Mason Greenwood | Officially a Marseille player

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Longshanks said:
Because they have a duty towards the alledged victim and there is a possibility that the evidence to compleatly clear Mason paints the alleged victim in bad light. So maybe they are protecting the alledged victim.
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That would have to mean that the recording was fake then, surely? And I don't think anyone could fairly assume that based on the content. Maybe I'm missing other alternatives...

christinaa said:
So it's MORALLY OKAY for him to play with any other club - just not at United ?!
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That's up to fans of the other clubs, not us. All I know is that I'd have a hard time explaining to my daughters why I'm wearing a United shirt if Mason was on the pitch. His second chance isn't dependent on playing for United.
 
cafecillos said:
The cancel culture brigade just can't stop embarrassing themselves, can they?
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It seems like you'll want to edit this post, cause everyone is reading it as if you're blaming cancel culture for what's happened to Greenwood...
 
sullydnl said:
Well, the key decision makers in the club at least.

Though how much weight anyone should place on that is extremely debateable given they a) are not professional investigators, b) have zero domestic/sexual violence expertise, c) didn't actually speak to the alleged victim, d) by their own admission had limited access to evidence and e) are the party who would gain most from Greenwood being seen as innocent other than Greenwood himself.
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I don’t believe that distinction needed be made since they are by your own admission the decision makers at the club.

You raise valid points of contention and for potential skepticism - though the citing of potential new/evidence not in the public domain was not made by the club in isolation - IIRC the statement for CPS cited something similar.
 
Mr Pigeon said:
Ah yes. The witch hunts where innocent women were drowned or burned at the stake. Very similar situations.
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I'm going to answer you even if your answer don't deserve it.

What where missing and who commit the wrong doings "when innocent women were drowned or burned at the stake"? (hint)

The reason we today have a police force and a legal system is to prevent innocent people to be "drowned and burned at the stake". Maybe it's unfamiliar to you but the legal system is one of the most important corner stones for a modern democracy.
When we let the "mob" act as both prosecutors, defense lawyers and judges then is when we have a problem.

The mob 400 years ago or so mostly didn't give these "innocent women" a chance.
You probably didn't like it. I didn't like it and judging by our history most decent people didn't like that sort of mob mentality. .

The legal system couldn't convict Mason (based on lack of witnesses and eveidence) but "the mob" on social media doesn't care because they want him punished no matter what, even if there's not enough evidence to be 100% sure he's guilty.

Maybe now you see some of the similraties now.
 
OverratedOpinion said:
Do we have zero standards? What if a bang average youth player goes and shoots someone tomorrow? Do we say "they could get counselling that will heal them and stop them from shooting someone again"?

What is the level? Do you accept that we have a level and that threatening to rape women is a reasonable level for us to say we don't accept it?
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Of course we don't accept it.
But help is always given to any type of criminal for them to restart their life for the good of society.
So it's morally okay for him to play with City or Liverpool now or is he still an unconvicted rapist and they'll be happy with him?
 
manutddjw said:
This is completely wrong. You can have an opinion on something, but unless you know the facts or spoken directly with the people involved or the one investigating the matter who has the facts, you should not have the power to ruin somebodys life because of it.
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Quite pathetic to be worried here about the life of a pro footballer who is going to get a multi million dollar contract elsewhere.

Not to mention siding with a player over club interests. United has booted better players for a lot less over the years.
 
Tender Teacher said:
As I said before, there could be any number of potential explanations for the wider context of the voice recording. It could be that the true explanation is deeply personal for the alleged victim and/or Greenwood thus would be harmful to them if made public.
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Such as?

You've already given us two explanations (albeit one being more laughably implausible than the other), might as well dig deeper.
 
JezChan said:
Seems from the wording in both the Club Statement and Richard Arnold's Open Letter is that they are keeping the door open for a possible future return (however unlikely and ill-advised).

This is such a messy situation, and for all those who say the club have handled this horribly - I agree. At the same time, I genuinely don't see how they could have handled it in a way that wouldn't be described as "horrible", apart from just letting the player go in the first place (though I'm uncomfortable with such black-and-white judgement on short notice in a world full of shades of grey).
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Maybe I have less faith in humanity, but I feel like if he played for us this season and scored a big goal or two against a Liverpool or City, most football fans are fickle enough that their disagreements with him being in the team would end.

mu4c_20le said:
I can see a release being possible but only if the interested club (Turkey?) cannot afford him and we genuinely want to help him. Otherwise, we aren't just sacking him like some have suggested. Loan could be possible, but would probably be seen as another U turn.
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See how it goes I suppose. Extremely silly to have dragged it out this long if it's going to end up with him going on loan. Didn't Juve want him a few months ago or whenever it was?
 
Shark said:
Not sure what these types of posts are getting at, that's all. At 21 any man such know that beating your partner to a pulp, and threatening r*pe is irredeemably wrong.
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This is true. It is also true that MG has grown up in a very different set of circumstances that many of us will never experience, where money, power, fame, success all can have twisting influences on people.

