Not Eriksen? I heard he stopped trying in his last 2 years.
Jose Mourinho | Spurs manager
- Thread starter roonster09
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I don't think Eriksen was an ego as such, he wanted a move and got it, worked out well for him
.i am not talking about Fergie/ Wenger type reigns of 20/30 years. I very clearly said 4-6 years, the sort of time Klopp and Pep are likely to do at Liverpool and City. That’s in no way in a comparison to Fergie and Eenger.
you will soon see the Jose cycle and join United and Chelsea fans. I hold nothing against him, we got pretty much what we should have expected from him. I doubt any manager in the history of football had spent as much money pro-rata as Jose during his time at United - he was backed. As I said, his effect starts to wane quickly after a couple of years.
Man I hated Jose! Hated him, but he is a very infectious character and to be honest the way he has dealt with the Likes of Dele and Ndombele I admire, I am well aware of an implosion, I didnt want him at Spurs, but we simply have to go with it, and thus far, its working. Will I be with you in a season or 2, I have no idea.
I dont think he can handle not winning, and it really doesnt work out with players unless they fully buy in.
First year and a half he was good at United (first season we were actually good but didnt get results we deserved. Plus 2 cups)
As soon as Pogba fluttered his eyelashes at City half way through the second season, he fell out with Mourinho and it started going downhill. Then he spat the dummy the next summer and the dressing room fell apart.
Spurs will be v happy with top 4 and a cup. He wont be. This season they look good but he hasnt spent much and no doubt next summer if Levy wont invest to strengthen again things could start to get messy
Ignoring the fact that he is Chelsea longest manager in charge and Madrid second longest during all the years because they just sacked everyone and their mother anyway ? 3rd season meltdown is another media tag to him, they never do it to other manager despite the fact that the likes Conte or Sarri are literally second season meltdown and so many bayern or madrid manager don't even last a season with . Spurs isn't as big as club which means less pressure from the board and fans to deliver , less pressure from the media , the main players such as Kane and Son are humble and professional, no one with inflated ego in to class with him on dressing room and Levy literally idolize him, he gave Poch a total around 500m and 5 years despite winning nothing so why he couldn't give more for Mourinho ? On top of that ,he and his family lives in London. Spurs is the perfect fit for him , a middle level club with plenty of top quality players unlike at United , a big club full of players whose only their ego match the club size. I don't see why he would turn toxic at Spurs, even if he left it would be on his term just like at Porto or Inter.
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Do you even know what you are talking about? When you went through a rough period last season he WAS already toxic on multiple occasions and that was just a prelude to whats about to happen if things start going really bad.
I'm waiting for the José implosion as much as the next guy but how was he toxic on occasion last season?
That's not true. I (and many others) always liked and respected Mourinho. I still do. I like what he represents in football as a counterweight to the sanctimony of Cruyff, Valdano, Pep and co. I don't agree with this crap that playing defensively is a coward's way of playing football. The fact that he's actually a great manager and beat Pep's Barca that way is even better. But the fact is that he failed miserably at United after the first year (and he disgraced himself with his conduct towards his players and the club's history) I'm going to paste what I wrote a few months ago again and link it to the full post (Post 1653):
£30m Bailly
£27m Mikhitaryan
£89m Pogba
£75m (rising to £90m) Lukaku
£31m Lindelof (As a pundit he went on TV and slagged him off saying he can't head the ball)
£40m Matic
£19m Dalot
£50m Fred
£1.5m Grant
and untold millions spent on Zlatan and Sanchez
That's not counting turning up in a hoodie to the Munich memorial, questioning Martial's decision to be with his newborn, Luke Shaw's mid game brain transplant and of course 'football heritage'.
In his first year at Spurs he slagged off Ndombele (a guy who doesn't even speak the language) in public , refused to play Parrot under any circumstance, his team leaked goals - a product of his tactics. Fair enough he seems to have turned things around now and I will be happy to credit him if Spurs do well come May/June.
All those transfers are speculation wether they were his choice or the recruitment's team (or Ed's). He must have had some confidentiality clause because I've never heard him talk negatively about his former players, especially this lot that undermined his work. LVG's has said many times however, that Ed never gave him the players he requested so it's not too farfetched to believe the trend continued. It was painfully obvious that he wasn't backed when the team was in dire need for defensive upgrades.
Regarding the other issues it's all very subjective and, personally, difficult to comprehend. I've learned long ago to take everything said on the news with a pinch of salt. What seems to me is that many United fans were too self-entitled to accept their level at the time was no higher than a club like Sevilha (who won 3 Uefa league's in a row). Who cares how a foreign manager expresses this or that? I'm not waiting for the manager of my club to say nice things of the club he's working for in every press conference.
