks info, Pogba makes about £165k p/w basic, and the more widely reported figure of £290k is probably reached via image rights/bonuses etc.
I’m sure a few of the City lads make more, no doubt KDB himself with his last deal. And if you don’t wish to believe that, you should at least know that Arsenal have been paying £350k p/w to Ozil and Aubameyang for a while now, although Ozil left days ago.
Sanchez was also on more than Pogba when he was with us, but yes - he has left now.
Even with that qualifier to take away De Gea's wages, the likes of Aubameyang, Ozil prior to his exit, De Bruyne, Sterling and Bale (even with Spurs subsidizing half his wages) all earn more so you're still wrong
Yeah, I get your point. I've stopped using the term now (well, I've tried) because it's very subjective.
Let's just hope Pogba continues to perform at a similar level because if we're going to challenge for leagues/major trophies this season, we will definitely need it.
What Pogba can give you in goals and creativity from the n8 position.
Im going to call the likes of Bruno,KDB and B. Silva number 10s/ attacking midfielders.
But when you look at other CMs he is a cut above them despite his long periods of poor form and Jose.
Mateo Kovacic 1 goal 6 assists 77 games.
Henderson 31 goals 47 assists 355 games
Wijnaldum 26 goals 16 assists 197 games.
Gundogan 20 goals 6 assists 115 games.
Tielemanns 10 goals 12 assists 69 games.
Keita 4 goals 4 assists 50 games.
Pogba 28 goals 26 assists 127 games.
Im going to call the likes of Bruno,KDB and B. Silva number 10s/ attacking midfielders.
But when you look at other CMs he is a cut above them despite his long periods of poor form and Jose.
Mateo Kovacic 1 goal 6 assists 77 games.
Henderson 31 goals 47 assists 355 games
Wijnaldum 26 goals 16 assists 197 games.
Gundogan 20 goals 6 assists 115 games.
Tielemanns 10 goals 12 assists 69 games.
Keita 4 goals 4 assists 50 games.
Pogba 28 goals 26 assists 127 games.
Another game, another Pogstaclass.
Just wish our players wouldn't choose when to be in form and would all do it at the same.
Start of the season was Bruno alone. Then Rashford and Bruno for a bit. Then Shaw joined in. Cavani gave a few games, around the same time Rashford stopped. Then Pogba stepped up, and now everyone else bar Shaw has sort of dropped off.
Just wish our players wouldn't choose when to be in form and would all do it at the same.
Start of the season was Bruno alone. Then Rashford and Bruno for a bit. Then Shaw joined in. Cavani gave a few games, around the same time Rashford stopped. Then Pogba stepped up, and now everyone else bar Shaw has sort of dropped off.
It’s an important distinction as for some, the expectation seems to be for him to match De Bruyne for goals, despite De Bruyne never playing in a double pivot.
And even then, his goals/games record is almost identical to KDBs anyway, but they never tell you that bit.
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Get out of here with your stats and logic, it's getting in the way of a good Pogba take on how he's not one of the best midfielders in the league.
among the best midfielders in the league
if his form has been significantly worse than kdb over a long period of time (it has) then he isn't
I’m not sure how to respond without coming across rude, which isn’t my intention, but - read it again please.
The over reaction to Pogba here will always amaze me.
As a fan base, we just cannot be objective with Pogba at all. people either think he's world class or total garbage.
This Pogba debate is just a shambles and not productive whatsoever.
I knew before I read half of the comments here it would be people over hyping him and stating he cant do wrong and he's the best player ever etc. usual tripe.
So Pogba against Fulham - top class goal - absolutely cannot argue with that, but bar that he was pretty much 5/10. Wasn't horrendous, wasn't great. The goal made his performance seem better than it was, which probably means he probably kicked his performance to a 7/10.
So why dont I rate him a 10/10 v Fulham? Easy - he wasn't that good. Fred had a better game in the middle of the park. Pogba done some nice things, he also gave the ball away cheaply, tried way to many long balls that didnt come off and played with no tempo whatsoever. He's so slow on the ball it's unreal.
He didnt control the midfield or set us up or play with tempo or anything. He can never be considered world class playing central midfield because he cannot dictate games. He relies on others too much to be considered an elite level player.
As a fan base, we just cannot be objective with Pogba at all. people either think he's world class or total garbage.
This Pogba debate is just a shambles and not productive whatsoever.
I knew before I read half of the comments here it would be people over hyping him and stating he cant do wrong and he's the best player ever etc. usual tripe.
So Pogba against Fulham - top class goal - absolutely cannot argue with that, but bar that he was pretty much 5/10. Wasn't horrendous, wasn't great. The goal made his performance seem better than it was, which probably means he probably kicked his performance to a 7/10.
