Ole Gunnar Solskjær | 2021/22 Discussion

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Womp said:
When exactly does this 'peak' arrive? It's not as if he joined yesterday. Most people would be far more inclined to give him time if we saw signs of that progress. He has been here a considerable amount of time and apart from maybe improving us as a counter attacking outfit, all the exact same issues are where they were.
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If you really believe that this season hasn't been better than the last one, then I really don't think there's any point in having a conversation as you've made your mind up. There has been clear progress, and no one would ever know when the peak has arrived. You'd only know that this was the peak time in Ole's tenure looking back, as the preceding and following performances would have been worse off or at a similar level to the 'peak'.
 
Womp said:
When exactly does this 'peak' arrive? It's not as if he joined yesterday. Most people would be far more inclined to give him time if we saw signs of that progress. He has been here a considerable amount of time and apart from maybe improving us as a counter attacking outfit, all the exact same issues are where they were.
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It has arrived! We are top of the pops since our missing piece “a proper number 10” was signed. We haven’t signed a single first team player since. We need to keep building and give our youngsters experience. The worst part of being a Utd fan right now is how embarrassing some of our fan base is. I’m absolutely enjoying our progress, and haven’t felt like this about our football in many many years. But some of our fan base? Embarrassing!
 
UNITED ACADEMY said:
Greenwood, James and Telles will still make 0-0 draw. What makes you think the result won’t be 0-0 draw if we miss Martial, Rashford and Shaw today?

I think you need to understand who they are missing, are the players irreplaceable? Partey is irreplaceable but not the others.
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Yeah probably a 0-0 draw we've got much more and better squad depth than Arsenal
 
The biggest observation is that our performances haven't merited the position we are in via the table, it's just that in the run of play (moments) some of our key players have stepped up a level to grant us results. The biggest issue is that what we are doing is not sustainable and enough of a foundation to build from. There are huge similarities between Solskjaer this season and Mourinho when he finished second.

If our performances do not improve we will begin to slide down the table I cannot see any other way out unless we can rejuvenate. We looked awful against a very poor Arsenal side and the players did not respond at the defeat to statistically the worst team in the history of the league in Sheff Wed. Bad signs ahead.
 
I dont understand these grand declerations about title races etc literally half way through a season. Is it because of the close start to last seasons end?
Its our first bad spell.. 2 games.. In a few months. Lets just see how it pans out.
 
UnofficialDevil said:
Yeah probably a 0-0 draw we've got much more and better squad depth than Arsenal
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Arsenal have 70m player as squad depth mate.The only arsenal players that I call it big miss if they get injured is Partey and Laca because no arsenal players offer the same ability as them. The same with United, Bruno and Maguire and also Fred for big game.
 
Withnail said:
He may or may not be demanding all sorts but you'll be waiting to hear about it in these post match camera in the face interviews. They're a pointless feckin exercise and rarely offer anything approaching insight.
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I doubt that.
 
anant said:
If you really believe that this season hasn't been better than the last one, then I really don't think there's any point in having a conversation as you've made your mind up. There has been clear progress, and no one would ever know when the peak has arrived. You'd only know that this was the peak time in Ole's tenure looking back, as the preceding and following performances would have been worse off or at a similar level to the 'peak'.
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Season is not over yet. Bit immature to talk about it to be fair. So far so good. Lets see if we can maintain the same momentum .
 
I’m an Ole In man, but what we’ve seen over the last two matches is appalling.

Banana skins happen, especially after a massive win over Liverpool, so we can’t be too hard on the manager for the defeat to a relegation bound club. But the response today? Play for the draw.

There actually is a defensible grand strategy for playing for draws against top 6 clubs, especially after what Spurs did to us. But the match was there to be won today and what did the manager do when when McT had to be subbed off? He brought in a players whose been in horrific firm all season rather when we had better weapons on the bench to take over for McT.

We deserved no better than a draw given how we set up and we arguably deserved to be defeated.
 
If we’d have been told we are where we are at the start of the season, we’d have said Ole’s doing a great job.

Still feels as though we have another gear but on balance, decent outcome at this point of the season.
 
It doesn’t matter who he gets the football will be the same. Let’s hope this season is his last.

We need a to go up three levels in management.
 
He is doing a good job but jury is out on whether he can win trophies. Way I see it, his contract is up after next season and he has until then to win one.
 
KiD MoYeS said:
He is doing a good job but jury is out on whether he can win trophies. Way I see it, his contract is up after next season and he has until then to win one.
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If he doesn't win something, he can't complain he hasn't been given time. You cannot spend an eternity rebuiding a side. It all has to come together at some point.
 
