Juan Mata image 8

Juan Mata Spain flag

2018-19 Performances

View full 2018-19 profile

5.3 Season Average Rating
Appearances
32
Goals
6
Assists
3
Yellow cards
3
Status
Not open for further replies.
Andycoleno9 said:
When he plays, we play football. Why he doesn't play more, is 1,000,000$ question.
Click to expand...

Caus he gets crowded out too easily. Especially away from home.

Don't get me wrong, I agree with your assessment about him and against teams like Fulham at home he's great, but we've gone through this cycle with Mata at least 30 or 40 times now and it always ends up with people going 'oh, yeah, that's why he isn't picked away from home'.
 
NinjaFletch said:
Caus he gets crowded out too easily. Especially away from home.

Don't get me wrong, I agree with your assessment about him and against teams like Fulham at home he's great, but we've gone through this cycle with Mata at least 30 or 40 times now and it always ends up with people going 'oh, yeah, that's why he isn't picked away from home'.
Click to expand...

It's amazing our best away performance post-ferguson is named after him in that case.

Frankly I see this as a theme on here. He's stupidly underrated.
 
Dalot & Mata could work in games where we're going to have a lot of the ball.

He was excellent today. One of our more reliable attackers who instantly changes the style of play of the entire team.

Good goal and a nice cutback for the Lukaku tapin. We need more crosses from the halfspaces. City, Pool, Arsenal do it all the time. Today, Mata & Dalot demonstrated that. Death to corner flag crosses :lol: !!
 
Minimalist said:
It's amazing our best away performance post-ferguson is named after him in that case.
Click to expand...

Well yes, fantastic, your case study is one game.

I like Mata a lot and think he adds a lot to the team when he's playing well, so it is a shame he's never been able to produce consistent performances in tighter away games. But, whether we like it or not, that has been the reality of his time. Hell, if you don't believe me just flick through the threadmarks in this thread alone.
 
NinjaFletch said:
Well yes, fantastic, your case study is one game.

I like Mata a lot and think he adds a lot to the team when he's playing well, so it is a shame he's never been able to produce consistent performances in tighter away games. But, whether we like it or not, that has been the reality of his time. Hell, if you don't believe me just flick through the threadmarks in this thread alone.
Click to expand...

Well it's an argument and despite n=1, a pretty strong example. You just waved your hands about and suggested he's poor in all away games without one example or how he's any worse than our other attackers in that regard. :lol:

I do find it very hard to believe he's any worse than Lingard/Rashford/whoever in that aspect in tight away games but whatever. And for every example you could provide of other players 'doing the business' in tight away games, I'm sure we can find Mata providing some value.
 
Another good game Juan. Will be nice to see the blog back on Monday. Fully expect Mata to not be selected next game now. That is the mindset of our manager unfortuanetely.
 
When Mata is not on the pitch, we don’t play the football everyone keeps raving about. It’s as simple as that.
 
Minimalist said:
It's amazing our best away performance post-ferguson is named after him in that case.

Frankly I see this as a theme on here. He's stupidly underrated.
Click to expand...

Mata was playing in the final third in that game. Its pretty established that Mata's best position is playing in the final third, not as a genuine midfielder. His best season at Chelsea was him being in the final third all the time making runs off the last shoulder and feeding the striker.

To be honest, I see him as a player similar to Griezmann, but not as good though.
 
Minimalist said:
Well it's an argument. You just waved your hands about and suggested he's poor in all away games without one example or how he's any worse than our other attackers in that regard. :lol:

I do find it very hard to believe he's any worse than Lingard/Rashford/whoever in that aspect in tight away games but whatever. And for every example you could provide of other players 'doing the business' in tight away games, I'm sure we can find Mata providing some value.
Click to expand...

I mean, if that's genuinely what you thought I said I can see your confusion, but you'd do well to go back and read what I did say before getting yourself in a tizz.

I get it though, you're a Mata fan, but it's a huge stretch to try and argue there isn't a pattern between the sorts of games he plays well in and the sorts of games he doesn't. Of course there are outliers (I never suggested otherwise), but they are just those: outliers.
 
I do feel people are forgetting that he was decidedly poor almost all of 2018 up until the last month or so. Now it's great that he is starting to come back into form again and it's definitely helping the team, but it's certainly understandable that he wasn't necessarily playing all the time.
 
NinjaFletch said:
I mean, if that's genuinely what you thought I said I can see your confusion, but you'd do well to go back and read what I did say before getting yourself in a tizz.

I get it though, you're a Mata fan, but it's a huge stretch to try and argue there isn't a pattern between the sorts of games he plays well in and the sorts of games he doesn't. Of course there are outliers (I never suggested otherwise), but they are just those: outliers.
Click to expand...

Fair enough.

