José Mourinho | 2018/19 Performances

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LvG was shite at identifying players to fit his football, and his football, although possession based, was so out of fashion.

At least he did well with our young players though, that was the primary thing to look forward to when we played.
 
Jose has a different approach to the game. Allowing the opposition to have the ball doesn't mean you're suddenly at their mercy.
Yes it does mean that. You are basically hoping that the opposition never does anything extraordinary and when you start a game with that approach and then concede an early goal, it is very difficult.
 
LvG was shite at identifying players to fit his football, and his football, although possession based, was so out of fashion.

At least he did well with our young players though, that was the primary thing to look forward to when we played.
It isn't out of fashion, LvG just didn't have the coaching know-how or he hired some dumb coaches under him.
 
Yes it does mean that. You are basically hoping that the opposition never does anything extraordinary and when you start a game with that approach and then concede an early goal, it is very difficult.

False. There are successful managers who allow the opposition to play more with the ball because they believe they are so good without the ball that they will control it their own way.

Mourinho is one of those managers. He's successful in it too.
 
This. LvG was never afraid of the opposition and in big games we usually tried to control the game. Nowadays we are at the mercy of the opposition and praying to god our defenders dont feck up

We got the second most points in the league against the top 6 last season. Do you lot purposely ignore facts and stats under Mourinho just to fit your anti Mourinho agendas?
 
I think it would go a long way if supporters got behind Mourinho and the team. It would make Jose happier, and energize the team. We should all unite together instead of encouraging the constant negativity of media. (but no flying posters please :) )
The constant agenda against Jose and the team is beyond ridiculous.
 
I think it would go a long way if supporters got behind Mourinho and the team. It would make Jose happier, and energize the team. We should all unite together instead of encouraging the constant negativity of media. (but no flying posters please :) )
The constant agenda against Jose and the team is beyond ridiculous.


Entertain the fans and they will have no problem getting support. Winning is the minimum requirement. Losing while being boring is always a bad mix.
 
False. There are successful managers who allow the opposition to play more with the ball because they believe they are so good without the ball that they will control it their own way.

Mourinho is one of those managers. He's successful in it too.
There aren't that many, only one right now at a top club is Simeone(and Mourinho) and he hasn't won much. That sort of football is only good for financially weaker underdog clubs, you can't sign 100m players and then park the bus, it won't last long.
 
LvG is a very experienced manager with many trophies to go with it, of course he has the know-how.
He openly admitted that he takes no active part in coaching and delegates them to his assistants. He may have the right idea but didn't sign proper assistants.
 
I think it would go a long way if supporters got behind Mourinho and the team. It would make Jose happier, and energize the team. We should all unite together instead of encouraging the constant negativity of media. (but no flying posters please :) )
The constant agenda against Jose and the team is beyond ridiculous.
I doubt they read this forum. Match goers have been supporting Mourinho and the team all along.
 
I think it would go a long way if supporters got behind Mourinho and the team
For that Jose must be behind the team, and personally i don't think he is. Whether we are talking about the squad or the club itself. I have a feeling his bags are half-packed already.
For example you look at Pep, at Klopp and you can feel they are committed to the club. So fans love them. Jose? He still lives at hotel and everybody knows he is off if not this year (i would bet on it) then the next one for sure. So how can you support a person like that. Sure fans will be support him as manager, in the end of the day, even if he is going this season he would want United to do good, even if it only for his resume. And that's what we want too. So United wins - everybody is happy, at least satisfied. But i don't believe any great number of United fans would walk that extra mile in terms of supporting Jose.
 
He is not finished yet. If he gets Toby this is gonna be very interesting. Probably the best central defender in the Premier League. Very athletic, he could play for the next 4-6 years. Great buy by Mourinho.
 
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Under Jose we are playing the most negative football I have ever seen at the club. This cannot be spoken about enough. Unless there is a radical change in direction, you will not convince me that he will ever be the right man for Manchester United. We also have to contend with the ridiculous things he says in his press conferences, and his very worrying relationship with his players, both historically and currently.
Then how can you not remember Moyes' days when we just hoofed the ball to Fellaini and got dismantled by every team in the league even when we had 10 players defending at all times as well? We're not playing great under Mourinho, sure, but to claim we're playing the most negative football under him is ridiculous.

