Did you see our team against Newcastle? Wouldn't get out of League 1. Genuinely. Bournemouth was poor I'l give you that. I actually felt we PLAYED ok in the other two. Missed a load of chances. But we're going to get ups and downs with a team with an average age of 23. We've also beaten most of the top teams we've played. Just depends whether you want to take the positives or negatives. I'm not saying it's brilliant but there is No quick fix.
Ole Gunnar Solskjær | 2021/22 Discussion
- Thread starter Samid
- Start date
- Status
Seriously? No one is asking from such squad to challenge for anything but yes I'm sure even with injuries we still had a better lineup than Newcastle this day. It's Newcastle, not Man City.
It's so easy to beat Newcastle without our best players yet 6 other teams have already failed to do so.
He also won the German cup with Frankfurt.
You are right. I completely forgot it.
Didn't we lose at Newcastle February 2018? Or was that the managers fault too?
I'm not really sure about the relation here but I doubt people were excusing the manager back then.
I prefer Fred to Anderson. At least the former tries hard to settle down and be useful.
You're point about Ole not being good enough is that he had better players than Newcastle so therefore should have beaten them.
United went to Newcastle 18 months previous with a slightly better team and we're beaten that day too. Different manager though.
Aren't you understanding that saying it's 'the managers fault' as everyone seems to do when we lose, isn't right. It's not that simple
This is a very poor logic let's be honest. So every team we lost to before it means when we lose to them now it is not the manager's fault. So since we lost to Bournemouth 4 years ago with LVG it's not Ole's fault to lose to them now. Since we lost to Newcastle 2 years ago it means it's not the manager's fault to lose to them. So I get it each manager coming after Ole from now on won't be his problem if his side lost to Newcastle, because the 2 previous managers lost against them.
Can you see now the ridiculous perspective of such logic? Each game is evaluated on its own, whatever we won or lost against them in previous matches.
And the other problem in such logic is it is not just Newcastle that we lost to this season.
Well your starting to understand yeah. What has been the one common factor in the last few years? Ed woodward and the players. So my blame would be on them. What I'm also referring to is you saying that because we had a better team (debatable on the day) we should beat Newcastle. It doesn't work like that. As previous years under different managers show. If we don't it's not just down to the manager. Analyse it a bit deeper!
Just because Ed is terrible it doesn't necessarily means the manager himself is blameless when we lose a game though. I haven't so far seen anyone who is on the Ole out side and is defending Woodward at the same.
And of course if you lose a favorable game while you have better players than the opposition, the manager will get a portion of the blame. It's always like that not just in United but every club around now, irrespective of the previous results against such time. It doesn't make sense. Each game has different circumstances and should be evaluated on its own.
No one saying the squad is great but at the same time most of our losses and draws are against teams we should be beating even with few injuries. Injuries are normal, happened and will keep happening. It's the manager's responsibility to plan for what to do on missing few key options, especially against inferior teams. We shouldn't be around 7th-10th for the last few months even with this squad imo.
The season is still long and things might improve but it has been a very bad start no denying it. Let's see what will happen from now on.
Even PSG wil lose against Toulouse and City will lose against Norwich. But problem is that under Ole we lose against weaker teams week after week. We already lost against Bournemouth, Palace, Newcastle and West ham. In a range of two months. Plus draw against Saints. That is pathetic form against mid table and low table clubs and it is sign that we don't have general play and plan to dominate weaker teams than us. Against equal or better teams we play on counter attacks.
So, so far our setup under Ole is like we are some mid table team
Look I'm not saying the start to the season has been great! But study them 4 defeats a bit deeper than just saying 'It's the managers fault'. Palace we missed a penalty and a load of chances, and against Newcastle and West ham we had to play Mata and Matic due to injuries and a paper thin squad. And again, I'm not saying Ole is brilliant but look into the results a bit more before just blaming the manager. And people just dismiss the good results against the better teams because we counter attack? why isn't everyone beating them if it's that easy??!!! Only teams to have taken a point off Liverpool (deserved 3) and beaten Leicester and Chelsea twice. That's the top 4 we're aiming for. If we can keep everyone fit we'l beat all the lower half teams too.
Why is managing a football team and making decisions all of a sudden a change of approach? You start with the best 11 players that you think will have the best chance of beating th opposition. This is based on form, fitness, mentality, tactics, opposition and learning more about your squad over time and who you can rely on in certain situations.
The difference between PSG and the City and the lower teams in their respective leagues are far greater though than that of this current United team, especially as we’ve been missing our best player for every one of those games bar Palace.
Klopp had a bad time against the lower teams for a long time after his tenure at Liverpool began. Since he took over from Rodgers in 15/16 they lost to Palace, Newcastle, Watford, West Ham, Southampton, Swansea with a negative goal-difference of 13-3 just from those games.
In his first full season they lost to Burnley, Bournemouth, Swansea, Hull, Leicester and Palace whilst also drawing against Bournemouth, Southampton (2x) and Sunderland. Similarly to us though they never lost once to a top 6 competitor.
The start to his 17/18 campaign could’ve very well spelled the end of him at another club, only winning 3 of his first 9 games which included draws against Watford, Burnley, Newcastle and also 5-0 and 4-1 drubbings to City and Spurs.
It was only thereon after, about 2 years in that they were able to find consistancy in their performances.
We all know what Klopp had achieved before taking over Liverpool but unless you have the kind of advantage that City and PSG have had it’s going to take time.
So Ole had no choice other than to sell Lukaku as the player no longer wanted to remain a United player. Similar to the Herrera situation in many respects.
Any argument that implies Ole is the anti-Christ for selling these wantaway players should end today.
