NBA 2021-2022

Haven't watched any of the games since Klay returned but wondering if he is being a net negative right now.

Ok you get destroyed by the Bucks with Draymond missing (and no Wiseman) but how do you go from that to destroying the Bulls 24 hours later.
 
Didn't expect that at all. Great win. Also Kuminga could definitely be a force down the road. Impressive!
 
Luka the Don just put Memphis to sleep with the fishes. They need a big physical wing defender. The west is no place to not have that type of perimeter defender with the likes of James, Luka and Kawhi all lurking around.
 
SinNombre said:
Haven't watched any of the games since Klay returned but wondering if he is being a net negative right now.

Ok you get destroyed by the Bucks with Draymond missing (and no Wiseman) but how do you go from that to destroying the Bulls 24 hours later.
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Because the Bucks are much better than the Bulls?
 
How did the Warriors get beaten the way they did against the Bucks (nearly a 40 point half time deficit) to pasting the Bulls the very next game?
 
RooneyLegend said:
Luka the Don just put Memphis to sleep with the fishes. They need a big physical wing defender. The west is no place to not have that type of perimeter defender with the likes of James, Luka and Kawhi all lurking around.
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They'll be fine if Dillon Brooks comes back healthy. He's their best perimeter defender last season.
 
elmo said:
Because they shot like shit yesterday and were on fire against a lousier team today whose best player went down after 5 mins.
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Not to mention the Nets just annihilated the Bulls with a fully healthy LaVine so it kind of takes the luster off the win.
 
elmo said:
Because they shot like shit yesterday and were on fire against a lousier team today whose best player went down after 5 mins.
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Fair enough. Although Chicago are nowhere near as good as Milwaukee, I still don't think there's that drastic a difference, but I didn't watch the game and didn't realize the LaVine barely played.
 
sport2793 said:
Not to mention the Nets just annihilated the Bulls with a fully healthy LaVine so it kind of takes the luster off the win.
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Yeah, it's why for all the talk about the parity in the East, I'll be surprised if any team other than the Bucks/Nets makes it to the Finals.

The rest of the East just isn't championship contenders this year.
 
elmo said:
Yeah, it's why for all the talk about the parity in the East, I'll be surprised if any team other than the Bucks/Nets makes it to the Finals.

The rest of the East just isn't championship contenders this year.
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You guys talk as if Miami plays in the WNBA. I wont say much but the Heat will take out one of the Bucks and Nets if not both. Its obvious most on here don't watch Miami games.
 
therealtboy said:
You guys talk as if Miami plays in the WNBA. I wont say much but the Heat will take out one of the Bucks and Nets if not both. Its obvious most on here don't watch Miami games.
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I like Spo but nobody's winning a championship with Jimmy Butler as the best player on the team.
 
That reminds me
SinNombre said:
Heat is not winning.

You need genuine superstars to win it all. What was the last champion to not have a consensus top-5 player in the league. 2011 Mavs?
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Malcolm Gladwell actually did an interesting podcast on effectively this question several years ago. Discussing how basketball is a “strong link” sport (who has the best player usually wins) vs a “weak link” sport (whoever has the worst player usually loses). He’s talking a lot about whether you should focus on improving the best or worst school in a region, but the discussion on why basketball is that way vs something like ice hockey is very interesting.
 
elmo said:
I like Spo but nobody's winning a championship with Jimmy Butler as the best player on the team.
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That's an interesting statement for a Suns fan to make since the strength of your team relies on the skill of your players as a whole and the way they fit together rather than one true superstar. Devin Booker is a very good player but he's probably not top 10 on most people's player rankings. Chris Paul is a sure fire HOFer but even he would admit he's on the downside of his career. I would actually argue that Jimmy Butler is probably as good a player as anybody on your roster yet it wouldn't surprise me at all to see the Suns win it all even without a top 5 player. I also dont think it would be that big a surprise if the Heat pulled an upset or two and did the same.
 
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elmo said:
I like Spo but nobody's winning a championship with Jimmy Butler as the best player on the team.
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Think Pistons 04, it's not about the best player on the team but more about the performance of the whole team including the bench. Miami is probably the deepest team in the league with Herro avg 21 points off the bench and Oladipo coming back. Second in the East with Bam out for 20 games and Butler too, Morris has missed most of the season too but still the Heat have have won 8 of the last 10 and beat the Bulls twice, beat the Suns, beat the Bucks just to name a few. Yurtseven has been a great find, double double machine, Strus is a sniper, Duncan picking up form, Caleb Martin has been amazing so take them lightly at your peril.
 
charlton66 said:
That's an interesting statement for a Suns fan to make since the strength of your team relies on the skill of your players as a whole and the way they fit together rather than one true superstar. Devin Booker is a very good player but he's probably not top 10 on most people's player rankings. Chris Paul is a sure fire HOFer but even he would admit he's on the downside of his career. I would actually argue that Jimmy Butler is probably as good a player as anybody on your team yet it wouldn't surprise me at all to see the Suns win it all even without a top 5 player.

