Jose Mourinho needs two more transfer windows, say senior Man Utd figures

[Attila]

Moratti and the board always had their say in transfers.

Mourinho did go there with a huge reputation and Moratti was desperate for the CL. I would not be surprised if him and the board took the backseat when Mou arrived there

 

[RORY65]

All of his transfers have been a success so far for us. Don't see why we need a DOF....having another guy making transfers would probably cause conflict with the way Mourinho is

Did he have one at Inter? His signings were really good there as well

Because part of our problem is that our squad is a weird mish-mash of Ferguson, Moyes, Van Gaal and Mourinho players. The way that Moyes wanted to play is completely different to Van Gaal which is completely different to Mourinho. It may help Mourinho to have someone with actual knowledge about football above him to assist in recruitment and other areas that could help the team, obviously with the manager retaining a key role within that but giving him more time to focus on his work with the players.

It would also help in case it doesn't work out with Mourinho (or even if it does but he leaves after 3 years like usual) in that there would be a clearer plan of what manager fits the type of team we want to be going forward, rather than lurching again to the complete opposite type of manager who would want a completely different type of squad.

 

[Hugh Jass]

Mate why wouldn't DoF and manager work together on buying and selling players instead of just DoF making decisions alone?

Ever read Animal Farm? What happens if they have a disagreement?

 

[Chesterlestreet]

Well, the amount itself (as cited) ain't that horrific, given the nature of the thing. We lost Fergie, a figure even our slower fans now realize was - sort of - crucial to what was going on, the whole «3rd in the league is as bad as it gets» reality we enjoyed. So, beyond that - we had to spend big, beefing up the sheer quality of the playing staff. Had to happen.

Clear as day, really. And everyone and his granny knows we pay more than anyone else. We're loaded and desperate, as it were. Literally that, actually.

 

[Hugh Jass]

Because part of our problem is that our squad is a weird mish-mash of Ferguson, Moyes, Van Gaal and Mourinho players. The way that Moyes wanted to play is completely different to Van Gaal which is completely different to Mourinho. It may help Mourinho to have someone with actual knowledge about football above him to assist in recruitment and other areas that could help the team, obviously with the manager retaining a key role within that but giving him more time to focus on his work with the players.

It would also help in case it doesn't work out with Mourinho (or even if it does but he leaves after 3 years like usual) in that there would be a clearer plan of what manager fits the type of team we want to be going forward, rather than lurching again to the complete opposite type of manager who would want a completely different type of squad.

So you are implying Mourinho, despite all that he has won, doesnt have knowledge of football.

If we had appointed a DoF when ferguson was manager, ferguson would have quit and we wouldnt have had near the success we had.

If i owned a company, i would hire one senior manager to control aspects of that company. i wouldnt hire two of them. Its a recipe for disaster.

We had about 25 years of success under Ferguson being the man in charge. Thats a good system. What is not a good system is when you have another person buying players the manager doesnt want.

Now in fairness we already have one in Bobby Charlton, but he leaves all the decision making to Mourinho.

 

[SirAF]

So you are implying Mourinho, despite all that he has won, doesnt have knowledge of football.

If we had appointed a DoF when ferguson was manager, ferguson would have quit and we wouldnt have had near the success we had.

If i owned a company, i would hire one senior manager to control aspects of that company. i wouldnt hire two of them. Its a recipe for disaster.

We had about 25 years of success under Ferguson being the man in charge. Thats a good system. What is not a good system is when you have another person buying players the manager doesnt want.

Now in fairness we already have one in Bobby Charlton, but he leaves all the decision making to Mourinho.

Completely agree.

 

[Fracture90]

Ever read Animal Farm? What happens if they have a disagreement?

If they both are working for the club, with club's best intentions in their mind don't see why wouldn't they be able to find some sort of compromise. They're professionals after all.

BTW haven't read it.

 

[RORY65]

So you are implying Mourinho, despite all that he has won, doesnt have knowledge of football.

If we had appointed a DoF when ferguson was manager, ferguson would have quit and we wouldnt have had near the success we had.

If i owned a company, i would hire one senior manager to control aspects of that company. i wouldnt hire two of them. Its a recipe for disaster.

We had about 25 years of success under Ferguson being the man in charge. Thats a good system. What is not a good system is when you have another person buying players the manager doesnt want.

Now in fairness we already have one in Bobby Charlton, but he leaves all the decision making to Mourinho.

No, that's quite clearly not what I'm implying, I'm implying that the people above him don't. I also said that Mourinho should have key role in recruitment and that a director of football could assist with that as well as other areas of the football club i.e. how the vast majority of clubs that perform well across Europe work. Bobby Charlton's role is purely ceremonial, if it was worth much more than that than I suspect Mourinho wouldn't be our manager.