So why dont I rate him a 10/10 v Fulham? Easy - he wasn't that good. Fred had a better game in the middle of the park. Pogba done some nice things, he also gave the ball away cheaply, tried way to many long balls that didnt come off and played with no tempo whatsoever. He's so slow on the ball it's unreal.
He didnt control the midfield or set us up or play with tempo or anything. He can never be considered world class playing central midfield because he cannot dictate games. He relies on others too much to be considered an elite level player.
Who’s said he can’t do wrong and the best player ever?
I would agree. Managers have tried to give Pobga the more advanced role but it wasn't effective. He is like a hybrid jack of all trades kind of dude rather than a STRAIGHT attacking or defensive player. That said, some of the players you mentioned play a completely different kind of role to Pogba and different skillsets. for example he will have more G+A than Xavi but one would not place them in the same stratosphere in terms of midfielders. Henderson has helped drive Liverpool to League and CL glory and played a key role in both. I don't think he is better than Pogba but his G+A (Hendo) are supplemented by other characteristics. I would say Pogba leans more towards the attacking side of a midfielder than the guys you listed as they have not built up a career of scoring woldies and making hollywood passes etc
Yeah your wrong by any statistical metric he was 6.5/7 out of 10. That is clear objectional data. Yet you are saying people here cannot be objective
What you described sounds like a typical Bruno Fernandes display, yet there is no such ‘debate’ as you put it. He is unanimously seen to be doing well. We don’t count every misplaced pass, or sloppy loss of possession in the defensive third.
And I agree that he wasn’t a 10/10 vs Fulham - I don’t think anyone should say he was. He’s played better football than his last few games before. It’s just that they have likely been erased, or the fact that the current performances are coupled with the team doing well makes them worth more. That will always be the case in football. If your team wins, your performance will be looked at from the context of what you did to contribute to the success. The misplaced pass doesn’t matter as much, because you win. As I said earlier, in the memory of most fans, the likes of Keane/Scholes etc probably never had bad games, which isn’t actually true. They both had plenty. But who cares? Ruud scored and United won. If your team gets poor results, performances are always analysed from the perspective of what could/should have been done better, because praise cannot be unreserved as after all, you guys lost! There must have been faults.
In summary, even in the last few years, performing exactly as he did, Pogba would be considered more unanimously successful if we as a team had been successful. It’s just the nature of the game. It’s different for strikers, as they are judged on simpler metrics. Midfielders, fullbacks etc. Their reputation relies on team success. It is why part of the reason why players who want to be recognised as the best want to move to the best teams. Team success does wonders for the reputation of the individual. On the flipside, there is rarely such a thing as lauded players in failing/underachieving teams.
fecking this, haha. But you can't do with reason and stats around here.
Basically, he had hoped to see more criticism of Pogba than he has and he doesn’t like it. If you look back at his posts over the years, you would see why he would struggle to process any Pog-praise, unless it is caveated with a ‘but’, or a how many misplaced passes stat, which of course is never required to praise any other living footballer.
I do think that's the importance of having top quality players in your team. A couple of seasons ago, if certain players dropped off, then we didn't have the required quality to win games.
You look at Liverpool and City. They have 4,5,6 match winners - maybe more. Not sure we're quite there yet but we've certainly made massive strides this season and long may it continue.
Finally looks to have shaken off his injury/Covid issues from the past year or so, and looks every bit the player we hoped for. Joy to watch, and can cover all aspects of the game.
With Spain being a non-starter money wise for him, it's really only Juve or PSG who could be in for him. I'm sort of hoping that, with a strong second half of the season, we can convince him to commit to another deal.
A few months ago I wouldn't have been too sore over the idea of him leaving. Now it would really push as back on the progress Ole has made. Especially as replacements like Grealish/Rice/Maddison would probably cost more than what we'd get for Pogba!
With Spain being a non-starter money wise for him, it's really only Juve or PSG who could be in for him. I'm sort of hoping that, with a strong second half of the season, we can convince him to commit to another deal.
A few months ago I wouldn't have been too sore over the idea of him leaving. Now it would really push as back on the progress Ole has made. Especially as replacements like Grealish/Rice/Maddison would probably cost more than what we'd get for Pogba!
No one did, another raving of a mad man.
May this current run of form last for a long long time. His goals, chances created and his defensive responsibility have just been amazing for a few weeks now. Looks to be the player we paid all that money for now.
As long as he is okay with being moved about positionally depending on the opposition, looks like he is a new signing almost.
May be it was injuries and futness, maybe motivation, maybet the players form around him but whatever, he seems to have worked it all out.
I cannot believe a very few people criticising his performance yesterday, I thought he was good (even though partly at fault for the goal).
As long as he is okay with being moved about positionally depending on the opposition, looks like he is a new signing almost.
May be it was injuries and futness, maybe motivation, maybet the players form around him but whatever, he seems to have worked it all out.
I cannot believe a very few people criticising his performance yesterday, I thought he was good (even though partly at fault for the goal).
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