James Maddison

Status
Not open for further replies.
Classical Mechanic said:
He didn’t say it publicly, it was one of the things that was in the press at the end of the season. Could be nonsense of course but it would better explain how you could fit Pogba, Maddison/Fernandes in a side.
Click to expand...
By DLP, I was under the Pirlo, Jorginho impression. I could certainly see him playing in a b2b role though, next to a ball-winner and holding midfielder like Rice or Rodri.
 
Mcking said:
Even if you ignore Maddison's key passes from set-pieces, he still has twice more than Felix. We might have to overpay for Maddison because he is English, but I've always felt that the hype around Felix stems from his age, style and flavour of the season status. Until he was first linked to us, I had never heard of him. That he was first linked as the 'new Ronaldo' when he is actually nothing like him, with the hype quickly escalating from there makes me firmly believe that many are just jumping on the bandwagon.
Maddison's technique is really good too, he's got some skills that Felix probably does not have, he is only 22 and there's huge room for improvement too. I would argue that he is currently the better player and £60m for him would be a sensible price relative to the quoted price for Felix. I cannot quantify the bolded part statistically, so fairplay.
Click to expand...

Whoscored have Maddison at 2.8 KP per 90, with half of that being set pieces. Felix got 1.1 KP per game. We will see in 1 year who is the better player.
 
I really rate Maddison and would love him at United, but even I think £60 million is too much for him.

Leicester are perfectly entitled to value him at that of course, they don’t need or necessarily want to sell.
 
Crashoutcassius said:
Reminds me a bit of Beckham in that his main quality is striking the ball. Could he play out wide for us?
Click to expand...
fps said:
There are other factors. The Premier League money and increasing backing of rich owners means players clubs don't want to sell CAN be bought, but for utterly ridiculous fees, whereas before they could be picked off for less.

Looking at Man City - Bayern and the Sane situation, the latter have essentially said the valuation is insane and they won't pay it. This is an attempt to re-balance the market by refusing to match the market as it currently exists at the top-end, essentially saying this isn't value. Seeing the performances of Coutinho and Dembele, it makes sense for big clubs to refuse to meet these valuations - there's plenty of value out there if it's properly scouted for.
Click to expand...
I get why it's like it, but it's still utterly mental.
 
OL29 said:
This is getting more and more xenophobic as this conversation goes on. I hate this attitude of foreign players being weak-minded mercenaries. It's equally as stupid as dismissing all British players as not being good enough.
Click to expand...
Good post. It really seems like there are many people on here who automatically dismiss foreign players as money obsessed and weak willed, and an equal amount of those who instinctually dismiss British players as technically inept and overpriced and if you rate them you are automatically a gammon. The tribalism on this forum is becoming insufferable.
 
Last edited:
I like him, and can only see him getting better. Also think he's a player Fergie would have gone for.
When you see the 60m valuation, you get taken back by it, but Coutinho is your benchmark. Also Fred was 50m, Keita 60m. You then get a bit of clarity.
He's not a player I desperately want, but won't be disappointed if we signed him.
 
fps said:
There are other factors. The Premier League money and increasing backing of rich owners means players clubs don't want to sell CAN be bought, but for utterly ridiculous fees, whereas before they could be picked off for less.

Looking at Man City - Bayern and the Sane situation, the latter have essentially said the valuation is insane and they won't pay it. This is an attempt to re-balance the market by refusing to match the market as it currently exists at the top-end, essentially saying this isn't value. Seeing the performances of Coutinho and Dembele, it makes sense for big clubs to refuse to meet these valuations - there's plenty of value out there if it's properly scouted for.
Click to expand...

They can refuse to meet the valuations as much as they want, end result is that the player won't join them that transfer window.
 
Mcking said:
Pogba would be the CM, not Maddison. As for width, we'd still have the wingers and the fullbacks. When has midfielders ever been responsible for width?
Click to expand...

Pogbas' best position is #10 same as Maddison, we wouldn't be able to get best out of either and our midfield would get overrun. If you play two #10s along with a DM and a CM that means one lesser player to field out wide.

Scholsey2004 said:
How many 10's do city play? Certainly more than 2. If you've got good, quick wide forwards then it should work.
Click to expand...

Stop using City as a metric, they have a proper system in place where the roles are defined. Prior to Pep ending up there Silva was actually used as an LM, and KDB on the right or as a #10 but he's transformed them both into CMs.

We posses exactly zero 'good, quick wide forwards'. Adding a #10 when you already have Pogba for that role is just wasting money especially when its on someone like Maddison who isn't worth the quoted sum.
 
Kush said:
Pogbas' best position is #10 same as Maddison, we wouldn't be able to get best out of either and our midfield would get overrun. If you play two #10s along with a DM and a CM that means one lesser player to field out wide.