Just to remind you of that Fulham game with the 80 crosses that we did. Fun times.
 
Then how can you not remember Moyes' days when we just hoofed the ball to Fellaini and got dismantled by every team in the league even when we had 10 players defending at all times as well? We're not playing great under Mourinho, sure, but to claim we're playing the most negative football under him is ridiculous.

Just to remind you of that Fulham game with the 80 crosses that we did. Fun times.

Did we hoof the ball to Fellaini under Moyes? Weren't people surprised by the fact that he was used as a DM instead of the "Tim Cahill" role that he had with Everton in his last seasons there?
 
Did we hoof the ball to Fellaini under Moyes? Weren't people surprised by the fact that he was used as a DM instead of the "Tim Cahill" role that he had with Everton in his last seasons there?

Yep. He was rarely played in that AM target man role under Moyes for us, surprisingly enough.
 
Then how can you not remember Moyes
The obvious difference is that Moyes did not even finished one season. So it was in category of a forgotten mistakes.
Jose not only here for quite some time, but United also seriously backed him in transfer market, buying Lukaku, Pogba, getting Sahcnez for huge wages and we still can't figure out any sort of decent attacking game.
 
Jose has a different approach to the game. Allowing the opposition to have the ball doesn't mean you're suddenly at their mercy.

No it doesn’t but having more possession should mean more chances, more confidence for the players, few chances conceded, less bad luck etc. This is only of the possession game is coached properly, which is where LVG fell down.
 
Mourinho thrives being the underdog. In fact, his entire success came from inspiring his team and fans revel in playing the underdog role to perfection. I am not saying he is exactly engineering this, but City and Liverpool being considered favorites with their fluid attacking players maybe is exactly what we need. We have players like De Gea, Matic, Pogba, Sanchez and Lukaku in the squad and we are still being written off, not a bad place to be. No pressure on these players at the moment.
 
Then how can you not remember Moyes' days when we just hoofed the ball to Fellaini and got dismantled by every team in the league even when we had 10 players defending at all times as well? We're not playing great under Mourinho, sure, but to claim we're playing the most negative football under him is ridiculous.

Just to remind you of that Fulham game with the 80 crosses that we did. Fun times.

So clearly you are confusing shit with negative. All three of Moyes, Van Gaal and Mourinho play/played shit football. Moyes wasn’t inherintely negative. His tactics were just rudimentary and ineffective, but he tried to attack. Albeit by endlessly crossing. Van Gaal’s football was shit because it was risk averse possession, just endlessly probing. Mourinho’s football is shit because he parks the bus so often and for so long. That’s what defines his negativity. The pervasive lack of intent to attack. I have never had a United manager that negative before. It’s not me saying he’s worse than Moyes or LVG. Just more negative.
 
It's possible to play absolutely awfully and win the game.
Seriously now. This is becoming beyond ridicoulous.

Mourinho is here to stay, at least for this season, we can either support him and the club or continuying talking rubbish without knowing facts just to please our ego.
 
Mourinho thrives being the underdog. In fact, his entire success came from inspiring his team and fans revel in playing the underdog role to perfection. I am not saying he is exactly engineering this, but City and Liverpool being considered favorites with their fluid attacking players maybe is exactly what we need. We have players like De Gea, Matic, Pogba, Sanchez and Lukaku in the squad and we are still being written off, not a bad place to be. No pressure on these players at the moment.
The underdog thing is true and it's the basis for the siege mentality he tries to create. For good or bad reasons a sizable portion of United fans just haven't bought into it and probably never will. His fit here will remain an awkward one for however long he stays
 
