Patrick Kluivert...

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H10

Huseyin 10
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Anybody remember him? ;)

He used to be a really good striker at Barcalona. Then it all went downhill when he was suppose to be in his prime, at the age of 28 or so?

So how comes he turned crap over night, and ended up at Newcastle on loan?

Where is he now?

Does anybody care? :)
 
Don't think he was over-rated as some would say, very classy player when he can be bothered. There were people wanting him at United when he was at Barcelona. Too costly probably.

Don't know where he is now, probably fatter though.
 
Another genius lost to the high life of superstardom. I mean scoring that goal against the mighty Milan in the CL final at just 19 really is what changed his life. Success came to him too early imo like Ronaldo (Brazil) and he just fell off the wagon from it.

Still, managed to be Netherland's highest scorer and is one of the most complete strikers I have ever seen. Could comfortably play as a striker a forward and a wide forward. Strong in the air and on the ground, astute finishing.

He and Ronaldo(Brazil) are the only players I can recall who were the finished product at 19.
 
He's at Lille in France. Scored a couple of weeks ago.
 
Was a shame he didn't really live up to his potential. Used to be one of my favourite players
 
He was an overrated primadona who tasted success to early and took it for granted, hence threw his career away- Ruud is the same age and still on top of his game.
 
I think it remains a mystery, how he went from so good, to so bad. I can remember we were linked with him quite frequently in his Barcalona days...
 
krazyrobus said:
Another genius lost to the high life of superstardom. I mean scoring that goal against the mighty Milan in the CL final at just 19 really is what changed his life. Success came to him too early imo like Ronaldo (Brazil) and he just fell off the wagon from it.

Still, managed to be Netherland's highest scorer and is one of the most complete strikers I have ever seen. Could comfortably play as a striker a forward and a wide forward. Strong in the air and on the ground, astute finishing.

He and Ronaldo(Brazil) are the only players I can recall who were the finished product at 19.
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Ronaldo is one of the all time greats in football and he was world-class even during his final real madrid days, his goal-scoring records show this and it's obvious to those who watched him then. In fact he scored 7 goals in 14 games for Milan last season. If success came to him too early and he fell off the wagon from it, he wouldn't have come back from a 2 year injury lay-off to score 8 goals in the world cup and win Brazil their fifth world cup. Putting him and Kluivert in the same bracket is inaccurate to say the least.
 
reddevilcanada said:
Ronaldo is one of the all time greats in football and he was world-class even during his final real madrid days, his goal-scoring records show this and it's obvious to those who watched him then. In fact he scored 7 goals in 14 games for Milan last season. If success came to him too early and he fell off the wagon from it, he wouldn't have come back from a 2 year injury lay-off to score 8 goals in the world cup and win Brazil their fifth world cup. Putting him and Kluivert in the same bracket is inaccurate to say the least.
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Yes injuries have contributed to Ronaldo's problems but Ronaldo clearly has enough talent to still be the best player in the world if he so wished. Even being half the player he was 95-98. What does he do instead? Party late, get fat, be unfocused in training. That's why Capello sold him at RM. That's why he turned up to the world cup overweight. Putting him and Kluivert in the same bracket is not inaccurate
 
I remember being well chuffed when it looked like we were gonna sign him in 98, then the fecker turned us down and said Arsenal were the only team in England for him. cnut!
 
definately not overated was la liga top scorer a couple of times at barca and if you go back and watch ajax during mid 90's you can trully appreaciate just how amazing he was.

Was never suited to serie A as he was never a poacher and they used to be ultra defensive back then(they are merely defensive now). Was great in la liga and would have been perfectly suited to prem if he came here at the height of he's career(straight from ajax).

When he came to Newcastle he'd lost the fire that you saw at ajax and in spells at barca.

A shame really as he'd make my top ten favourite mid 90's stikers any day.
 
that's true blunder. He was good at Barca but killing someone must have done something to him mentally. As for Ronaldo - he was the best for a very long time. Zidane is thought of as the best of his generation but Ronaldo was at a higher level for longer then even him so for me it's Ronaldo.

Sometimes people just get wight problems. It's not always cause they eat too much. There's so many problems out there no one knows for sure why Ronaldo put on the weight. At the last World Cup though he wasn't even a shadow of the old Ronaldo - which ruined the whole competition
 
for me, a fit Ronaldo is the best i've ever seen and I'd argue with anyone that he was at least on a par with the likes of Maradona
 
Well certainly 95-98 I would definitely say the best i've ever seen. He used to make dribbling past 3 people look routine.

