Ole Gunnar Solskjær | 2021/22 Discussion

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Maguire and Lindelof are fine in possession in a deeper block with midfield and fullback cover, hence Solskjaer wanting another CB.

Adding another attacking threat on the right with inferior technical players to Witsel and Hakimi in support isn't gonna provide the platform for Sancho to succeed. Hakimi for example is clearly superior to Wan Bissaka on the ball and the same apllies to Dortmund's right sided midfielders compared to ours.

We transition play in a reactive manner whilst Dortmund have been transitioning play with a higher defensive line in a proactive manner, where they have upto 6 or 7 players involved in the transition. Sancho has better support out wide and better midfield support to create triangles which helps open up space and stretches play.

That very well be, that does not mean Sancho at United is going the rendered completely helpless because the players around him does not have the same technical ability as his teammates at Dortmund. I agree that none of AWB or McFred are particularly good on the ball, especially not in tight areas, but they dont need to be imo for Sancho, Bruno + LW and CF to do some damage on the break

As much shit as Fred gets on here, a lot of our most dangerous attacks start with him winning the ball in a favorable position where we have space to attack into.

Just to make it clear, i think a technical proficient CM to partner Fred should be top priority this summer, but i still think we should go for Sancho as i am confident he would add a lot to our attack
 
That very well be, that does not mean Sancho at United is going the rendered completely helpless because the players around him does not have the same technical ability as his teammates at Dortmund. I agree that none of AWB or McFred are particularly good on the ball, especially not in tight areas, but they dont need to be imo for Sancho, Bruno + LW and CF to do some damage on the break

As much shit as Fred gets on here, a lot of our most dangerous attacks start with him winning the ball in a favorable position where we have space to attack into.

Just to make it clear, i think a technical proficient CM to partner Fred should be top priority this summer, but i still think we should go for Sancho as i am confident he would add a lot to our attack
I do agree with most of what you're saying here. But I didn't say Sancho would be rendered useless here but rather we need to take on board that as much as he's a brilliant player, he wasn't the winger on the right hand side in the 19/20 season. Just watch the video below to see what I'm talking about. Hakimi was their right wing player who stretched opposition with his electric pace and dribbling from wide. I also agree that Fred should be partnered with a new midfield addition as things stand.

 
Just WHY?! There's no reason to believe we'd have such a downwards trajectory. Such a ridiculous statement to make.

We're close to winning the league than we are just hitting a major freefall in progression. Makes no sense.

I don't know I can't help it.

I don't think that we are any closer to winning the league than we were 2 years ago. No way next year are Liverpool and Chelsea gonna be this shit like this year. Also Leicester are on the up and either you like Rodgers or not he has them playing great football even with key players missing like Maddison and fight for top4 consistently which for a club the size of Leicester is quite an achievement. I think it's clear to see the progress under him

You keep missing the point. City already have the best coach AND the best squad AND the most money to spend. The odds are well and truly stacked against whoever we appoint, so I imagine we'd be having the very same conversations no matter who it is.

Ole has already closed the gap a little and has shown that he can match up to these managers when they face-off, so there is certainly room for optimism should he be able to build up the squad to something resembling the strength of the opponent.

It is completely insane to acknowledge that the opponent has the upper hand in almost every department and simultaneously expect us to over take them.

Ole has already closed the gap? What do you mean? By next week we will be at 18 points gap, which is the same as 2nd season of Mou and with less points.

I agree that he can match these managers head to head, but there are serious doubts he can match them in the long run
 
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I don't know I can't help it.

I don't think that we are any closer to winning the league than we were 2 years ago. No way next year are Liverpool and Chelsea gonna be this shit like this year. Also Leicester are on the up and either you like Rodgers or not he has them playing great football even with key players missing like Maddison and fight for top4 consistently which for a club the size of Leicester is quite an achievement. I think it's clear to see the progress under him



Ole has already closed the gap? What do you mean? By next week we will be at 18 points gap, which is the same as 2nd season of Mou and with less points.

I agree that he can match these managers head to head, but there are serious doubts he can match them in the long run
Last season we were 3rd and 33 points off top. This season we are 2nd and max 15 points off. What part of that is not closing the gap?

Why you are comparing it to Mourinho I have no idea. Has nothing to do with Ole.

