Ole Gunnar Solskjær | 2021/22 Discussion

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I think I'm yet to see an Ole in fan who when questioned, doesn't bring up sentimentality, 'long term plan' and everything in between at every opportunity, outside of purely analysing what we see on the pitch week after week.

That's my biggest frustration with them. It's as if it isn't even important to them what happens on the pitch.

As if they're completely oblivious to the reality of the club's performances, results and position in the table.

As long as they get to live in this romantic fantasy.

I really don't get it.
 
Mainoldo said:
So what actually makes them a better run club? I hear this a lot but I’m always confused.

Besides sacking managers when the time is right. How would Rodgers struggle here compared to his current management?
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Don’t know... they sold Maguire for £80m and didn’t sign a replacement as the first choice was viewed as to expensive... luckily for them they have a good manager who was able to adapt and get the best out of a squad defender who was already at the club.

Could easily say they let the manager down.
 
Rafaeldagold said:
What? Yes I selected them as they are 2 good managers..I don’t really see your point? Why would I choose other clubs with worse managers...(excluding Poch who’s done so much more in the game than Ole & clearly the better manager)

My point is good managers make a team better & we’ve settled . Simple as that & we deserve a Shite season for thinking having Ole will be good enough.

Rogers is so much the better manager than Ole it’s embarrassing the different directions we’re going in.
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It's just pointing at the current flavour of the month. Last season it was Nuno, Hasenhuttl, Pochettino, etc. In 3 months it will probably be someone else. Of course a good manager makes a team better, but cherry picking whoever is currently doing the best seems pretty pointless.
 
JustAGuest said:
It's just pointing at the current flavour of the month. Last season it was Nuno, Hasenhuttl, Pochettino, etc. In 3 months it will probably be someone else. Of course a good manager makes a team better, but cherry picking whoever is currently doing the best seems pretty pointless.
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Ole is worse than those managers anyway you’ve mentioned.

Rogers is clearly a cut above them all anyway & miles ahead of Ole it’s embarrassing our fan base are happy with this.

Pretty pointless keeping a shite manager in place I’d say.
 
Rafaeldagold said:
What? Yes I selected them as they are 2 good managers..I don’t really see your point? Why would I choose other clubs with worse managers...(excluding Poch who’s done so much more in the game than Ole & clearly the better manager)

My point is good managers make a team better & we’ve settled . Simple as that & we deserve a Shite season for thinking having Ole will be good enough.

Rogers is so much the better manager than Ole it’s embarrassing the different directions we’re going in.
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Wilder is this seasons Nuno. Flavor of the month no more and no less.

It simply doesn't matter whom the manager is, our club has been hugely mismanaged for years and whomever the manager is needs time.

The Ole out brigade can't wrap their heads around this extremely simple fact.

And don't give me crap about Leicester and Rodgers. They've been a really well ran club for years, hell they've a title win more recently than us.

I'm not getting the Rodgers hype at all, most of the players were already in place for him.
 
He'sRaldo said:
My main point was that while we might not have the best manager in the world, we need a manager who can operate under the poor conditions Man Utd give him. For instance, when Rodgers had poor buys at Liverpool, he failed massively and looked clueless. however, with clubs like Celtic and Leceister where he doesn't need to worry that much about that, he's looking better.


That's why I said in my initial post that all these comparisons are not that relevant, as the conditions are not the same. We need a manager who can manage current Man Utd, not any fancy manager who will come here and wilt due to the lack of support he will no doubt face.


In fact, you've hit the nail on the head that we operate differently as a club, thus, either our managerial requirements must be different as well, or a change needs to be made at the organizational level before we start to go after normal managers.
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So who’s the ideal manager under our current circumstances as Ole is proving it isn’t him. He blow yes a relatively low Net spend budget.
 
Keefy18 said:
I'm not getting the Rodgers hype at all, most of the players were already in place for him.
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Those players are all playing better now under BR than they ever did under Puel. The same thing happened at Celtic, he came in and every player he inherited has came on leaps and bounds since. He's a quality coach.
 
Majima said:
I think I'm yet to see an Ole in fan who when questioned, doesn't bring up sentimentality, 'long term plan' and everything in between at every opportunity, outside of purely analysing what we see on the pitch week after week.

