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2024-25 Performances

View full 2024-25 profile

5.8 Season Average Rating
Appearances
32
Clean sheets
4
Goals
1
Assists
1
Yellow cards
6
The Hilton said:
Your initial disagreement involved suggesting he was a bit of consistency away from being "one of if not the best defender in the world already". That's stretching far more than any blame I assigned to him for the 4th goal.

For point 2 in this post, I think him being more comfortable further forward is accurate, as he has the pace to recover most of the time (unless he wildly overcommits, like for Lyon's 3rd), whereas his poor concentration and marking in the box on Thursday night cost us a couple of goals.

We generally agree that he's likely gonna end up brilliant, but we're doing him a disservice by glossing over shortcomings and poor performances.
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You might want to reread what I had post again. I did not say he was 'a bit of consistency away..'. It was a rhetorical point to imply that his inconsistency can be attributed to the fact he is trying to do a lot of things, which can cause concentration issues. If he was able to do those things consistently, then we wouldn't be criticising him as much because he would be a world class player, which we know he is not as of now.

I think he's shown a lot of good box defending and has decent awareness generally speaking there. Whilst he's also done well outside of it, if I had to make a more definitive generalisation, I'd go as far to say he's actually more vulnerable in open spaces defensively. He's been willing to press higher and engage outside the box, which is great to see but I'm not sure I would say he's more comfortable/effective there especially when against someone with a bit of pace or agility. That concern is less when he's in the box for me anyways, Lyon game notwithstanding. However, because it's such a short sample size and very incidental, it's hard to really say what the pattern is long term.
 
The Hilton said:
Dorgu was there for the duels though, for the first goal he was having to mark 2 players as Shaw wasn't paying attention, second one he was just beaten.

In contrast Yoro was beaten for Lyon's first and second goals, and charged out of position leaving a huge space for their 3rd.

It's just faulty logic to suggest that pointing out that Yoro was beaten by the goalscorer for two of Lyon's goals is being overly critical, yet pointing out that Dorgu was beaten in the build up to them isn't. It was a fairly poor defensive showing from them both.
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No, it’s not faulty logic. To say it is, is faulty logic. To say what you wrote in your posts about this here in this thread, is an opinion about form and degree. I haven’t said 20-year olds can’t be criticized, I just think you went over the top for this game, and you wrote alot more than what you summarize in this post.

It’s also an opinion that Dorgu’s mistakes for the goals on thursday were far bigger than Yoro’s and you don’t have to share that opinion, though I find it puzzling if you don’t. Either way, it doesn’t say anything relevant about the general quality and development of either player, as it’s just one match.
 
Man Utd 0:1 Wolves New
criticalanalysis said:
You might want to reread what I had post again. I did not say he was 'a bit of consistency away..'. It was a rhetorical point to imply that his inconsistency can be attributed to the fact he is trying to do a lot of things, which can cause concentration issues. If he was able to do those things consistently, then we wouldn't be criticising him as much because he would be a world class player, which we know he is not as of now.

I think he's shown a lot of good box defending and has decent awareness generally speaking there. Whilst he's also done well outside of it, if I had to make a more definitive generalisation, I'd go as far to say he's actually more vulnerable in open spaces defensively. He's been willing to press higher and engage outside the box, which is great to see but I'm not sure I would say he's more comfortable/effective there especially when against someone with a bit of pace or agility. That concern is less when he's in the box for me anyways, Lyon game notwithstanding. However, because it's such a short sample size and very incidental, it's hard to really say what the pattern is long term.
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To avoid this continuing to go around in circles, I'm happy to park this, it looks like we generally seem to agree about his potential, but disagree with how bad his performance was against Lyon and how far he has to go to fulfil that potential.
 
Grande said:
No, it’s not faulty logic. To say it is, is faulty logic. To say what you wrote in your posts about this here in this thread, is an opinion about form and degree. I haven’t said 20-year olds can’t be criticized, I just think you went over the top for this game, and you wrote alot more than what you summarize in this post.

It’s also an opinion that Dorgu’s mistakes for the goals on thursday were far bigger than Yoro’s and you don’t have to share that opinion, though I find it puzzling if you don’t. Either way, it doesn’t say anything relevant about the general quality and development of either player, as it’s just one match.
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We clearly aren't going to agree on this. You find my apportioning of criticism puzzling, whereas I find yours to be textbook bias in favour of a player you like more.

We won't get any more out of this debate, so let's hope he fulfills the great potential we both seem to agree he has, and that it'll be a while until we need to talk about our defenders conceding 4 goals in less than a half of football again.
 
He was backing off in a few instances. The caf will eat him alive for that type of defending.
 
Athletic Club 0:3 Man Utd New
He's so good. What was the yellow for? Thought he and Bruno were the second best performers tonight after Casemiro.
 
He genuinely looks quality. Of course he will make some mistakes at times at his age but honestly looks so good already at this age and you can see why Madrid wanted him. Serious potential.
 
Still makes mistakes on his decision making sometimes but thats to be expected. Has had a cracking month on two recently. Looking like the player we hoped we had bought.
 
One of those players who it appears that time slows just a little bit for them. Bruno has a little bit of the same. He’s pressed, but somehow he has found a gap or does a shimmy to create space for himself and advances forward. Already very good. Can be truly elite
 
Wonder what the people who were saying he’d never make it at the start of the season are. Clear as day he’s going to become a quality player.
 
I thought he showed a lot of responsibility on the ball in that difficult start to the game when those around him were failing to keep their heads.

Really promising character and ability.
 
He’s showing a lot of composure for such a young defender. I thought Maz, Lindelof and Dorgu were shaky before the first goal but he always looks so good at bringing the ball out from the back.
 
He's such a smooth mover and full of class. Can't wait to see him back in RCB and have Martinez or Heaven in LCB, which would free up Mazraoui to appear more often at RWB. I think his passing from his right foot is much more effective as RCB, but I'm glad he's developing well to slot in at LCB too.
 
Started slow, was caught ball watching for the early headed chance that Williams fortunately missed.

Grew into things and looked very comfortable once we'd settled down.
 
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