I trust my eyes more than I trust the press. It was clear as water some players were playing bad on purpose. Losing balls (Pogba), leaving defensive black holes (Shaw), not pressing or trying hard (Martial). You need just one bad apple to spoil the barrel.
Mourinho is very good at getting the most out of a team. But he is not good at building a team. That is why he was awful for us and perfect for Spurs.
I agree he managed the team as well as he possibly could, kicked the players that needed a kick and got on with it.
I really disagree with this.
In Leiria he got many players together and reached 4th in the league, the club's best position, while doing things such as winning away in Benfica 0-2.
Porto was in a really bad place when he came mid season, he scrapped to reach 3rd place to get Europa League. He basically bought half the Leiria team (Porto could do that) and together with other players he mounted that amazing Porto team that won the UEFA Cup and, incredibly, the Champions League. That was the last time a club outside the top4 countries won the competition as the monetary difference keeps spiralling out of control.
He went to Chelsea that had a good run before with Ranieri, he of course had almost unlimited funds but he bought well and joined together players that would be successful for the club for 10 years.
I think Abramovic fired him because he thought with that super team anyone would win - and as it could be seen it wasn't that simple. And his team in that year reached the final with Grant just somehow being there.
In Inter he was the telegraphed champion of Italy but they were underdogs in Europe, he sold his best player (Ibrahimovic) in order to have enough money to buy all the players for positions he needed. The players here were experienced and not thinking about the future but leaving the club with the only squad in history that won the treble in Italy (including beating super Barça) is nowhere near bad.
He then went to Real that were minnows vs that super Barça and in Europe too (7 years eliminated in a row in the round of 16!).
The team already had great players like Ronaldo but it was just not able to stop being eliminated by Barça, like he was in the first game.
He was able to get more players to this and turned the tables vs Barça, so that in the end of his run Barça was unable to beat Real directly, while he got to 3 semis in the CL in a row, losing in the second year to penalties.
In this 3rd year things went bad, we will need more years to know what really happened, but it seems some players reached the limit with him, most likely Ramos and Casillas as we have heard/seen, but why exactly this fallout happened I don't know.
Still Real Madrid was left in a much much better position than when he came, winning the copa del rey 18 years later (this one was more of a token victory vs that super Barça), then winning the spanish league with the points and goals record (even above super Barça), and he did this while spending less in his 3 years combined than the year before him or the year after alone.
He came to Chelsea that was a top 4 team at the moment and in the first year he finished 3rd in the league and the semis in the CL, having won all 4 games vs the team above him in the league. And his strikers were an almost retired Etoo, Ba and post-liverpool Torres. In the second here he got 2 or 3 key players and won the league.
Again in his 3rd year right at the beginning things went super sour, with that Eva affair, and even later after the court case closed Mou still didn't want to apologise to her. Was he a super twat simply? Was there something else related or not to her? Again it will be very interesting to check in 10 or 20 years what really happened. Things went bad and he was fired, months after being champion.
Then he went to Man Utd, that was in a dire situation. I think Mou thought Man Utd had a solid football structure in place and imho he got shocked that there wasn't none. He scrapped to win trophies with that team (no, Lingard shouldn't play more, Redcafe ffs) and even reached 2nd in his second year, but the team wasn't good enough. DId he want the players he bought? I don't know. But I think he was very unhappy how the club was run in the inside and basically got bitter over his frustration. The team slightly improved imho but not enough, so that it keeps being a team fighting for a top 4 place just like recently.
Ok I wrote more than I wanted, but basically what I mean is that in all his runs the club was better than when he left - with the momentary (not global) exception of his second Chelsea stint and Man Utd.
Heh, well, I think he did a good job getting much out of the squad of Chelsea, Inter and Real Madrid. But build well in either case considering the resources he had? Nah, dont think so.
Similar at Spurs now. He has done a good job building on what Poch left. But not much more. If he leaves after next season, it will still be the team Poch built.
(And remember, Mourinho wanted to be manager, not coach, and did not like the idea of a sporting director.)
I feel that he was always on a losing wicket at United. From the beginning too. His style of play is entirely different to what SAF played. Spurs may score goals and so did Real but the style was counter attacking. Jose will defend and only attack when he gets the chance. I would say if United had sold Pogba and given Jose Maguire we could have won or be challenging for the PL.
Look at Kane. He has bought into the Jose thinking. He doesn't showboat but drops deep and creates chances. I am surprised at some players he bought or Ed got for him though. Players like Mikhi, Lindelof are not Jose type of players. Neither was Sanchez.
He was and is toxic and that is his way.
