Patrick Dorgu | United in talks

hellhunter said:
It's not 40% pass success rate, he's at the 40% percentile for passers. Which is still really poor
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You are right, but yeah like you said still not great according to fbref his passing % is 76.7% which isn't too far off the squad average of 77.7%. Compared to the 83.1% average of our squad one would also have to factor in that they (Lecce) probably play a bit more direct than we do.
 
Berbaclass said:
Thats true but maybe they just rate Dorgu higher.
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How though? On what basis? It's far too small a sample size to judge a player on whatever metrics you use!

Lemoor said:
Ait Nouri has a club option for another year according to transfermarkt at least.
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Wasn't aware of this, but I doubt he'd cost much more than Dorgu either way and he looks perfect for a left wing back in Amorim's system.
 
2 man midfield said:
All we have to do is find 6m (the amortised fee). If Antony and Rashford leave, there’s 6m in wages right there. Unless it doesn’t work like that? Any accountants in here?
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I'm sorry but that is just a fecking awful trade. The quoted price will be a massive chunk of our budget for this window and probably summer too. We don't have the spending power to spunk out this amount on a virtual nobody.

How much do you think he would cost the likes of Brighton, Bournemouth or Forest? Probably under 10m. We've been shit at spending money recently but that's another part of why we struggle so much in the market. We get bent over by prices being quoted. It may hurt for a bit but we are simply going to have to start refusing to pay fees above that which other clubs would be quoted. We can't sustain spending otherwise.
 
groovyalbert said:
I'm sorry but that is just a fecking awful trade. The quoted price will be a massive chunk of our budget for this window and probably summer too. We don't have the spending power to spunk out this amount on a virtual nobody.

How much do you think he would cost the likes of Brighton, Bournemouth or Forest? Probably under 10m. We've been shit at spending money recently but that's another part of why we struggle so much in the market. We get bent over by prices being quoted. It may hurt for a bit but we are simply going to have to start refusing to pay fees above that which other clubs would be quoted. We can't sustain spending otherwise.
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Exactly right. We need to just walk away from deals if we get quoted prices above the odds.

There are always more players out there.
 
Hope we get it done. Then we can finally call it quits with Shaw and Malacia.

Dorgu and Leon are worth the investment.
 
Berbaclass said:
What is?
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Mostly his age, truth be told. We lack players of peak age in our first team, and have relied to heavily on very young players.
On top of that I have not been impressed with his passing when I have watched him.
 
Berbaclass said:
How much do you know about the player that you are adamant is not good enough?
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I'm not saying he's "not good enough". I'm saying an objective valuation would be around £10m, give or take.

He plays for Lecce, with fewer than 50 appearances in Serie A. His team are just above the relegation zone.
 
Lyng said:
Mostly his age, truth be told. We lack players of peak age in our first team, and have relied to heavily on very young players.
On top of that I have not been impressed with his passing when I have watched him.
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Fair enough but the club seems to be looking at younger profile players
 
groovyalbert said:
Throw in the difference in the leagues, I'd wager he's a worse option than either Kerkez or Nouri. His defensive attributes for the Italian league are also alarming.
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Could that not be due to him playing in soany different positions though?
 
Overhaul FC said:
Hope we get it done. Then we can finally call it quits with Shaw and Malacia.

Dorgu and Leon are worth the investment.
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Shaw's not going anywhere. Nobody is taking a left back on his wages that is constantly injured.

Also neither Dorgu or Leon are proven and may be years away from being ready to play at this level if they ever even get there.
 
groovyalbert said:
I'm sorry but that is just a fecking awful trade. The quoted price will be a massive chunk of our budget for this window and probably summer too. We don't have the spending power to spunk out this amount on a virtual nobody.

How much do you think he would cost the likes of Brighton, Bournemouth or Forest? Probably under 10m. We've been shit at spending money recently but that's another part of why we struggle so much in the market. We get bent over by prices being quoted. It may hurt for a bit but we are simply going to have to start refusing to pay fees above that which other clubs would be quoted. We can't sustain spending otherwise.
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Can’t really say to be fair, I’ve never seen him play or even heard of him before this window opened. Have you watched him enough to know he’s not up to it?
 
Lyng said:
Mostly his age, truth be told. We lack players of peak age in our first team, and have relied to heavily on very young players.
On top of that I have not been impressed with his passing when I have watched him.
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Agreed. If this deal is done, the squad will have two wing/left-backs who are 18 and 20 in the summer and Luke Shaw who's completely unreliable and probably can't play the position anymore.
 