I agree that the Bucks and the Nets are the two best teams in the East, but I also wouldn't be that surprised if the Heat pulled an upset or two and went all the way.
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I'm biased, but Booker and CP3 are better than Jimmy :lol:

And they have a lot more help than Jimmy. I swear the Heats roster are made up of random 2K regens.
 
therealtboy said:
Think Pistons 04, it's not about the best player on the team but more about the performance of the whole team including the bench. Miami is probably the deepest team in the league with Herro avg 21 points off the bench and Oladipo coming back. Second in the East with Bam out for 20 games and Butler too, Morris has missed most of the season too but still the Heat have have won 8 of the last 10 and beat the Bulls twice, beat the Suns, beat the Bucks just to name a few. Yurtseven has been a great find, double double machine, Strus is a sniper, Duncan picking up form, Caleb Martin has been amazing so take them lightly at your peril.
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I would actually argue that the Warriors are the deepest team in the league but either way when the playoffs come around those rosters become a whole lot shorter. I do think the Heat have a punchers chance to upset the odds and as I said previously it wouldn't shock me too much if they did. However, I still believe the most likely scenario is for either the Bucks or Nets to come out of the East.
 
therealtboy said:
Think Pistons 04, it's not about the best player on the team but more about the performance of the whole team including the bench. Miami is probably the deepest team in the league with Herro avg 21 points off the bench and Oladipo coming back. Second in the East with Bam out for 20 games and Butler too, Morris has missed most of the season too but still the Heat have have won 8 of the last 10 and beat the Bulls twice, beat the Suns, beat the Bucks just to name a few. Yurtseven has been a great find, double double machine, Strus is a sniper, Duncan picking up form, Caleb Martin has been amazing so take them lightly at your peril.
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We'll see, but i still have the Bucks and Nets as the clear favourites for the East especially come playoffs time when every team including the Heat will tighten their rotations.
 
Fox for Simmons is getting some traction. I think that deal would help both teams actually. I think their value is almost same but I expect Morey to ask for Haliburton + 2-3 picks and for the deal to collapse because of that. Must be annoying for Philly fans to watch all of that while Embiid is at his best ever. You can’t have a zero in Simmons spot and challenge.
 
Anfernee Simons with 26 points and 6 assists, 7-10 from three…

In a half.
 
Steph and Draymond both out tomorrow. Could be tough, Wolves play some good basketball especially at home.
 
charlton66 said:
It's funny but deserved. LeBron mortgaged the future at the expense of the present and the present sucks.

Schadenfreude! :):):D:D
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We sold our soul for a chip, I feel like I mention this every other page but I don't understand how we now have the team that we do. Even when we picked up Lebron we could have had:

Ball, Hart, Ingram, Kuzma, Randle, LeBron, Caruso, Zubac.

That is a solid group of 8 players right there. With 1st round picks still in tow, cap would have been difficult but not impossible and you could have just waited for AD until he was about to hit FA. We were on a good trajectory with that young core with LeBron to guide it and we just had a bad season with injuries in LeBron's first year.

I had a really fun couple of years watching that young core grow and my fears were realised in that 2nd season, it was the most bittersweet championship win ever because I knew that we would be looking at this kind of situation a couple years later. Instead of a sustained period of challenging for 5-10 years we were just set to capitulate. It won't surprise me at all if LeBron gets to the last year of his deal and goes back home to Cleveland again when their young core should be ready to compete and tries to put them over the top properly like he should have done with ours.
 
RooneyLegend said:
The Lakers are a joke.
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And thanks to the deal they did to acquire Westbrook they have basically zero way of changing that roster for the next 2 years outside of free agents who want to take minimum contracts. And all three players they traded for Westbrook are actually better fits for that team.
 
Stobzilla said:
We sold our soul for a chip, I feel like I mention this every other page but I don't understand how we now have the team that we do. Even when we picked up Lebron we could have had:

Ball, Hart, Ingram, Kuzma, Randle, LeBron, Caruso, Zubac.