So why don’t you give any credit to the manager when we beat or draw teams that have, for now, better squad?
You seem to just see the negative part but the positive part is nowhere to be seen.
Yep. And here’s another on Jose not being backed to buy Maguire when he said it would be embarrassing to spend £50m on him. At the time Leicester we’re willing to sell for £60m
https://metro.co.uk/2019/11/16/manc...o-harry-maguire-11169116/?ito=amp-more-item-3
I did. It's not my problem if you don't want to read really.
But what, you are probably surprised because you expect everyone to be like you, fixating your opinion on the same thing every game and twisting every narrative to suit it.
I did. It's not my problem if you don't want to read really.
But what, you are probably surprised because you expect everyone to be like you, fixating your opinion on the same thing every game and twisting every narrative to suit it.
Every post that you quoted have something negative in it. So you are just making my evidence even stronger. You just can’t keep of negativity.
Or that's what you search in posts while ignoring the rest. Not really my problem, again.
We are seeing partnerships form across the pitch. Martial, Rashford and James, Fred and Scott, Maguire and lindelof. This shows the manager has been able to effectively integrate the correct personnel and get the best out of them. Performances of all these players have improved quite drastically and some credit has to goto Solskjaer
Nothing will 'end today'. The manager of the football can take a stand and block outgoing moves until he gets a replacement in. It happens all the time at most clubs.
Well, to be fair Jose had already bought two CB's so him sulking over not getting a third one was understandably not well received by the board. Ed can still feck off though
Like they do at Spurs? Working for well for them, I must say.
When has that ever ended well? That Spurs squad is doing immensely well after being refused moves by Levy, eh?
And for a player who will not be first choice? I can think of Ronaldo under Ferguson - but that was an exception for so many reasons. Who else? It's accepted wisdom (based on overwhelming evidence to back it) that when a player wants out and when "his head is gone", it's best to cut him loose. It's obvious from all accounts that Lukaku was being a terrible professional (read: was being unprofessional), was unfit and would just have been a drag and negative influence in the dressing room - apart form being on high wages of course. What exactly was Ole supposed to do?
So many people still talk and think of squad management as though its a computer games. There are financial and human implications that none of us are fully aware of.
Lukaku wanted out and he held a significant value on the market - keeping him this season would have achieved little, apart from having a demotivated player with a year less on his contract come the summer. I have no doubt that Ole would have loved to sign a replacement, but clearly we didn't find the right player available or (more likely) there were financial restraints given the wage bill and the need to offset some of the outlay. We practically got our money back on him - job well done. Great deal for the club.
Going into this season with a light squad was always likely to cost us, but the future benefits are as yet unknown. A lot of non-contributors off of the wage bill. Potential future transfers fees for Smalling (definitely) and Sanchez (maybe). Opportunities for our academy that should save us some significant outlay (Williams & Greenwood very likely - Garner, Tuanzebe and others to be decided). The squad look happy, united and we are starting to see a spine emerge in a young team that can play impressive football but need some consistency.
I really believe that we could end up finishing 7th or 8th and yet still look back on this season in 5 years time as a defining point where we learnt our lessons as a club and put the foundations in place for future success.
Lukaku wanted out and he held a significant value on the market - keeping him this season would have achieved little, apart from having a demotivated player with a year less on his contract come the summer. I have no doubt that Ole would have loved to sign a replacement, but clearly we didn't find the right player available or (more likely) there were financial restraints given the wage bill and the need to offset some of the outlay. We practically got our money back on him - job well done. Great deal for the club.
Going into this season with a light squad was always likely to cost us, but the future benefits are as yet unknown. A lot of non-contributors off of the wage bill. Potential future transfers fees for Smalling (definitely) and Sanchez (maybe). Opportunities for our academy that should save us some significant outlay (Williams & Greenwood very likely - Garner, Tuanzebe and others to be decided). The squad look happy, united and we are starting to see a spine emerge in a young team that can play impressive football but need some consistency.
I really believe that we could end up finishing 7th or 8th and yet still look back on this season in 5 years time as a defining point where we learnt our lessons as a club and put the foundations in place for future success.
The manager is well within his rights to block the move of a player under his employ, sure, but doing so benefits neither party in the long run.
Lukaku - with his weight problems, inability to press the opposition effectively due to a lack of mobility, and the fact that he no longer wanted to be a United player - was not worth causing disharmony amongst the squad just to keep him around. The decision to sell him on was the right move all things considered.
Will be interested to hear Ole's views on Poch being sacked when he is asked about this in his press conference on Friday
Why would he have a public opinion about that? It's not our club, and all. We don't talk about other clubs' players, we certainly have nothing to say about other clubs' managers.
Drop points against Sheffield United or Villa ,,and there will be a riot on Social Media to dump Ole for Poch. In a way it's already started with the OleOut crowd.
There’s already a riot going on here, and we haven’t even lost yet! Just imagine what the next draw/loss is going to be like.
We have lost to Palace, West Ham, Newcastle & Bournemouth.
If we lost to Villa or Sheff U it would exacerbate the feeling of wanting him out for some but the levels of performance that have happened this season are why some fans want OgS are wanting OgS gone, not games that are yet to be played.
We will defeat Villa at Old Trafford.
Sheff is what will be an interesting game.
Bit at 4:23's interesting in relation to how he uses his subs as manager.
I think it's clear that Ole didn't fancy him as a player. Maybe Lukaku would have wanted to leave anyway but I'd imagine it was a factor.
Think the problem is that he doesn't have any impact players on the bench. Greenwood is 17. Mata/Lingard offer absolutely nothing.
- Status