That's what the transcript of Ole's presser said.
Ole Gunnar Solskjær | 2021/22 Discussion
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That's what the transcript of Ole's presser said.
Has he not had 3 years? We have never come close to winning the league or FA Cup, and he’s got a terrible record in the champions league. Also, our 3 title rivals xG for scoring & conceding is miles better than ours, which is a good indicator that we won’t stay in touch with them.
As I always say with Ole, I hope im wrong.
So he should have won with the squad we had in his first and second years? Give him time. This season is important of course, but lets not sack him before he's even had a chance to challenge!
Team hasn't been good enough to win the league in his first two seasons. That's totally fair to say, regardless of manager.
Went out in the semifinals of FA Cup last year or two years ago now? Pretty far down the line in that tournament. Record in CL isn't good, even if they were 3rd best in their group last year with PSG and RB Leipzig.
And the games aren't won on paper, so xG is just a forecast/projection, as it's not the strongest barometer of success.
Yeah, but you assume what is going on in training.
All of the players that started yesterday could be performing very well in training, pushing for a place in the first team rotation.
It was because Ole was under a lot of pressure at the time and the rest of the club did not push hard enough for him, to feel like he will be wanted even if Ole lost his job.
So, naturally, he decided to go to Dortmund because they will play him immediately in every game, will agree to a release clause and he won't have to worry if the next manager will suddenly come with different ideas and he won't be protected by the people above.
Does that make sense now?
Then why aren’t they getting minutes when it matters if they’re playing so well in training?
If Donny is pulling up trees in training why is he not getting at least 10 minutes when we’re beating Newcastle? It works both ways.
I have to say this, my trust in Ole at this moment is the same as the trust I had in our squad a couple years ago, I just don't expecting anything from him anymore.
Donny did get about 10 minutes when we were beating Newcastle.
Bruno scored the 3-1 at 80minutes, before then we needed another goal to feel safer. VdB came on shortly after at 84 mins for Bruno at the same time as Martial for Greenwood. Then Lingard scored 4-1 at 92min, I remember Donny having positive contributions in the time leading up to the last goal.
It is remarkable how different two people can perceive the same event. United may have been the better team yesterday. But it would still have been somewhat of a shitshow. I am still puzzled how we managed to look desinterested in scoring for 80 odd minutes after conceding...
A competition is a distraction?! Really? We don't even know who our opponent would have been, maybe it would have been a league one team or whatever. I obviously respect any opinion but I really find it remarkable how lighthearted we are talking about going out of a cup at the first possible chance after looking not interested in the outcome of the game for 90 minutes.
I agree, nobody sticked out and nobody was particularly bad but all in all, what constitutes a good performance for you guys? What was good about it? It is a genuine question because I thought it was as bloodless as it gets. No urgency whatsoever.
Which is why a) it would be important to have some fringe players in form to share the workload by being part of the first team and b) you don't even know the draw. That such a weird backwards thinking to convince yourself that it is fine to get out of the cup. Is our program so much harder than the one of other teams? I don't think so and even if, see point a). Games aren't a distraction, they can become them in the middle of the season when you are plagued with injuries and deciding games on all corners. But it is September ffs. September, the season started one month ago, how do we manage to put on a full fringe player team and not put the first teamers on the bench at least. I only see one reason, that game wasn't important to us and I am somewhat puzzled to see so much agreement with it. We have one of the two best squats in the country.
I agree with all your posts today. I wouldn't have gone the road Ole used, I would have put on a strong eleven connected with three or four fringe players, keep the game and style of play as intact as possible and set the fringe up to succeed. Ole did different, put on a full B-team - I don't see it as a mistake but choosing even more fringe players for the bench is nuts in my opinion. As Fergie said, he always set up his teams so he was convinced that the team was able to get a win. In no way there are any indicators, that this team would be good enough to win against a PL opponent (it might be good enough but there is nothing like evident to that), so at least make sure you have a strong bench to turn the tide if needed.
I am very disappointed. It reminded me of the performance against Leicester last year, in the FA cup. Where we also left the competition leaving the impression that we simply didn't bother enough...
My main concern, stop selecting Martial and Matic. Neither of them are going to be part of the next iteration of this team as we take a step forward. Minutes to these 2 are wasted IMO.
Otherwise, Ole, keep pushing!
Otherwise, Ole, keep pushing!
West Ham drew City at home.
Even if we hadn't drawn the same there are 11 PL teams left (12 counting West Ham), 3 Championship and 1 League One team (Sunderland, placed 2nd. in the table).
Hopefully that isn't the progress everybody is talking about. Being aware of the threat to us that is hold by 2nd-in-League One-Table-team Sunderland...