Both truths can co-exist.
 
Martial'sEmergingSmile said:
Yeah, there were apparently loads of posts and it was well known how mutually toxic the relationship was. I think the United statement intimates that.

Here are a couple of the forum posts. I've edited out the girl invoved's name:

1

2

There were 15 screenshots on Reddit. Orla Sloan, the girl they mention a few times, was the girl who was recently in court for stalking Mason Mount.
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What forum is that from?
 
Ceteris said:
Funny how they say he's been with us sine the age of 7, when he was scoring he was one of us and we cheered

One mistake, then it's cut him away we don't need his sort at the club

Where's our culpability for how he has turned out?

But hey some people can sleep well tonight because we a very upstanding club with impeccable moral values.

Laughable and sad really
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it is a difficult for the club. What should they do then? Take him back and say it doesn’t matter our players rape women and beat women? The evidence of what he did is so clear. Should our club say that it doesn’t matter you treat women that way?
 
christinaa said:
Of course we don't accept it.
But help is always given to any type of criminal for them to restart their life for the good of society.
So it's morally okay for him to play with City or Liverpool now or is he still an unconvicted rapist and they'll be happy with him?
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It's up for any other future employer to decide what they feel is acceptable. I am extremely pleased* that the football club I support has decided that what he has done that is publically available is not conducive of someone they wish to provide a huge platform to.

*Even though it took public pressure.
 
Redlambs said:
So it's MORALLY OKAY to keep him because he's decent at football ?!
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No, it’s morally ok to keep Greenwood, because you know LESS than the CPS & United, and both of which had insufficient evidence to prove the wild (and clearly misleading) allegations.

But sure, let’s just bin off a generational talent for Snowflakes & nut jobs, who think they know better.
 
So Mason can prove he didn’t commit attempted rape but doesn’t want to explain it. I’m struggling to see any situation where I wouldn’t want to clear my name if I was accused of that.
 
Jazmodo said:
No, it’s morally ok to keep Greenwood, because you know LESS than the CPS & United, and both of which had insufficient evidence to prove the wild (and clearly misleading) allegations.

But sure, let’s just bin off a generational talent for Snowflakes & nut jobs, who think they know better.
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Speaking of nut jobs, weren't you leaving?
 
Jazmodo said:
No, it’s morally ok to keep Greenwood, because you know LESS than the CPS & United, and both of which had insufficient evidence to prove the wild (and clearly misleading) allegations.

But sure, let’s just bin off a generational talent for Snowflakes & nut jobs, who think they know better.
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As soon as you use language like this, you've already lost the argument.
 
Jazmodo said:
No, it’s morally ok to keep Greenwood, because you know LESS than the CPS & United, and both of which had insufficient evidence to prove the wild (and clearly misleading) allegations.

But sure, let’s just bin off a generational talent for Snowflakes & nut jobs, who think they know better.
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Not sure you can assert its clearly misleading
 
christinaa said:
Of course we don't accept it.
But help is always given to any type of criminal for them to restart their life for the good of society.
So it's morally okay for him to play with City or Liverpool now or is he still an unconvicted rapist and they'll be happy with him?
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Those clubs won't touch him for the same reasons as United.
 
I really hope he can break the statistical cycle and this episode will have been an awful period in his life where he has overcome the issues he has and never heads down this path again. I hope he can go on to have a good career if he does break the cycle of domestic abuse.
Im glad we have parted ways, the only decision that we could have come to in reality.
 
Cassidy said:
Again they were not FORCED into anything.
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They took a decision they didn’t want due to external influences.

By your reckoning, nobody is ever forced into anything.

Commentator: “Shaw is forced to go back to his goalkeeper”
Cassidy: “Actually, he was not FORCED into it, he, like, literally could have done other things”
 
Superunknown said:
This is the right decision and the only inevitable outcome, in my opinion. The noise around the club this week has been uncomfortable and the way the club has handled it has been nothing short of embarrassing. This club needs to clean up its image and, importantly, it needs to be clean.

However, I've got to admit that I'm more confused about where the club stands on this after reading that statement. The line about them believing that Mason did not commit the acts he was charged with, and the other line about the club and Mason accepting that mistakes have been made just seems more than a little contradictory. What exactly does the club think has or hasn't happened? What is the exact reasoning for letting him go? The line about the excerpt being from a much larger recording is also interesting and they've thrown that in deliberately. I don't honestly know what the club are trying to say or what the values are that they're aiming to portray.

