Mason Mount | Confirmed

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RedRonaldo said:
Mount is a very good passer. There stats show he is the most accurate long passer in the league, and his overall passing % stays at around 85% most of the time, even though he is playing most of his pass in the final third.
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He is a good long passer yes, but so was Wayne Rooney. That doesnt tell me if he is a good fit at CM.

As for his passing success % and his passing volume, I believe the numbers say it all :

Mount in 2020/21 : 59 passes avg, 81% accuracy
Mount in 2021/22 : 48 passes avg, 78% accuracy
Mount in 2022/23 : 42 passes avg, 75% accuracy

De Jong in 2022/23 : 78 passes avg, 90% accuracy :
Kroos in 2022/23 : 101 passes avg, 91% accuracy
 
Trex said:
I can see us playing a 3241 in possession e.g
GK
Dalot Varane Martinez
Casemiro Shaw
Antony Bruno Mount Rashford
CF
There'll be more emphasis on pressing from the front, in Possession Shaw will seat at the base of a left sided triangle with Mount and Rashford interplaying between Half space and wide left, same with happen on the right between RB, Antony and Bruno.
When you think of Conte Chelsea had Alonso, Hazard, Costa, Pedro and Moses pushing forward with the other five outfielders covering and working the build up. Klopps Liverpool at it best Robertson, Mane, Firmino, Salah, Arnold doing same. With the other five outfielder working the build up and covering. Pep various tactical variation will always have five pushing forward as well.
If we added a De Jong type to our midfield in place of Eriksen it means we'll only be utilizing 4 outfielders capable of making things happen in the final third with any decent regularity as none of our fullbacks can be described as a pure attacking fullback like prime Marcelo or Arnold. So it makes more sense to utilize them as inside fullbacks and give freedom to two midfielders to join the front three. This is why Mount is targeted because he can do that but also has top notch work ethic which Eriksen lacks.
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We have already played this system and it was widely used. One of the FB staying deep to make it 3 at the back and then pushing higher up to help the midfield. Other FB pushes higher up to support attack.


1 Midfielder usually stays deeper and then you have others being a 5 or 6 member attack that occupies spaces between defenders. This was sort of base template and then you see lot of off the ball movement, rotations to drag the defenders to make space.

Lot of times Eriksen was the deeper midfielder with Casemiro joining the attack. If we sign Mount, it will be Mount, Bruno in the attack with Casemiro as deeper midfield.

Carl Anka mentioned about 3-1-6 formation that was used at Ajax
Where a number of players could comfortably exchange passes and play out from the back, Ajax would often start possession in a 3-1-6 shape. A full-back such as Daley Blind or a central midfielder like Frenkie de Jong would drop deep to help the centre-backs, while right-back Noussair Mazraoui would advance forward. “Slow-slow-fast” was a common factor, playing around the opposition press or lulling them into certain areas before exploiting the space quickly.
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Also lot of articles and accounts did the same analysis on our game vs Everton.



Also there was a 2-3-5 formation at Ajax.



I think that's the reason we are going for a player who can play as CM but stronger in the final third. Maybe completely wrong but my gut feeling is, if we sign Mount we will see the 3-1-6/2-3-5 tactical shape in possession much more than the last season
 
roonster09 said:
We have already played this system and it was widely used. One of the FB staying deep to make it 3 at the back and then pushing higher up to help the midfield. Other FB pushes higher up to support attack.


1 Midfielder usually stays deeper and then you have others being a 5 or 6 member attack that occupies spaces between defenders. This was sort of base template and then you see lot of off the ball movement, rotations to drag the defenders to make space.

Lot of times Eriksen was the deeper midfielder with Casemiro joining the attack. If we sign Mount, it will be Mount, Bruno in the attack with Casemiro as deeper midfield.

Carl Anka mentioned about 3-1-6 formation that was used at Ajax


Also lot of articles and accounts did the same analysis on our game vs Everton.



Also there was a 2-3-5 formation at Ajax.



I think that's the reason we are going for a player who can play as CM but stronger in the final third. Maybe completely wrong but my gut feeling is, if we sign Mount we will see the 3-1-6/2-3-5 tactical shape in possession much more than the last season
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Thanks for the response. Doubters need to understand ETH is a very tactically astute manager, and if he wants Mount it's because he sees quality in him necessary for implementing his ideas.
 
