I believe Damien plans something with the data. Copy/pasting all the stat posts in separate thread, maybe sticky, think it would be worth it.
Manchester United Goals and Assists (1987/88-today)
- Thread starter Mrs Smoker
- Start date
Holy mother of god.... Those Giggs assists stats.Are you sure it is reliable? Unbelievable...
@Mrs Smoker If I am not wrong, it was the Scholes vs Lampard vs Gerrard thread where Hannibal claimed Giggs had that many assists wasn't it? Everyone was disputing it and saying that was nigh on impossible... Just can't believe he had that many assists. Oh this explains why created that help with the 92/93 thread
You should see the amount of assists Beckham put up.
http://www.premiersoccerstats.com/P...PLAYER_TEAM=219&Year=1999/00&PlayerID=BECKHAD
Great thread
Appears quite wrong. By my research, Beckham had 24 assists that season, and just checked two random games I didn't have him as assister, 4-0 vs Sheffield Wednesday, he has no assists there, unless they count those hockey ones Beckham - > Sheringham -> Cole, and in 7-1 he had 2 nice assists, no idea where they got 4 of them.
Amazing thread, great job!
Season 1996-97
==============1996-97==============
Bittersweet end of this season. We won the title again, but the shock came soon after. At the time still only 30-years-old, Eric Cantona, captain of the team retired. Not that there was any significant change success wise, but it still really really sucked.
So, league was won, but domestic cups were disappointing, passed just one round in each of them. Reached the semi-final of Champions League though, where eventual winners, Borussia Dortmund, eliminated us with two 1-0 victories.
Plenty of new signings, each with a different level of success in United. Karel Poborský and Jordi Cruyff more leaning to disappointment pile, while Ronny Johnsen and especially Ole Gunnar Solskjær had excellent United careers. Also signed was Raymond van der Gouw, but just 60 appearances in 6 years. Well, he did spend half of his career as a Schmeichel cover.
Steve Bruce left us though for Birmingham City , as well as Lee Sharpe (Leeds).
David Beckham won the PFA Young Player of the Year award, first since Giggs won his second in 1992-93 season.
Notable departures
Player focus
Ole Gunnar Solskjær
Another great bargain for Sir Alex Ferguson. If he was not plagued by serious injuries in his last few years at Old Trafford, think you could have easily added 20-30 goals to his tally.
Bittersweet end of this season. We won the title again, but the shock came soon after. At the time still only 30-years-old, Eric Cantona, captain of the team retired. Not that there was any significant change success wise, but it still really really sucked.
So, league was won, but domestic cups were disappointing, passed just one round in each of them. Reached the semi-final of Champions League though, where eventual winners, Borussia Dortmund, eliminated us with two 1-0 victories.
Plenty of new signings, each with a different level of success in United. Karel Poborský and Jordi Cruyff more leaning to disappointment pile, while Ronny Johnsen and especially Ole Gunnar Solskjær had excellent United careers. Also signed was Raymond van der Gouw, but just 60 appearances in 6 years. Well, he did spend half of his career as a Schmeichel cover.
Steve Bruce left us though for Birmingham City , as well as Lee Sharpe (Leeds).
David Beckham won the PFA Young Player of the Year award, first since Giggs won his second in 1992-93 season.
Notable departures
Player focus
Ole Gunnar Solskjær
Another great bargain for Sir Alex Ferguson. If he was not plagued by serious injuries in his last few years at Old Trafford, think you could have easily added 20-30 goals to his tally.
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Season 1997-98
==============1997-98==============
First trophyless season in a while. Arsenal took the double, league and FA Cup, while Chelsea took the lite-double, League Cup and Cup Winners Cup. We were just one point of Arsenal at the end, and while finishing the league strongly (5-2-0 in last seven), loss at home to Arsenal in March (0-1) ultimately decided the title winners. They had 51 points then, we had 60, but also three games more played. That was their second win in a series of ten wins.
Barnsley eliminated us in a 5th round replay in FA Cup, while Ipswich beat us 2-0 in first game of League Cup.
Champions League campaign started quite well, we glided through the group with five straight wins, only for Juventus to beat us in the last group game, which was completely unimportant for us. Draw for knockout phase looked excellent, with Monaco being our first opponent. As it happened, they were also our only opponent in knockout phase, eliminating us from the rest of competition with two draws, that one with more goals again at our place. Curse you, away goal gods!