Guess I just notice a lot of unfair criticism towards players like Mata on this board. I think frankly, there's a real bias against players who are not known for being 'quick' or are not 'tall/strong/fast/athletic'. You seen it when Blind was playing for us too, despite rarely struggling against big strikers that weren't meant to destroy him, people were just waiting to criticise him.

Posters will bang on about how much we need good footballers. Juan Mata is a good footballer - especially in this squad.
 
Minimalist said:
Fair enough.

Guess I just notice a lot of unfair criticism towards players like Mata on this board. I think frankly, there's a real bias against players who are not known for being 'quick' or are not 'tall/strong/fast/athletic'. You seen it when Blind was playing for us too, despite rarely struggling against big strikers that weren't meant to destroy him, people were just waiting to criticise him.

Posters will bang on about how much we need good footballers. Juan Mata is a good footballer - especially in this squad.
Click to expand...

I generally agree – particularly in regards to Blind – but I do think it's a reasonable enough criticism of Mata. If he had a touch more agility and a slightly better burst of acceleration it would make a huge difference in finding that extra yard of space in the games where he does struggle and turn him from a good player into a great one.
 
MadDogg said:
I do feel people are forgetting that he was decidedly poor almost all of 2018 up until the last month or so.
Click to expand...
No he wasn't.

And certainly no more than many others.
 
When we are going to have most of the ball it makes sense to have him on the pitch. Helps that the RB was actually threatening unlike Valencia...
 
Only player in our team who knows how to make a good run behind the defence, what space to occupy and how to make the right movement. He will make a fantastic coach when the time comes.

In the meanwhile, player the little fella more, will you?
 
MadDogg said:
I do feel people are forgetting that he was decidedly poor almost all of 2018 up until the last month or so. Now it's great that he is starting to come back into form again and it's definitely helping the team, but it's certainly understandable that he wasn't necessarily playing all the time.
Click to expand...

No, he wasn’t. I think he’s been the most reliable player during the post-Fergie era. He just needs some creativity and runners around him. Even today, three or four times, he was looking hopelessly for some runs up front. He needs some clever players around him, unfortunately, we don’t have many.
 
Does well in these types of games. Sad that he can't provide consistency in performances because we badly need a player of his ilk in other games as well, where as Mata just isn't reliable anymore.
 
Mata is reliable most of the time but when the team has an off game, it always appears to be his fault as far as some are concerned - too slow, blah blah. Well slow is better than static, like Lukaku and Matic. (Static Matic - see what I did there?)
 
I think Mata unfairly gets dropped against bigger sides... Especially as often, when he actually gets to play in those games, he does quite well.

This season for example, he's only started for us in the Chelsea game, where he played really well and is the only game vs a big 6 side that we should have won.
 
It's really a moot point if Mata is good enough for us right now, because clearly he is. We're 8th though. He wasn't good enough last season when we really needed him to contribute with goals and assists. He just isn't consistent enough at such a high level that he should expect to be more than a squad-player, and I don't think that is due to our managers not playing him enough. He has clearly had chances, and not had much competition here and still hasn't proved himself as a reliable first-choice, imo. He didn't fit in under LVG and Mourinho because of tactics too, but I don't think even Pep would play him as a first choice if I'm honest.
 
Mata, when you play against quicker teams who attack us is a liability. He has vision and the pockets of space but in this United team he is also needed to defend and also keep possession too. He is too slow and also he get tackled and loses the ball often.
Now in a game like this where the other team stays back and let us have the ball he is very useful. Today he had a very good game. To me he was our best player. But Mata also needs other players to see his movement and pass it to him.
Today when Rashford cut it back to him he scored. Many times the passes would not come to him when he makes his moves.
 
MikeKing said:
It's really a moot point if Mata is good enough for us right now, because clearly he is. We're 8th though. He wasn't good enough last season when we really needed him to contribute with goals and assists. He just isn't consistent enough at such a high level that he should expect to be more than a squad-player, and I don't think that is due to our managers not playing him enough. He has clearly had chances, and not had much competition here and still hasn't proved himself as a reliable first-choice, imo. He didn't fit in under LVG and Mourinho because of tactics too, but I don't think even Pep would play him as a first choice if I'm honest.
Click to expand...

We finished second last year, our best since Fergie. He contributed to that as much as others, more than some. Are you suggesting that no-one else in the team was responsible for us not winning the league?
 
Mata played well today in central areas, which is where he should be. I wish we would just play him there and sign a proper winger to play on the right.
 
Livvie said:
We finished second last year, our best since Fergie. He contributed to that as much as others, more than some. Are you suggesting that no-one else in the team was responsible for us not winning the league?
Click to expand...