Trex said:
Thanks for the response. Doubters need to understand ETH is a very tactically astute manager, and if he wants Mount it's because he sees quality in him necessary for implementing his ideas.
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Let’s not forget though - ETH - despite his excellent start - has not proven astute in the transfer market at all to date.

we openly chased FDJ for months and then overpaid for Casemiro. We supposedly wanted Jurien Timber by all accounts and fluked our best signing Martinez when LVG got involved - who we then had to overpay for because that decision was late and he was on his way to Arsenal. We then wasted so much time faffing about chasing targets that we should not have been so solely focused on that we had to panic spunk €100 million on Antony- a player who, despite his obvious potential, could have been found 10 times over for half the price elsewhere with even a half decent scouting network.

So when I see Mason Mount -€70 million from a prem rival - I just immediately think shit show. Chelsea won’t let him go cheap or quickly - and for anything approaching that amount a half way decent scouting network would have 5other names we should be pursuing.

I like ETH a lot but that doesn’t mean you can overlook the errors that have been made.
 
captaincantona said:
Let’s not forget though - ETH - despite his excellent start - has not proven astute in the transfer market at all to date.

we openly chased FDJ for months and then overpaid for Casemiro. We supposedly wanted Jurien Timber by all accounts and fluked our best signing Martinez when LVG got involved - who we then had to overpay for because that decision was late and he was on his way to Arsenal. We then wasted so much time faffing about chasing targets that we should not have been so solely focused on that we had to panic spunk €100 million on Antony- a player who, despite his obvious potential, could have been found 10 times over for half the price elsewhere with even a half decent scouting network.

So when I see Mason Mount -€70 million from a prem rival - I just immediately think shit show. Chelsea won’t let him go cheap or quickly - and for anything approaching that amount a half way decent scouting network would have 5other names we should be pursuing.

I like ETH a lot but that doesn’t mean you can overlook the errors that have been made.
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We fluked Martinez buy? Thats new. Also how do you reckon we overpaid for him?
Also its not on ETH to pay or not pay the amount, so if we go by the fact which players he chased he's actually astute in the market.
Hardly anthing right with your post.

Also I love scouting network stuff, this isnt aimed only at you, if that network would find someone we'd hear cries - who do hell is this guy.
 
Trex said:
Thanks for the response. Doubters need to understand ETH is a very tactically astute manager, and if he wants Mount it's because he sees quality in him necessary for implementing his ideas.
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I am not saying he is not, but that's a very blind approach. Mourinho was also a very astute manager, and he bought some absolute crap players, so did LVG.
 
captaincantona said:
Let’s not forget though - ETH - despite his excellent start - has not proven astute in the transfer market at all to date.

we openly chased FDJ for months and then overpaid for Casemiro. We supposedly wanted Jurien Timber by all accounts and fluked our best signing Martinez when LVG got involved - who we then had to overpay for because that decision was late and he was on his way to Arsenal. We then wasted so much time faffing about chasing targets that we should not have been so solely focused on that we had to panic spunk €100 million on Antony- a player who, despite his obvious potential, could have been found 10 times over for half the price elsewhere with even a half decent scouting network.

So when I see Mason Mount -€70 million from a prem rival - I just immediately think shit show. Chelsea won’t let him go cheap or quickly - and for anything approaching that amount a half way decent scouting network would have 5other names we should be pursuing.

I like ETH a lot but that doesn’t mean you can overlook the errors that have been made.
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We didn't overpay for Martinez.
FdJ and Antony are linked cases and you can blame Arnold and Murtough for that more than Ten Hag. They were the ones meeting in Barcelona while he was on the pre season tour.

We got Malacia in before he landed in Lyon, and Eriksen in early for free.

Your post has a lot of BS
 
Highfather_24 said:
He is a good long passer yes, but so was Wayne Rooney. That doesnt tell me if he is a good fit at CM.

As for his passing success % and his passing volume, I believe the numbers say it all :

Mount in 2020/21 : 59 passes avg, 81% accuracy
Mount in 2021/22 : 48 passes avg, 78% accuracy
Mount in 2022/23 : 42 passes avg, 75% accuracy

De Jong in 2022/23 : 78 passes avg, 90% accuracy :
Kroos in 2022/23 : 101 passes avg, 91% accuracy
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Mount usually sits higher up on the pitch in the final third for Chelsea and hence he would have less space and more pressure in the most crowded area to make those pass. You should compare him with other players in similar position (AM rather than CM) in the same league to draw the fairer picture.

