This. I'm hoping for an upgrade on Fred before the end of the window although not necessarily expecting one.
Our best midfield balance?
- Thread starter Walters_19_MuFc
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This. I'm hoping for an upgrade on Fred before the end of the window although not necessarily expecting one.
It will never work. Bruno is anti good football.
Is Pogba another player that’s become a legend now that he’s left? Casemiro another player to “unlock” him? 
As great as Casemiro is, I still worry about the legs and energy in our midfield. Hence I think Fred needs to play alongside him.
As great as Casemiro is, I still worry about the legs and energy in our midfield. Hence I think Fred needs to play alongside him.
Interesting seeing the replies.
It's clear that since ten Hag has joined, he's tried to replicate the midfield structure he had at Ajax.
Typically, he would set up with the following:
Berghuis
Gravenberch Alvarez
Despite being a 4231 on paper, this would typically transition into a 433, with Gravenberch pushing forward into the half-spaces. However, there was plenty of rotation, especially with Gravenberch, who often used to pop up on the wing or even drop into the defensive line to start play. You then had Berghuis as the playmaker type and Alvarez as the ball winner.
Number 6
Now, I was all for Frenkie De Jong, because he's a tremendous ball player, but if ten Hag wanted to go towards a similar template to what he had at Ajax last season, then it begs the question as to why it took him so long to identify that we needed a top quality holding midfielder as he had in Alvarez? Someone who can not only start play but more importantly, snuff out any potential counterattacks, which has been one of our weaknesses for quite a while now.
With the addition of Casemiro, you'd expect him certainly help us in that regard.
Number 8
To me, this is our biggest weakness in midfield. In Gravenberch, ten Hag had someone who was not only technically sound but a physical monster. People will berate me for this, but the closest player we have to Gravenberch is McTominay, and during pre-season, ten Hag often used McTominay the most in that role. Having said that, whilst McTominay has the running power and stamina to perfom this role, he's not great on the ball.
The other options we currently have consist of Fred, Eriksen and Van de Beek.
Fred, like McTominay has the ability to get up and down the pitch with no problems. However, his lack of exposure in the final third often lets him down.
Whilst I worry about Eriksen's lack of physicality, he's easily our best passer of the ball and would be able to play that mezzala role. He wouldn't be able to give us the running off the ball Fred, McTominay or even Van de Beek would give us, but he'd obvious be the best choice from a possession point of view.
You then have Van de Beek who, to me, would be more suited as a number 10, as he has enact of picking up clever positons in the box and getting on the end of things.
Based on our current options, it, therefore, doesn't surprise me why we've been linked to Milinkovic-Savic, who would currently plays the same role for Lazio. Again, like Gravenberch, he has a nice mixture of technique and physicality and would be ideal for that role. That said, I personally can't see us buying another midfielder, although I do think it's imperative we look to upgrade that position next season. My dream signing would be Bellingham.
Number 10
A lot of people have said Bruno plays too high up, but traditionally, ten Hag does want his two midfielders in front of the single pivot playing in high positions. As said before, the 8 will have more license to drop, but if you look at Berghuis, or even Van de Beek a couple of seasons ago, he often used to play as a kind of second striker, and we used to see a lot of rotations with the striker if/when they dropped for the ball, so that's not really an issue with me.
My issue with Bruno is the way in which he uses the ball. His choice of pass isn't always great which, as a result, kills our play quite often in the final third. I felt he had a really good pre-season, but it seems when we go a goal down, he often loses his head and tries to force it. If he's on his game, he'd be my first choice, but with Eriksen, and maybe even Van de Beek, I'd be inclined to try someone else in that role.
Best balance
I think ten Hag has been taken back a bit with the physicality of the EPL. Whilst we need technical players in midfield, we certainly need that blend of physicality to match the running distance of our opposition.
We started the season with Fred, McTominay, and Bruno, changing to Eriksen, Fred, and Bruno in the second.
We definitely know Casemiro will start as the 6, providing he's fit, so it's the two 8's who he will need to get right.
I also find it interesting that he kept Eriksen deep against Brentford. That makes me think that ten Hag will initially go with Eriksen as the 8, with Casemiro as the 6, and Bruno/Van de Beek as the 10.