I'm not sure Ferguson is a great example to use anyway, I've not seen anything in Jose Mourinho's career that suggests he's a man to build a squad and a club in the long-term but instead a man to get a team performing impressively quickly and to have a couple of years of success. I obviously hope that I'm wrong and he lasts longer but it would be nice to know if that's not the case that we're not back to square one again.

 

[Attila]

If they both are working for the club, with club's best intentions in their mind don't see why wouldn't they be able to find some sort of compromise. They're professionals after all.

BTW haven't read it.

You are talking about Mourinho though. Look at the "compromise" that occurred at Real Madrid

Jose Mourinho nemesis Jorge Valdano loses power stuggle and leaves Real Madrid
Real Madrid director general Jorge Valdano has left the club after losing his power struggle with coach Jose Mourinho.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/fo...ses-power-stuggle-and-leaves-Real-Madrid.html

Club president Florentino Perez announced at a hastily-arranged press conference he wanted to reorganise the club in the style of an English one and give Mourinho more authority.

The former Chelsea and Inter Milan manager has clashed repeatedly with Valdano during an eventful first season in the Bernabeu hot seat.

Real Madrid director general Jorge Valdano has been sacked after a board meeting at the Bernabeu stadium.

"We have decided to end the contractual relationship with Jorge Valdano," said Real president Florentino Perez.

Valdano's removal is part of a Real reorganisation that strengthens coach Jose Mourinho's position at the club.

The pair fell out after Valdano queried Mourinho's request for another striker as cover for the injured Gonzalo Higuain earlier in the season.

"The experience of this just completed season demonstrated a need for more autonomy, including within the coaching unit," said Perez.

"Mourinho demanded an autonomy on the sporting side like that which works with English clubs. I think for the sake of the institution that this is a reorganisation that has to be done.

"We signed the best coach in the world, so we want to be sure that even when he leaves one day and we sign another of the world's best, the structure is there."

At a later media conference, Valdano revealed that he and Mourinho had not spoken "for a long time".

"I am not the one who turned Real Madrid into a battlefield," said the Argentine. "All my efforts this season were directed toward restraint.

"It has been a long time since I have spoken personally to Mourinho. We greet each other politely, but he sought to deal with people other than me.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/13553663

 

[hobbers]

Looking at the players he's signed, I think I trust him with our money a hell of a lot more than Moyes or LVG.

Mkhitaryan, Bailly and Pogba..... more in that vain could only be a good thing in the long run.

 

[Hugh Jass]

If they both are working for the club, with club's best intentions in their mind don't see why wouldn't they be able to find some sort of compromise. They're professionals after all.

BTW haven't read it.

That is precisely what is wrong.

Mourinho says: I want this player.
DoF says: No, i want a different player.

Then according to you they compromise by buying some other player. So basically Mourinho has been overruled and has lost control and what did Ferguson say about control?

 

[dichinero]

Our rivals will probably be spending a lot too. Epic failure is a bit excessive

If the club is backing in the way the reports suggests, I foresee us out spending everyone should we make the CL. I'm not a big fan of crazy spending myself and iirc, Jose used to be criticised on here for his mercenary squads and it's the similar stick that we are now using to beat Pep with. As much as I hate to say it even if the occasion demands it, we now have one firm foot in the galactico spending zone, and with a galactico manager in our hands the expectations will be really really high.

 

[Hugh Jass]

No, that's quite clearly not what I'm implying, I'm implying that the people above him don't. I also said that Mourinho should have key role in recruitment and that a director of football could assist with that as well as other areas of the football club i.e. how the vast majority of clubs that perform well across Europe work. Bobby Charlton's role is purely ceremonial, if it was worth much more than that than I suspect Mourinho wouldn't be our manager.

I'm not sure Ferguson is a great example to use anyway, I've not seen anything in Jose Mourinho's career that suggests he's a man to build a squad and a club in the long-term but instead a man to get a team performing impressively quickly and to have a couple of years of success. I obviously hope that I'm wrong and he lasts longer but it would be nice to know if that's not the case that we're not back to square one again.

Currently the people above Mourinho (who keep to themselves are) Bobby Charlton and Sir Alex Ferguson. The latter is a man who won 49 trophies as a manager. I am sure he knows football. One other thing he knows is that the manager should have full control of the club.

 

[Keeps It tidy]

Once again most clubs in the major leagues in Europe do not give managers full control of transfers.

 

[RORY65]

Currently the people above Mourinho (who keep to themselves are) Bobby Charlton and Sir Alex Ferguson. The latter is a man who won 49 trophies as a manager. I am sure he knows football. One other thing he knows is that the manager should have full control of the club.