Nobody knows, who we would have got. Nobody knows in what situation we would be in or the opponent. We might fancy a game to bring an injured player up to speed. Maybe to end a streak of bad results, bad luck, whatsoever. We are a football club, we are made for football matches. They aren't a distraction, if they distract you in a particular moment, send out the U23.
THE OLD TRAFFORD ATMOSPHERE
"[It was] fantastic. Absolutely incredible. We have some new coaches coming in and they were asking this morning, ‘what do you reckon, how many fans - are we going to get 40, 50 [thousand]?’ No, I knew it would be close to full. No doubt about our fans, they are brilliant. They kept going and the atmosphere was brilliant."
Taken from here
The issue is we’re 3 years on and I’ve still no idea if we’re going to beat City and Chelsea 4-0 or lose to Young Boys and West Ham 4 days later. It’s still a total rollercoaster in sync with outstanding individual performances one day and very average ones the next.
Because there are another 11 players who have proven they can deliver. Lingard is a good example of a player who is now knocking on the door to start games.
And the starting 11 may be doing even better in training.
The league cup? Yes. Its very much a 2nd tier competition considering the FA cup exists and even that is not put that highly among the top clubs
During the usual fixture pile-up around Christmas and New Years the league cup is just a headache imo. Unless you are Chelsea of course and somehow always draw non-PL opponents
For Ole to lightly dismiss a competition we had probably the best chance of winning, along with the FA cup, when we havent won anything for over 4 years is baffling. I could understand Fergie doing it, as we were usually winning the Premier. Ole needs a trophy and any trophy will do for your first one. The final is in February, so doesnt impact the other 3 trophies at all.
I seen in the last 6 years City have won this cup 5 times and us once. It’s all good if you don’t care or are not winning the league cup if you are too busy challenging for the league or CL, even then City win this every year and they do.
I’m not that upset about going out of the cup but Ole needs silverware and so does the club. If we don’t win anything this season it will be 5 years without a trophy and anything less than a challenge in the league and decent run in CL then Ole will be under pressure.
This loss will be forgotten about soon if we keep performing in the PL and starting winning in the CL but if don’t get all 3 points this weekend it will be looked at as 3 bad results in 4 games.
I’m not that upset about going out of the cup but Ole needs silverware and so does the club. If we don’t win anything this season it will be 5 years without a trophy and anything less than a challenge in the league and decent run in CL then Ole will be under pressure.
This loss will be forgotten about soon if we keep performing in the PL and starting winning in the CL but if don’t get all 3 points this weekend it will be looked at as 3 bad results in 4 games.
We haven’t won a game that I can remember to say Ole was brilliant in his tactics.
We lost plenty of games against much lesser opponents when Ole was outcoached. Ole is just a middle of the road coach with very good players winning the games for him with their individual moments.
We lost plenty of games against much lesser opponents when Ole was outcoached. Ole is just a middle of the road coach with very good players winning the games for him with their individual moments.
The 2-0 win at City last year was one of United's best displays post-Fergie. So controlled, just bossed the game and nullified them. When we smashed Leipzig, the win at PSG...I don't think you're looking very hard.
That City game is probably the best game under Ole (and best McFred have ever played). PSG away was brilliant as well, with great contributions from Tuanzebe and Rashford. Leipzig at home was anything but comfortable and then they caved, but until our first or second goal, we struggled to play through their high press.
100% and I find it annoying when people say it was just a counter attacking performance, which to me is just a lazy stereotype. We bossed long periods of that game and they couldn’t live with us for most of it. Should have won 3 or 4-0 and they barely laid a glove on us.
Bit of a myth that Liepzig high press, the referee blew the whistle every time we got into their half in the first half, it was pathetic officiating, whenever we broke their press the referee would pull a foul out of his arse. Someone must have told him to knock it off in the second half because the whistle barely touched his lips after that.
naaaah it was just counter attacking tactics which are so easy that even a sunday league coach can implement in a day. Don't you watch sunday league football? 90% of the goals are these simple no-tactic counter attacking goals.
I agree, it was a great day, a great game, I was really proud of the performance but I have to note, I think, it became a bit more glorious than it was every day that passed since.
We went into the match being 14 points behind City. We started well, were awarded a penalty in the first minute of the game, scored. An early lead obviously helped with nerves and from then on, City attacked relentlessly with us handling them quite comfortably because we fought so well (all over the place but particularly in midfield), which was helped that we stayed a bit deeper and didn't press them early on. Still they had some shots, a few a bit more dangerous. We had a few counters but nothing major. After halftime, we scored again right after the break after a dribbling of Shaw in the 49th minute, a simple pass in the box and a shot through 4-6 legs right into go. The second time our nerves had calmed. We did well to stop City creating real pressure and it was great but a lot went in our favor and at the end of the day, we were still 11 points behind.
xG-wise the match ended 1.5 to 1.6 in our favor. After the match, Pep got a lot of criticism for not setting up as he did in other recent games (I think, Foden came on very late for example). He also went with a single pivot while in the games before (the win against us in the Cup and the draw in the league) he went with a more reserved approach (in the league even more of a double-pivot iirc) which resulted in a match without the biggest chances on both sides that still favored City slightly in the end. In the cup we were just pushed aside.