We didn't blow them away. They were generally a bit of a struggle until the 70-80 minute mark where we'd score in a flurry as the opposing team tried to get back into the game. I remember making this point at the time, predicting that this would stop and usual (largely terrible) service would be resumed. Which happened.
The opening game (H v West Ham) was great from beginning to end. A real quality performance. And an all too common false dawn.
The football during the second half of last season was, at times, just as bad as anything we watched under Van Gaal. And I could at least sympathise with the latter because his ambition was to control the game irrespective of opposition. It didn't work either, but there was a principle there that I could sort of buy into. With Mourinho we get neither.
Yup. And, like Jose. it was worse to watch in his second season than in his first. Have both of them lost confidence the longer they've been in the job?
Personally, I think the football has been dire since December of Mourinho's first season. I said this at the time, too, so it's not kneejerk based on a poor pre season.
The only really enjoyable stuff has been the fightbacks. The football may be terrible, but the players have frequently shown there's nothing wrong with their mentality. For this, Jose must take much of the credit.
It still remains the case that the best football we've played under Mourinho is the first couple of months of his first season. I vividly remember drawing 0-0 with Burnley and we absolutely battered them with chances created. Tom Heaton played played like a superhero in goal for them. We dropped points but the intent was great. Since, the football has been abysmal, whether you compare it with Van Gaal's reign or not.
I seem to remember quite a lot of games in his first season (not just in the early part) where we played well, battered the opposition and only came away with a point. It seemed that a simple solution was at hand: bring in a more prolific striker. Which we did, but at the same time our play suddenly got a lot more laboured. Maybe Matic for Herrera didn't help.
 
can someone please change the title from performances to bashing because i dont think there is a lot of performances to judge at the moment
 
I seem to remember quite a lot of games in his first season (not just in the early part) where we played well, battered the opposition and only came away with a point. It seemed that a simple solution was at hand: bring in a more prolific striker. Which we did, but at the same time our play suddenly got a lot more laboured. Maybe Matic for Herrera didn't help.

Valencia's decline and trying to play with two holding players and 3 behind the striker rather than 3 CMs hurt our balance I believe. I haven't looked but I'd guess that we much more frequently played with 3 CMs in the first season, whereas in the 2nd season I think he thought Matic would be enough to control the midfield while Pogba could go forward. When he tried to get Pogba to play more disciplined he was unable and/or our attacking thrust was diminished.

I believe we will feature 3 CMs much more often this season and it will be the setup of choice from the beginning.
 
Valencia's decline and trying to play with two holding players and 3 behind the striker rather than 3 CMs hurt our balance I believe. I haven't looked but I'd guess that we much more frequently played with 3 CMs in the first season, whereas in the 2nd season I think he thought Matic would be enough to control the midfield while Pogba could go forward. When he tried to get Pogba to play more disciplined he was unable and/or our attacking thrust was diminished.

I believe we will feature 3 CMs much more often this season and it will be the setup of choice from the beginning.
Good point re. Valencia. He used to make our right side look a lot more effective than it did last season.

Herrera was a key part of the midfield in the first season and did really well.

The 4-2-3-1 didn’t bring out the best in the team at all. Matic isn’t mobile enough and Pogba isn’t disciplined enough, at least for United. Let’s hope we see a less rigid and more dynamic setup this season. Fred should certainly help, but having Herrera back to the form of Jose’s first season would be great as well. I’d love to see Pereira given a go as sole holding midfielder against some weaker team; I think he’d do well.
 
I doubt they read this forum. Match goers have been supporting Mourinho and the team all along.
The match goers I know are not looking forward to the season and were hoping for a managerial change but feel it a betrayal to voice their concerns during the match. This is just a tradition at the club. Fans pretty much stuck with Moyes and LVG and did not voice that many concerns during the match.
 
Jose not only here for quite some time, but United also seriously backed him in transfer market, buying Lukaku, Pogba, getting Sahcnez for huge wages and we still can't figure out any sort of decent attacking game.
We also backed Moyes and Van Gaal. Fellaini for 30 million was ludacris. Mata, albeit a good player, we overpaid for. Just because Moyes was an idiot and didn't know what to do at the transfer market doesn't mean that the club didn't back him.

So clearly you are confusing shit with negative. All three of Moyes, Van Gaal and Mourinho play/played shit football. Moyes wasn’t inherintely negative. His tactics were just rudimentary and ineffective, but he tried to attack. Albeit by endlessly crossing. Van Gaal’s football was shit because it was risk averse possession, just endlessly probing. Mourinho’s football is shit because he parks the bus so often and for so long. That’s what defines his negativity. The pervasive lack of intent to attack. I have never had a United manager that negative before. It’s not me saying he’s worse than Moyes or LVG. Just more negative.
Moyes was inherintely negative. What the flying feck are you talking about? This is the guy that wanted to make it "difficult for Newcastle" and in all of his press conferences and interview was extremely negative, always downplaying United and always talking about how we must stop the opposition rather than punch through them. I think you have forgotten pretty quickly what it was.