Two men in their 70s in ceremonial positions, not even on the executive board, they're not the people above Mourinho. I think Ferguson might also realise that he was the best manager of all time (who had spent twice as long at Aberdeen as Mourinho has in any job despite being almost 10 years younger when he became United manager) and that our squad still apparently needs 2 windows despite being the most expensive in football history because we've not had someone alongside the manager involved in its building.

 

[Fracture90]

You are talking about Mourinho though. Look at the "compromise" that occurred at Real Madrid

Mate what happened in Madrid is mostly because Perez don't want to have anyone questioning his decisions or asking any questions whatsoever.

That is precisely what is wrong.

Mourinho says: I want this player.
DoF says: No, i want a different player.

Then according to you they compromise by buying some other player. So basically Mourinho has been overruled and has lost control and what did Ferguson say about control?

Mate it's not that simple. If Mourinho wants some player i guess he would talk to DoF and explain how would he incorporate that player and how would that player improve us, than comes the price.

Like i said they both would be working in club's best interest.

 

[Ali Dia]

So what sort of ins and outs are we expecting?

To be honest I think a years coaching under Mourinho is more valuable to this squad.

It's the fringes we need to upgrade though, the likes of Darmian, Young, Fellaini, Schneiderlin and Depay being replaced with top quality players would definitely make a huge difference.

If Jose can get martial, Rashford and one of Rooney/lingard playing well consistently then our fringe players are fine for now. We just need more first team players in form and we will comprehensively beat teams, especially at home. We already have a decent squad of international players just not playing up to their potential. I think we should be prioritizing signing players that improve the first 11 and that's what Jose has done so far. It's also worth noting that Jose mostly sticks with the same 11 unless he is forced to change through injury or suspension. The squad signings should be young players on the verge of becoming big names fighting the established players to get into the team.

 

[Stack]

That is precisely what is wrong.

Mourinho says: I want this player.
DoF says: No, i want a different player.

Then according to you they compromise by buying some other player. So basically Mourinho has been overruled and has lost control and what did Ferguson say about control?

If you think that this is all a DoF does and this is how things are done with a DoF then its no wonder you have such a daft understanding of how it works.

 

[Snow]

One of the best things Van Gaal did for us was get rid of many squad players. Players like Welbeck, Rafael, Cleverly, Anderson, Nani, Zaha, Buttner etc were either well below or a little below par. Van Gaal also brought in some duds, but his signings always made sense at the time.

Welbeck, Hernandez, Rafael and Nani were all better players than what he brought in.

 

[Man-United]

Let him spend as much as he wants in january. All his signings so far has been fantastic.

It's still a team that need to get rid of LvG's poor players. When Jose get more of his there will be no worry.

 

[ghagua]

How about coaching and getting the best out of the players he already has. I remember Chelsea struggling for most of the season last year, but their manager has them firing after 1 transfer window.

 

[SwansonsTache]

How about coaching and getting the best out of the players he already has. I remember Chelsea struggling for most of the season last year, but their manager has them firing after 1 transfer window.

Because they have:

- The leagues best and most in form striker
- The leagues best winger by a landslide
- The leagues best B2B midfielder (Poggers is better but I class him as more attacking than Kante)

Only thing that puzzles me is how he has gotten that backline to be as solid that it is. Could be the result of having Kante and Matic ahead of them though.

 

[vodrake]

How about coaching and getting the best out of the players he already has. I remember Chelsea struggling for most of the season last year, but their manager has them firing after 1 transfer window.

Because it keeps getting ignored that they're built on the core of a generally young, well drilled team who utterly dominated the league the season before last? They underperformed last season, but its a joke to pretend that they're coming from the same position

 

[ghagua]

Because they have:

- The leagues best and most in form striker
- The leagues best winger by a landslide
- The leagues best B2B midfielder (Poggers is better but I class him as more attacking than Kante)

Only thing that puzzles me is how he has gotten that backline to be as solid that it is. Could be the result of having Kante and Matic ahead of them though.

Where were they last season when the team was struggling in the bottom half of the table? Maybe the form they're in has something to do with their coach getting the best out of them?

 

[ghagua]

Because it keeps getting ignored that they're built on the core of a generally young, well drilled team who utterly dominated the league the season before last? They underperformed last season, but its a joke to pretend that they're coming from the same position

So maybe their manager is getting the best out of them this season after their struggles last year.

 

[SwansonsTache]

Where were they last season when the team was struggling in the bottom half of the table? Maybe the form they're in has something to do with their coach getting the best out of them?