Look at Kane. He has bought into the Jose thinking. He doesn't showboat but drops deep and creates chances. I am surprised at some players he bought or Ed got for him though. Players like Mikhi, Lindelof are not Jose type of players. Neither was Sanchez.
He was and is toxic and that is his way.
You have to be toxic when you are losing mate. If you are losing and you smiles then that's a huge problem which is why Ole Gunnar Solskjaer remains trophyless just look at him grinning from ear to ear when losing. The difference was at Spurs , he can be toxic & get backed instead of getting sacked. Levy agreed with him and brought 7 new players in the summer. This attitude is also good for players so they know they would face a toxic manager whenever they lost. At United your club cares more about PR , reputation and image , De Gea lost his captaincy just because he can't be positive in handling defeat ,at United a manager should never call out players publicly because those players have their own fanbase who would stop supporting the manager if they did it .I don't think Sir Alex could remain positive when losing , his face would turn purple , sometimes he didn't want to be interviewed , Roy Keane would have threw a tantrum at dressing room whenever they lost. This is why Sir Alex , Roy Keane and Jose Mourinho are winners , while you have bunch of loser right now who went crying to the media and to their agent when they got scolded or publicly criticize by their manager and that was a toxic environment to me.
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Sir Alex played counter attacking football
I will put Wayne Rooney quote to prove it
Sir Alex is just as pragmatic as Mourinho, he puts Park Ji Sung to mark Pirlo, puts Jones to mark Fellaini after seeing him destroy his team 2x ( that 4-4 draw and 0-1 lost ) , Sir Alex adapt his tactic based on opponent strength , either this or spamming crosses from the wing because he has such a great wingers and fullback, had Scholes to pull perfect hollywood passes all the time feeding wingers. He used to only have around 30% possession against Arsenal or City and pounce them by counter attack. I think people who said Sir Alex played attacking football only watch his team through Youtube highlights and people who said Jose Mourinho is defensive manager also only read the media ignoring the fact that all his successful team scored shitloads of goals as well.
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What nonsense. Obviously you have not watched United. Yes SAF can play defensive football but he always wants to attack. The fact United can break out is not taking it away from the front foot he wants to play.
The fact we lost one of our most important matches because he didn't want to play defensive football. Quoting Wayne Rooney here.
Attacking football according to Sir Alex isn't possession football ala Pep which is what people keep thinking about him. If any how Sir Alex set his team is much closer to Mourinho rather than Pep. I still remember your match against Arsenal at UCL , Sir Alex parked both home and away with only around 30% possession each , 30% against Barca and City and so on , you can look at the match vs Mourinho's Real Madrid , you would have swore Sir Alex manage Madrid and Mourinho manage United if you only look at the match stats.
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I think what made Fergie so special was he could set up a team in multiple ways to get the very best out of every single player, whether that be Butt or O'Shea or Beckham or Ronaldo. He set up his team to win, plain and simple, weather that be expansive attacking football or a physical grind, the goal was too win. To many managers now are quite inflexible when it comes to a style of play.
Classic
This is just not true. We could mix it up and solely counter if needed but most Fergie sides were able to take attacking initiative in a game and overwhelm the opposition, scoring many goals in the process. "Throwing the kitchen sink"
There is a reason why United fans hated Jose in United.
Seriously saying Fergie was defensive or closer to Jose is hilarious.
Spurs are obviously playing well, as per their limitations, but lets not talk nonsense to evaluate Jose.
He is fantastic manager, and I happy he is doing well in Spurs. But no Fergie 's philosophy was never like Jose.
Seriously saying Fergie was defensive or closer to Jose is hilarious.
Spurs are obviously playing well, as per their limitations, but lets not talk nonsense to evaluate Jose.
He is fantastic manager, and I happy he is doing well in Spurs. But no Fergie 's philosophy was never like Jose.
You don’t know what you are talking about. Possession doesn’t matter in here and shouldn’t be included in discussion. I have watched Ole, Sir Alex & Mourinho week in week out.
Sir Alex & Ole had one in common, when they have less possession, they will still try to score, they will still create chances and have lot shots. Their instinct is to score.
Mourinho on the other hand is pure defensive. He ain’t try to score, he ain’t try to launch quick counter, you will often see Mourinho‘s team when they have less possession, his team rarely have shots. Mourinho plays for a draw and less risk, opposite of Sir Alex.
Wants evidence? Here Ole vs PSG, Chelsea & City
This is Mourinho vs city & Chelsea:
It was only a joke. I agree with some of his points, not all really.
Err what. City weren’t a ball hogging possession team when Sir Alex was around. There was never a game between Fergie and Mancini which ended with city having 70% or anything near it possession wise. That semi final against Arsenal we had 42% possession. Stop making things up.Chelsea or Liverpool will win the League. If it was 5/10 years ago playing like this in the big games I would say they had a good chance to win, this days there’s more quality around.