His tactics were shit, but they were negative as well. Rewatch our matches in that season - in every single match, especially the big ones, we played on the defensive, but unlike Mourinho, we got battered constantly anyway. To claim Moyes wasn't negative is simply mind boggling to me.
 
The match goers I know are not looking forward to the season and were hoping for a managerial change but feel it a betrayal to voice their concerns during the match. This is just a tradition at the club. Fans pretty much stuck with Moyes and LVG and did not voice that many concerns during the match.
I'm not sure if that's a good thing or a bad thing.
 
I don't understand this argument that good performances don't count because we blew them away at the end of games. That Is how it usually goes, you break the team down, they have no option but to be more attacking, thus creating more space for you to exploit.
 
So clearly you are confusing shit with negative. All three of Moyes, Van Gaal and Mourinho play/played shit football. Moyes wasn’t inherintely negative. His tactics were just rudimentary and ineffective, but he tried to attack. Albeit by endlessly crossing. Van Gaal’s football was shit because it was risk averse possession, just endlessly probing. Mourinho’s football is shit because he parks the bus so often and for so long. That’s what defines his negativity. The pervasive lack of intent to attack. I have never had a United manager that negative before. It’s not me saying he’s worse than Moyes or LVG. Just more negative.
That's negative. Mindless crossing is stupid and negative and of course, for that boring tactic to be effective you need someone big or tall to get at the end of crosses which was pretty much what people moaned about when We signed Lukaku or kept Fellaini. There's a reason why Moyes signed Fellaini.

Under Moyes We had the worst tactic which was to cross the ball into the box and hoping someone to get on the end of it to score. That's all, no variations, you'd think it was an amateur football team playing. At some point, teams even let us to control the wings while They just sit there in the middle near the box, anticipating for the mindless crosses. If Mourinho's football is shit and negative, Moyes's football is disastrous, pointless and ultra negative. Oh and Moyes also won feck all, not to mention the constant "We hope to... We aspire to...." in the media. Out of LvG, Jose and Moyes, I'd argue Moyes was the worst. He was out of his depth.

Obligatory reminder :
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Oh and Moyes also won feck all, not to mention the constant "We hope to... We aspire to...." in the media. Out of LvG, Jose and Moyes, I'd argue Moyes was the worst. He was out of his depth.

Mourinho's United have won trophies, showed fight when falling behind against rivals and improved to the highest level since SAF retired.

LvGs United won a trophy, beat rivals and at least never totally gave up even if they hated the manager and played boring football.

Moyes' United was bad, showed zero fight and played awful football while collapsing in the league.

Anybody that really thinks what we've seen under Mourinho is worse than what was served up under Moyes is clueless.
 
I seem to remember quite a lot of games in his first season (not just in te early part) where we played well, battered the opposition and only came away with a point. It seemed that a simple solution was at hand: bring in a more prolific striker. Which we did, but at the same time our play suddenly got a lot more laboured. Maybe Matic for Herrera didn't help.

I think it has more to do with Zlatan than Herrera. Lukaku is a fine striker but his strengths don't really align with what Jose likes. Zlatan was a better target man with better hold up play, better technique, and more creative ideas; a lot of our chance creation that season heavily involved him. Lukaku's faster and a more lethal finisher from inside the box, but he can't play the Zlatan role as effectively.
 
Moyes was inherintely negative. What the flying feck are you talking about? This is the guy that wanted to make it "difficult for Newcastle" and in all of his press conferences and interview was extremely negative, always downplaying United and always talking about how we must stop the opposition rather than punch through them. I think you have forgotten pretty quickly what it was.

His tactics were shit, but they were negative as well. Rewatch our matches in that season - in every single match, especially the big ones, we played on the defensive, but unlike Mourinho, we got battered constantly anyway. To claim Moyes wasn't negative is simply mind boggling to me.


That's negative. Mindless crossing is stupid and negative and of course, for that boring tactic to be effective you need someone big or tall to get at the end of crosses which was pretty much what people moaned about when We signed Lukaku or kept Fellaini. There's a reason why Moyes signed Fellaini.