Final third passer (AM) in PL:

Mount 19-23
Short pass - 89.7%
Medium pass - 79.6%
Long pass - 53.7%
Total - 79.3%

De Bruyne 15-23
Short pass - 86.6%
Medium pass - 78.7%
Long pass - 56.3%
Total - 75.4%

Maddison 18-23
Short pass - 87.6%
Medium pass - 80.7%
Long pass - 49.8%
Total - 75.3%

Bruno 19-23
Short pass - 85.9%
Medium pass - 77.6%
Long pass - 54.6%
Total - 73.6%

These are some of the best final 3rd passer in the league over recent years, they all fall short on percentage when compared with Mount.
 
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Kostov said:
I am not saying he is not, but that's a very blind approach. Mourinho was also a very astute manager, and he bought some absolute crap players, so did LVG.
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It's one thing to argue that ETH has misjudged Mount's quality or that he's a bad buy for the price, even though we don't actually know the price yet.

But it's another to argue that ETH is targeting the wrong profile of midfielder entirely, which is what the posters saying we need X type of midfielder instead of Mount are doing. Because what we need depends entirely on how we plan to set up, which is something ETH actually knows objectively rather than subjectively and we don't.
 
VP89 said:
We didn't overpay for Martinez.
FdJ and Antony are linked cases and you can blame Arnold and Murtough for that more than Ten Hag. They were the ones meeting in Barcelona while he was on the pre season tour.

We got Malacia in before he landed in Lyon, and Eriksen in early for free.

Your post has a lot of BS
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We overpaid for Martinez in the very simple sense that Arsenal identified him as their primary CB target and had a deal in place at a lower price. We targeted Timber and when then went balls up we had to pay more than Arsenal had agreed.

we didn’t overpay from a quality perspective but had we identified him as our primary CB target we could have gotten him for less.

and as for BS - how is chasing FDJ for so long not at all on the manger when we had several gaping holes in midfield?Conveniently removing ETH from that process and blaming the negotiators is bullshit.You are underplaying the managers power in that situation to suit your arguement.

And Anthony is not a linked transfer so again - your response was bullshit just dismissing the point. When we couldn’t get FDJ - we overspent on a player because we had no other options for less than €100million? That is the definition of a scouting network failure.

there seems to be a real disjointed approach at our club. We might have the same 50 names in each position as the rest but we seem to have real trouble finding the balance, the value, the right character. That’s not on ETH - that has been the case for years. But my point was ETH has given me plenty of reasons to be positive but his transfers have not been one of them.
 
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captaincantona said:
We overpaid for Martinez in the very simple sense that Arsenal identified him as their primary CB target and had a deal in place at a lower price. We targeted Timber and when then went balls up we had to pay more than Arsenal had agreed.

we didn’t overpay from a quality perspective but had we identified him as our primary CB target we could have gotten him for less.
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All reports were that they didn’t want to pay the asking price and we did. Not that they had a deal agreed.

“Van der Sar told the Athletic: “Arsenal came earlier for Lisandro, but it was an amount where we said, ‘Thank you very much for the offer, but we’d rather keep the player than start negotiating’.”
 
macheda14 said:
All reports were that they didn’t want to pay the asking price and we did. Not that they had a deal agreed.

“Van der Sar told the Athletic: “Arsenal came earlier for Lisandro, but it was an amount where we said, ‘Thank you very much for the offer, but we’d rather keep the player than start negotiating’.”
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Wonder how he will work around that one now.
 
RedRonaldo said:
Mount usually sits higher up on the pitch in the final third for Chelsea and hence he would have less space and more pressure in the most crowded area to make those pass. You should compare him with other players in similar position (AM rather than CM) in the same league to draw the fairer picture.

Final third passer (AM) in PL:

Mount 19-23
Short pass - 89.7%
Medium pass - 79.6%
Long pass - 53.7%
Total - 79.3%

De Bruyne 15-23
Short pass - 86.6%
Medium pass - 78.7%
Long pass - 56.3%
Total - 75.4%

Maddison 18-23
Short pass - 87.6%
Medium pass - 80.7%
Long pass - 49.8%
Total - 75.3%

Bruno 19-23
Short pass - 85.9%
Medium pass - 77.6%
Long pass - 54.6%
Total - 73.6%

These are some of the best final 3rd passer in the league over recent years, they all fall short on percentage when compared with Mount.
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All the #10s you mentioned(Bruno, KdB, Maddison), usually play with another #8 who complements their style by having higher passing volume and accuracy, so you have Eriksen, Gundogan and Tielemans respectively. Even Mount has Kovacic/Enzo.