Stop using City as a metric, they have a proper system in place where the roles are defined. Prior to Pep ending up there Silva was actually used as an LM, and KDB on the right or as a #10 but he's transformed them both into CMs.

We posses exactly zero 'good, quick wide forwards'. Adding a #10 when you already have Pogba for that role is just wasting money especially when its on someone like Maddison who isn't worth the quoted sum.
Click to expand...
I obviously meant Pogba and Maddison as AMs with one defensive midfielder.
 
Honestly, Pogba is more of a mix no 10 & no 8. He has asset to be great box to box but lack consistency of being discipline in that role, when he is great he is actually world class box to box. James Maddison on the other hand he’s more like a no 10, can’t see an asset in him to be box to box or no 8.

Playing both Pogba & Maddison in midfield can still work if we play diamond or false 9.
 
ThierryHenry14 said:
This will not happen. He is not good enough for Utd. The chance for him going to Man City to replace Silva next summer is probably higher than him joining Man Utd this summer.
Click to expand...
Not good enough for us, but man city probablly buying is higher

I salute you, if only I had your faith.
 
There is absurd hate with lots of poster here about signing any player from mid table team and below who might be ready to step up. This has been the case for sometime now, Mane was branded not good enough here, Van Djik was overrated. This forum and in general United fan seems so entitled bunch that all they seem to want is big name player or the one who is flavor of the month and everyone else is not good enough.
 
Kush said:
Pogbas' best position is #10 same as Maddison, we wouldn't be able to get best out of either and our midfield would get overrun. If you play two #10s along with a DM and a CM that means one lesser player to field out wide.



Stop using City as a metric, they have a proper system in place where the roles are defined. Prior to Pep ending up there Silva was actually used as an LM, and KDB on the right or as a #10 but he's transformed them both into CMs.

We posses exactly zero 'good, quick wide forwards'. Adding a #10 when you already have Pogba for that role is just wasting money especially when its on someone like Maddison who isn't worth the quoted sum.
Click to expand...
Firstly Pogba will probably leave so we won't have him for that role.
Secondly city can play that way because they have all these number 10 type players. You can't implement a system without having the correct type of players first. So bring in technically gifted players and build from there, not the other way round.
Thirdly rashford clearly is a good quick wide player and martial would be too if he was more motivated. To suggest we lack pace in the wide areas is disengenuous.
Your basic premise is that we couldn't do what city do so we shouldn't bother trying to sign the kind of players they do. That's such a drab mentality.
 
SamVimes said:
This can only be true if we are selling Pogba. Think Ronaldo and Valencia.
Click to expand...
Think Ronaldo actually did stuff for us. I can't recall Pogba doing anything of note apart from that brace against city.
 
This guy's a terrific player and he's worth a punt simply because he has in him -I hope- the potential to be that metronomic midfielder dictating the tempo and outcome of a game we've lacked since Carrick. But the numbers are, as usual, a total bitch. That said, if we get 100 for Pogba, I'd spunk half of it on him. I mean, that's what Fred cost...
 
Shaidabdullah Hussain said:
Good post. It really seems like there are many people on here who automatically dismiss foreign players as money obsessed and weak willed, and an equal amount of those who instinctually dismiss British players as technically inept and overpriced and if you rate them you are automatically a gammon. The tribalism on this forum is becoming insufferable.
Click to expand...
Agreed, there’s a massive lack of balance on most topics.
 
Only Leicester player we should be signing is Ndidi.

Maddison is really uninspiring.
 
Nep77 said:
There is absurd hate with lots of poster here about signing any player from mid table team and below who might be ready to step up. This has been the case for sometime now, Mane was branded not good enough here, Van Djik was overrated. This forum and in general United fan seems so entitled bunch that all they seem to want is big name player or the one who is flavor of the month and everyone else is not good enough.
Click to expand...

I beg to differ. It’s common crap. Go to the Mane thread and point out where the majority did not want him. We didn’t know much about him but was vet impressed with his displays against Chelsea. Was we not excited about Schneiderlin to?

Your argument just sounds good. But at the end of the day people on here like quality players and we aren’t going to be impressed with links to mediocrity. It’s that simple.

We moan about the best stat wise midfielder in Paul Pogba. Why do you expect us to be impressed with Maddison based on stats. We’ll judge him how he is as a player.

As far as I’m concerned he’s exactly where he needs to be. Yes we could sign him and he could improve. But we aren’t in that position now. The less risks we take the better. He’s the worse option out of there midfield 3.
 
Nep77 said:
There is absurd hate with lots of poster here about signing any player from mid table team and below who might be ready to step up. This has been the case for sometime now, Mane was branded not good enough here, Van Djik was overrated. This forum and in general United fan seems so entitled bunch that all they seem to want is big name player or the one who is flavor of the month and everyone else is not good enough.
Click to expand...