Just being negative for the sake of it.
 
So after we’ve secured CL and are preparing for european final, people are moaning that we gave away a few meaningless games and making general conclusions.
The state of this place when we happen to lose or draw a game.... Toxic.
 
Last season we were 3rd and 33 points off top. This season we are 2nd and max 15 points off. What part of that is not closing the gap?

Why you are comparing it to Mourinho I have no idea. Has nothing to do with Ole.

Just being negative for the sake of it.

I'm not saying there hasn't been progress, there clearly has been. But not quite so dramatic. The gap has been narrowed from the top down, not the other way around. We're 5 points better off than last season with a game to play, so could be 8. We've scored 5 more so far (71) and conceded 7 more, so GD is 28 now and was 30.

We've not had some outstanding season here. We're making incremental progress.
 
I'm not saying there hasn't been progress, there clearly has been. But not quite so dramatic. The gap has been narrowed from the top down, not the other way around. We're 5 points better off than last season with a game to play, so could be 8. We've scored 5 more so far (71) and conceded 7 more, so GD is 28 now and was 30.

We've not had some outstanding season here. We're making incremental progress.
You’re quite right. I’m not claiming there’s massive progress made, but the poster I was replying to was claiming the gap hasn’t been closed at all.

As far as I’m concerned there’s absolutely no need for such pessimism from fans while we are moving in the right direction. It may not be at the breakneck speed they like, but denying it completely is just a falsehood.
 
I'm not saying there hasn't been progress, there clearly has been. But not quite so dramatic. The gap has been narrowed from the top down, not the other way around. We're 5 points better off than last season with a game to play, so could be 8. We've scored 5 more so far (71) and conceded 7 more, so GD is 28 now and was 30.

We've not had some outstanding season here. We're making incremental progress.

If we win the EL, that's more than 'incremental progress' considering last summer, we basically only improve one first XI position in 34 y.o. Cavani.
 
So after we’ve secured CL and are preparing for european final, people are moaning that we gave away a few meaningless games and making general conclusions.
The state of this place when we happen to lose or draw a game.... Toxic.

Complaining about two wins in seven is not toxic ffs.
 
You’re quite right. I’m not claiming there’s massive progress made, but the poster I was replying to was claiming the gap hasn’t been closed at all.

As far as I’m concerned there’s absolutely no need for such pessimism from fans while we are moving in the right direction. It may not be at the breakneck speed they like, but denying it completely is just a falsehood.

Yeah, could have been much nicer reading had we not dropped 8 points from the last 3 matches. But we've not finished seasons well under Ole so far. We've faded after a good run. Leicester game was understandable, Liverpool and Fulham was just not good enough.
 
Yeah, could have been much nicer reading had we not dropped 8 points from the last 3 matches. But we've not finished seasons well under Ole so far. We've faded after a good run. Leicester game was understandable, Liverpool and Fulham was just not good enough.

Precisely my thoughts also. Fulham in particular are already relegated and we put out a full strength side. Not sure why it's so difficult for some to admit it was not good enough and a team doing the bare minimum in front of returning fans is alright.
 
If we win the EL, that's more than 'incremental progress' considering last summer, we basically only improve one first XI position in 34 y.o. Cavani.

I don't see anything dramatic, like I said. If we just look at the points on the table, goals scored, conceded, goal difference. It's nothing major. There was obviously the chance to improve a lot more, but it's not panned out that way. It's been a weird season, hard to really gauge where we're at, outside of just looking at the stats.

And I wouldn't say improvement is solely down to recruitment each summer - that would be quite mad. Coaching can be quite undervalued (and overestimated too) and I'd expect a good coach (or manager who has an eye for good coaches) to improve his side, make them tactically better, develop players. And the players bought a year or two ago to bed in better.
 
Precisely my thoughts also. Fulham in particular are already relegated and we put out a full strength side. Not sure why it's so difficult for some to admit it was not good enough and a team doing the bare minimum in front of returning fans is alright.
Also, our first home game in front of fans after 420 days. That alone should have been enough motivation for a win.
 
I think that Ole has most certainly improved the squad since he arrived, both the quality and mentality, although I do feel that some of the signings have been questionable without doubt.