Berbaclass said:
Based on what though? It seems completely arbitrary.
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He plays for Lecce, with fewer than 50 appearances in Serie A. His team are just above the relegation zone.

How much would Brighton be willing to pay for him? That's what we should be asking ourselves. That's his value.
 
MikeUpNorth said:
He plays for Lecce, with fewer than 50 appearances in Serie A. His team are just above the relegation zone.

How much would Brighton be willing to pay for him? That's what we should be asking ourselves. That's his value.
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You also have to factor in that it's January and we are desperate. The club are rightly going to ask more for that alone.
 
Berbaclass said:
You also have to factor in that it's January and we are desperate. The club are rightly going to ask more for that alone.
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Then don't buy him. Overpaying is the one thing we must not do, if we're to have any chance of dragging ourselves out of this hole.

There are ALWAYS more players out there.
 
MikeUpNorth said:
He plays for Lecce, with fewer than 50 appearances in Serie A. His team are just above the relegation zone.

How much would Brighton be willing to pay for him? That's what we should be asking ourselves. That's his value.
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Brighton spent 30m to get Pedro from a mid-table Championship side.
 
2 man midfield said:
Can’t really say to be fair, I’ve never seen him play or even heard of him before this window opened. Have you watched him enough to know he’s not up to it?
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Nope, never heard of him before we were linked and I've only seen clips since the news broke (although there wasn't much there that stood out).

But what I would feel confident in assuming is that no other club currently in the lower half of the table, competing in the second European tournament and with little chance of silverware this season would be quoted the price we've been for him.
 
SilentWitness said:
Brighton spent 30m to get Pedro from a mid-table Championship side.
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A forward, with over 100 senior appearances and 24 goals, on the verge of being called up by Brazil. United would probably have bid £60m for him.
 
MikeUpNorth said:
A forward, with over 100 senior appearances and 24 goals, on the verge of being called up by Brazil. United would probably have bid £60m for him.
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...and Dorgu is capped by Denmark and has scored for them.

MaMa given red said:
He's an attacker and he'd played a season in the Premier League for Watford.
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The point was more that saying "how much would Brighton pay for them?" is a silly remark and reflection of attributing value to a player. Similarly saying they're only worth 10m based on pretty much nothing.
 
Berbaclass said:
You also have to factor in that it's January and we are desperate. The club are rightly going to ask more for that alone.
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Which is why we should pay the buyback clause for Alvaro Carreras who’s excelled for Benfica, played CL football, is further along in his development, counts as homegrown and is half the price of what Lecce apparently want us to pay
 
davidmichael said:
Which is why we should pay the buyback clause for Alvaro Carreras who’s excelled for Benfica, played CL football, is further along in his development, counts as homegrown and is half the price of what Lecce apparently want us to pay
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They obviously just don't rate him.
 
SilentWitness said:
...and Dorgu is capped by Denmark and has scored for them.


The point was more that saying "how much would Brighton pay for them?" is a silly remark and reflection of attributing value to a player. Similarly saying they're only worth 10m based on pretty much nothing.
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My starting point for all United transfer business — given our recent history — is that:
1. The player is probably not good enough.
2. The fee is way too high.

I think the burden of proof is always on people who think it's a good signing. As a club, we'd have been far better off if we'd avoided 90% of the purchases made over the last decade.

Out of an abundance of caution, we should probably avoid signing anyone we can't afford to buy twice. At least for the next few windows.
 
MikeUpNorth said:
I'm not saying he's "not good enough". I'm saying an objective valuation would be around £10m, give or take.

He plays for Lecce, with fewer than 50 appearances in Serie A. His team are just above the relegation zone.
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How is that an "objective" valuation? You've just listed three random things and arbitrarily came up with a number

Mainoo plays for United, with fewer than 50 appearances in the Prem. His team are just above the relegation zone - so I take it £10m, give or take?
 
MikeUpNorth said:
My starting point for all United transfer business — given our recent history — is that:
1. The player is probably not good enough.
2. The fee is way too high.

I think the burden of proof is always on people who think it's a good signing. As a club, we'd have been far better off if we'd avoided 90% of the purchases made over the last decade.

Out of an abundance of caution, we should probably avoid signing anyone we can't afford to buy twice. At least for the next few windows.
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You are just being negative. for £20 million this is a pretty low-risk transfer with quite a bit of potential upside.
 
SuperiorXI said:
Every player we try to get is costing at least 40m why is that? Is there no bargains to be had anymore?
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There's no value in the market.

But really, clubs just know we are going to pay this. They also know how desperate we are for players that fit the new formation/tactics.
 
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