Honestly it's gotten annoying. Watch them in a couple of years, ask why we didn't go for him. Robertson, wijnaldum, mane and vad dijk all bought from midtable teams or relegated teams.
 
Yet another example of us taking a lazy approach to scouting. We SHOULD have been aware of players like Madison when he was at Norwich, you HAVE to identify players early now....by the time they get to other PL clubs it's too late*

*I've been through this a million times elsewhere but the new TV deal signed in 2016 meant that for the first time in a long time, the majority of the PL clubs actually operated at a profit - https://www.theguardian.com/football/2018/jun/06/premier-league-clubs-profit-record-revenues-tv-deal

The 'transfer inflation' we have seen since 2016 has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with clubs 'ruining the market' and has VERY LITTLE to do with oil money. The single and sole reason for the increase in prices is that clubs no longer have to sell their assets to survive. Therefore, they can relax and say 'hey....you want our best player....try £100m....' - whereas during SAFs time in charge, pretty much ANY PL player from a non-top 2/3 club was available at a reasonable price because clubs would otherwise be running at a loss

The challenge now for clubs like United is that we HAVE to be able to identify players earlier. Look at our strategy between 2000-2010, for example. We signed the likes of Berbatov, Ferdinand, Carrick and Rooney from other PL clubs...this is not going to be tenable going forward. If you want these players now, you have to gamble and take them in their Bayer Leverkusen, Leeds, West Ham, Everton Youth years before they are the finished article
 
flappyjay said:
Honestly it's gotten annoying. Watch them in a couple of years, ask why we didn't go for him. Robertson, wijnaldum, mane and vad dijk all bought from midtable teams or relegated teams.
Click to expand...
You're quoting the best examples of players who have succeeded at a higher level. There are many many more players purchased from lower leagues by Premiership clubs who have not fulfilled their potential at higher levels and have lost the clubs money. Basically, it's not that simple as you describe.
 
Mainoldo said:
I beg to differ. It’s common crap. Go to the Mane thread and point out where the majority did not want him. We didn’t know much about him but was vet impressed with his displays against Chelsea. Was we not excited about Schneiderlin to?

Your argument just sounds good. But at the end of the day people on here like quality players and we aren’t going to be impressed with links to mediocrity. It’s that simple.

We moan about the best stat wise midfielder in Paul Pogba. Why do you expect us to be impressed with Maddison based on stats. We’ll judge him how he is as a player.

As far as I’m concerned he’s exactly where he needs to be. Yes we could sign him and he could improve. But we aren’t in that position now. The less risks we take the better. He’s the worse option out of there midfield 3.
Click to expand...
Why, because he is the English one?
 
Mainoldo said:
I beg to differ. It’s common crap. Go to the Mane thread and point out where the majority did not want him. We didn’t know much about him but was vet impressed with his displays against Chelsea. Was we not excited about Schneiderlin to?

Your argument just sounds good. But at the end of the day people on here like quality players and we aren’t going to be impressed with links to mediocrity. It’s that simple.

We moan about the best stat wise midfielder in Paul Pogba. Why do you expect us to be impressed with Maddison based on stats. We’ll judge him how he is as a player.

As far as I’m concerned he’s exactly where he needs to be. Yes we could sign him and he could improve. But we aren’t in that position now. The less risks we take the better. He’s the worse option out of there midfield 3.
Click to expand...
To be fair, I remember no one on here wanted Mané. Myself included.

I do however agree with the bold. We should be buying specific players to fill the obvious holes, not another Mkhitaryan or Mata type that we'll struggle to fit into the starting 11 and keep everyone happy.
 
Sultan said:
You're quoting the best examples of players who have succeeded at a higher level. There are many many more players purchased from lower leagues by Premiership clubs who have not fulfilled their potential at higher levels and have lost the clubs money. Basically, it's not that simple as you describe.
Click to expand...
His point is it's worked incredibly well for Liverpool because they've scouted properly and identified players from lesser teams that can be Liverpool quality. You'd hope we've done the same with players we've been linked with like James, Maddison, Longstaff etc.
 
Lennon7 said:
His point is it's worked incredibly well for Liverpool because they've scouted properly and identified players from lesser teams that can be Liverpool quality. You'd hope we've done the same with players we've been linked with like James, Maddison, Longstaff etc.
Click to expand...
van Dyck was hardly a player from the lower leagues with Liverpool paying a hefty fee. United also wanted Mane. Granted, Robertson has been very good. Wijnaldom is nothing special, in my opinion.
 
Sultan said:
van Dyck was hardly a player from the lower leagues with Liverpool paying a hefty fee. United also wanted Mane. Granted, Robertson has been very good. Wijnaldom is nothing special, in my opinion.
Click to expand...
Certainly worked out better than Smalling, Jones and Shaw (with the latter 2 coming for hefty fees at the time).
 
Status
Not open for further replies.