He has identified the players that we, as fans wanted Manchester United to get rid off and for that I think he deserves a huge amount of credit. He has done more good for United in his tenure than any of the mangers combined since we lost Fergie in 2013 but i think the football we play is still very poor quality compared to those teams we are trying to catch like City and Liverpool. There is no identifiable patterns to our play and it's becoming more and more obvious that we rely on individual brilliance rather than a coherent plan to be able to win football games. Our home record is embarrassing and even though our away form is very good it doesn't detract from it.

I think it's obvious the players all like Ole and he seems like a very good man manager but I think he's dropped a massive bomb not surrounding himself with some top quality coaches instead of a guy like McKenna whose only previous experience was in charge of youth teams and Carrick whose just starting out in coaching.

I'm absolutely hoping that Solskjaer ends up proving me wrong but at this stage I just see a constant pattern of good followed by very bad and it is not consistent to challenge for any of the big trophies.
 
Last season we were 3rd and 33 points off top. This season we are 2nd and max 15 points off. What part of that is not closing the gap?

Why you are comparing it to Mourinho I have no idea. Has nothing to do with Ole.

Just being negative for the sake of it.

Just because City didn't reach 99 points doesn't mean we closed the gap. We are just 5 points better than last season with Bruno and Cavani full season and we have 15 points(maybe 18 after Wolves) difference. Exactly the same gap there was under Mourinho. How exactly is this closing the gap?

I'm not being negative, it's that I'm not convinced that Ole can deliver.
 
Just because City didn't reach 99 points doesn't mean we closed the gap. We are just 5 points better than last season with Bruno and Cavani full season and we have 15 points(maybe 18 after Wolves) difference. Exactly the same gap there was under Mourinho. How exactly is this closing the gap?

I'm not being negative, it's that I'm not convinced that Ole can deliver.
Right, so we are still 33 points off the champions then are we? We are closer to the top in both points and position since last season, there's no other way to look at it.

And I'm not sure why you keep spouting 18pts, we are currently 12 behind with a game to go.
 
Right, so we are still 33 points off the champions then are we? We are closer to the top in both points and position since last season, there's no other way to look at it.

And I'm not sure why you keep spouting 18pts, we are currently 12 behind with a game to go.

Yeah we are better than last season position wise, because Liverpool and Chelsea had a shit year not because we are actually any better than last year.
I highly doubt that will be the case next year.

The so-called progress is minimal and if we won't win the Europa League not even that.

The offloading of deadwood and the happy place that is the dressing room under Ole, but shit on a stick football that we've been served for the best part of 2,5 years and bottling it every time it matters isn't exactly progress on football terms.
 
Yeah we are better than last season position wise, because Liverpool and Chelsea had a shit year not because we are actually any better than last year.
I highly doubt that will be the case next year.

The so-called progress is minimal and if we won't win the Europa League not even that.

The offloading of deadwood and the happy place that is the dressing room under Ole, but shit on a stick football that we've been served for the best part of 2,5 years and bottling it every time it matters isn't exactly progress on football terms.
I agree we will have to see about this progress next year.

But, it is hard to understand that people think that other teams are being poor and we are not is somehow our fault or something. Yes, maybe they are bad, it is a credit to us that we are not that bad.

Or you could think that maybe we are bad this year too just like them. Our potential might be much higher than what we show just like them?

Point is that there is no way to tell. It is always yearly base. Trying to compare every details from year to year is frankly ridiculous.
 
I think that Ole has most certainly improved the squad since he arrived, both the quality and mentality, although I do feel that some of the signings have been questionable without doubt.

He has identified the players that we, as fans wanted Manchester United to get rid off and for that I think he deserves a huge amount of credit. He has done more good for United in his tenure than any of the mangers combined since we lost Fergie in 2013 but i think the football we play is still very poor quality compared to those teams we are trying to catch like City and Liverpool. There is no identifiable patterns to our play and it's becoming more and more obvious that we rely on individual brilliance rather than a coherent plan to be able to win football games. Our home record is embarrassing and even though our away form is very good it doesn't detract from it.

I think it's obvious the players all like Ole and he seems like a very good man manager but I think he's dropped a massive bomb not surrounding himself with some top quality coaches instead of a guy like McKenna whose only previous experience was in charge of youth teams and Carrick whose just starting out in coaching.