DomesticTadpole said:
If he doesn't win something, he can't complain he hasn't been given time. You cannot spend an eternity rebuiding a side. It all has to come together at some point.
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Yeah, pretty much. He has earned until then in my opinion anyway. We'll see what happens, I'm pretty calm.
 
M Bison said:
If we’d have been told we are where we are at the start of the season, we’d have said Ole’s doing a great job.

Still feels as though we have another gear but on balance, decent outcome at this point of the season.
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I’m not sure this would be the case if we were also told how inconsistent City & Liverpool and poor Arsenal,Spurs and Chelsea would be.
 
UNITED ACADEMY said:
Arsenal have 70m player as squad depth mate.The only arsenal players that I call it big miss if they get injured is Partey and Laca because no arsenal players offer the same ability as them. The same with United, Bruno and Maguire and also Fred for big game.
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Auba maybe not so much on recent form but Tierney and especially Saka were a big miss for Arsenal today.
 
UNITED ACADEMY said:
They both played in the first game and did nothing different to Pepe and Cedric. Unless you are telling those two on the pitch could make Pogba do the same foul again? I watched arsenal lot this season, I know saka performance per match this season was the same as Pepe’s performance today, Pepe did well today.
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You know you're too far gone on the Ole train when your main argument for why we dropped points against a poor Arsenal side, is that their players that didn't play probably wouldn't have done any better than those that did play. Give it a rest, you're not convincing anyone.
 
First time I'm hearing Gary Neville have even slightly critical things to say, when he says it's a weird bunch and they only have moments in matches which are in effect individual quality pulling us through and that there's too much chopping and changing to produce consistency.
 
The biggest disappointments this season have been our performances against the 'big 6' and our CL exit. The rest has been ok.

A draw today would have been relatively decent had we not totally and utterly fecked up against Sheffield United. Let's hope we get back to winning ways against Southampton - who have looked poor lately - on Tuesday. The table is still really close and we have to be careful we don't slip out of the top four.
 
His post match interview highlights his lack of belief and ambition

He thought we.played well deserved to win.

How are we wver going to get back to playing well and dominate games with this mentality, we were shockingly poor today
 
FatherWolff said:
It has arrived! We are top of the pops since our missing piece “a proper number 10” was signed. We haven’t signed a single first team player since. We need to keep building and give our youngsters experience. The worst part of being a Utd fan right now is how embarrassing some of our fan base is. I’m absolutely enjoying our progress, and haven’t felt like this about our football in many many years. But some of our fan base? Embarrassing!
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What progress in our football is exactly evident over say our second place finish under Jose, for example? Genuinely curious what any of you lot are seeing to suggest anything has changed apart from a mentality shift arguably which we all know isn't enough
 
anant said:
If you really believe that this season hasn't been better than the last one, then I really don't think there's any point in having a conversation as you've made your mind up. There has been clear progress, and no one would ever know when the peak has arrived. You'd only know that this was the peak time in Ole's tenure looking back, as the preceding and following performances would have been worse off or at a similar level to the 'peak'.
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Yes been much better. But at the same time, are we really a team or are we just a bunch of very good individuals whose talent comes out occasionally
 
Well, that was a bit shit, wasn’t it? And we’re not even in the latter stage of the season where everyone that thinks Ole’s the man will turn a blind eye to shit performances and blame fatigue. And they’ll do that without even thinking about how it’s the third season in a row he’s had to run the team into the ground because he can’t find a way to comfortably beat even the worst sides in the league to allow for some rest for his best players.

But we’ll probably sign some better players over the summer and people would say that we’re progressing under Ole, but any team would progress under any manager with objectively better players, that goes without saying, doesn’t it?
 
Bastian said:
First time I'm hearing Gary Neville have even slightly critical things to say, when he says it's a weird bunch and they only have moments in matches which are in effect individual quality pulling us through and that there's too much chopping and changing to produce consistency.
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He has mentioned things in this tone throughout the last few months. If Neville is aware of it I'd imagine that Solskjaer is too. We are not going to progress as a team if Ole cannot get the team to find an identity.
 
anant said:
If you really believe that this season hasn't been better than the last one, then I really don't think there's any point in having a conversation as you've made your mind up. There has been clear progress, and no one would ever know when the peak has arrived. You'd only know that this was the peak time in Ole's tenure looking back, as the preceding and following performances would have been worse off or at a similar level to the 'peak'.
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This season has been better, but I really don't put that down to him as much tbf. Has the coaching improved? Has the quality of the football improved? I dont really think so. Our performances are about the same as they were since Bruno has come in. We have more Individually brilliant players on the pitch so can pull wins out of our arse more consistently.

How long does it take before we actually see improvements in the facets of the game that we are very clearly underpeforming in? Managers like Hassenhuttl, Rodgers, Pep, Kopp etc. You could see the fruits of what they were trying to implement quite early, even if it wasn't the best af the start. It doesn't take 3 years to start seeing some semblance of a system.