So Mount would be playing in that slightly deeper #8 role that Eriksen is playing, since Bruno is our primary creator, and I dont think he feels like a good fit for that. A younger Kovacic would have been perfect.
 
macheda14 said:
All reports were that they didn’t want to pay the asking price and we did. Not that they had a deal agreed.

“Van der Sar told the Athletic: “Arsenal came earlier for Lisandro, but it was an amount where we said, ‘Thank you very much for the offer, but we’d rather keep the player than start negotiating’.”
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Yeah, Arsenal had their bid rejected because it was derisory, but you can't use that to shit on our club.

Also, if Arsenal had already agreed a fee, why would we have to outbid them?
 
Halftrack said:
Yeah, Arsenal had their bid rejected because it was derisory, but you can't use that to shit on our club.

Also, if Arsenal had already agreed a fee, why would we have to outbid them?
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Martinez was off to Arsenal, he phoned up Ten Hag and told him that himself.
These stories are nothing but noise, negotiation tactics.
 
cyberman said:
Martinez was off to Arsenal, he phoned up Ten Hag and told him that himself.
These stories are nothing but noise, negotiation tactics.
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He was off to Arsenal unless we were interested. Us/an EtH reunion was the preferred option. Arsenal also didn't want to meet Ajax valuation.
 
Halftrack said:
He was off to Arsenal unless we were interested. Us/an EtH reunion was the preferred option. Arsenal also didn't want to meet Ajax valuation.
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Apparently they also wanted him to play LB, if their fans are to be believed.

Which would have been madness.
 
Halftrack said:
He was off to Arsenal unless we were interested. Us/an EtH reunion was the preferred option. Arsenal also didn't want to meet Ajax valuation.
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But they would have came to an agreement because Martinez literally told Ten Hag he was off to Arsenal unless Ten Hag wanted him at United. Both Ten Jag and Martinez said this.
Ajax would have eventually sold Martinez to Arsenal since that’s what they do
 
cyberman said:
But they would have came to an agreement because Martinez literally told Ten Hag he was off to Arsenal unless Ten Hag wanted him at United. Both Ten Jag and Martinez said this.
Ajax would have eventually sold Martinez to Arsenal since that’s what they do
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Never said they wouldn't, but the idea that we paid more because "Arsenal already had a deal in place" like captain moaner up there claimed, is pure stupid.
 
Halftrack said:
Never said they wouldn't, but the idea that we paid more because "Arsenal already had a deal in place" like captain moaner up there claimed, is pure stupid.
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What’s your problem? I point out the fact that he was in the process of going to Arsenal for a lower fee - that’s basically confirmed by the man himself. You’re ignoring the fact that we also only went for him when Timber rejected us. Considering how much of a resounding success Martinez has been character wise - surely we should have been after him instead of a younger prospect in Timber. With ETHs links to the player, and the fact he wanted to join us, if we go in for Martinez from the outset we get him cheaper than we did.

All signs of the basic inoffensive and reasonable position I was taking - that ETH has a multitude of pluses - but so far transfers aren’t one of them. It’s been two windows -in Fact one because January there was no cash - so he might just need time and let’s hope that’s the case. But don’t be getting snappy with me because I disagree withyou.
 
Real Name said:
Wonder how he will work around that one now.
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Go read what Martinez and ETH have said about the transfer. Martinez was going to Arsenal. Everything else is just posturing that happens with every transfer.

It’s really odd trying to argue otherwise.

The Martinez transfer - our one resounding success under ETH…may not have happened if Timber said yes or indeed if Arsenal had the chance to keep negotiating. So in my view, rode our luck and paid more than we would have if he was our main target from the outset.

In fact, having seen now first hand how Fuking good Martinez is and his character is worth the price tag alone - why were we after Timber? Could you imagine this season without Martinez? Timber does not strike me as a leader or a fighter both traits we lacked at that point. So maybe that’s another question - why on earth did ETH want Timber instead of Martinez in the first place?

All reasons why I wouldn’t necessarily blindly say - it’s grand ETH has this - when it comes to transfers. It’s fine like, lots of great coaches buy shit players and players that don’t work out - we don’t have to just pretend it doesn’t happen cause we love the guy?!
 