Mata contributed 3 goals and 7 assists in 40 appearances last season. Across all competitions he contributed a goal or assist every 267 minutes and only contributed two assists after Christmas. He ended the season with most on here thinking replacing him in the first team was our upmost priority in the window. No, he's not a 'right winger' (although he never actually plays as one in reality) and yes he badly needed an overlapping fullback to help him out, but suggesting that Mata was integral to our 'success' last season is revisionist in the extreme. It was, in fact, by virtually every measurable metric his worst season at the club.
 
NinjaFletch said:
Mata contributed 3 goals and 7 assists in 40 appearances last season. Across all competitions he contributed a goal or assist every 267 minutes and only contributed two assists after Christmas. He ended the season with most on here thinking replacing him in the first team was our upmost priority in the window. No, he's not a 'right winger' (although he never actually plays as one in reality) and yes he badly needed an overlapping fullback to help him out, but suggesting that Mata was integral to our 'success' last season is revisionist in the extreme. It was, in fact, by virtually every measurable metric his worst season at the club.
Click to expand...
Yes. Thanks for the stats, I was about to look it up so thanks.
 
The type of manager I'd want at the club would, on arriving, immediately make Mata a near certain starter. Not because he's particularly amazing but because he is an actual, natural footballer.

That manager would then sign better players to replace him in that role.
 
With a right back, who is very good going forward such as Dalot today, it allows Mata to drift inside, where he can influence the game from the middle. He did that today. Got on the ball and kept it flowing. Took his goal very well. Typical Mata finish.
 
Not necessarily. Today he was our best player for me. But a lot of games he has been poor.
 
Minimalist said:
:lol: Not one comment so far. Tells you something.

Either him or Dalot were MOTM for me. Different level compared to the other attackers for passing, touch and movement. Should be playing more.
Click to expand...

That's because he was fantastic. This thread is basically an argument between a handful of people who value his contributions vs people who value Speed/Strength over footballing ability.
Its amazing how we ask for good football all the time and we ask him to be replaced
 
anant said:
That's because he was fantastic. This thread is basically an argument between a handful of people who value his contributions vs people who value Speed/Strength over footballing ability.
Its amazing how we ask for good football all the time and we ask him to be replaced
Click to expand...

No he gets criticised most of the time, because he was poor. If he gets tackled and lose possession or if he fails to get the ball when it is 60/40 in favour of him or when the player he is supposed to be marking sprints away from him all the time and put others under pressure then he is not doing his job too.
He gets the same way Fellaini gets slated. It is not the physical aspect but his lack of pace and lack of strength. Today with a team who is always sitting back and giving us time and space he will be good. If other team is attacking us and not giving us space and pressing us always, Mata will become a liability.
 
anant said:
This thread is basically an argument between a handful of people who value his contributions vs people who value Speed/Strength over footballing ability.
Click to expand...
I was wondering why the vibe was so weird, I guess this explains it. Pretty stupid though, as it obviously is possible to value both things, they aren't mutually exclusive. When Mata is played as a wide midfielder his movement is more restricted and his lack of pace and strength means he struggles to put his mark on the game, and he is also often slowing us down by dwelling on the ball out wide as he can't beat his man against a good organised defence. I don't think he has it in him to to back up a free-role in the middle with necessary goal-points. He used to score goals like he did against Fulham a lot more often before, put he has missed a lot of chances like that last few years. I don't think Mata doesn't deserve praise for his class on the ball and class as a person too, even the odd fantastic performance and many decent ones, but looking at him like some potential saviour in 2018 is pretty gullible.
 
We keep the ball better when hes on too. Forget his size and all, he keeps the ball so well under pressure and keeps it going.

He should start big games for us.
 
NinjaFletch said:
Well yes, fantastic, your case study is one game.

I like Mata a lot and think he adds a lot to the team when he's playing well, so it is a shame he's never been able to produce consistent performances in tighter away games. But, whether we like it or not, that has been the reality of his time. Hell, if you don't believe me just flick through the threadmarks in this thread alone.
Click to expand...
He was great away to Chelsea this very season. I’m not sure who it is that consistently adds more to our away performances than Mata.
 
acnumber9 said:
He was great away to Chelsea this very season. I’m not sure who it is that consistently adds more to our away performances than Mata.
Click to expand...

Yes, and he was either anonymous or worse against Bournemouth, West Ham and Brighton away. As I said, no one has argued he's never played well away from home, but if you're arguing there hasn't been a pattern to the games that he's struggled in then you're barking.
 
NinjaFletch said:
Yes, and he was either anonymous or worse against Bournemouth, West Ham and Brighton away. As I said, no one has argued he's never played well away from home, but if you're arguing there hasn't been a pattern to the games that he's struggled in then you're barking.
Click to expand...
But who was so good in those games that it makes sense to play them ahead of him? Nobody is trying to say he’s perfect for every game. Just that he’s comfortably the best we have for that position and it doesn’t make much sense not to play him.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.