He spoke about needing a ''connector'' in midfield, and Eriksen is probably the only player who has the ability to do this for us. I guess you could argue that's why he wanted De Jong so much.
Going forward I think we will see:
Eriksen Bruno
Casemiro
Van de Beek to rotate with Bruno and McTominay or Fred to come in to solidify things if we're winning but I definitely think it's crucial we get a top-class number 8 next season.
It's clear that since ten Hag has joined, he's tried to replicate the midfield structure he had at Ajax.
Typically, he would set up with the following:
Berghuis
Gravenberch Alvarez
Despite being a 4231 on paper, this would typically transition into a 433, with Gravenberch pushing forward into the half-spaces. However, there was plenty of rotation, especially with Gravenberch, who often used to pop up on the wing or even drop into the defensive line to start play. You then had Berghuis as the playmaker type and Alvarez as the ball winner.
Number 6
Now, I was all for Frenkie De Jong, because he's a tremendous ball player, but if ten Hag wanted to go towards a similar template to what he had at Ajax last season, then it begs the question as to why it took him so long to identify that we needed a top quality holding midfielder as he had in Alvarez? Someone who can not only start play but more importantly, snuff out any potential counterattacks, which has been one of our weaknesses for quite a while now.
With the addition of Casemiro, you'd expect him certainly help us in that regard.
Number 8
To me, this is our biggest weakness in midfield. In Gravenberch, ten Hag had someone who was not only technically sound but a physical monster. People will berate me for this, but the closest player we have to Gravenberch is McTominay, and during pre-season, ten Hag often used McTominay the most in that role. Having said that, whilst McTominay has the running power and stamina to perfom this role, he's not great on the ball.
The other options we currently have consist of Fred, Eriksen and Van de Beek.
Fred, like McTominay has the ability to get up and down the pitch with no problems. However, his lack of exposure in the final third often lets him down.
Whilst I worry about Eriksen's lack of physicality, he's easily our best passer of the ball and would be able to play that mezzala role. He wouldn't be able to give us the running off the ball Fred, McTominay or even Van de Beek would give us, but he'd obvious be the best choice from a possession point of view.
You then have Van de Beek who, to me, would be more suited as a number 10, as he has enact of picking up clever positons in the box and getting on the end of things.
Based on our current options, it, therefore, doesn't surprise me why we've been linked to Milinkovic-Savic, who would currently plays the same role for Lazio. Again, like Gravenberch, he has a nice mixture of technique and physicality and would be ideal for that role. That said, I personally can't see us buying another midfielder, although I do think it's imperative we look to upgrade that position next season. My dream signing would be Bellingham.
Number 10
A lot of people have said Bruno plays too high up, but traditionally, ten Hag does want his two midfielders in front of the single pivot playing in high positions. As said before, the 8 will have more license to drop, but if you look at Berghuis, or even Van de Beek a couple of seasons ago, he often used to play as a kind of second striker, and we used to see a lot of rotations with the striker if/when they dropped for the ball, so that's not really an issue with me.
My issue with Bruno is the way in which he uses the ball. His choice of pass isn't always great which, as a result, kills our play quite often in the final third. I felt he had a really good pre-season, but it seems when we go a goal down, he often loses his head and tries to force it. If he's on his game, he'd be my first choice, but with Eriksen, and maybe even Van de Beek, I'd be inclined to try someone else in that role.
Best balance
I think ten Hag has been taken back a bit with the physicality of the EPL. Whilst we need technical players in midfield, we certainly need that blend of physicality to match the running distance of our opposition.
We started the season with Fred, McTominay, and Bruno, changing to Eriksen, Fred, and Bruno in the second.
We definitely know Casemiro will start as the 6, providing he's fit, so it's the two 8's who he will need to get right.
Find it interesting that a lot of people have Fred starting, despite being hooked at halftime in both games.I also find it interesting that he kept Eriksen deep against Brentford. That makes me think that ten Hag will initially go with Eriksen as the 8, with Casemiro as the 6, and Bruno/Van de Beek as the 10.