That is a solid group of 8 players right there. With 1st round picks still in tow, cap would have been difficult but not impossible and you could have just waited for AD until he was about to hit FA. We were on a good trajectory with that young core with LeBron to guide it and we just had a bad season with injuries in LeBron's first year.

I had a really fun couple of years watching that young core grow and my fears were realised in that 2nd season, it was the most bittersweet championship win ever because I knew that we would be looking at this kind of situation a couple years later. Instead of a sustained period of challenging for 5-10 years we were just set to capitulate. It won't surprise me at all if LeBron gets to the last year of his deal and goes back home to Cleveland again when their young core should be ready to compete and tries to put them over the top properly like he should have done with ours.
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The deal for AD basically did not work out perfectly for either side I think. NO let Lonzo go for nothing, Ingram has developed nicely but is still not a top player, Hart is just about a decent rotation player and picks have been rather average so far. They do have some picks quite far out in the future though that may end up looking tasty. On Lakers side they got a championship but on the other hand seem to have no future way to build around Davis.
 
elmo said:
I'm biased, but Booker and CP3 are better than Jimmy :lol:

And they have a lot more help than Jimmy. I swear the Heats roster are made up of random 2K regens.
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I think Suns and Heat are kind of on the same boat when it comes to squad depth to be honest. It's a bunch of players you would not normally expect to be that good but somehow they are.

Booker v Butler is an obvious difference in terms of profile
Paul v Lowry, basically same concept of pass first older point guard to run the plays, though CP3 is a better player at this point
Mikal Bridges v Duncan Robinson, both are extremely good at what they do though it's a completely different thing though Bridges is much better overall
PJ Tucker v Crowder, an older solid defensively power forward
Adebayo v Ayton, both are basically same level as a player, maybe Adebayo is slightly better but not much in it

Herro on the bench is IMO better at what he does than any of Suns players, his closest equivalent is sort of Cam Johnson (from the same draft I think). Then you have a bunch of players who you wouldn't expect to perform and were struggling prior to getting to Miami and Phoenix but are somehow good: Caleb Martin, Strus, Yurtseven and then Payne, McGee, Kaminsky on the other side. All of them (except maybe McGee) could easily have been out of the league already.

Suns are a better team but I don't think there's a whole load in it. Both teams are extremely good at recycling talent these days, and finding random players you've never heard of / thought they sucked who are somehow performing quite well.
 
Trade deadline is basically 3.5 weeks away but there doesn't seem to be too much movement. I don't really know who the sellers in current market would be outside of the obvious tanking teams like Detroit, OKC, Houston who don't really have a whole bunch to offer to other teams though (could maybe see players like Williams, Gordon being somewhat appealing to other teams, maybe Wood but he'd be pricey). Teams like Sacramento or New Orleans will probably still want to be close to play-in tournament as they haven't made playoffs for a while. Portland should be selling some of their older players like Nurkic and Covington but I'm not entirely convinced they will go down the tanking route, even though it makes sense with Lillard possibly out for season and the whole team not being built to win long term. Thing is current crop of players even without Lillard is probably still good enough to at least be close to SAC and NO.

Very curious whether Morey will finally budge and trade Simmons for something reasonable or continue valuing him as a top 10 player in the league, in which case he's not getting the deal done. I think the only way he gets a player of top 20 quality is if Wizards finally give up on their project and let Beal go (he can opt out in the Summer if I'm not wrong, so it's their last chance) - which could actually put them in a direction of fast rebuild as I think they have the pieces to build a successful team around Simmons (+ whoever they get in the draft). Kings would be a reasonable choice and again, I think Fox for Simmons would benefit both teams. Timberwolves probably don't have the assets to get it done though he'd complete their team very well too.
 
Disappointing loss but expected with who is out. We’re on a poor run but have some very winnable games coming up at home. Kuminga is a really special prospect!
 
Charlie Foley said:
Disappointing loss but expected with who is out. We’re on a poor run but have some very winnable games coming up at home. Kuminga is a really special prospect!
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Steph might be in a bit of a slump but when he's not there the Dubs are not the same team. Draymond too. Having said that I think the poor run is as much to do with who is playing. Klay will eventually be a huge plus to the team but at the moment players are trying to adjust to him being on the floor and he is trying to adjust to them. I think that is causing some disruption to the team as a whole. It will come good eventually but it's going to take some time. As you say we (hopefully) have some winnable games coming up and they can use those to help figure out what works and what doesn't.
 
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