As Eric Cantona retired, Sir Alex went to search for replacement. Found it in Tottenham striker Teddy Sheringham, who'll spend the next four years with United. Henning Berg and Erik Nevland, two Norwegians, were another signings of that summer. Jonathan Greening joined in March of 1998.
Notable departures
Player focus
Andy Cole
Another record signing at the time. Andy Cole was brought to United for 6 million pounds and rated youngling Keith Gillespie. While struggling a bit in first few full seasons, starting with this one, he found his scoring touch again.
First trophyless season in a while. Arsenal took the double, league and FA Cup, while Chelsea took the lite-double, League Cup and Cup Winners Cup. We were just one point of Arsenal at the end, and while finishing the league strongly (5-2-0 in last seven), loss at home to Arsenal in March (0-1) ultimately decided the title winners. They had 51 points then, we had 60, but also three games more played. That was their second win in a series of ten wins.
Barnsley eliminated us in a 5th round replay in FA Cup, while Ipswich beat us 2-0 in first game of League Cup.
Champions League campaign started quite well, we glided through the group with five straight wins, only for Juventus to beat us in the last group game, which was completely unimportant for us. Draw for knockout phase looked excellent, with Monaco being our first opponent. As it happened, they were also our only opponent in knockout phase, eliminating us from the rest of competition with two draws, that one with more goals again at our place. Curse you, away goal gods!
As Eric Cantona retired, Sir Alex went to search for replacement. Found it in Tottenham striker Teddy Sheringham, who'll spend the next four years with United. Henning Berg and Erik Nevland, two Norwegians, were another signings of that summer. Jonathan Greening joined in March of 1998.
Notable departures
Player focus
Andy Cole
Another record signing at the time. Andy Cole was brought to United for 6 million pounds and rated youngling Keith Gillespie. While struggling a bit in first few full seasons, starting with this one, he found his scoring touch again.
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Big season for own goal that.
Also interesting to see the amount of assists Andy Cole got over his career. Somewhat makes up for his sometimes erratic finishing and makes me all of a sudden rate him more.
Also interesting to see the amount of assists Andy Cole got over his career. Somewhat makes up for his sometimes erratic finishing and makes me all of a sudden rate him more.
This is brilliant stuff. I can't believe someone took the time to go through and compile all these stats. You're dedicated!
I think your numbers deserve something more than just a common thread and posts format. A sort of microsite (which has become so popular at ManUtd.com) with the stats presented in a dashboard format where we could navigate and look through the stats willy nilly would be awesome. Maybe RedCafe would like to host it, and someone on here can put it together?
I think your numbers deserve something more than just a common thread and posts format. A sort of microsite (which has become so popular at ManUtd.com) with the stats presented in a dashboard format where we could navigate and look through the stats willy nilly would be awesome. Maybe RedCafe would like to host it, and someone on here can put it together?
Wait until 2009/10, it should've gotten its own jersey then.
And yeah, forgot to mention how willing of a provider Cole was.
Season 1998-99
==============1998-99==============
The Treble season.
Don't think there's too many fans who don't know how this season went on. Drama in all three competitions I'd say. Shock Tottenham lead in last game of the season, Keane's injury after ten minutes of FA Cup final, and Bayern's lead in the Champions League final with just three minutes of stoppage time...
No quadruple though, Tottenham stopped us in 5th round of League Cup.
Dwight Yorke joined us from Villa in another club's record breaking transfer and had an outstanding debut season with United. Jaap Stam also joined as a most expensive defensive player, as well as Jesper Blomqvist. Stam took some time to adapt only to become an immense defender for United. Blomqvist's injury voes limited him only to 38 appearances, and all in this season. John O'Shea joined as well, but he'll have his debut in next season, and serious game time from 2002-03.
After 11 and 9 years, Brian McClair and Gary Pallister left the club.
David Beckham, villyfied after the red card in that summer's World Cup also had an excellent season by finishing as runner-up to Rivaldo in 1999's European Footballer of the Year and FIFA World Player of the Year awards.