That's my biggest frustration with them. It's as if it isn't even important to them what happens on the pitch.

As if they're completely oblivious to the reality of the club's performances, results and position in the table.

As long as they get to live in this romantic fantasy.

I really don't get it.
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Then you are ignoring all of us who are giving you all sorts of reasons why we should keep Ole for now. That tells more of you than of us.

It's like me saying: I haven't seen any of Anti-Ole brigade who isn't saying we want Premier League Trophy this year. Every manager who don't win that should be fired immediately. Even if our squad is not up for it.
 
Pink Moon said:
Those players are all playing better now under BR than they ever did under Puel. The same thing happened at Celtic, he came in and every player he inherited has came on leaps and bounds since. He's a quality coach.
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That's the problem with most Ole supporters here. They think that just get better players and we will be off with squashbuckling football week in week out.
 
JustAGuest said:
I doubt we would even consider appointing a former Liverpool manager. Is Rodgers being seen as a serious option on here?
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Yes..I mean isn’t that a bit childish? I get it with players but we need the best man for the job & Rogers is proving himself a very very good manager
 
90 + 5min said:
Then you are ignoring all of us who are giving you all sorts of reasons why we should keep Ole for now. That tells more of you than of us.

It's like me saying: I haven't seen any of Anti-Ole brigade who isn't saying we want Premier League Trophy this year. Every manager who don't win that should be fired immediately. Even if our squad is not up for it.
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:lol::lol:
 
Keefy18 said:
Wilder is this seasons Nuno. Flavor of the month no more and no less.

It simply doesn't matter whom the manager is, our club has been hugely mismanaged for years and whomever the manager is needs time.

The Ole out brigade can't wrap their heads around this extremely simple fact.

And don't give me crap about Leicester and Rodgers. They've been a really well ran club for years, hell they've a title win more recently than us.

I'm not getting the Rodgers hype at all, most of the players were already in place for him.
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Ole in brigade can’t wrap their heads around fact that Ole is shite & a good manager will be beneficial for our club no matter what’s happening behind the scenes. Why don’t you want us to get better & happy with mid table rubbish? Just cos it’s Ole? I don’t get it .

Come on so you’re saying Puel would be doing what Rogers is doing? Nonsense. Rogers has quickly & easily implemented his style on that club & how he wants them to play.
 
Pink Moon said:
Those players are all playing better now under BR than they ever did under Puel. The same thing happened at Celtic, he came in and every player he inherited has came on leaps and bounds since. He's a quality coach.
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No doubt he is, but that isn't exactly very difficult.

Scotland is a mickey mouse league and anything he done up there for me is completely irrelevant.

Rafaeldagold said:
Ole in brigade can’t wrap their heads around fact that Ole is shite & a good manager will be beneficial for our club no matter what’s happening behind the scenes. Why don’t you want us to get better & happy with mid table rubbish? Just cos it’s Ole? I don’t get it .

Come on so you’re saying Puel would be doing what Rogers is doing? Nonsense. Rogers has quickly & easily implemented his style on that club & how he wants them to play.
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Such a well thought out and intelligent reply, he's sh*t and I'm having a temper tantrum cause he hasn't made us instantly challenge for the league so sack yet another manger.

Answer me this you football managerial genius, if Ole was sacked tomorrow.. do you honestly see Allegri turning Lingard into a 15-20 goal a season player? Does he turn Matic into Kante or Ndidi? The squad is what it is and he's having to work with a poor group of players... This is what he inherited.

Where did I once say "It's Ole and he's a legend" or any sentimental bollicks? Do not create narratives I haven't put here.

I've specifically said it doesn't matter whom the manager is, the manager needs time regardless of their name and their history, weather its a history with this club or elsewhere.

EVERY time a new manager is hired, the reset button is hit again and we are back to square one...

Like I say, the dumbest of the dumbest surely, surely, surely understand this extremely basic and logical concept?
 
Alabaster Codify7 said:
I was speaking to a United supporting mate last night who's Ole In, and asked him this simple question:

'If David Moyes was in charge right now and was saying it was a long-term process and he needed 3-4 more transfer windows while we are sat midtable, would you want to stick with him?'