In my opinion, the club has muddied the waters with this statement and has just got the messaging wrong again. It may have been a case of the club thinking that they were being transparent, but actually it just seems like very confused thinking to me. I'm also led to believe that, had it not been for the noise this week, the club would have reinstated Mason. The lines in the club statement about them not believing that Mason committed the acts he did, and all the wording around that...it just comes across to me as if the only reason they've moved him on is down to the negative publicity. What that tells me is that the club honestly would have tried putting him back in the side if they think they could have got away with it. The length of time this has taken really doesn't sit comfortably with me.
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This is what I believe. If you do not think he is guilty, then you should stick by your principles. Why take 7 months and waste all that time, to just come to that conclusion. It is a cop out. I would have liked him to stay and the club to take the slow rehabilitation process or make a more definitive decision much earlier.

Different topic, but our preparation for this season is now completely shot. It is clear the Ten Hag was assured that Greenwood was coming back and now we are left with Antony who is crap.

My next off topic, is that this club needs new governance. New owners who are more proactive. This is just shambolic.
 
7even said:
The mob 400 years ago or so mostly didn't give these "innocent women" a chance.
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They chucked them into a river. if they drowned, they were innocent, but if they survived, it must be witchcraft... so they were burnt at the stake.

Cf Matthew Hopkins et al.
 
He is most definitely not going to be playing for City. They fecked Mendy off to outer space within a week of his scandal:lol:
 
padzilla said:
22 pages here and let's be honest, not one of us has changed our views on this since posting here.
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Good point. But that won't stop people speculating like they were instant experts on every aspect of this sorry saga.
This has become worse than the worst soap.
 
Can't wrap my head around this. If they believe strongly enough he didn't do it they should have stuck to their convictions and brought him back and told everyone exactly what they found.

Complete shambles.

Based on what's public its the correct, only decision.
 
I was chuffed when I heard the news, and about to shower Utd with praise.... and then I read the statement. Baffling way to ruin great PR.
 
Yorke to Cole said:
This is what I believe. If you do not think he is guilty, then you should stick by your principles. Why take 7 months and waste all that time, to just come to that conclusion. It is a cop out. I would have liked him to stay and the club to take the slow rehabilitation process or make a more definitive decision much earlier.

Different topic, but our preparation for this season is now completely shot. It is clear the Ten Hag was assured that Greenwood was coming back and now we are left with Antony who is crap.

My next off topic, is that this club needs new governance. New owners who are more proactive. This is just shambolic.
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I mentioned this yesterday, it’s clear that they didn’t plan for worst case scenario
 
mu4c_20le said:
If it was Messi he'd be back in the lineup by the end of the week
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But he's not. Sucks to suck but that's how life is for the not rich enough and not powerful enough. If this had happened a decade later with multiple ballon d'ors and a host of defense lawyers at the ready to gag order the info before anything comes out, perhaps there's a different outcome.

But there isn't. So severe sexual assault charges have consequences even if they've all been dropped. Mason admitting he made mistakes doesn't help either.
 
Iker Quesadillas said:
I did completely forget about that.
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And this was my point. I don't disagree with @Pexbo 's take at all, I was just making the point that the only other side is that. It's the only other plausible explanation. Either he is guilty or she lied.

Which is what I've said all along, either way this was always going to be the only decision to be made. Throwing the women under the bus, blaming social media, all that nonsense needs to die. Mason in his own words started these events, and the club have exacerbated them with the terrible handling.

But whatever way you want to look at it, someone or both have been incredibly stupid to say the very least.
 
7even said:
I'm going to answer you even if your answer don't deserve it.

What where missing and who commit the wrong doings "when innocent women were drowned or burned at the stake"? (hint)

The reason we today have a police force and a legal system is to prevent innocent people to be "drowned and burned at the stake". Maybe it's unfamiliar to you but the legal system is one of the most important corner stones for a modern democracy.
When we let the "mob" act as both prosecutors
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I got as far as this before I had to start typing a reply; the "mob" didn't charge Mason. The police force and legal system (thanks for telling me about those, I assumed it was fecking garden gnomes who handled this stuff before you told me) were the ones who charged Mason.

The rest of your post is just noise, since the CPS themselves said they had no choice but to drop charges due to lack of evidence (maybe you're unfamiliar with the success rate of rape charges in the UK due to lack of evidence).

At the end of the day you're still comparing folk saying nasty things about a guy online (which he can ignore), who is on audio threatening to rape and assault the victim, with literal murders.
 
Redlambs said:
And this was my point. I don't disagree with @Pexbo 's take at all, I was just making the point that the only other side is that. It's the only other plausible explanation. Either he is guilty or she lied.

Which is what I've said all along, either way this was always going to be the only decision to be made. Throwing the women under the bus, blaming social media, all that nonsense needs to die. Mason in his own words started these events, and the club have exacerbated them with the terrible handling.

But whatever way you want to look at it, someone or both have been incredibly stupid to say the very least.
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I agree with this take on the whole situation.
 
spiriticon said:
He is most definitely not going to be playing for City. They fecked Mendy off to outer space within a week of his scandal:lol:
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They have Alvarez, even as a joke it doesn't make sense.

I was thinking more like Spurs, or Everton
 
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