Notable departures
Players focus
Dwight Yorke
Teddy Sheringham
Two excellent strikers who enjoyed short but sweet United careers. Both members of 1998-99, 99-00, 00-01 title winning squads, 1998-99 FA Cup and Champions League winners. Yorke was named Premier League Player of the Season in 1999, while Sheringham won both the PFA Players' Player of the Year and FWA Footballer of the Year in 2001.
The Treble season.
Don't think there's too many fans who don't know how this season went on. Drama in all three competitions I'd say. Shock Tottenham lead in last game of the season, Keane's injury after ten minutes of FA Cup final, and Bayern's lead in the Champions League final with just three minutes of stoppage time...
No quadruple though, Tottenham stopped us in 5th round of League Cup.
Dwight Yorke joined us from Villa in another club's record breaking transfer and had an outstanding debut season with United. Jaap Stam also joined as a most expensive defensive player, as well as Jesper Blomqvist. Stam took some time to adapt only to become an immense defender for United. Blomqvist's injury voes limited him only to 38 appearances, and all in this season. John O'Shea joined as well, but he'll have his debut in next season, and serious game time from 2002-03.
After 11 and 9 years, Brian McClair and Gary Pallister left the club.
David Beckham, villyfied after the red card in that summer's World Cup also had an excellent season by finishing as runner-up to Rivaldo in 1999's European Footballer of the Year and FIFA World Player of the Year awards.
Notable departures
Players focus
Dwight Yorke
Teddy Sheringham
Two excellent strikers who enjoyed short but sweet United careers. Both members of 1998-99, 99-00, 00-01 title winning squads, 1998-99 FA Cup and Champions League winners. Yorke was named Premier League Player of the Season in 1999, while Sheringham won both the PFA Players' Player of the Year and FWA Footballer of the Year in 2001.
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What happened to Yorke then? Seemed to peter out.
Its weird. Amazing first season, still pretty good second. But by the time he scored that hat-trick against Arsenal in his third season he was already fourth choice and a bit of a laughing stock to be honest (all that stuff with Jordon was in the press). Can't think of a player (barring injury) slipping so fast at United.
Yorke was ridiculous that season. One of the best players in Europe.
brilliant thread! thread of the year!
Didn't Ruud come in before Yorke's final season, which somewhat explains his terrible stats that season as most of those appearances would've been from the bench.
Awesome thread @Mrs Smoker
Ryan Giggs
This whole project started when I saw the post claiming that Giggs had astonishing 284 assists in his career. Surely, that's hogwash, with his goals, how could he be directly responsible for almost 25% of all United goals? Ridiculous. 100-150 at most I'd say. Didn't help that first two seasons I watched and counted the stats were 1992-93 and 1998-99. He had 5 and 7 in those.
Needless to say, I was dead wrong.
What an astonishing career for the most decorated player in MUFC & English football history. I'd say he was the best United player ever. It was popular on Cafe to say that Giggs never reached the highs Bale did for instance. I'll never agree with that. Especially after watching and re-watching his career in the past month or so. Skilled and fast, a real menace to opponents. And he did it for 20+ seasons.
In the sea of highlight videos, this one really isn't all that bad. More goals oriented though. He was much more than just that.
Holy mother of feck... In 963 games he was directly involved in 477 goals... Not to mention his pace and dribbling which stretched the opponents, and his work-rate in tracking back which Irwin always banged on about. What a ridiculous player.
Season 1999-00
==============1999-00==============
We steamrolled the Premier League in this season. Finished with 18 points more than second placed Arsenal and with only three losses.
By the request of FA themselves, we didn't defend our FA Cup title, but have travelled to Brazil for inaugural FIFA Club World Championship. Finished third there with a draw against Nexaca, loss against winners Vasco de Gama and win over Australian club South Melbourne.
We did win the Intercontinental Cup game against Palmeiras 1-0 a month or so before. And *everyone* knows IC is a much bigger deal.
Swift exit from League Cup with a 0-3 loss against Villa, but early to middle term of Champions League went well. For some reason UEFA thought it would be swell to have two group stages in CL before quarter-finals. We won both groups with 13 points in each, only to falter before Real Madrid in QF. Real finished as champions that season.