The match against Leipzig wasn't a spectacle as well. I remember the first half for being relatively even while they went more and more attacking in the second which suited us because we could counter them. Nagelsmann was called inexperienced because he went with his attacking approach when it was clear, we can exploit it which lead to a score that was a bit overblown as Leipzig could have stopped us after 3:0 just by stopping their suicidal attacks. He didn't repeat that mistake in the other game and the rest is history.
Don't get me wrong, I really enjoyed those matches and celebrated great results, but I wouldn't consider them as tactical masterpieces but overall good (or great) performances. You don't need a masterpiece all the time, it shouldn't be used as a stick. Ole had his moments but, at least from my perspective, they were rare and often not particularly shiny (him being the obvious one responsible for something). I would say though, that his tactical shortcomings (actual shortcomings not just "could have been more proactive") are also pretty rare. It is a bit of a dilemma, that they appeared at least in one of the most relevant matches last year, where we could have won a trophy.
The whole "tactically inept" thing is a bit pointless, because everybody means something different with it. I think, it is obvious that he is alright with setting up for a match and lineups and he is also fine with ingame-adjustments especially subs but in comparison with the managers of our competitors he falls a tad short in some aspects. Which has to be acknowledged at some point.
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The PSG one stands out tactics wise for me. The performance was good but the tactics were so spot on. We looked comfortable all game. We let them have the ball and just stuck to the plan left no gaps and worked as a team. Then when we had the ball we did the right thing everytime
I just think this is an insane take. We have improved league position and points tally season by season, and have gotten closer and closer to winning a cup.
As long as Solskjaer is here we`re always gonna be a work in progress and Excuse United. I want a charismatic manager with great coaching skills and a clear system. Silverware is what matters and his "Trophies is for egos" comment just says it all. He is the nice teacher we all had and love on elementary School, but didnt learn much from. Also Ronaldo is here for a limited time. I really want us to have the highest chance for a major trophy with him here.
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It's not so insane. There's reason not to expect anything from Ole and there's reason to. The reason to is basically what you've said which I'm in support of for now. We've been improving every season since he's been here. The 'next improvement' requires what most are clamouring for which is a title challenge and a cup win. So since we've been improving since Ole came, one would be more optimistic that Ole can deliver this 'next improvement"
The reason not to I'd say is because Ole has lost every chance to win a trophy whether facing an inferior or superior team and he just did that recently again. So expecting him to win a cup can only be met with pessimism. As for the league I'm guessing people look at his competition Chelsea, City, Liverpool. All these teams have a squad at least as good as ours as well as superior coaches to Ole and even if we were to look past that I'd say their tactics or system is superior to Oles so anyone can pessimistic about our chances of challenging
That's because Sir Alex was too busy winning or challenging for every other competition.
Also, don't compare SAF's first years in United to Ole. SAF didn't not have the squad Ole has, and even without taking that into consideration, his previous feats with Aberdeen were enough to warrant faith in him .
Isn't this what they still say about Pep? I think he'd be the ideal candidate. He's massively underrated and is a master tactitian IMO. He left Real on his own terms twice and won la Liga without Ronaldo on his short-lived second 'stint' there.
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Perhaps you are right, I'm just unsure. I didn't think Zidane was known for his tactics, wasn't that always a complaint against him.
He's more highly regarded for his man management but that's not where his biggest strengths lie.
When Zidane first took over at Real he relied exclusively on a 4-3-3 formation with the untouchable Bale, Benzema, Cristiano combo.
When Zidane realized he couldn't rely on Bale he switched to a midfield diamond which brought the best out of Isco and rendered Bale obsolete.
The move also made Ronaldo even more prolific as insane as it sounds because his brilliant partnership with Benzema was the focus of the attack in the formation. Zidane has outdone the success of the galactico era
I agree with you. Zidane isn't famous for being as prolific about his tactics as Pep or Klopp have been but I guess, that meant that tactics aren't one of his biggest strength but it certainly wasn't a weakness as well. Additionally to the things you mentioned he also made for example Marcelo work as hybrid between playmaker and leftback, he established a fantastic midfield trio in Modric, Kroos and Casemiro when many thought, it would be way to light-weight.
This!
He needs to go. Enough of this shit
This thread should be fun.
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