He said no. Ole is literally in the job because he used to play for us, absolutely no other reason. Certainly not football related reasons. Any non-United man would have been fired after the Newcastle game.
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There are differences between Ole and Moyes that you (or your mate) have neglected to consider, I’d argue.

  • Moyes was working with a significantly better squad of players, not the likes of Pereira, Lingard, Fred and Young at full back.
  • The morale and attitude within the squad was clearly fractured. Under Ole, the squad is putting in a graft, in spite of its obvious lack of quality. Players are playing for him, whether you think his coaching is good enough or not.
  • Moyes’ bumbling in the transfer window and perceptions of what a United team should be were (and clearly still are) all wrong. Ole has done good work in the transfer market and I have faith that he will continue to strengthen the right areas of the pitch. Moyes didn’t look like doing that at all.
It remains to be seen what Ole will do here. But comparisons with Moyes miss the wider picture.
 
Amir said:
A) and we're not doing even that.
B) While no manager would make this bunch title contenders, a quality manager actually can get more out of a team than they are supposedly worth. We get less.
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Not now, but I think we will be in with a decent shout of 5th or 6th.
 
Keefy18 said:
No doubt he is, but that isn't exactly very difficult.

Scotland is a mickey mouse league and anything he done up there for me is completely irrelevant.








Such a well thought out and intelligent reply, he's sh*t and I'm having a temper tantrum cause he hasn't made us instantly challenge for the league so sack yet another manger.

Answer me this you football managerial genius, if Ole was sacked tomorrow.. do you honestly see Allegri turning Lingard into a 15-20 goal a season player? Does he turn Matic into Kante or Ndidi? The squad is what it is and he's having to work with a poor group of players... This is what he inherited.

Where did I once say "It's Ole and he's a legend" or any sentimental bollicks? Do not create narratives I haven't put here.

I've specifically said it doesn't matter whom the manager is, the manager needs time regardless of their name and their history, weather its a history with this club or elsewhere.

EVERY time a new manager is hired, the reset button is hit again and we are back to square one...

Like I say, the dumbest of the dumbest surely, surely, surely understand this extremely basic and logical concept?
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Keefy18 said:
No doubt he is, but that isn't exactly very difficult.

Scotland is a mickey mouse league and anything he done up there for me is completely irrelevant.



Such a well thought out and intelligent reply, he's sh*t and I'm having a temper tantrum cause he hasn't made us instantly challenge for the league so sack yet another manger.

Answer me this you football managerial genius, if Ole was sacked tomorrow.. do you honestly see Allegri turning Lingard into a 15-20 goal a season player? Does he turn Matic into Kante or Ndidi? The squad is what it is and he's having to work with a poor group of players... This is what he inherited.

Where did I once say "It's Ole and he's a legend" or any sentimental bollicks? Do not create narratives I haven't put here.

I've specifically said it doesn't matter whom the manager is, the manager needs time regardless of their name and their history, weather its a history with this club or elsewhere.

EVERY time a new manager is hired, the reset button is hit again and we are back to square one...

Like I say, the dumbest of the dumbest surely, surely, surely understand this extremely basic and logical concept?
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When did I say I wanted us to be instantly challenging for the leagues ? Just be nice not to be languishing in mid table and near relegation or is that too much to ask?

And yes you do need to be the dumbest of the dumb to think a good manager isn't better for us than a shite one. It’s like saying why not stop at Doris the tea lady as manager as we sack too many managers. Utterly stupid. Let’s stick with a good manger? Doesn’t that make sense or is that too dumb a concept to understand?
 
Bobcat said:
Not everyone hits the ground running, plenty of good managers have had rough starts at a club, and plenty of of mediocre ones have had brilliant ones. In some cases you see a manager having an instant impact, in other cases you dont really see the fruits of their labor until 1-2 seasons have passed.