I'm absolutely hoping that Solskjaer ends up proving me wrong but at this stage I just see a constant pattern of good followed by very bad and it is not consistent to challenge for any of the big trophies.
It's not been very bad for almost 18 months. The start this season was due to factors outside of our control, and right now we're seeing a team who is running on fumes after they've exceeded most of the targets they were set during a season where they have had an unprecedented workload, and I'm sure not wanting to risk being injured for the final next week is playing a part in this also.
 
Just because City didn't reach 99 points doesn't mean we closed the gap. We are just 5 points better than last season with Bruno and Cavani full season and we have 15 points(maybe 18 after Wolves) difference. Exactly the same gap there was under Mourinho. How exactly is this closing the gap?

I'm not being negative, it's that I'm not convinced that Ole can deliver.

By that logic, we didn't deserve to win the treble as well. We won the league with 79 points! We would have been 7-8 points behind the imaginary leaders of that era.

And while we're at it, the level of competition has been shite for last 3 years, so let's not pretend and say this season has been a one-off when in the last 3 seasons, atleast 4 of the 6 teams ave either not touched 70 point mark or limped over the line
 
Yeah we are better than last season position wise, because Liverpool and Chelsea had a shit year not because we are actually any better than last year.
I highly doubt that will be the case next year.

The so-called progress is minimal and if we won't win the Europa League not even that.

The offloading of deadwood and the happy place that is the dressing room under Ole, but shit on a stick football that we've been served for the best part of 2,5 years and bottling it every time it matters isn't exactly progress on football terms.
Ok, I can see there’s no reasoning with you so let’s move along.
 
Yeah we are better than last season position wise, because Liverpool and Chelsea had a shit year not because we are actually any better than last year.
I highly doubt that will be the case next year.

The so-called progress is minimal and if we won't win the Europa League not even that.

The offloading of deadwood and the happy place that is the dressing room under Ole, but shit on a stick football that we've been served for the best part of 2,5 years and bottling it every time it matters isn't exactly progress on football terms.

Is this the new go-to thing to moan about?

Judging by this place one could think we were fecking Burnley, just parking the bus and shithousing our way to draws by hoofing it into the box. We are second in goals scored, so we cant be that shite to watch, can we?
 
Hypothetical situation. We lose the final on Wednesday. Do we renew his contract based on his overachieving league exploits?
 
I agree we will have to see about this progress next year.

But, it is hard to understand that people think that other teams are being poor and we are not is somehow our fault or something. Yes, maybe they are bad, it is a credit to us that we are not that bad.

Or you could think that maybe we are bad this year too just like them. Our potential might be much higher than what we show just like them?

Point is that there is no way to tell. It is always yearly base. Trying to compare every details from year to year is frankly ridiculous.

No, I didn't say that it's our fault that the others were shit. Couldn't care less what the scousers and Spurs and the rest do.

I was comparing our two (full) seasons with Ole, and I see minimal progress
2019/20 66 points
2020/21 71 points until now at least (though no hope for a win at Wolves)
Football isn't any better really from last year with the odd game here and there. And I really hate how we end up the last 5-10 games each season under Ole including his first half after Mourinho.

No, we are not shit like them, we're progressing with very very small steps. I don't disagree that we maybe have a higher ceiling.

Sure it's always yearly base but every year every team sets the bar according to last season's table.

By that logic, we didn't deserve to win the treble as well. We won the league with 79 points! We would have been 7-8 points behind the imaginary leaders of that era.

And while we're at it, the level of competition has been shite for last 3 years, so let's not pretend and say this season has been a one-off when in the last 3 seasons, atleast 4 of the 6 teams ave either not touched 70 point mark or limped over the line

Man I'm not comparing this year to the past 30.
The tremble was a tremendous achievement I wouldn't mind if we got 40 points and won the league.

The rest of the league maybe were shit for the past 3 years but each year the champion was over 95 points. What are you on about? We are supposedly looking what's in front of us not behind us. If you think that we should compare ourselves with wolves or Southampton then that's on you. I wanna see us Champions of England and Europe

Is this the new go-to thing to moan about?

Judging by this place one could think we were fecking Burnley, just parking the bus and shithousing our way to draws by hoofing it into the box. We are second in goals scored, so we cant be that shite to watch, can we?