Under Moyes We had the worst tactic which was to cross the ball into the box and hoping someone to get on the end of it to score. That's all, no variations, you'd think it was an amateur football team playing. At some point, teams even let us to control the wings while They just sit there in the middle near the box, anticipating for the mindless crosses. If Mourinho's football is shit and negative, Moyes's football is disastrous, pointless and ultra negative. Oh and Moyes also won feck all, not to mention the constant "We hope to... We aspire to...." in the media. Out of LvG, Jose and Moyes, I'd argue Moyes was the worst. He was out of his depth.


Mourinho's United have won trophies, showed fight when falling behind against rivals and improved to the highest level since SAF retired.
LvGs United won a trophy, beat rivals and at least never totally gave up even if they hated the manager and played boring football. Moyes' United was bad, showed zero fight and played awful football while collapsing in the league. Anybody that really thinks what we've seen under Mourinho is worse than what was served up under Moyes is clueless.

So against my better judgement, I will respond to the general teeth gnashing and mouth frothing in these posts, by just reiterating the difference between shit and negative. At no point did I say that Moyes or Van Gaal were better managers, had better tenures, were more effective, or played better football. I merely said that of the three - all of whom I find to produce excruciatingly bad football to watch - that Mourinho's tactical style was the most negative. In fact the most negative I have seen in 40 years of watching United. I have never seen a United manager park the bus as often, and for such prolonged period as Mourinho has. He has other qualities as a manager, and I was a strong advocate of his for the job, mainly because I felt his self belief and cult of personality was the only one strong enough not to be cowed by the shadow of Ferguson. But it never really hit home for me, how much "shit on a stick" football we were going to get. For what it is worth, if I had to summarise the three, I would call Moyes inept, Van Gaal overly burden by technical intricacies, and Mourinho negative. I have nothing good to say about the Moyes era, it was fecking bleak. And I have about as many good things to say about the Van Gaal era as I do the Mourinho one. Van Gaal got a 4th and 5th place finish, Mourinho a 6th and 2nd. Mourinho two cups to one. Not much to pick between the two, especially considering Van Gaal's net spend over two seasons was approx 160M and Mourinho's is 302M.

It's all been horribly shit. Mourinho is entering a make or break season. I hope he succeeds.
 
So against my better judgement, I will respond to the general teeth gnashing and mouth frothing in these posts, by just reiterating the difference between shit and negative. At no point did I say that Moyes or Van Gaal were better managers, had better tenures, were more effective, or played better football. I merely said that of the three - all of whom I find to produce excruciatingly bad football to watch - that Mourinho's tactical style was the most negative. In fact the most negative I have seen in 40 years of watching United. I have never seen a United manager park the bus as often, and for such prolonged period as Mourinho has. He has other qualities as a manager, and I was a strong advocate of his for the job, mainly because I felt his self belief and cult of personality was the only one strong enough not to be cowed by the shadow of Ferguson. But it never really hit home for me, how much "shit on a stick" football we were going to get. For what it is worth, if I had to summarise the three, I would call Moyes inept, Van Gaal overly burden by technical intricacies, and Mourinho negative. I have nothing good to say about the Moyes era, it was fecking bleak. And I have about as many good things to say about the Van Gaal era as I do the Mourinho one. Van Gaal got a 4th and 5th place finish, Mourinho a 6th and 2nd. Mourinho two cups to one. Not much to pick between the two, especially considering Van Gaal's net spend over two seasons was approx 160M and Mourinho's is 302M.

It's all been horribly shit. Mourinho is entering a make or break season. I hope he succeeds.
There's no gnashing of teeth but there's nothing that's not shit or negative (aside from Mata on a helicopter) when Moyes was the manager. Even worse when you think We were the champions just a few months before He came here. I don't think We played better under Moyes at all.
 
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I think it would go a long way if supporters got behind Mourinho and the team. It would make Jose happier, and energize the team. We should all unite together instead of encouraging the constant negativity of media. (but no flying posters please :) )
The constant agenda against Jose and the team is beyond ridiculous.

Mourinho has played a major part both in the media and the way he plays in breeding that negativity. He has to take responsibility, but we know he won't, and it doesn't look like he's going to change either.
 
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