Mikaël Silvestre and Quinton Fortune joined at the start of season, as well as Mark Bosnich (who was already at the club in early 90's) and Massimo Taibi who tried to replace the Big Dane, Peter Schmeichel. Taibi was a flop, while Bosnich stayed with the club for only a season. At the end of the season we signed yet another goalkeeper in our mission impossible - Frenchman Fabien Barthez from Monaco.
Notable departures
* haven't confirmed this yet
Player focus
David Beckham
About time we dedicate some more space to him. Just how useful he'd be these days when Valencia and Young have 1 in 15 success rate between them. Great long passer, great crosser, shame he left when he did.
We steamrolled the Premier League in this season. Finished with 18 points more than second placed Arsenal and with only three losses.
By the request of FA themselves, we didn't defend our FA Cup title, but have travelled to Brazil for inaugural FIFA Club World Championship. Finished third there with a draw against Nexaca, loss against winners Vasco de Gama and win over Australian club South Melbourne.
We did win the Intercontinental Cup game against Palmeiras 1-0 a month or so before. And *everyone* knows IC is a much bigger deal.
Swift exit from League Cup with a 0-3 loss against Villa, but early to middle term of Champions League went well. For some reason UEFA thought it would be swell to have two group stages in CL before quarter-finals. We won both groups with 13 points in each, only to falter before Real Madrid in QF. Real finished as champions that season.
Mikaël Silvestre and Quinton Fortune joined at the start of season, as well as Mark Bosnich (who was already at the club in early 90's) and Massimo Taibi who tried to replace the Big Dane, Peter Schmeichel. Taibi was a flop, while Bosnich stayed with the club for only a season. At the end of the season we signed yet another goalkeeper in our mission impossible - Frenchman Fabien Barthez from Monaco.
Notable departures
* haven't confirmed this yet
Player focus
David Beckham
About time we dedicate some more space to him. Just how useful he'd be these days when Valencia and Young have 1 in 15 success rate between them. Great long passer, great crosser, shame he left when he did.
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Becks.
I'd love to know how many goals Van Nistelrooy scored from Beckham assists.
I'd love to know how many goals Van Nistelrooy scored from Beckham assists.
Becks.
I'd love to know how many goals Van Nistelrooy scored from Beckham assists.
After I did the seasons, planned some misc tables, and most popular combinations assist->goal included.
Excellent stuff. Thank you very much for this thread.
Season 2000-01
==============2000-01==============
Third in a row, feat that happened only three times in the history of English first division. Huddersfield Town from 1924-1926, Arsenal from 1933-1935 and Liverpool in early eighties, 1982-1984. And the newest addition, Manchester United. 10 points difference at the end, grabbed 1st place in October, and we stayed there until the end. Teddy Sheringham had an excellent season which brought him PFA Players' Player of the Year and FWA Footballer of the Year.
Disappointing in domestic cups again, with only a single victory in each of them. And Chelsea took the Charity Shield.
There was a bit of struggle in first group in Champions League, but managed to go through, and lost the first place in second group stage to Valencia on goal difference. That meant Bayern in QF, and that didn't go too well, as we lost both legs.
Only notable addition was goalkeeper Fabien Barthez. Sometimes brilliant, but had his brain farts occasionally.
Notable departures
Players focus
Gary Neville
Phil Neville
Nicky Butt
Rest of the Class of '92. Great servants that helped us achieve much success. Gary and Phil are now pundits, while I believe Nicky is assisting Warren Joyce with our U21 side. I always felt Nicky was a bit underappreciated, was better than people gave him credit.
Third in a row, feat that happened only three times in the history of English first division. Huddersfield Town from 1924-1926, Arsenal from 1933-1935 and Liverpool in early eighties, 1982-1984. And the newest addition, Manchester United. 10 points difference at the end, grabbed 1st place in October, and we stayed there until the end. Teddy Sheringham had an excellent season which brought him PFA Players' Player of the Year and FWA Footballer of the Year.
Disappointing in domestic cups again, with only a single victory in each of them. And Chelsea took the Charity Shield.
There was a bit of struggle in first group in Champions League, but managed to go through, and lost the first place in second group stage to Valencia on goal difference. That meant Bayern in QF, and that didn't go too well, as we lost both legs.