My Favourite move of his.

 
it's just a pity about the injuries. He's had some bad ones in his time. I also think it was a mistake leaving barca when he did. Going to Italy I don't think was the best idea
 
golden_blunder said:
dont think its any coincidence that his career nosedived after he killed someone in Amsterdam
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No it didnt... that was in 97... he scored 88 goals in 306 appearances for Barca between 98/99 to 02/03.... hasnt got into double figures for any team since...


Bet he'll end up in the MLS!!
 
Striker10 said:
it's just a pity about the injuries. He's had some bad ones in his time. I also think it was a mistake leaving barca when he did. Going to Italy I don't think was the best idea
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ITaly was clearly the best league in the world at the time, by some distance. All well and good scoring 34 in 37 games for Barca but he needed to go to where the defences were meaner and he was up against the best strikers on offer, Batistute, Beirhoff etc. Didn't do too badly some 25 goals in 33 games in his 1st season there.
 
golden_blunder said:
for me, a fit Ronaldo is the best i've ever seen and I'd argue with anyone that he was at least on a par with the likes of Maradona
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No way! Maradona was a genius, you can play with 9 defenders and a keeper and you know that Maradona would still manage to invent a goal. Ronaldo relies much more on the work of his team mates.
 
golden_blunder said:
for me, a fit Ronaldo is the best i've ever seen and I'd argue with anyone that he was at least on a par with the likes of Maradona
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Absolutely. It was like Inter and Barcelona were cheating by having him in the team.
He was basically the perfect attacking player and was capable of moments of absolute genius. No-one has come close to that over the past few years.
 
Ronaldo was class he could do anything as a striker and then some more.

I'd still take a fat Ronaldo over a fair few other current strikers.

Him and Zidane were by far the best two of their generation its just a shame Ronaldo was injured for a large part of it. Still though missing out on all that football and what not he is still regarded so highly just shows.

Kluivert was okay as well, just shows you need to work hard to stay at the top not just in getting there. Ronaldinho is getting a bit of stick for this - it isn't going to happen to him is it?
 
Fat Ronaldo then Batistuta in that order. Kluivert quite a bit behind them. Class strikers i wish we'd signed.
 
krazyrobus said:
Yes injuries have contributed to Ronaldo's problems but Ronaldo clearly has enough talent to still be the best player in the world if he so wished. Even being half the player he was 95-98. What does he do instead? Party late, get fat, be unfocused in training. That's why Capello sold him at RM. That's why he turned up to the world cup overweight. Putting him and Kluivert in the same bracket is not inaccurate
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Ronaldo is a world class striker when he's fit, you sound as if he's been shit and non-existant since 95-98 which is completely inaccurate because he was banging the goals in regualrly for Madrid after he won Brazil their fifth world cup in 2002. Your allegations of partying late and being unfocused in training have more to do with Spanish tabloid rumours than anything truthful. His weight problems don't hold him back from scoring regularly when he's fit plus there are tons of reasons for weight gains, so I don't see your point. If he was as shit as you claim him to be, Milan wouldn't have spent over 10 mil getting him from Madrid, nor would he have scored 7 in 14 games for them last season.
 
reddevilcanada said:
Ronaldo is a world class striker when he's fit, you sound as if he's been shit and non-existent since 95-98 which is completely inaccurate because he was banging the goals in regularly for Madrid after he won Brazil their fifth world cup in 2002. Your allegations of partying late and being unfocused in training have more to do with Spanish tabloid rumors than anything truthful. His weight problems don't hold him back from scoring regularly when he's fit plus there are tons of reasons for weight gains, so I don't see your point. If he was as shit as you claim him to be, Milan wouldn't have spent over 10 mil getting him from Madrid, nor would he have scored 7 in 14 games for them last season.
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The late night boozing and clubbing is not tabloid conjecture it's clear fact that can be backed up with pictures of him taken at clubs at 2am the night before a match.

Regarding his weight with access to the best nutritionists and physical trainers out there even the people with the worst genetic predispositions should not be overweight much less a professional player.

You're inferring things from my posts and not actually reading the points. I've never said Ronaldo at any point was shit. My main point is that he like Kluivert had the potential to be so much more but chose not to keep their head down and work to achieve their best.

Ronaldo is different from Kluivert in that he is so talented he can get by doing the minimum, not something Kluivert could afford to do.

Notwithstanding his injuries Ronaldo has already cut a name for himself as one of the best strikers to ever play the game. Now imagine what he could have achieved if he kept his head down and worked hard and kept trim like he was in WC 2006 and prior to that. People would probably be saying "Pele and Zidane who?" And he would have overshadowed Zidane in the 90's and 2000s in much the same way Maradonna did to Platini in the 80's.