If it had been the case that we were a decent side with a squad that was young, hungry and talented, a decent leadership and good structure it would be a different story. We were not though, the squad was a trainwreck, a useless CEO running the show, morale was a rock bottom, fitness levels were shite and there were plenty with questionable attitudes among the players. It was a complete shitshow from top to bottom

Take AC Milan as an example, they were a fantastic side not to long ago with a rich history, huge fanbase yadayadaya, but they are a horribly run club with an utterly insane owner. They last won the league in 10/11 under Allegri and they had a fantastic core of players including the likes of Nesta, Thiago Silva, Pirlo, Gattuso, Van Bommel, Boateng, Inzaghi, Seedorf and Zambrotta. The following season they ended up 3rd and then they sacked Allegri midseason the following year being 11th in the table. Must mean Allegri is clueless right? I mean, he took a objectively fantastic team from 1st to 11th, what a muppet !

No. Despite that 10/11 Milan side having a fantastic group of players, most of those players were at the very ends of their career and should have had decent replacements lined up, but since the club lacked leadership, infrastructure and direction from the top that never happened. The following years they did one poor transfer after the other and had no less than 9 managers from 2014-2019, thinking that simply changing managers would solve everything when the squad was getting progressively worse and the infrastructure around the manager was completely lacking. I dont know if any of these 9 managers they've had in the last five years would have been the right one to take Milan back to glory, but none of them really got the chance either

Half a year after Allegri was sacked from Milan for supposedly doing a bad job he was hired by Juventus, a club that is well known for being a incredibly well run club, with a fantastic scouting network and he won 5 league titles in a row. Coincidence? City have not won 4/8 PL titles the last 8 years because they've had the best managers, most of it is down to them having done massive investments in both squad and club infrastructure and being properly run from top to bottom.

Ours isn't a case of a well run club with a good squad that was simply looking for a manager to take us to the next level. Yes, Jose managed second in 17/18, hes probably the best in the world at exactly that, but his style of management is not sustainable either over longer periods. Jose himself called it "his greatest achievement" and if Liverpool, Spurs or Chelsea had actually turned up that year i highly doubt we would have placed that high on the table

In my opinion, the Rumenicke rumors (if true) are the biggest news we've had in a decade, because that means we can finally have someone at the top who can oversee the rebuilding process and do a proper job. Ole isn't the best manager in the world, but hes not the main problem. And even if Ole turns out to be the wrong man for the job there is little point in sacking him mid season as it only puts the next one in line in a really tricky position
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Ole isn't starting his job though. He has been here since last December. He's about 10 months in the job.
 
lysglimt said:
Moyes has taken a lot of stick, but in reality Moyes probably never had a chance. First of all he took over a team of aging players where the majority of them either had peaked or were pretty close to peaking

Evra was 32, Vidic was turning 32 a few months later, Ferdinand was 34, RvP was 30, Rooney was only 28 but had probably already peaked. Carrick was 32, Rafael was only 23 but always injured. Nani was only 26 but had the worst career of his life behind him and in reality had also probably peaked. Fletcher had being diagnosed with a chronic illness which meant the end of him at top-level. Basically the entire first-11 was past it or always injured. Of course Moyes didn't make it better by signing Mata and Fellaini - but I am not really sure it would have made a difference.

Add to that, Ferguson had been here so long, it probably was impossible for these players to adapt to something new overnight.

I am not saying things would have been different under other circumstances with Moyes - but in hindsight I genuinely believe that regardless of whoever took over after Ferguson, they would have failed.

The one major mistake Ferguson did in his time as United-manager was that he failed to get in the right players to replace his aging squad. Maybe that was because Glazers didnt allow enough spending, we will never know. But the fact remains - that behind the core (who all were in their late 20s and early 30s) - we had Cleverley, Welbeck, Kagawa, Buttner, Jones, Smalling, Nani, Young - and if you look at what they have achieved afterwards, they weren't good enough

And I'll admit it - I didn't see it at the time. I thought we had a good squad and that Moyes should have done better (and he probably should have) - but Ferguson should have broken up that team 1-2 years earlier. By the time he retired, that team was finished. And it actually says a lot about Ferguson that he managed to get that team to be champions - but had he stayed on 1 more season, things would have been worse, even for Ferguson.

But could Moyes have turned it around if he had been given 6 years as you say ? No - because I felt his tactics were wrong and because the players hated him. As I have said before, the key for me whether to keep a manager or not is just that - the players. As long as the players fight for their managers it can turn around - the second they don't - that's when you have to get rid of him. And at the end - the players didn't fight for Moyes, just like they didn't do for Mourinho. They are still fighting for OGS, and the players seem happy..and that is one of the main reasons I Believe he will turn it around with 1-2 new signings.
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Not necessarily at all. If the manager is terrible, it won't matter much in the end.
 
