Mike Phelan - Assistant manager

Oldyella said:
Its hard to say with any certainty what ability any coach has, given they ultimately are not the top dog, but you can say we have been awful for several years now and Carrick is one of the only constants during that time. The club seem happy with him though and they see more than we do.

As for Phelan, didnt he take a fair bit of persuading to come back to us in the first place? Maybe he knows the writing is on the wall, maybe he just wants to go back to what he was doing before?
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He did say he was definitely going back so maybe he promised Ole he would do a year/18 months and no more. And he was good to his word.
 
Feed Me said:
Is it just me or has Phelan been less visible on the bench of late?
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You're right, I haven't seen him on the touchline for a while now. Probably thinking about moving on, maybe retiring. I think he was brought in to bring that Fergie-days work rate and mentality and we've kind of got that now.
 
Wasn't he supposed to be more of a sporting director type this season anyway rather than an assistant coach in the traditional sense?
 
If a modern, progressive coach came in I'd be chuffed to see the back of Phelan. I know that's gonna ruffle some 'hardcore Red' feathers but I don't care - I see him as a dated coach that brings nothing to a modern setup to be honest. Thankful for his efforts in coming into help steady the ship but I get no sense of urgency or inspiration from Phelan or any of the other coaches to be honest.
 
When people think they can accurately gauge the influence, whether positive or negative, of individual coaches, what are the metrics you go by?

What exact details makes you confident that Phelan will be a massive loss, a positive move into a progressive future or anything in between?
 
LawCharltonBest said:
Heard that’s he’s leaving United at the end of the season.

Not itk, no source, just trust the person who said it

I’ll be worried if it does happen. Feel he helps Olé more than we’re aware. Would hope Olé gets an experienced replacement and not just give it to Carrick. I think that’d be a disaster move for everyone
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I see why this would be worry some. But I've never bought into the 'Phelan is key' theory.

Sure he worked for Fergie, but until United brought him back his claims to fame were being sacked by Hull and working in Australia.

If he is so great, why has nobody other than United fans valued him?

Maybe being harsh.
 
Funny to see fan opinions change from him being seen as a yes man under Fergie to a key player under Ole.
 
Tiber said:
I see why this would be worry some. But I've never bought into the 'Phelan is key' theory.

Sure he worked for Fergie, but until United brought him back his claims to fame were being sacked by Hull and working in Australia.

If he is so great, why has nobody other than United fans valued him?

Maybe being harsh.
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He was unfairly sacked by Hull and on the whole did a very good job in testing circumstances. I think he had 15 players going into the Premier League season.

Fair enough to criticise what he’s done but I’m not sure he could do much more with Hull at the time.
 
Have no opinion one way or the other as none of us know what goes in training but wasn't there initial rumours that he was hesitant about the board when taking the job full time?
 
If Ole is to stay on, he needs proper coaches and that should start with the assistant manager.

He needs a modern Queiroz character that can coach players and bring something different to the table.

A good assistant and a couple of first team coaches could make a world of difference.
 
Maluco said:
If Ole is to stay on, he needs proper coaches and that should start with the assistant manager.

He needs a modern Queiroz character that can coach players and bring something different to the table.

A good assistant and a couple of first team coaches could make a world of difference.
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Or a Steve McClaren, his CV as an assistant is pretty much unrivalled after all.
 
m1tch said:
Or a Steve McClaren, his CV as an assistant is pretty much unrivalled after all.
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I think football has evolved a good bit since then. It’s the same reason why people like Moyes and Pardew are where they are. It’s not good enough to get the cones out and keep them fit anymore. Football has moved on and McClaren’s current standing in the game proves that.
 
Maluco said:
If Ole is to stay on, he needs proper coaches and that should start with the assistant manager.

He needs a modern Queiroz character that can coach players and bring something different to the table.

A good assistant and a couple of first team coaches could make a world of difference.
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Who knows what Phelan really does or how well he does it?

But I agree with the sentiment. I’ve been fully unconvinced by claims that Ole is not a good coach because the evidence just isn’t there. He may be a good coach or possibly not but my hunch is that he is more of a manager than a coach. I would be delighted to see him bring in some new faces to the coaching team with a view to replacing Phelan as Assistant at some point. SAF had several AMs over the years.

As for which coaches should be brought in, that’s not an easy question to answer.
 
Fergie kept Phelan but used Rene as the head coach. You can see Rene is the one who does most of the watching of the match etc while Phelan is bursting balloons. I know Rene failed as a manager but there are many good coaches who fail as managers.
 
Foxbatt said:
Fergie kept Phelan but used Rene as the head coach. You can see Rene is the one who does most of the watching of the match etc while Phelan is bursting balloons. I know Rene failed as a manager but there are many good coaches who fail as managers.
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True. I don’t know how we could be sure but I dare say there are some average coaches who have been very successful as managers. What’s Rene up to now and would he come back? Or who is the next Rene?

I’m not purposely putting him down but possibly Phelan is doing something useful simply assisting Ole with donkey work. I wonder how much he gets paid.
 