Only notable addition was goalkeeper Fabien Barthez. Sometimes brilliant, but had his brain farts occasionally.
Notable departures
Players focus
Gary Neville
Phil Neville
Nicky Butt
Rest of the Class of '92. Great servants that helped us achieve much success. Gary and Phil are now pundits, while I believe Nicky is assisting Warren Joyce with our U21 side. I always felt Nicky was a bit underappreciated, was better than people gave him credit.
They're probably using an incredibly loose interpretation of assists, I have a hard time believing Beckham got 33 assists in the Premier League alone, if you go by Wiki he only even played in 31 league games in 99/00. Stuff like rebounds, getting fouled for free kicks and pens, causing a player to score an own goal etc... I think it's 50/50 whether or not you'd class those as assists, some would and others wouldn't.
Even with all of that you mentioned (fouls, rebounds, own goals), which today are officially counted as assists, Beckham was on 24 that season. I've seen some of the goals that site claimed Beckham got an assist in, and no sign of them. They could be using those hockey assists, where passer to a final passer is credited as well, but then we could add to Giggs another hundred or so more.
Season 2001-02
==============2001-02==============
All good things come to an end. Arsenal stopped us in our quest for fourth title in as many years. At the end we came third, 10 points behind the winners, and 3 behind second placed Liverpool. Sir Alex Ferguson had a change of heart, and decided to postpone retirement and stay for at least three more seasons as manager of United.
Cup runs and Charity Shield weren't something to be proud of, as we lost CS to Liverpool 1-2, first game of League Cup (3rd round) to Arsenal 0-4, and 4th round of FA Cup to Middlesbrough 0-2.
Europe run saw us all the way to semi-finals of the Champions League, where we again were eliminated after two draws, again on away goals.
Lots of new names in United. Ruud van Nistelrooy finally completed the move after we were poised to sign him last season but waited because of his injury. From Lazio we got Juan Sebastián Verón, for then record British fee of 29.1 million pounds. Also joined us Laurent Blanc, Diego Forlán and Roy Carroll.
One significant loss was Jaap Stam, who was sold shortly after the season started. The other was Teddy Sheringham who returned to Tottenham on a free transfer. During the winter, we'll lose Andy Cole as well.
Notable departures
Player focus
Ruud van Nistelrooy
Just look at that production. If he would have stayed, would he broke the records? Then again, we was 30 when he left us.
All good things come to an end. Arsenal stopped us in our quest for fourth title in as many years. At the end we came third, 10 points behind the winners, and 3 behind second placed Liverpool. Sir Alex Ferguson had a change of heart, and decided to postpone retirement and stay for at least three more seasons as manager of United.
Cup runs and Charity Shield weren't something to be proud of, as we lost CS to Liverpool 1-2, first game of League Cup (3rd round) to Arsenal 0-4, and 4th round of FA Cup to Middlesbrough 0-2.
Europe run saw us all the way to semi-finals of the Champions League, where we again were eliminated after two draws, again on away goals.
Lots of new names in United. Ruud van Nistelrooy finally completed the move after we were poised to sign him last season but waited because of his injury. From Lazio we got Juan Sebastián Verón, for then record British fee of 29.1 million pounds. Also joined us Laurent Blanc, Diego Forlán and Roy Carroll.
One significant loss was Jaap Stam, who was sold shortly after the season started. The other was Teddy Sheringham who returned to Tottenham on a free transfer. During the winter, we'll lose Andy Cole as well.
Notable departures
Player focus
Ruud van Nistelrooy
Just look at that production. If he would have stayed, would he broke the records? Then again, we was 30 when he left us.
Excellent thread @Mrs Smoker
Even with all of that you mentioned (fouls, rebounds, own goals), which today are officially counted as assists, Beckham was on 24 that season. I've seen some of the goals that site claimed Beckham got an assist in, and no sign of them. They could be using those hockey assists, where passer to a final passer is credited as well, but then we could add to Giggs another hundred or so more.
I don't think fouls, rebounds and own goals are counted as official are they? I think Giggs has 131 official premier league assists whereas you have him down for 309 in all competitions, Giggs hasn't had 178 assists outside the premier league so you'd assume at least 200 of those 309 were in the Premier League. Having said that I don't think they counted assists officially until the very late 90's so maybe that 131 figure is from since 1999 and none of his assists pre 1999 counted.