If you think these performances are sustainable or acceptable, pulling undeserved wins out of our arses with terrible xg and players who look clueless playing together after 3 years - all power to you
 
M Bison said:
If we’d have been told we are where we are at the start of the season, we’d have said Ole’s doing a great job.

Still feels as though we have another gear but on balance, decent outcome at this point of the season.
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This argument has served him well. Last season we signed Bruno and were afforded time (due to the lockdowns) to reclaim some injured players, so we turned it around.

If you go further back than the start of the season, back to March 2019 and you were told that that season you'd get sixth place with 66 points and third the following season with 66 points, would you say great job?

I think the great job sentiment is multi-factored. For me, he's doing a great job considering the expectations I have of him, not the expectations I have of the club in general or the potential of the playing staff. I think he's managed the players really well, he deals well with the press more or less, he's professional and presents a good image of the club as such. We've played like the underdogs in virtually every big game, we've spent a very long time figuring out how best to play as the dominant side against weaker teams, there's quite a lot of things yet to work on if his "United DNA we want to attack and dominate" is supposed to come true. And one of his main obstacles is lack of leverage with the board, given the owners are unambitious.

I'd be impressed if he can accrue equal amount of points over the 2nd half of the season and have us finish on 80, to be honest. That would certainly be an indicator of health. If we win anything I'd be amazed.
 
Womp said:
This season has been better, but I really don't put that down to him as much tbf. Has the coaching improved? Has the quality of the football improved? I dont really think so. Our performances are about the same as they were since Bruno has come in. We have more Individually brilliant players on the pitch so can pull wins out of our arse more consistently.

How long does it take before we actually see improvements in the facets of the game that we are very clearly underpeforming in? Managers like Hassenhuttl, Rodgers, Pep, Kopp etc. You could see the fruits of what they were trying to implement quite early, even if it wasn't the best af the start. It doesn't take 3 years to start seeing some semblance of a system.

If you think these performances are sustainable or acceptable, pulling undeserved wins out of our arses with terrible xg and players who look clueless playing together after 3 years - all power to you
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What undeserved wins are you talking about? On balance of it we have played decent in most of the games to warrant 3 points. Did you see city's game against Sheffield today or against Villa where they needed an offside goal and a penalty to win, so they should also be undeserved wins. Had cavani scored today we would have been the deserving winners.

I do understand ole has his flaws and this team is not a finished article. The fact that when transfer window ended in October no one expected us to challenge for the title but we are doing that. The whole idea that when we win it is because of luck but when city or pool scrap a one goal win it is elite mentality is becoming tiring to see now.
 
Bastian said:
First time I'm hearing Gary Neville have even slightly critical things to say, when he says it's a weird bunch and they only have moments in matches which are in effect individual quality pulling us through and that there's too much chopping and changing to produce consistency.
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He said what was on many people's minds. We're a moments team rather than a cohesive side that beats teams by dominating games. Yeah you could say that if we had Mbappe or Halland we may put more of those moments away but you've got to have a plan B when you don't have that clinical spark in games. Ole simply doesn't know how to win games when plan A fails, that's the problem. His management from the bench is shockingly bad.
 
The sooner people realise we are still a work in progress team and not a team that can win the title the nore objective they will become.
 
AshRK said:
The sooner people realise we are still a work in progress team and not a team that can win the title the nore objective they will become.
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When will the work in progress schtick extend to the manager and coaching staff and not only the players? If you’re waiting to assess Ole’s quality until we have Messi level talent in each position then you’ll be waiting a long time.
 
Game 2 where we looked devoid of ideas. Another blip ? Probably. But you just can't put everything on players everytime.
 
AshRK said:
What undeserved wins are you talking about? On balance of it we have played decent in most of the games to warrant 3 points. Did you see city's game against Sheffield today or against Villa where they needed an offside goal and a penalty to win, so they should also be undeserved wins. Had cavani scored today we would have been the deserving winners.

I do understand ole has his flaws and this team is not a finished article. The fact that when transfer window ended in October no one expected us to challenge for the title but we are doing that. The whole idea that when we win it is because of luck but when city or pool scrap a one goal win it is elite mentality is becoming tiring to see now.
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It's probably because City can also destroy any team on their day. We've been playing at what looks like the best we'll play this season and we're scraping every game by one goal. Is this the best we'll be under this management? Aside from the Leeds game, we've not once shown that we can handle an opponent with ease. That's worrying - we've spent a chunk of money on a number of players and, bar Bruno, not one of them has had any significant influence on this team. Defensively, we're awful, we're not that great at controlling games and our attack has never looked cohesive. Martial, Rashford and Greenwood are playing so poorly - whose responsible for that?
 
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