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captaincantona said:
What’s your problem? I point out the fact that he was in the process of going to Arsenal for a lower fee - that’s basically confirmed by the man himself. You’re ignoring the fact that we also only went for him when Timber rejected us. Considering how much of a resounding success Martinez has been character wise - surely we should have been after him instead of a younger prospect in Timber. With ETHs links to the player, and the fact he wanted to join us, if we go in for Martinez from the outset we get him cheaper than we did.
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He wasn't in the process of joining Arsenal for a lower fee, Arsenal were in the process of bidding for him and not having much luck. If we'd entered the process earlier, before Arsenal, could we have gotten him cheaper? Probably, yes. Just as Arsenal would likely have gotten him cheaper if we never entered the race. But that's assuming Arsenal would have abstained from bidding had we bid first. Because you're going to end up paying more if there's more than one club bidding.

Point is, saying Arsenal had "a deal in place" or that he was "in the process of joining them" is false, and anything regarding the fee is merely speculation.

And who knows, maybe EtH didn't want to raid Ajax? But with Martinez set on leaving anyway, why not bring him here?
 
I would like Mount here at the right price. I have no problem with us being priced out of the move under Chelsea's current demands. I just hope we don't cave at anything over 60.
 
captaincantona said:
Go read what Martinez and ETH have said about the transfer. Martinez was going to Arsenal. Everything else is just posturing that happens with every transfer.

It’s really odd trying to argue otherwise.
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Martinez pushed for a move to United and we paid the fee which Ajax wanted unlike Arsenal. So yes, if those 2 things hadnt happened he was going to Arsenal, you're right about that.
Why we were going for Timber is such a strange point. We were going for A player and that deal didnt go through for whatever reason so we went for another player. Transfers go like that you know.
Also still not sure how we overpaid for him. Its the new thing roung here, which ever transfer we do apparently we overpaid..
 
It doesn‘t make sense we were going for Timber, Ten Hag wanted a left footed cb. I question that theory.

BTW this thread is about Mason Mount.
 
Whenever I hear the name Mount I'm neither excited or put off. To me this is just a 'meh' signing pretty much in the same way I see Fred. Doesn't exactly fill me with excitement if I'm honest.

I'm seriously hoping he's just a front for someone else we've got lined up and he's just being used as a deflection tactic.

If we are in for him then we should just offer Chelsea £30-40m max and if they don't bite then walk away. He's not worth 50m by any stretch of the imagination.
 
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Whoever United go for, the price will always go up...its down to years and years of proclaiming to be the richest club in the world. Problem nowadays in the Premier League everyone is rich, so no English club is desperate to sell.

Just having 1 year one your contract doesn't make any transfer easier or cheaper...just look at the numbers quoted for Kane.

Rashford has 1 year left on his contract, but I doubt many United fans would be happy to sell him for 40-60 million? you could argue Rashford is better than Mount, but both are academy graduates and ideally I think Chelsea would like to keep Mount.

So it was never going to be an easy transfer to make.
 
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Bored of this one already. Not even a player I'd be majorly excited about and we've still got to go through the rigmarole of 'formal bid soon', 'rejected', 'gap in valuation' before we eventually fork out £58m on July 19th.
 
Betson said:
I stand corrected but I think once you are in the last year of your contact you are allowed to talk to other clubs and your club cannot stop you.
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He actually isn’t yet in the last year of his contract.
 
Solius said:
Bored of this one already. Not even a player I'd be majorly excited about and we've still got to go through the rigmarole of 'formal bid soon', 'rejected', 'gap in valuation' before we eventually fork out £58m on July 19th.
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This... will be spot on :lol:
 
Solius said:
Bored of this one already. Not even a player I'd be majorly excited about and we've still got to go through the rigmarole of 'formal bid soon', 'rejected', 'gap in valuation' before we eventually fork out £58m on July 19th.
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Real Madrid made Courtois go into hiding to force a transfer, Chelsea did the same thing with Enzo Fernandez. Basically astute clubs sense player's desperation to join them use that factor to bring clubs to the negotiating table. We should be doing something similar with Mount. No one else is going to pay him what we will.
 
. Is this done then or is it a joke? Thought we’re still far from their valuation.
 
Wow - that is unexpected

But only 3 years? Hopefully we have optional to extend for at least another year, decent fee nevertheless.

Edit - damn I knew it would too good to be true
 
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