And that was my main point from the beggining.
 
reddevilcanada said:
Ronaldo is a world class striker when he's fit, you sound as if he's been shit and non-existant since 95-98 which is completely inaccurate because he was banging the goals in regualrly for Madrid after he won Brazil their fifth world cup in 2002. Your allegations of partying late and being unfocused in training have more to do with Spanish tabloid rumours than anything truthful. His weight problems don't hold him back from scoring regularly when he's fit plus there are tons of reasons for weight gains, so I don't see your point. If he was as shit as you claim him to be, Milan wouldn't have spent over 10 mil getting him from Madrid, nor would he have scored 7 in 14 games for them last season.
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I'd be prepared to bet that he'll have a good run in the second half of this season.
 
krazyrobus said:
The late night boozing and clubbing is not tabloid conjecture it's clear fact that can be backed up with pictures of him taken at clubs at 2am the night before a match.

Regarding his weight with access to the best nutritionists and physical trainers out there even the people with the worst genetic predispositions should not be overweight much less a professional player.

You're inferring things from my posts and not actually reading the points. I've never said Ronaldo at any point was shit. My main point is that he like Kluivert had the potential to be so much more but chose not to keep their head down and work to achieve their best.

Ronaldo is different from Kluivert in that he is so talented he can get by doing the minimum, not something Kluivert could afford to do.

Notwithstanding his injuries Ronaldo has already cut a name for himself as one of the best strikers to ever play the game. Now imagine what he could have achieved if he kept his head down and worked hard and kept trim like he was in WC 2006 and prior to that. People would probably be saying "Pele and Zidane who?" And he would have overshadowed Zidane in the 90's and 2000s in much the same way Maradonna did to Platini in the 80's.

And that was my main point from the beggining.
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Nothing wrong with late night boozing and clubbing every now and then when you can continue to score regularly in the games, those stories are more exagerations and meant to sell papers than reflecting his actual lifestyle. If that were the case , he wouldn't have scored so regularly during his time with Madrid nor would AC Milan have paid over 10 mil for his services. As for his weight, again, it has feck all to do with anything because it didn't stop him from scoring the goals which he was meant to do and got paid for.

You actually said that success came too early to him and he fell off the wagon from it just like Kluivert which is false, otherwise he wouldn't have come back from those long-term career threatening injuries to win Brazil their fifth world cup and become the best player in the world and continue to be one of the best strikers in the game. Kluivert isn't fit to lace his boots and your comparison of the two based on that claim is far from accurate.
 
we were in for him before treble season, he said at the time if he came to PL it would only be for the Arse, we went for Dwight, the rest is history.

and so were the Arse until recently
 
I remember in an interview Cristiano said that his childhood nickname was Kluivert. Lets hope Ronnie doesn't fade like Patrick.
 
ITaly was clearly the best league in the world at the time, by some distance. All well and good scoring 34 in 37 games for Barca but he needed to go to where the defences were meaner and he was up against the best strikers on offer, Batistute, Beirhoff etc. Didn't do too badly some 25 goals in 33 games in his 1st season there.
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Yes it was BUT the type of player Ronaldo was i just felt the slow pace of the league didn't suit his explosive style. There's no doubt he did it in Italy, but Ronaldo could have done it in any league. The spanish league at the time wasn't THAT bad a standard it was just Ronaldo was THAT good hence his record in Italy too.

Dev1 - Maradonna was a genius as was Ronaldo. Simple as
 
reddevilcanada said:
Nothing wrong with late night boozing and clubbing every now and then when you can continue to score regularly in the games, those stories are more exagerations and meant to sell papers than reflecting his actual lifestyle. If that were the case , he wouldn't have scored so regularly during his time with Madrid nor would AC Milan have paid over 10 mil for his services. As for his weight, again, it has feck all to do with anything because it didn't stop him from scoring the goals which he was meant to do and got paid for.

You actually said that success came too early to him and he fell off the wagon from it just like Kluivert which is false, otherwise he wouldn't have come back from those long-term career threatening injuries to win Brazil their fifth world cup and become the best player in the world and continue to be one of the best strikers in the game. Kluivert isn't fit to lace his boots and your comparison of the two based on that claim is far from accurate.
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Nothing wrong with late night boozing at the right time, 2am before a match that kicks off at 3pm the next day is definately not the right time. How is a picture of him at X place at that time an exxagerration? Much continous regular pics of him doing that?