Henry had 24 league assists in 02/03 and nobody has gotten anywhere near that figure recently, the last 4/5 years all the players with the top assists in the league have been on around 11-14 so maybe they have been using a more strict definition now, it's all very confusing.
Great thread by the way.
Season 2002-03
==============2002-03==============
Back at top this season. Fantastic form in second part of the season, where we went on an unbeaten run of 18 games (21 counting three at the start of 2003-04 season), winning 15 and drawing three games made sure of the title. That was our eighth title in 11 seasons.
This time around our domestic cup runs weren't as disappointing. Round 5 in FA Cup, where we got beaten by eventual winners, Arsenal, and final of League Cup, where Liverpool prevailed.
In Europe we again safely reached QF after two group stages, but this time Real Madrid waited for us there. After 1-3 loss in Madrid, we won 4-3 at Old Trafford.
Notable addition to the squad was Rio Ferdinand, who became yet another English transfer record. Dennis Irwin, after magnificent 12 years at the club, left. And we also bid farewell to Dwight Yorke, Andy Cole (left in winter of previous season), Ronny Johnsen and Raimond van der Gouw. Oh yeah, Jesper Blomqvist left the club for Everton a month or so before Cole.
Notable departures
Players focus
Wesley Brown
Mikael Silvestre
A bit of a focus on guys who spent a lot of time with us. Great professionals with not-as-sexy stats. Interesting to see Silvestre's delivery in this and previous seasons though.
Back at top this season. Fantastic form in second part of the season, where we went on an unbeaten run of 18 games (21 counting three at the start of 2003-04 season), winning 15 and drawing three games made sure of the title. That was our eighth title in 11 seasons.
This time around our domestic cup runs weren't as disappointing. Round 5 in FA Cup, where we got beaten by eventual winners, Arsenal, and final of League Cup, where Liverpool prevailed.
In Europe we again safely reached QF after two group stages, but this time Real Madrid waited for us there. After 1-3 loss in Madrid, we won 4-3 at Old Trafford.
Notable addition to the squad was Rio Ferdinand, who became yet another English transfer record. Dennis Irwin, after magnificent 12 years at the club, left. And we also bid farewell to Dwight Yorke, Andy Cole (left in winter of previous season), Ronny Johnsen and Raimond van der Gouw. Oh yeah, Jesper Blomqvist left the club for Everton a month or so before Cole.
Notable departures
Players focus
Wesley Brown
Mikael Silvestre
A bit of a focus on guys who spent a lot of time with us. Great professionals with not-as-sexy stats. Interesting to see Silvestre's delivery in this and previous seasons though.
I believe OPTA does the stats for Premier League and also for http://fantasy.premierleague.com/. And yeah, fouls, rebounds and own goals are all counted. Basically, same as me, though with some small differences as outlined in first post.
In Premier League I have Giggs on 195 assists. That's exclusively PL, 11 in Division 1, 52 in Europe, 34 in FA Cup, 9 in League Cup, 4 in CS, 3 in Club World Cup and one (to Keane) in Intercontinental Cup. What a guy.
Not sure about 131 figure, probably is as you said from some time until today exclusively in PL.
We really did play some incredible football in 2002/03. A joy to watch.
We have a good record of strikers doing really well in their first season don't we?Yorke, Soljskaer,Van Nistelrooy and more recently Hernadez and RVP. Hopefully Falcao will be be another to add to the list.
I suspect I know where this thread is leading to. Yes it is interesting and convenient but cannot all of you guess its purpose?
Man, Rooney's so cool.
Reasons and purpose are stated in first post, how I got interested to start it in #24.
Reasons and purpose are stated in first post, how I got interested to start it in #24.
Hmmm. Well it will end up about Rooney. We have been discussing his goal stats for months. This will be a convenient reference point.
Wh
What do you think will happen when the thread reaches the end of 2012/ 13? I know you are not naïve.
It wouldn't have had you not brought it up unnecessarily
What's your point?
What do you think it will happen when the thread reaches the end of 2007/2008?
You're utterly obsessed with Rooney.
Ok we shall see.