No we are not Burnley, but there have been many games where we are terrible. Sure there have been some great games but it's the minority.

Hypothetical situation. We lose the final on Wednesday. Do we renew his contract based on his overachieving league exploits?

No, but we let him have his 3rd year and if he doesn't deliver a big trophy or at least challenge for one replace him at the end of the season. The "rebuild" supposedly has finished.
 
Man I'm not comparing this year to the past 30.
The tremble was a tremendous achievement I wouldn't mind if we got 40 points and won the league.

The rest of the league maybe were shit for the past 3 years but each year the champion was over 95 points. What are you on about? We are supposedly looking what's in front of us not behind us. If you think that we should compare ourselves with wolves or Southampton then that's on you. I wanna see us Champions of England and Europe

I'm not comparing this season to 99. I'm comparing the seasons around that time period to 99, and by your logic, you'd have come up with "lucky to win league with just 79 points"

Have you thought what the reason might be for the winners of the league this time not getting to the points totals of historical seasons? maybe just maybe too many games? And maybe that impacted every team from 1 to atleast 7 if not 20? Unless of course you think football all across Europe suddenly became more competitive/champions became weaker.

Most Ole outers have been using the argument that top 4 is not possible at 60 something points. However for the past 3 seasons, 4 of top 6 have been shite. If you were believe the winners are someone who get 95+ points to win the title based on last 3 seasons, you cant really "But Ole wouldnt have gotten top 4 with this points total in any other season", because this is as much a norm now as 95+ point seasons are.

I'm not saying this is where we want to be, but you need to understand that this is progress. We've had nothing to play for since maybe even the Leeds game when top4 was a matter of when than if, and you can see our players are playing at a reduced intensity to make sure they dont have to sit out of EL final due to an injury.
 
Hypothetical situation. We lose the final on Wednesday. Do we renew his contract based on his overachieving league exploits?
We're extending his contract this summer. It's more a matter of when than if now
 
No, I didn't say that it's our fault that the others were shit. Couldn't care less what the scousers and Spurs and the rest do.

I was comparing our two (full) seasons with Ole, and I see minimal progress
2019/20 66 points
2020/21 71 points until now at least (though no hope for a win at Wolves)
Football isn't any better really from last year with the odd game here and there. And I really hate how we end up the last 5-10 games each season under Ole including his first half after Mourinho.

No, we are not shit like them, we're progressing with very very small steps. I don't disagree that we maybe have a higher ceiling.

Sure it's always yearly base but every year every team sets the bar according to last season's table.



Man I'm not comparing this year to the past 30.
The tremble was a tremendous achievement I wouldn't mind if we got 40 points and won the league.

The rest of the league maybe were shit for the past 3 years but each year the champion was over 95 points. What are you on about? We are supposedly looking what's in front of us not behind us. If you think that we should compare ourselves with wolves or Southampton then that's on you. I wanna see us Champions of England and Europe



No we are not Burnley, but there have been many games where we are terrible. Sure there have been some great games but it's the minority.



No, but we let him have his 3rd year and if he doesn't deliver a big trophy or at least challenge for one replace him at the end of the season. The "rebuild" supposedly has finished.

I think any kind of comparison with recent seasons is utterly ridiculous in all honesty. This season is out on its own in many ways and will probably always be remembered as that weird covid season.

There's no doubt that the lack of fans has had a big effect of results but also the crazy packed schedule has pushed players and squads to the limit. Remember our non existent pre season? How many points did that cost us?

Its been a strange season all over the top European leagues alot of big clubs have struggled to cope, I think credit has to go to Ole for achieving a respectable second place we simply didn't have the squad to compete with city this season.

The only disappointment of the season has been the CL group stage exit, we should of got through but other than that it's been
Good enough.

We have seen some good football scored plenty of goals and who hasn't enjoyed all those comebacks?

Ole will certainly be here next season, let's hope the board back him in the summer and we see some improvements to the first team.
 
Even if we get our higher priority targets like a 6 and a RW for big money?

Yes because it is going to be Odion all over again. We have Cavani for one more year. We have Greenwood and we do need a CF but it is not Danny Ings. We need a DM more than Ings.
 