Rafaeldagold said:
When did I say I wanted us to be instantly challenging for the leagues ? Just be nice not to be languishing in mid table and near relegation or is that too much to ask?

And yes you do need to be the dumbest of the dumb to think a good manager isn't better for us than a shite one. It’s like saying why not stop at Doris the tea lady as manager as we sack too many managers. Utterly stupid. Let’s stink with a good manger? Doesn’t that make sense or is that too dumb a concept to understand?
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If for arguments sake we finished mid table this season for a longer term fix, would you not take that? He's bought well, he's introducing youth extremely well and in a logical way. We've kids like Greenwood, Garner and Williams looking like they definitely will be 3 that will have long term futures here.

We're in a season where an experienced PL manager like Poch is struggling but Ole can't be afforded time for inheriting an absolute circus? He can't be given time to work with, improve and integrate youth players into the squad over the season? We've hired a tonne of new coaches in the background and again this takes time.

How exactly is he this supposed "shit" manager you are so adamant he is? You haven't a feckin clue what's involved in the day to day of being a manager.

And you keep ignoring my point, even if a better manager is hired...... TIME is still needed FFS!

If Allegri comes in, he needs a season or two to put his ideas across, to buy his players etc etc etc......

Please for the love of god, can you even understand that?

Any Ole out, insta gratification clown can understand that?
 
Whenever a club appoints a new manager, they should wait a season or two to get results. The manager needs to get his own players and needs two years to lay an imprint.

Lampard and Rodgers are just pure anomalies. Klopp when he joined had Liverpool play with an identity almost instantly was an anomaly. Conte who won the league in his first season was a fluke.
 
Keefy18 said:
If for arguments sake we finished mid table this season for a longer term fix, would you not take that? He's bought well, he's introducing youth extremely well and in a logical way. We've kids like Greenwood, Garner and Williams looking like they definitely will be 3 that will have long term futures here.

We're in a season where an experienced PL manager like Poch is struggling but Ole can't be afforded time for inheriting an absolute circus? He can't be given time to work with, improve and integrate youth players into the squad over the season? We've hired a tonne of new coaches in the background and again this takes time.

How exactly is he this supposed "shit" manager you are so adamant he is? You haven't a feckin clue what's involved in the day to day of being a manager.

And you keep ignoring my point, even if a better manager is hired...... TIME is still needed FFS!

If Allegri comes in, he needs a season or two to put his ideas across, to buy his players etc etc etc......

Please for the love of god, can you even understand that?

Any Ole out, insta gratification clown can understand that?
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Are you being intentionally stupid?
Yes a good manager deserves time. Like Allegri that you mentioned.

Ole Isn’t a good manager & doesn’t deserve this time.

Time for a good manager- Yes.
Time for a bad manager- No


Surely any Ole in clown can understand that
 
Rafaeldagold said:
Are you being intentionally stupid?
Yes a good manager deserves time. Like Allegri that you mentioned.

Ole Isn’t a good manager & doesn’t deserve this time.

Time for a good manager- Yes.
Time for a bad manager- No


Surely any Ole in clown can understand that
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So ignore my question again......

Specifically... In detail, explain how Ole is a supposed "shit manager".

You want to post on here like you know better, like you've got your coaching badges, as if you understand what's happening at the club on a daily basis and have better in game management than him.

Come on Gary Nev, post us some pearls of wisdom.
 
Keefy18 said:
So ignore my question again......

Specifically... In detail, explain how Ole is a supposed "shit manager".

You want to post on here like you know better, like you've got your coaching badges, as if you understand what's happening at the club on a daily basis and have better in game management than him.

Come on Gary Nev, post us some pearls of wisdom.
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He has us in mid table with our worst start in years, nearer relegation than top 4, awful boring performance with lack of goals, got Cardiff relegated, got sacked by Cardiff in the Championship.

Apart from that we’re very lucky to have such an outstanding manager
 
Rafaeldagold said:
He has us in mid table with our worst start in years, nearer relegation than top 4, awful boring performance with lack of goals, got Cardiff relegated, got sacked by Cardiff in the Championship.

