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And while not ideal I don’t think he’s so good that we have to spend £30m+ on him.
At that point I think you move onto another target.
At that point I think you move onto another target.
Patrick Dorgu | United in talks
- Thread starter bosskeano
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) and Imran (@Annihilate Now!) are here to discuss Amad saving our blushes in a win against Southampton as well as our now annual loss at home to Brighton. They discuss Amorim's post-match comments, revisit how mid-table we may or may not be, and discuss some transfer news.
People in here talking like there's some sort of magic figure that would automatically be accepted and that would automatically represent 'value'. Pulling numbers out of thin air. We can offer 15 million until we're blue in the face but if the club don't accept it we can't force them. Realistically, if we want the player badly now then we have to pay a price that the selling club deems acceptable. Yes, it's on us to make sure that price is as low as possible but there is a floor to that. If that is 30 million, then that's the price. The question then becomes whether the player is worth it or will be in the long run. Saying that paying more than any other buying club is willing to pay is overpaying is stupid, unless by overpaying you very literally mean 'paying more than other buying clubs' which has nothing to say about the actual value (and future value) of an asset.
Can someone explain how Antony leaving on loan (I haven't seen a loan fee reported), with a team covering just part of his wages enables us to be able to make this move?
Ignore the first part, because it was silly, and reply to the second part to distract from the silliness of the first, you mean?
Exactly.
A lwb signing isn't going to be a game changer for the season. It's not that he is a super talent that we are going to miss out on if we don't get him now.
Who are you?
Obviously the club sees him as a very promising player. I can't comment too much because I don't know enough about the player and I'm not going to sit here and pretend that I do to seem intelligent.
If United are willing to pay up to 30 million euros then fine, I'm willing to trust their judgment with how tight the finances are right now. Reading between the lines they think it's a good deal at that price and will benefit us long term. As long as they stick to that valuation and don't go over that, because for me that is what I define as overpaying. Setting an internal valuation and at the last minute going 'feck it' and just paying what it costs.
To add to that...
Part of the reason for Amorim to come in midseason is to properly assess the squad within his preferred system. I would argue that our current LWB options are so bad that it's unbalancing the whole team and effectively making it impossible to properly assess players in multiple positions.
(this also applies to RWB but at least Amad can do a job there but would prefer him further forward)
Would love to borrow your crystal ball when you're done with it.
I disagree with this. The wingbacks in this system are in my opinion the two most important players.
It's nonsense.
It absolutely would be if whoever we bring in was good.
No idea about this guy but a LWB is definitely a priority position, in this system.
It's not nonsense at all. Maguires extension and Antony's wages will free up just enough room in the budget to cover the amortised cost of Dorgu, providing it's at or around £30 million.
I never said they are not. I am asking why do we have to overpay (which is my opinion and you think it too) for this one now?
Agreed. There's an element of risk in all transfers but having a sensible approach and avoiding the classic Moyes/Fellaini situation is key. Posters here pretending like they know the player inside and out and setting arbitrary values beyond which we're overpaying makes no sense.
I agree, if the player is of a good standard it completely unlocks another side of our attack
I'm a person posting on an internet forum. Who are you?! Redcafe famous?!
He'll join, have an outstanding debut and then get injured for the rest of the season
I hope the lad is good to do that
What a debut though!
How? Can you provide me the numbers that show we are on the verge and have to match penny by penny?
What has Maguire's extension got to do with it?
We cannot simply stretch his amortization just because we extended his contract by a season. His cost would have already been amortized at the beginning of the season.
You don't know what you are taking about, do you?
Best I can do is "Whitwell and Horncastle tend to be okay."
Funny that, I was thinking the same thing about you.
Someone who doesn't butt in into a discussion when he doesn't need to.
Cool. Can you please give me the numbers now?
I didn't need to but I did want to. Hope that clears it up.
What does extending Maguire have to do with anything? His transfer fee was already paid up in the books last year. This is simply around £9.8m in annual wages that might have decreased that now aren't.
Some joker probably mentioned it in a tweet.
Have you got a source for this?
For me, it's more about physicality than athleticism. If we can get hold of players who are not just athletic but mostly 6 foot plus it will help with that competitive edge. Players like Malacia will get brushed off the ball and the PL is becoming more physical year on year with duels on the ground and aerially.
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I disagree with you here. I think a LWB will be a game changer personally because of what it frees up all over the pitch.
However I don’t think Lecce can turn down sub £30m offers for their players.
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Market value is just what the highest bidder pays.
But some deals don’t make as much sense.
Maguire signed a 6-year contract in 2019 for a fee of £80 million. That's a yearly amortisation cost of £13.33 million a year.
By extending his contract by 1 year (now 7 years in total), the remaining unamortised amount is spread over 3 years instead of 2. Making it £8.89 million for the next two years.
A difference of roughly £4 million. Along with £1-2 Million saved from Antony's wages over the next 5-6 months.
I may be wrong, haven't looked in depth - but regardless of whether it was £80m over 5 years or 6 years, the cost is still accounted for ahead of time. How does extending him change anything?
Agreed. I just don't understand the confidence of some posters in determining that we're overpaying for a player that I'd wager they know little about. Particularly when taking into account the difference he could make to our system and the fact that we'd be depriving them of him at an important point in the season.
What makes you put faith in our recruitment to get it right for the valuation in question?
I am specifically talking about the rest of this season. I don't think it'll move the needle very much in context of this sesson. On top of that this guy is very young and looks very raw.
I really really want us to sign a LWB. But I don't want us to overpay for someone in desperation.
He signed a 6-year deal so I assumed that it would be amortised over the 6 years. I posted above how it works to my understanding.
I feel like they did a good job in the summer.
Do you not feel Zirkzee and Yoro may have been overpriced?