Yes because it is going to be Odion all over again. We have Cavani for one more year. We have Greenwood and we do need a CF but it is not Danny Ings. We need a DM more than Ings.

You can't guarantee that both Cavani and Greenwood will be fit. Martial is unreliable in the CF position. Danny Ings is a good option if only to rest players. I mean we had Cole, Yorke, Sheringham and Ole in our treble year.
 
Yes because it is going to be Odion all over again. We have Cavani for one more year. We have Greenwood and we do need a CF but it is not Danny Ings. We need a DM more than Ings.

He's a much better player than Ighalo. I think he'd be a good squad option and he will score goals.

As for a DM, that's what I said. I asked if he's a cheap squad option at striker but we get a proper DM and a RW would you still be against it?
 
He's a much better player than Ighalo. I think he'd be a good squad option and he will score goals.

As for a DM, that's what I said. I asked if he's a cheap squad option at striker but we get a proper DM and a RW would you still be against it?

We need a quality, DM and a Quality CF. I think there are better options than Danny Ings. As for the lack of this RW, I do not buy this idea. We have enough players who are right footed. But they all want to be strikers. But they are not strikers. People say that Martial, Rashford and James cannot play on the right. Yes they can if they stop being prima donnas and be right wingers and put in crosses or create chances. No, they don't want to do that but only score goals. I am sure Beckham would rather play in the centre than on the right side too. But he played on the right side and created a lot of goals.
 
We need a quality, DM and a Quality CF. I think there are better options than Danny Ings. As for the lack of this RW, I do not buy this idea. We have enough players who are right footed. But they all want to be strikers. But they are not strikers. People say that Martial, Rashford and James cannot play on the right. Yes they can if they stop being prima donnas and be right wingers and put in crosses or create chances. No, they don't want to do that but only score goals. I am sure Beckham would rather play in the centre than on the right side too. But he played on the right side and created a lot of goals.

The bolded bit is pure speculation on your part.

I'd rather have a player who's naturally suited to the position rather than someone who's doing a job. We've seen that doesn't really work. I can't agree with the idea of persisting with playing people out of position when we could get someone better in.

It's fairly obviously our team doesn't have the right balance no matter who we put at RW.
 
No one besides City has looked particularly good this year. In any case, we are much better to watch now than under Moyes, LvG and Jose and we still miss a a few pieces of the puzzle
We've said this last year (Liverpool & City were simply too good).
We've also said this the year before that (when we lost against mid table/lower table clubs - "Look at City, they lost too this week").

I get it. This year pandemic has hit everything hard and we've never had a squad as good as City. But really though it's up to the club and nobody else. If we have bad results in games that should be winnable, "X is not any better than us anyway" or "X lost the game as well!" should not be a valid excuse. Winnable games are winnable. We don't have the best squad but we could beat most of the teams in PL. It's up to the coaching staff and manager to figure out how to achieve it. It's not like we're playing peak Barca every week. We've lost and drawn against teams worse than us because for some reason we decided to play worse than them. Forget about beating the top 4 consistently, had we won the points in silly games where we played like crap against worse oppositions (players wise), the table would look much different. That's all there's to it.
 
The bolded bit is pure speculation on your part.

I'd rather have a player who's naturally suited to the position rather than someone who's doing a job. We've seen that doesn't really work. I can't agree with the idea of persisting with playing people out of position when we could get someone better in.

It's fairly obviously our team doesn't have the right balance no matter who we put at RW.

It is not pure speculation. Are they strikers? No they are not. Can they play centrally? No they cannot. The only reason they play on the left is because they want to be pseudo strikers. Both Rashford and Martial are right footed. Both can cross and both can dribble and both has pace. Tell them to stop being pseudo strikers and put the ball in from the right for Cavani or Mason and we will score more goals.
We did not play Beckham on the left. Neither did we play Giggs on the right.
 
It is not pure speculation. Are they strikers? No they are not. Can they play centrally? No they cannot. The only reason they play on the left is because they want to be pseudo strikers. Both Rashford and Martial are right footed. Both can cross and both can dribble and both has pace. Tell them to stop being pseudo strikers and put the ball in from the right for Cavani or Mason and we will score more goals.
We did not play Beckham on the left. Neither did we play Giggs on the right.

I could be wrong but didn't play Giggs from the right in the CL Final 99?
 
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