Apart from that we’re very lucky to have such an outstanding manager
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So basically you can't tell me.

Case and point.....You just want instant gratification.

What about his 3 investments arguably being 3 of our best players this season?
What about introducing talented youth like Garner, Greenwood and Williams who I'm absolutely certain will be vital in the years ahead for us.

Must have imagined beating Chelsea twice, Leicester and out playing Liverpool when everyone had us to get utterly smashed.

Reality is he inherited a poorly managed club, that has recruited poorly for a decade.

It's kids and spoiled brats who think things will be instantly brilliant such as yourself who can't see the bigger picture.

TBH, I don't see him winning us a league but I could certainly see him improving us given the time and leaving us in an extremely healthy position in terms of players and playing style.
 
Keefy18 said:
So basically you can't tell me.

Case and point.....You just want instant gratification.

What about his 3 investments arguably being 3 of our best players this season?
What about introducing talented youth like Garner, Greenwood and Williams who I'm absolutely certain will be vital in the years ahead for us.

Must have imagined beating Chelsea twice, Leicester and out playing Liverpool when everyone had us to get utterly smashed.

Reality is he inherited a poorly managed club, that has recruited poorly for a decade.

It's kids and spoiled brats who think things will be instantly brilliant such as yourself who can't see the bigger picture.

TBH, I don't see him winning us a league but I could certainly see him improving us given the time and leaving us in an extremely healthy position in terms of players and playing style.
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He took over a poorly managed squad and managed them worse. Good effort by him.
 
Keefy18 said:
So basically you can't tell me.

Case and point.....You just want instant gratification.

What about his 3 investments arguably being 3 of our best players this season?
What about introducing talented youth like Garner, Greenwood and Williams who I'm absolutely certain will be vital in the years ahead for us.

Must have imagined beating Chelsea twice, Leicester and out playing Liverpool when everyone had us to get utterly smashed.

Reality is he inherited a poorly managed club, that has recruited poorly for a decade.

It's kids and spoiled brats who think things will be instantly brilliant such as yourself who can't see the bigger picture.

TBH, I don't see him winning us a league but I could certainly see him improving us given the time and leaving us in an extremely healthy position in terms of players and playing style.
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i mean I literally just told you why he’s awful..

God you Ole lot in think you’re so clever & wise ‘you’re just not seeing the bigger picture’
What’s that picture? Mid table obscurity?


A better manager than Ole would do much better for our club as a whole & our team. End of
 
Keefy18 said:
So basically you can't tell me.

Case and point.....You just want instant gratification.

What about his 3 investments arguably being 3 of our best players this season?
What about introducing talented youth like Garner, Greenwood and Williams who I'm absolutely certain will be vital in the years ahead for us.

Must have imagined beating Chelsea twice, Leicester and out playing Liverpool when everyone had us to get utterly smashed.

Reality is he inherited a poorly managed club, that has recruited poorly for a decade.

It's kids and spoiled brats who think things will be instantly brilliant such as yourself who can't see the bigger picture.

TBH, I don't see him winning us a league but I could certainly see him improving us given the time and leaving us in an extremely healthy position in terms of players and playing style.
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Don't bother mate. Some people just can't see that this team is just getting better and better. The results have been poor but I actually only think we have had 2 maybe 3 bad games this season so far. You can see that Ole is trying to get them off to a good start each game and he wants them to keep attacking even if they score. We didn't see that under Mourinho and LVG. Under LVG we couldn't score in the first half and barely at all and under Mourinho we seemed to score first and then stood back and invited pressure. This team is showing grid and that gives me confidence that we will have a decent season.
 
Ole's so useless he's beaten Lampard twice. He's also beaten Leicester twice, not sure if the first game was Rogers but the second definitely was.
 
momo83 said:
Don’t know... they sold Maguire for £80m and didn’t sign a replacement as the first choice was viewed as to expensive... luckily for them they have a good manager who was able to adapt and get the best out of a squad defender who was already at the club.

Could easily say they let the manager down.
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Sounds ever so simple but will be overlooked for this silly point that they are a better run club because there players play well.

Swansea are a well run club didn’t stop them getting relegated.
 
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