He spoke about needing a ''connector'' in midfield, and Eriksen is probably the only player who has the ability to do this for us. I guess you could argue that's why he wanted De Jong so much.
Going forward I think we will see:
Eriksen Bruno
Casemiro
Van de Beek to rotate with Bruno and McTominay or Fred to come in to solidify things if we're winning but I definitely think it's crucial we get a top-class number 8 next season.
Casemiro
De Jong ... ... ... ... Erikssen
Antony ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... Sancho
Bruno
De Jong ... ... ... ... Erikssen
Antony ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... Sancho
Bruno
But, just to push the Barcelona model...if you'd like me to find a use for them all...well then:
Casemiro .... McTominay .... De Jong .... Fred
De Beek
Erikssen .... .... .... .... Bruno
Anthony .... .... .... .... .... .... .... .... .... Sancho
Gakpo
Mes de un club
De Beek
Erikssen .... .... .... .... Bruno
Anthony .... .... .... .... .... .... .... .... .... Sancho
Gakpo
Mes de un club
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With Casemiro you need two press resistant players in midfield. Bruno does not fit that profile.
............cesimeiro.........
.........vdb..........erikson
Play Bruno as a false 9
.........vdb..........erikson
Play Bruno as a false 9
Well considering the other options, you'd probably say he's the best fit unless ten Hag plays Zidane Iqbal.
No, i would add Fred and Eriksen if playing Casemiro. The latter is used to playing with Fred and Eriksen is the best Modric/Kroos version you have.
Casemiro DVB Ericksen
So what you're saying is Fred's more press resistant than Bruno, because that's the initial point that you made?
It’s not the strength of either one but from the limited exposure to United games I had, I‘d say that Fred is less reckless with the ball. Casemiro at Real functioned so well because Modric and Kroos cannot be pressed and are excellent passers.
I would think that Fredemiro and Erikson is the way to go.
Based on the midfield ten Hag has put out tonight against Liverpool, I can imagine the only change will be Casemiro for McTominay, thus seeing a midfield three of:
Bruno
Eriksen - Casemiro
Eriksen - Casemiro
I'm not sure what the best midfield balance is but I know that McTominay as a lone DM with Bruno and Eriksen may be the worst.
If man City can play two basically attacking midfielders in a 3 man midfield then why not us with an even stronger dm than what man City have, not bruno though, screw him.
-----casemiro
Eriksen____vdb
Maybe also a diamond of -
-----casemiro
Eriksen__fred
____sancho
We could go down the ragnick route of -
Casemiro__martinez
Eriksen____sancho
-----casemiro
Eriksen____vdb
Maybe also a diamond of -
-----casemiro
Eriksen__fred
____sancho
We could go down the ragnick route of -
Casemiro__martinez
Eriksen____sancho
Casemiro - Eriksen - (one of) McFred.
Good balance of energy, technique and defensive stability there.
Good balance of energy, technique and defensive stability there.
Everyone is assuming that it will be McTominay dropped for Casemiro, and that may end up being the case, but I think that in terms of the style of football ETH wants us to play, as well as the midfield balance, it should be Bruno.
A midfield three of Casemiro, Eriksen and McTominay has a nice balance to it. Energy, physicality, technique, defensive stability.
A midfield three of Casemiro, Eriksen and McTominay has a nice balance to it. Energy, physicality, technique, defensive stability.
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Let's answer this question once the transfer window closes. It appears there is still hope we can bring in de Jong. 10 days ago Casemiro wasn't even a rumor. 14 days ago we were all in a state of panic that Veronique's son would be the only addition to our midfield.
But if we do bring in de Jong we have some pretty decent looks on offer against any given opponent, although we'd still be a short a proven CDM behind Casemiro (Garner may stay, but he's not yet proven at this level).
The hardest issue ETH is going to face is whether to rotate Bruno in and out of the squad, which I think needs to happen especially as we make the transition to ETH tactics.
But if we do bring in de Jong we have some pretty decent looks on offer against any given opponent, although we'd still be a short a proven CDM behind Casemiro (Garner may stay, but he's not yet proven at this level).
The hardest issue ETH is going to face is whether to rotate Bruno in and out of the squad, which I think needs to happen especially as we make the transition to ETH tactics.