There was visibly some toys being thrown out of the pram last year with Mourinho, no way that squad if they are giving it a 100% will ever perform as shit as they did last year, they are simply far too talented.

Look at the revival of some of our players under Mourinho .vs. LvG, clearly some of it is down to tactical restrictions being lifted, but Valencia, Jones, Rojo, Herrera and Mata has all been revived and are performing way better than last year.

Sometimes a manager just runs his course with a club and there needs to be a change.

 

[vodrake]

So maybe their manager is getting the best out of them this season after their struggles last year.

But it's a form they've shown they're already capable of as a team previously, but had lost the mentality. The majority of this United team have not shown anything like that. Don't get me wrong, I think there's still a lot to come from a lot of the players in this team who are currently getting a lot of stick and it's wrong to write them off, I just think it's a case of apples and oranges to compare to the turnaround at Chelsea this season in terms of speed and ease.

 

[Devil81]

We're not a million miles away now, as said in the transfer thread, January and the summer should see the deadwood gone. Everyone from that point onwards will be either Mourinho approved or his new players.

Already getting excited about what lies ahead.

 

[Devil may care]

Because they have:

- The leagues best and most in form striker
- The leagues best winger by a landslide
- The leagues best B2B midfielder (Poggers is better but I class him as more attacking than Kante)

Only thing that puzzles me is how he has gotten that backline to be as solid that it is. Could be the result of having Kante and Matic ahead of them though.

Same way Jose has gotten Jones and Rojo to be a solid partnership, defense is more about being really well drilled and communicative than attacking positions.

 

[ivaldo]

Well if we had DoF maybe we wouldn't have appointed Moyes and LVG in the first place mate.

Regarding Madrid it's exactly that and that's how you end up with buying players that you don't need just for the sake of buying.

All this assuming we appoint the right DoF. We appoint a shit DOF and they appoint a shit manager anyway. Then you have two problems instead of one.

 

[Red_toad]

Basically the title next season, anything else will be a failure.

So finishing second and winning the champs league and FA cup would be deemed as a failure by you? Interesting!

If he builds a genuine team that are serious contenders and play attractive football is enough for me. Winning the league has so many variables and is extremely difficult.

 

[izec]

So finishing second and winning the champs league and FA cup would be deemed as a failure by you? Interesting!

If he builds a genuine team that are serious contenders and play attractive football is enough for me. Winning the league has so many variables and is extremely difficult.

A big title is enough. We wont win the CL for various reasons, so the league title is our best bet. Yes if we spend another 200m, a big title is the only target i'm afraid.

 

[FujiVice]

Ever read Animal Farm? What happens if they have a disagreement?

No but I've seen the video. What that woman does with that horse, its no wonder they have disagreements.

 

[Revan]

A DoF would be a disaster. Basically you have another man buying players for the manager. Yea, thats going to work out well.

The best system to have is wherein the manager has full power over the goings of the club.

And then the manager gets sacked, and the new manager doesn't fancy half of the player, spends another 200m and still needs another two transfer windows to build the team he wants. That is the formula of success.

Of course, having a DoF (or similar position) is a disaster. Just look at Real, Barca, Atletico and Bayern. Terribly run clubs who won't win nothing in a thousand years.

 

[Fracture90]

All this assuming we appoint the right DoF. We appoint a shit DOF and they appoint a shit manager anyway. Then you have two problems instead of one.

Ofc we shouldn't appoint any just for the sake of having a DoF, it's a serious thing that requires serious evaluation and preparation.

 

[ivaldo]

Ofc we shouldn't appoint any just for the sake of having a DoF, it's a serious thing that requires serious evaluation and preparation.

So does picking a manager, and we are on our third one in three years.

 

[Fracture90]

So does picking a manager, and we are on our third one in three years.

That's because we lack DoF to work with Woody and point him in the right direction and advise him. We have Woody picking managers he deems worthy purely based on his business model approach.

 

[ivaldo]

That's because we lack DoF to work with Woody and point him in the right direction and advise him. We have Woody picking managers he deems worthy purely based on his business model approach.

You're missing the point, the people deemed to lack judgement in picking the manager would be the same people who pick the director of football.

 

[Hugh Jass]

You're missing the point, the people deemed to lack judgement in picking the manager would be the same people who pick the director of football.

This.

 

[Fracture90]

You're missing the point, the people deemed to lack judgement in picking the manager would be the same people who pick the director of football.

Yes i see your point but he can't be that wrong with picking DoF? After all he would be picking a guy to do transfers so that Woody himself wouldn't need to.

I quite like the initiative Mourinho had to bring over Andrea Berta from Atletico Madrid.