I am not one of those who thinks there’s only one right way to play, for every Bielsa there’s one Mourinho.
Do I like to watch? No, reason why I didn’t followed the game and already knew the script before it started.
With this I don’t make critics to Spurs fans who want to win titles. It’s legitimate to win even if this days is more difficult for defensive type of teams to win domestic leagues, maybe they are more suited to win cups, let’s see.
I am not one of those who thinks there’s only one right way to play, for every Bielsa there’s one Mourinho.
Do I like to watch? No, reason why I didn’t followed the game and already knew the script before it started.
With this I don’t make critics to Spurs fans who want to win titles. It’s legitimate to win even if this days is more difficult for defensive type of teams to win domestic leagues, maybe they are more suited to win cups, let’s see.
There's a difference between a defensive team and a counter-attacking team. The latter hope to concede zero and nick a goal mainly from set-plays or long balls lumped up top. The latter also hope to concede zero, but aim to mainly score from fast-paced and slick counter-attacks.
Moreover, the current Spurs team can - and do - play attacking football when the circumstances suggest this is the way to go - i.e. against teams that sit deep or teams that try to go toe-to-toe but don't have the players to pull this off.
Thought his post match interview was pretty good actually, in previous years Spurs would be high fiving at getting a point at Chelsea but to win the league you need slightly different mentality and win at likes of Chelsea as Man. City and Liverpool have done in recent seasons. He is trying to change that mindset step by step so I expect Spurs to win league cup and have a really good go at europa.
Interested what the Spurs fans think of the continual Dele Ali deep storage situation. He apparently played o.k in europa but didn't even make the bench today so been exiled from premier league action for about 3 months now. I did expect him to be back by now as another alternative option off the bench at least.
Interested what the Spurs fans think of the continual Dele Ali deep storage situation. He apparently played o.k in europa but didn't even make the bench today so been exiled from premier league action for about 3 months now. I did expect him to be back by now as another alternative option off the bench at least.
About time IMO, he did play well in Europe, but you have to look at the opposition. Dele has had a free pass for nearly 3 seasons, this is exactly what he needs, if he doesn't like it I wont be bothered 1 bit if he's sold.
christ, did he really do that?
I dont think anyone can argue about Jose's tactics being effective, look at the trophies he has won. But can you get away with playing like that at the biggest clubs in the world? The likes of RM, Man Utd? Not really, the fans demand more, they dont want to see their team defending their penalty area with a back 6. At Spurs however you can get away with it, especially if it brings them trophies.
Jose would be loving getting 4 points off City and Chelsea, with Arsenal next up who have been in poor form.
Jose would be loving getting 4 points off City and Chelsea, with Arsenal next up who have been in poor form.
For me I cant stand Mourinho's personality (the one he clearly shows to the media) and ego neither his tactics.
However, literally every team in the PL looks inconsistent this year due to the schedule, the fan limit and so many different things that Jose Mourinho's basic tumescent football has really simplified Spurs in a good way. They look campy like the draw I saw today - any other season that would have been a loss maybe against a club that is starting to look like a PL title challenger.
That Mourinho 2nd season he does so well in happens to have fallen at a time when everyone cant find consistentcy or is struggling with fatigue or Injury - or atleast complaining about there struggles this season early on.
I really wont rule Jose out of it but I really hope I'm wrong.
I'd imagine they prefer it to being thrashed 1 - 6 at home.
Meh, happened before.
He keeps bringing it up, because it's literally the only thing of note Spurs have done in decades. Reminds me of that Liverpool 4-1 win at old trafford in 2009, where they kept gloating about it for years despite not winning the league.
Yes.
"But in many other respects, he was such a bad fit for United. Mourinho, as we all know, is a stubborn character. If he wants something done, he will do it his way, with little thought given to the opinions of others.
When Mourinho turned up to the 60th anniversary memorial of the Munich air disaster wearing dark trainers with a garish white trim on them, and a hoodie under his club suit, some senior figures were appalled. Nobody had the gumption to tell him to put on a pair of smart shoes and ditch the hoodie, though. This was Mourinho. He did what he wanted. When he wanted his son, José Mario Mourinho Jr, to sit with him on the bench for the match against Swansea City in April, he made it happen, even though it bemused long-serving members of staff. “What is he doing here?” one asked."
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/jos-mourinho-the-inside-story-of-how-it-fell-apart-cpcplt6wp
Ugh. That's really poor form.
Really don't see Chelsea winning it. They have a lot of talent but they're not a great team.