If he does go we need someone external with experience . Obviously I don’t have clue what goes on behind the scenes but I’m not convinced by McKenna or Carrick to be AM.
 
Ole and Bruno have taken all the credit for our amazing 2nd half to the season, but Mike Phelan probably deserves a lot more credit than he's currently getting.
 
What more credit does he need?

Seriously what does he do? I think he's just a figurehead there to act as a "representative" of experience and oldhead from Fergie's staffs. He experienced it all and this naturally garnered respects from the players. He seems to not mind doing the "boring work" of coaches eg. cones etc. He's also seen to be communicating with the players often, basically keeping them in check and in constant connection with the players, it's like a link between coaches and players.

Any team need that.
 
Based on absolutely nothing other than how visible he is on the sideline, he seems far less involved today than he was when Ole was initially appointed.

Has his role officially changed?
 
POF said:
Based on absolutely nothing other than how visible he is on the sideline, he seems far less involved today than he was when Ole was initially appointed.

Has his role officially changed?
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When you see the difference in Ole as a manager at Cardiff, compared to now, that's 100% the Mike Phelan effect. He has obviously mentored Ole in the Fergie ways.
Ole would have flopped badly without him.
 
I remember Phelan was slated when he was working under Fergie. Now under Ole he's changed how?
 
99% of his work is done away from general public view on the training pitch. Not sure how people are making their judgements when they dont see him in action working.
 
Champagne Football said:
When you see the difference in Ole as a manager at Cardiff, compared to now, that's 100% the Mike Phelan effect. He has obviously mentored Ole in the Fergie ways.
Ole would have flopped badly without him.
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We have absolutely no way of knowing.

I'm sure he's doing a fine job, but how much is or isn't down to him is anyones guess.

Weird bump.
 
Stack said:
99% of his work is done away from general public view on the training pitch. Not sure how people are making their judgements when they dont see him in action working.
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Exactly. I imagine his experience is a big plus for Ole. Hope he stays for a while yet.

Would be interesting to see where we would be today had Phelan got the job ahead of Moyes. Doubt we would have finished outside the top 4 that year at very least.
 
Champagne Football said:
When you see the difference in Ole as a manager at Cardiff, compared to now, that's 100% the Mike Phelan effect. He has obviously mentored Ole in the Fergie ways.
Ole would have flopped badly without him.
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Of any manager, Ole is one that wouldn't need to be mentored in the "Fergie ways". He saw it himself first hand for years.

It's really hard to know what Phelan's impact has been. He could be extremely influential behind the scenes but is certainly less visible this season than last.

I think that's a good thing for Ole. In his first season Ole was slated when the team did badly and Phelan was praised when the team did well.
 
Champagne Football said:
When you see the difference in Ole as a manager at Cardiff, compared to now, that's 100% the Mike Phelan effect. He has obviously mentored Ole in the Fergie ways.
Ole would have flopped badly without him.
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Do you think Phelan doesn't have any coaching value? Why did Ferguson keep him? For him to remind him of the "Fergie ways"?
 
georgipep said:
Do you think Phelan doesn't have any coaching value? Why did Ferguson keep him? For him to remind him of the "Fergie ways"?
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Phelan was mainly in charge of man management and the administrative side of things, he wasn't in charge of coaching. He has value as a manager not a coach.
 
Carl said:
We have absolutely no way of knowing.

I'm sure he's doing a fine job, but how much is or isn't down to him is anyones guess.

Weird bump.
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Always this.

We have a weird fascination with speculating what the assistant manager and coaches do. There's just no way of knowing unless you are at Carrington every day (or if Ole gives us a comprehensive breakdown of their responsibilities)

It's daft to single them out for praise or criticism when we don't even know what their full remit is.
 
JPRouve said:
Phelan was mainly in charge of man management and the administrative side of things, he wasn't in charge of coaching. He has value as a manager not a coach.
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Is there any evidence for that?

Even if so, that is part of coaching (for me). And as far as we know he might be working under similar scope now.
 
Champagne Football said:
When you see the difference in Ole as a manager at Cardiff, compared to now, that's 100% the Mike Phelan effect. He has obviously mentored Ole in the Fergie ways.
Ole would have flopped badly without him.
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Agreed. If you watch our games closer you can spot the passing triangles. That’s all Phelan.
 
padzilla said:
I remember Phelan was slated when he was working under Fergie. Now under Ole he's changed how?
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So we begged to him to come back from his handy number in Australia just for the fun of it? Sure if the No.2 role at Man Uts was so easy that any clown could do it, then why didn't we just give the job to Phil Neville or Steve Kean or David May?
 
Champagne Football said:
So we begged to him to come back from his handy number in Australia just for the fun of it? Sure if the No.2 role at Man Uts was so easy that any clown could do it, then why didn't we just give the job to Phil Neville or Steve Kean or David May?
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There was talk of him being a DoF type at one point after Ole took over if I remember correctly.
 
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