The weight has nothing to do with his scoring? Did you not see the last world cup, him and Adriano could barely be bothered to make runs behind the defenses, you can be overweight and still score against mediocre teams/players but the 1st real test they came against in France and they failed it miserably.

When teams are closer in talent the margins between winning and losing become finer and hence the difference between a fat Ronaldo and a slim Ronaldo could possibly be the difference between winning and losing.

Kluivert not being as good as him is irrelevant to my point which was they both didn't work as hard to achieve the potential that their talent merited which is the definition of falling off the wagon and that happened because success come too early for both of them.
 
Suedesi said:
He was an overrated primadona who tasted success to early and took it for granted, hence threw his career away- Ruud is the same age and still on top of his game.
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Correct.This thread cannot have anything more to offer.
 
krazyrobus said:
Nothing wrong with late night boozing at the right time, 2am before a match that kicks off at 3pm the next day is definately not the right time. How is a picture of him at X place at that time an exxagerration? Much continous regular pics of him doing that?

The weight has nothing to do with his scoring? Did you not see the last world cup, him and Adriano could barely be bothered to make runs behind the defenses, you can be overweight and still score against mediocre teams/players but the 1st real test they came against in France and they failed it miserably.

When teams are closer in talent the margins between winning and losing become finer and hence the difference between a fat Ronaldo and a slim Ronaldo could possibly be the difference between winning and losing.

Kluivert not being as good as him is irrelevant to my point which was they both didn't work as hard to achieve the potential that their talent merited which is the definition of falling off the wagon and that happened because success come too early for both of them.
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What is your source that he was late night boozing at 2 am with a match at 3 pm? Of course there have to be more pics and stories like that if your allegations of his late night boozing lifestyle are to be believed.

Dunno if you noticed but he scored 3 goals in 5 games in teh world cup and was the second top scorer in the tournament making him the world cup's all time leading scorer with 15 goals. The problem with Brazil wasn't Ronaldo, it was not using Ronaldinho and Kaka properly and having the likes of Carlos and Cafu on the pitch despite having better full backs in the forms of Cicinho and Gilberto available and Parreira's tactics in general, your attempts at pointing the finger at Ronaldo for Brazil's poor world cup is a bad example and wrong on so many levels. There are many reasons for Brazil's defeat to France, if anything, the likes of Ronaldinho, Kaka, Cafu, Carlos (he was the one who left Henry unmaked to tap in Zidane's cross) underperformed much more than Ronaldo against France. So you're getting desperate here for blaming it on Roanldo.
 
reddevilcanada said:
What is your source that he was late night boozing at 2 am with a match at 3 pm? Of course there have to be more pics and stories like that if your allegations of his late night boozing lifestyle are to be believed.

Dunno if you noticed but he scored 3 goals in 5 games in teh world cup and was the second top scorer in the tournament making him the world cup's all time leading scorer with 15 goals. The problem with Brazil wasn't Ronaldo, it was not using Ronaldinho and Kaka properly and having the likes of Carlos and Cafu on the pitch despite having better full backs in the forms of Cicinho and Gilberto available and Parreira's tactics in general, your attempts at pointing the finger at Ronaldo for Brazil's poor world cup is a bad example and wrong on so many levels. There are many reasons for Brazil's defeat to France, if anything, the likes of Ronaldinho, Kaka, Cafu, Carlos (he was the one who left Henry unmaked to tap in Zidane's cross) underperformed much more than Ronaldo against France. So you're getting desperate here for blaming it on Roanldo.
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My sources are the usuall Spanish newspapers (Except that dogshit the Marca.) You can argue that they had an agenda to sell newspapers, which paper doesn't but are they going to doctor pictures? I don't see them going that far, bending the truth verbally is much easier and more up newspapers' alley

You really like inference don't you. Unless I say something directly stop putting words and notions into my mouth. I didn't blame Ronaldo for Brazil's poor world cup. I blamed Ronaldo for Ronaldo's poor world cup.

He scored 3 goals in 5 games, 2 against Japan and 1 against world cup debutants Ghana. Proves what I said earlier, when the difference in relative talent is large then scoring is not a problem, the smaller the margins are, the more the little things count, such as his weight.

Irrespective of whether Carlos made a mistake to let Henry score Ronaldo could have played all day and not scored, he wasn't a threat, didn't look like being a threat at any stage in that match. How could he? Couldn't out sprint Gallas, couldn't outlast him, couldn't out jump him. Would having less weight and being fitter helped him and consequently the team, yes.
 
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